【NB Debate Tourney: Zexion vs. PuppyDogGeneral】

[Tragic Nous]

Darui vs Deidara
(Zexion vs PDG)​

First Rounds
___________________________________________

Location:

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Distance: 25 meters
State of Mind: Perfect Resolve/ In Character
Knowledge: Manga
Restrictions: C0 and C4
Judges: Tragic Nous, Solo, Omnipotent, GwemBaba

Voting:

Spoiler

Unlike the majority of tournaments held here, matches will be held in versus thread section to allow debaters a more flexible space to fully improve their claims/posts. Comments are allowed in the respective thread until the debating starts and will not be allowed until after it ends: any comments formed during these times will be considered as spam.

Voting will be handled by a number of people: mostly by judges and a few by respectable members across the base. The voting will ultimately decide [as expected] the tournament’s set-up. All votes are required to have an explanation for the chosen. Judges will be assigned to matches once they are made. Three days are allowed for each round—two at the least, this allows participants the allotted time to format their posts if they wish: however debaters are not allowed to reconstruct their initial claiming; doing so will result in your upheaval in the tournament.

Match ends March 27 at noon [Eastern].

 

[Zexion~]

Hmm i would like PuppyDog to go first but if needed i guess i will ... and who is who if i may ask?

 

[Tragic Nous]

Listed under the character's name: Darui is Zexion, PDG is Deidara.

 

[Zexion~]

ahh thanks for giving me the Upper hand lol !!

 

[SilverSlick]

Can we take bets on this match?

 

[Varrah]

Can we take bets on this match?

What exactly?​

 

[SilverSlick]

​

What exactly?​

You know, bets through like rep and stuff. Wish we had Kumi though.

I bet Vorest will win this whole competition

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[Waltz]

I'll go first

 

[Zexion~]

I'll go first

Alright cool

 

[Waltz]

Eradication

---

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Darui is a highly skilled and capable Jounin of the cloud. He learned how to create black lightning under the tutelage of the Third Raikage, and in doing so he was able to make his lightning-based techniques even more powerful. His chakra reserves are great enough to not die of chakra exhaustion after using three of the Treasured Tools of the Sage of the Six Paths and still had enough chakra left to continue fighting. Denoting Durability.

On the other hand Deidara a S-rank missing nin has only increasingly shown his high intellectual capability; the ablility to quickly adapt to opponents fighting style and technique limitations thus, pinpointing possible weak-points. Being a given a 4.5 for intelligence in the Third Databook only attests to such facts. Though an akatsuki, Darui has shown no canonical knowledge of deidara; vice versa. Not actually necessary in Deidara's case as his fighting style works for almost any opponent.

Darui's down fall will be his overconfidence in his techniques as he begins his fights speaking

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to his opponents. Deidara's speed and Bunshin feints will be his greatest advantage in such a matchup as darui's reflexes are not only

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while using techniques but relatively slower than sasuke's; speed Deidara was able to anticipate. Once Deidara gets into the air, i don't see him having any difficulty as darui is a presumable close range kenjutsu fighter and his long range techs show no high potential damage. Darui's Storm element, though it can be directed, he is stationary while using it and would easily fall victim for C2 as they are several versions that exist and it is a technique no where limited to land mines. The

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from just

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element is enough to put him down. He has no possible defense for such a situation [

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] and would most likely sustain full damage. Black lightening also is a minor threat as it is not only predictable but easily avoidable by Deidara's speed [

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] not to mention the possible extension limits on black lightning itself.

 

[Zexion~]

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Darui

Although you are correct Deidara does indeed have the intelligence Over Darui .. It is all for Naught For A few Reasons.
One of the Major reasons ( if not THE major) Is that Deidara's Bombs are Rendered Useless When Hit By Raiton .. Which Darui is Obviously Capable of He could Simple Use Wave Of Inspiration that would create a similar affect of sasuke's Sword .. if he wanted To Use It On his own weapon.

