3 T Madara Vs the 3 Hyuga's

[Icelerate]

Yes i agree , but with byakugan they can scope out weaker less protected portions of madara's body , for example neji/hinata could target the lower body while hiashi shifts his aim to the upper.


I agree that madara can in fact react to their thust beforehand and with clones would most likely take care of hinata quickly which would instantly clip the hyuga's fire power and quicken their defeat.

Well if Madara stands in one spot and allows the Hyuuga to get close then I guess you'd have a point.

Okay since we agree on pretty much majority of the points we may as well conclude our argument.

 

[Haizaki]

It seemed madara channeled susano to create that barrier hence why we never saw obito do so.

It's the property of the Gunbai

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[Draegod]

Hiashi could solo, adding others assure a win.

 

[Made in Heaven]

Madara mid-high difficulty

 

[neosmith500]

Hiashi could solo, adding others assure a win.

How can he solo?

 

[Draegod]

How can he solo?

When it comes to speed nothing in madara's arsenal would take any of them (Hiashi and neji in particular) by surprise seeing how Hiashi Can track and match Hyper sonic speeds no diff. And Hinata was able to locate a Tobi the instant he used Kamui (S/T aka instant). So keeping track of him is not hard at all.

Next would be to deal with his Mid/Long range attacks. Fire style is dispells with Pure chakra covering the body or Vacuum palm (since it's a fact Gentle fist Destroys chakra and chakra related Substance). Hiashi's Vacuum wall palm Plows through what ever and if it connects instantly kills Madara. So Ninjutsu Fire style is useless for the most part.

CQC is what Madara Prefers (when not using MS), No matter who has 3 tomoe, it is still 3 tomoe when it comes to abilities. And no matter if you can see the opponent if you cannot react accordingly. If 64 palms come into play he cannot defend on retreat (if he knows about the tech in advance ofc), No ninja in the manga is able to move every part of there body in about a second from head to toe. For ex: I may be able to move my neck, arms, twist my upper torso, legs, but the frame of the body cannot change and some how not exist or change it's shape (unless konan, Gentetsu, etc). With the hits coming from top and bottom before you even have time to blink, you will be hit!

So if madara attempts CQC he loses. If he attempts with the Fan they can Instantly Rotate to deflect a would be blow (not hinata ofc) and have the fan Bounce off (thus out of his hand) and counter attack with a Vacuum palm or 64 palms.

Next is Shadow clones (seems to be his only hope really). They wouldn't split up and leave Hinata so the Hyugas watching literally every inch of teh battle field would perfectly fight in conjunction and disperse of the clones. But then the question would be would the clones all have the fan as well? And How many clones? I'm going to assume he can atleast make 10 strong clones since his edo version made 25 with the help of Hashirama (indra/Asura combo). 10 clones let alone 1 clone isn't his style for 2 kids and a adult.

If he uses multiple clones (more then 3) he wins, but if he is in character (cocky) he most likely loses before he gets a chance to get serious.

 

[Icelerate]

When it comes to speed nothing in madara's arsenal would take any of them (Hiashi and neji in particular) by surprise seeing how Hiashi Can track and match Hyper sonic speeds no diff. And Hinata was able to locate a Tobi the instant he used Kamui (S/T aka instant). So keeping track of him is not hard at all.

Hiashi isn't keeping up with Madara at all unless you can prove to me he is above the likes of Sai or SM Naruto in speed or reactions. Him being able to track doesn't mean much when his body isn't fast enough to react just like Sasuke VS Lee proved.

Next would be to deal with his Mid/Long range attacks. Fire style is dispells with Pure chakra covering the body or Vacuum palm (since it's a fact Gentle fist Destroys chakra and chakra related Substance). Hiashi's Vacuum wall palm Plows through what ever and if it connects instantly kills Madara. So Ninjutsu Fire style is useless for the most part.

This is true.