Also Deidara has not been shown that he could use His Mine Technique without Tobi .. So it would just simply be guided Missiles From Above Which Darui Could Easily Counter With Laser Circus

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Or even Water Encampment Wall

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. Mostly Darui Would Have To be On the defensive But Although he is not as intellegent As Sasuke Or Deidara he was given a 4 in the databook so he should Be able To Pinpoint When and when Not To attack And Do so with One Hit Blows ( Especially To Deidara's Clay Dragon Or anything he decides to fly on) Such as Black Panther In Laser Circus ..

Both Deidara AND Darui Are both hot headed but deidara more so ... You could even argue that it is because of his hot-hotheadedness That he Lost That Battle To Sasuke ..

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He thought he had won the battle and let his guard down

When Deidara Is on The Ground Darui has a deadly Combo which is His water Style And His Black Panther which increases Proficiency when Used In water

 

[Waltz]

Spoiler

Darui

Although you are correct Deidara does indeed have the intelligence Over Darui .. It is all for Naught For A few Reasons.
One of the Major reasons ( if not THE major) Is that Deidara's Bombs are Rendered Useless When Hit By Raiton ..
Which Darui is Obviously Capable of. He could Simple Use Wave Of Inspiration that would create a similar affect of sasuke's Sword .. if he wanted To Use It On his own weapon.

Also Deidara has not been shown that he could use His Mine Technique without Tobi .. So it would just simply be guided Missiles From Above Which Darui Could Easily Counter With Laser Circus

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Or even Water Encampment Wall

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. Mostly Darui Would Have To be On the defensive But Although he is not as intellegent As Sasuke Or Deidara he was given a 4 in the databook so he should Be able To Pinpoint When and when Not To attack And Do so with One Hit Blows ( Especially To Deidara's Clay Dragon Or anything he decides to fly on) Such as Black Panther In Laser Circus .. Both Deidara AND Darui Are both hot headed but deidara more so ... You could even argue that it is because of his hot-hotheadedness That he Lost That Battle To Sasuke ..

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He thought he had won the battle and let his guard down

When Deidara Is on The Ground Darui has a deadly Combo which is His water Style And His Black Panther which increases Proficiency when Used In water

Being at an intellectual disadvantage is a great factor in any fight, this is obvious. As regards the clay, though raiton renders the doton bombs useless, your forgetting that Deidara is an air-borne fighter and

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has no way of gaining areal coverage to any where near deidara's height [

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]. The Jutsu requires Darui to initally use suiton then raiton afterwards, which is very time consuming in a battle that requires quick reflexes and speed. Darui's reaction time has not been shown as anything spectacular so even if he was able to use it in time and in an upward direction; on noticing the suiton deidara would simply divert his

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until the suiton disperses then redirect them to darui at a given distance. This could be an ongoing process and would only result in Darui wasting his chakra.

As for Laser Circus, don't be fooled by the time skips between panels. It was easily anticipated by Ginkaku. The Beams themself's though directed by darui travel jointly to penetrate a single target at a time. While using this technique darui himself is stationary as i made mention in my previous post and open for attack.

Spoiler

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It is the worst possible tactic against Deidara's multiple homing birds which may attack jointly side by side or from different angles [

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] as he can only destroy one at a time and would no doubt be shattered with the other incoming one at such high speeds [

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].

As regards the latter portion of your rebuttal am not clear on what "One hit blows". Referring to Black panther and C2 Dragon. Deidara hovers a very great distance above the battle field for C4 Purposes [

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] There's no real proof that Darui could extend Black Lightning to such extents as sasuke wasn't able to extend Chidori sphere past 5 meters; and this is heibi sasuke who had the Curse Seal and a larger chakra pool than someone like Darui.

 

[Zexion~]

Being at an intellectual disadvantage is a great factor in any fight, this is obvious. As regards the clay, though raiton renders the doton bombs useless, your forgetting that Deidara is an air-borne fighter and

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has no way of gaining areal coverage to any where near deidara's height [

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]. The Jutsu requires Darui to initally use suiton then raiton afterwards, which is very time consuming in a battle that requires quick reflexes and speed. Darui's reaction time has not been shown as anything spectacular so even if he was able to use it in time and in an upward direction; on noticing the suiton deidara would simply divert his

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until the suiton disperses then redirect them to darui at a given distance. This could be an ongoing process and would only result in Darui wasting his chakra.

As for Laser Circus, don't be fooled by the time skips between panels. It was easily anticipated by Ginkaku. The Beams themself's though directed by darui travel jointly to penetrate a single target at a time. While using this technique darui himself is stationary as i made mention in my previous post and open for attack.

Spoiler

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It is the worst possible tactic against Deidara's multiple homing birds which may attack jointly side by side or from different angles [

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] as he can only destroy one at a time and would no doubt be shattered with the other incoming one at such high speeds [

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].

As regards the latter portion of your rebuttal am not clear on what "One hit blows". Referring to Black panther and C2 Dragon. Deidara hovers a very great distance above the battle field for C3 Purposes [

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] There's no real proof that Darui could extend Black Lightning to such extents as sasuke wasn't able to extend Chidori sphere past 5 meters; and this is heibi sasuke who had the Curse Seal and a larger chakra pool than someone like Darui.

Well for starters what i meant By One Hit Ko's Was that The Lightning If it does Hit the dragon would Instantly Render It usless Just Like Any other Bomb .. And Actually you over estimate Deidara's Height Sasukes range was 5 meters and by YOUR scan He was only A few Meters after that .. its the birds That fly high and they are not able to use Guided Missles He would Stick With Small Explosives Which Kunai Would Be able to stop..

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Also Black panther went a fairly far distance horizontal whats to say it cant go vertical?

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I believe the only thing able to take out darui would be The c3 missiles Which Can only be used on c2 dragon which doesnt Fly Too High Darui could even do the same as sasuke and use his sword as a foothold? Which Would Then Enable Laser Circus ( not directed At Deidara but the dragon itself) knocking it out of the sky.. or even black panther and on the ground it is darui's fight

*edit- His Sword Fused With Wave Of Inspiration Would Also Take Care Of the Small c1 Bombs Deidara Uses From His Clay Birds

 

[Waltz]

Well for starters what i meant By One Hit Ko's Was that The Lightning If it does Hit the dragon would Instantly Render It usless Just Like Any other Bomb .. And Actually you over estimate Deidara's Height Sasukes range was 5 meters and by YOUR scan He was only A few Meters after that .. its the birds That fly high and they are not able to use Guided Missles He would Stick With Small Explosives Which Kunai Would Be able to stop..

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Also Black panther went a fairly far distance horizontal whats to say it cant go vertical?

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I believe the only thing able to take out darui would be The c3 missiles Which Can only be used on c2 dragon which doesnt Fly Too High Darui could even do the same as sasuke and use his sword as a foothold? Which Would Then Enable Laser Circus ( not directed At Deidara but the dragon itself) knocking it out of the sky.. or even black panther and on the ground it is darui's fight

Your mistaken. That scan was when deidara was first getting into the air. He was way above 5 meters by that time in the battle [

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] [

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] Your underestimating C2 Dragon It was no where nullified on contact with Raiton [

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] which is rather obvious given it's size and the fact that sasuke went a step further to remove it's entire wing. Black panther was completely horizontal [

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] and there's no canonical evidence that Darui can distribute Keitai Henka over Ration on the levels of sasuke so it is arguable whether or not he can get the technique in the air. Even if so, it would have limitations and height and possibly dodged by Deidara.