CQC is what Madara Prefers (when not using MS), No matter who has 3 tomoe, it is still 3 tomoe when it comes to abilities. And no matter if you can see the opponent if you cannot react accordingly. If 64 palms come into play he cannot defend on retreat (if he knows about the tech in advance ofc), No ninja in the manga is able to move every part of there body in about a second from head to toe. For ex: I may be able to move my neck, arms, twist my upper torso, legs, but the frame of the body cannot change and some how not exist or change it's shape (unless konan, Gentetsu, etc). With the hits coming from top and bottom before you even have time to blink, you will be hit!

You prove my point when you said the bold. Madara using a 3 tomoe is superior to kid Sasuke using 3 tomoe so your point of the eyes being the same is moot. The first hit for 64 palms is the slowest one. Each consecutive hit is faster and Madara can attack from a 1 m distance whereas 64 palms will force Hiashi to attack directly with his palm. Most of what you wrote here is irrelevant as it is basically a no limit fallacy of no one being able to dodge or move their entire body just because you said.

So if madara attempts CQC he loses. If he attempts with the Fan they can Instantly Rotate to deflect a would be blow (not hinata ofc) and have the fan Bounce off (thus out of his hand) and counter attack with a Vacuum palm or 64 palms.

Then Madara attacks right after they stop rotating.

Next is Shadow clones (seems to be his only hope really). They wouldn't split up and leave Hinata so the Hyugas watching literally every inch of teh battle field would perfectly fight in conjunction and disperse of the clones. But then the question would be would the clones all have the fan as well? And How many clones? I'm going to assume he can atleast make 10 strong clones since his edo version made 25 with the help of Hashirama (indra/Asura combo). 10 clones let alone 1 clone isn't his style for 2 kids and a adult.

If he uses multiple clones (more then 3) he wins, but if he is in character (cocky) he most likely loses before he gets a chance to get serious.

Shadow clones should have the weapons that the original possesses or else Zabuza and Kisame's inferior water clones wouldn't have their swords.

 

[Draegod]

Hiashi isn't keeping up with Madara at all unless you can prove to me he is above the likes of Sai or SM Naruto in speed or reactions. Him being able to track doesn't mean much when his body isn't fast enough to react just like Sasuke VS Lee proved.

Bm, Being able to Spin your body so fast a Blur is only shown. Able to move your feet so fast you can perfectly spin in a non stop 360. The fact that he is able to instantly create the

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show he can spin before Madara could reach him. Being able to spin instantly to create a perfectly dense Chakra shield in Zero time>any movement speed SM naruto has ever shown! I'll break it down once you prove to not know how Rotation works and the mechanics behind it.

You prove my point when you said the bold. Madara using a 3 tomoe is superior to kid Sasuke using 3 tomoe so your point of the eyes being the same is moot. The first hit for 64 palms is the slowest one. Each consecutive hit is faster and Madara can attack from a 1 m distance whereas 64 palms will force Hiashi to attack directly with his palm. Most of what you wrote here is irrelevant as it is basically a no limit fallacy of no one being able to dodge or move their entire body just because you said.

lol No! Once in range

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! The moment a single hit is placed, you are instantly stunned and will be hit nigh instantly afterwards! And how is it irrelevant when it is life facts! How could you move your body a Way that is literally not posible except from some unique power/ability? Post a Scan of any regular bodied being being able (from any where on the internet, cartoon, manga, anime, comic, tv show, movie, youtube) to move there body a way that would justify your belief?

Then Madara attacks right after they stop rotating.

How when he will literally be stunned, knocked back, or hurt from the Rotation? Then the fact the other two would instantly in conjunction attack and protect each other accordingly! With out clones he loses badly!

Shadow clones should have the weapons that the original possesses or else Zabuza and Kisame's inferior water clones wouldn't have their swords.

But Do they work th esame is the real Question. Because we all know The beheader is not made of water and weak like the way Zabuzas clones made them seem. Plus the fact Water clones are not the same as Shadow clones. Add the fact the Fan is a spl weapon, and would it be able to mimic the og.. That would be a hard thing to argue tbh.

 

[Icelerate]

Bm, Being able to Spin your body so fast a Blur is only shown. Able to move your feet so fast you can perfectly spin in a non stop 360. The fact that he is able to instantly create the

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show he can spin before Madara could reach him. Being able to spin instantly to create a perfectly dense Chakra shield in Zero time>any movement speed SM naruto has ever shown! I'll break it down once you prove to not know how Rotation works and the mechanics behind it.

Spinning around isn't the same as travelling a distance. If that were the case, part one Neji would be some top tier speedster but he obviously isn't or else he'd have blitzed the hell out of the sound four pretty easily. Rotating before getting hit by a Juubi arm is a nice speed feat but do realize that Juubi arm was pretty distant so there was plenty of time to execute rotation. Madara will be nearby so that is the difference between their situation.

lol No! Once in range

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! The moment a single hit is placed, you are instantly stunned and will be hit nigh instantly afterwards! And how is it irrelevant when it is life facts! How could you move your body a Way that is literally not posible except from some unique power/ability? Post a Scan of any regular bodied being being able (from any where on the internet, cartoon, manga, anime, comic, tv show, movie, youtube) to move there body a way that would justify your belief?

Well if their striking speed was so godly than Neji wouldn't have claimed there were too many in that scan you posted (

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). I meant Madara can move out of the way much like how Itachi evaded Bee's sword attack and travelled 10 m whereas Bee still had his swinging motion pose by the time Itachi moved back to Nagato's location. There is also the fact that Madara dodged Tsunade's punch despite her coming through Mabui's tech at lightspeed. Sure Madara reacted to Tsunade's striking speed but she possesses vastly greater superior strength so logically the speed with which she moves her arm to strike her opponent should be greater than Hiashi who possesses no such physical strength. Sure the Hyuugas can use consecutive strikes much faster than the likes of Tsunade but that isn't my point. My point is about dodging the first strike and moving away to make the other consecutive strikes useless.

As for the Bee Vs Itachi scenario, this is what I'm talking about:

But lets continue

Another very impressive speed feat of Itachi's + an additional dodging/senses/reflexes feat, is this scan

Spoiler

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Here we see him being attacked from naruto, then dodging bee's attack from behind without turning around

All fine and dandy, but that's not what's important here.. what's important is this scan

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​

Don't see it? Not looking hard enough...

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After attacking, Bee and Naruto are in the SAME spot, same position, bee is still facing backwards and in the same manner from his missed attack..
YET
Itachi has made his way across the battlefield and over to nagato in ONLY SECONDS...

He can move incredible distances in the period of time it takes a ninja to even move their arm properly..

Anyway 8 trigram 64 palm increases in speed after each consecutive hit (

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)(

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)(

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). Basically first it is two palms, then four palms, then 8 palms, then 16, then 32. Each time the number of palms per panel increases by a factor of two so logically speaking the first one should be the slowest.

How when he will literally be stunned, knocked back, or hurt from the Rotation? Then the fact the other two would instantly in conjunction attack and protect each other accordingly! With out clones he loses badly!

The gunbai should protect him from any injuries or he deflects the rotation right back at his opponents. Not to mention who is to say he won't notice that they are about to spin via precog and simply move out of the way?

But Do they work th esame is the real Question. Because we all know The beheader is not made of water and weak like the way Zabuzas clones made them seem. Plus the fact Water clones are not the same as Shadow clones. Add the fact the Fan is a spl weapon, and would it be able to mimic the og.. That would be a hard thing to argue tbh.

Whatever. I guess his weapons will have shit tier durability because shadow clones have shit tier durability in comparison to the original.

 

[Unorthodox]

Sasuke solos both but

Madara negs

 

[Draegod]

Spinning around isn't the same as travelling a distance. If that were the case, part one Neji would be some top tier speedster but he obviously isn't or else he'd have blitzed the hell out of the sound four pretty easily. Rotating before getting hit by a Juubi arm is a nice speed feat but do realize that Juubi arm was pretty distant so there was plenty of time to execute rotation. Madara will be nearby so that is the difference between their situation.