A bit mistaken there, those Guided bombs are C2 elements not C3. There is no need for any higher level jutsu when darui hasn't shown any solid methods of getting pass Deidara's intelligent use of C2. His fighting style remains the same for a reason. Applying sasuke's methods of victory to darui is arguable to a point that it is far fetched as:

-> He does not have Sasuke's agility, CS-2 wings and physical amplification to give him an extra boost to reach Deidara's height on the C2 Dragon [

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]

-> His sword is relatively shorter than Sasuke's [

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]

-> It's not certain whether or not He can extend Black lightning to the extents of Chidori sphere [

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]

 

[Zexion~]

Your mistaken. That scan was when deidara was first getting into the air. He was way above 5 meters by that time in the battle [

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] [

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] Your underestimating C2 Dragon It was no where nullified on contact with Raiton [

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] which is rather obvious given it's size and the fact that sasuke went a step further to remove it's entire wing. Black panther was completely horizontal [

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] and there's no canonical evidence that Darui can distribute Keitai Henka over Ration on the levels of sasuke so it is arguable whether or not he can get the technique in the air. Even if so, it would have limitations and height and possibly dodged by Deidara.

A bit mistaken there, those Guided bombs are C2 elements not C3. There is no need for any higher level jutsu when darui hasn't shown any solid methods of getting pass Deidara's intelligent use of C2. His fighting style remains the same for a reason. Applying sasuke's methods of victory to darui is arguable to a point that it is far fetched as:

-> He does not have Sasuke's agility, CS-2 wings and physical amplification to give him an extra boost to reach Deidara's height on the C2 Dragon [

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]

-> His sword is relatively shorter than Sasuke's [

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]

-> It's not certain whether or not He can extend Black lightning to the extents of Chidori sphere [

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]

Hmm well how was i supposed To know he was just starting

But anyways Im doing this in steps Now

Countering The C2 Dragon
Hmm i did not realize it was only c2 but that jus means it would Take Less Lightning To nullify It . One way to defend against The Missles Is To simply Avoid It

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You were underesting Darui's Agility he was able to quickly Slice Ginkaku's (or kin cant remember) Arm Right Off Without Allowing any time to react .

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also sasuke Was Able to dodge them easily without His Curse Mark
Darui has the Word Raiton Tatoo'd on his Arm symbolizing he has mastery Over The element so he must have A simple Raiton Jutsu That Could Defuse The Bomb Or he could Use a simple Black Lightning Strike To defuse it .
To take down the Dragon completely he could easily Use Laser Circus The dragon is a huge target and the tentacle Like Lasers would definitely Pierce One of the wings .. Bringing It down .

SO6P Weapons

Your also forgeting ( and so did i till know) That Darui is listed To now have the Sages weapons ... And With Deidara's Hot Head He Is bound to be sealed Into The Kohaku no jōhei

 

[Waltz]

Hmm well how was i supposed To know he was just starting

But anyways Im doing this in steps Now

Countering The C2 Dragon
Hmm i did not realize it was only c2 but that jus means it would Take Less Lightning To nullify It . One way to defend against The Missles Is To simply Avoid It

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You were underesting Darui's Agility he was able to quickly Slice Ginkaku's (or kin cant remember) Arm Right Off Without Allowing any time to react .

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also sasuke Was Able to dodge them easily without His Curse Mark
Darui has the Word Raiton Tatoo'd on his Arm symbolizing he has mastery Over The element so he must have A simple Raiton Jutsu That Could Defuse The Bomb Or he could Use a simple Black Lightning Strike To defuse it .
To take down the Dragon completely he could easily Use Laser Circus The dragon is a huge target and the tentacle Like Lasers would definitely Pierce One of the wings .. Bringing It down .

SO6P Weapons

Your also forgetting ( and so did i till know) That Darui is listed To now have the Sages weapons ... And With Deidara's Hot Head He Is bound to be sealed Into The Kohaku no jōhei

Falsity.

Darui's agility in battle [

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] is no where near Heibi Sasuke's [

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]
you shouldn't even compare the two. It required shunshin for Sasuke to dodge Deidara's birds, something darui has not been shown to possess. His speed feats are once again, nothing spectacular. Tattoo's and your speculation are not facts of actual jutsu. I have already provided highly possible counters for Black lightning, so there's no need to patter. Laser circus did no serious harm to Ginkaku and it is arguable if it would even penetrate deidara's clay dragon completely. Even if so Deidara would just make another clay bird and let that one drop to finish the job [

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] in which, unlike sasuke Darui has no way of escape as his speed feats fail in comparison to sasuke's. His chakra pools are also not that spectacular and his stamina is relatively low. You must be joking with the Information you mis-interpreted from Narutowikia about the Sage's Tools. It seems like your grasping at straws to provide suitable counters, may as well conclude this debate.