Moving your Legs and Feet and Upper and Lower Turso is need to spin (fact one) the fact that he does it Nigh instantly shows how fast they can move there bodies. This shows there movement speed to be Nigh instant when using 8 trigram techs such as 64 and Rotation.

It takes Zero time to expel your own chakra from there body, then to spin when the moment it leaks. That gives madara Literally Zero openings! Like literally! There eyes have been shown to follow and Even See things in a Time freeze motion. Nothing madara does will overwhelm Hiashi in CQC.

Well if their striking speed was so godly than Neji wouldn't have claimed there were too many in that scan you posted (

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). I meant Madara can move out of the way much like how Itachi evaded Bee's sword attack and travelled 10 m whereas Bee still had his swinging motion pose by the time Itachi moved back to Nagato's location. There is also the fact that Madara dodged Tsunade's punch despite her coming through Mabui's tech at lightspeed. Sure Madara reacted to Tsunade's striking speed but she possesses vastly greater superior strength so logically the speed with which she moves her arm to strike her opponent should be greater than Hiashi who possesses no such physical strength. Sure the Hyuugas can use consecutive strikes much faster than the likes of Tsunade but that isn't my point. My point is about dodging the first strike and moving away to make the other consecutive strikes useless.

He can only strike 64 times not infinite. SO what was your point again? And no! Bee slow as sword movement is nothing compared to Hyuga's striking speed! the only ninja in the manga that has shown better striking speed is Guy himself! If he moves slightly to the left 4+ strikes will follow and meet him in every body position before he even thinks to make another move. When in the 8 trigrams there body not only moves in a way it looks as if they took one step. But it also makes there vision able to pin point every hit even when they are moving beyond human capability (excluding the elite Taijutsu speedsters).

Then you compare Tsunades striking speed to Hiashi... Who moves his arm fast enough to unleash a shit load of chakra over a great distance! 64 palms literally shits on any speed feat Tsunade has ever shown!

And No... You dont get that it doesnt stop at the first strike. lol Literally your body is mapped out and every hit is planned! You dodge one hit, doesn't mean the next 63 will stop or get any slower. As seen multiple times, they will all come rapidly and nigh instantly! With out Susanoo (or another method I wont mention just yet) he will fall prey!

As for the Bee Vs Itachi scenario, this is what I'm talking about:

Super irrelevant. As already explained above, sword that is heavy as shit and slow as fuq isn't even compared to even Hinata. Moving on.

Anyway 8 trigram 64 palm increases in speed after each consecutive hit (

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)(

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)(

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). Basically first it is two palms, then four palms, then 8 palms, then 16, then 32. Each time the number of palms per panel increases by a factor of two so logically speaking the first one should be the slowest.

And as shown in the scan earlier they can instantly just use the tech (as seen on the spiders). Once in range (8 trigrams) you are mapped and almost instantly blitz and hit! They hit with zero cooldown! If you mean the first one is the easiest to dodge then yes, but if you meant it is slow as in it has to build up speed then you're wrong. Each hit is planned, not just randomly fired. So if one miss or is avoided the rest will not stop all of a sudden since th etech is now activated and in full effect!

The gunbai should protect him from any injuries or he deflects the rotation right back at his opponents. Not to mention who is to say he won't notice that they are about to spin via precog and simply move out of the way?

How could it defelect the Rotation???? The Fan is not a mirror attack or compares. It absorbs the attack that directly hits the center of the fan, then turns it to wind and blast it back. Rotation is a continues huge amount of non stop chakra being perfectly compressed nigh instantly. If he takes the time to attempt to absorb all the chakra being produced he is literally a sitting duck! As seen

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he literally had to focus and wait till the attack was absorbed. He then had to

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r attack after the fact. Wayyyyyyy too slow! And what does he have to stop them from spinning again? especially at speeds that are nigh instant to the point they create (with chakra alone) a perfect circular defense!