 

[Zexion~]

Falsity.

Darui's agility in battle [

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] is no where near Heibi Sasuke's [

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]
you shouldn't even compare the two. It required shunshin for Sasuke to dodge Deidara's birds, something darui has not been shown to possess. His speed feats are once again, nothing spectacular. Tattoo's and your speculation are not facts of actual jutsu. I have already provided highly possible counters for Black lightning, so there's no need to patter. Laser circus did no serious harm to Ginkaku and it is arguable if it would even penetrate deidara's clay dragon completely. Even if so Deidara would just make another clay bird and let that one drop to finish the job [

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] in which, unlike sasuke Darui has no way of escape as his speed feats fail in comparison to sasuke's. His chakra pools are also not that spectacular and his stamina is relatively low. You must be joking with the Information you mis-interpreted from Narutowikia about the Sage's Tools. It seems like your grasping at straws to provide suitable counters, may as well conclude this debate.

Grasping at straws? no Just exploring since i am not a darui fan at all and have not bothered to learn much about him untill now ( i also cant find his data book page)

Any who i didnt get what you meant Drop and finish the Job ..? the dragon only exploded after because of the mines Underneath which are not in play here since there is no tobi ? And Just because darui isnt as smooth with his movements as hebi sasuke doesnt mean he is non agile . Without the bombs underground darui would be able to flee and dodge right when the bombs are Shot instead of having to go aerial to avoid them like sasuke did. And Your Sayinng Chidori Stream . Is stronger then laser circus .? A KKG ? No my friend Laser Circus Easily Takes Down The Dragon Even Reaching Far enough to hit deidara as well Seeing as it is just as accurate as chidori Spear yet with a wider field of attack

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..
it is also used for all ranges and takes less time to activate then the guided missile

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which requires it to come up from the tail first

 

[Waltz]

Grasping at straws? no Just exploring since i am not a darui fan at all and have not bothered to learn much about him untill now ( i also cant find his data book page)

Any who i didnt get what you meant Drop and finish the Job ..? the dragon only exploded after because of the mines Underneath which are not in play here since there is no tobi ? And Just because darui isnt as smooth with his movements as hebi sasuke doesnt mean he is non agile . Without the bombs underground darui would be able to flee and dodge right when the bombs are Shot instead of having to go aerial to avoid them like sasuke did. And Your Sayinng Chidori Stream . Is stronger then laser circus .? A KKG ? No my friend Laser Circus Easily Takes Down The Dragon Even Reaching Far enough to hit deidara as well Seeing as it is just as accurate as chidori Spear yet with a wider field of attack

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..
it is also used for all ranges and takes less time to activate then the guided missile

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which requires it to come up from the tail first

Not Just the bombs but impact from the ground as it has been shown that hard impact causes the clay to detonate:

Spoiler

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Spoiler

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Am not saying he's not agile. Sasuke had to utilize orochimaru's snakes to escape the magnitude of the blast as he not only had to get far away bit high off the ground, darui has no way of doing so. Your not taking into account that the C2 Dragon is roughly 30-35 times in length the size of the average human [

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] The heavier the object of mass the greater the effect gravity will have on it's deceleration. A stone falls faster than a feather. With his speed feats there's no way Darui could cover such distances in a few seconds:

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Laser Circus did little to no damage to Ginkaku:

Spoiler

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As opposed to chidori Spear:

Spoiler

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The spear is a pure concentration of Ration chakra as it hails from chidori itself where as Lazer circus is Storm Release a combination of Raiton and Suiton; impurities denature penetration and damage levels. Hence the reason white zetsu were only electricuted instead of sliced into various segments. It's a far cry to say that it would actually Peirce the C2 Dragon but to go as far as deidara himself; the odds are against you. Once more, Deidara's homing birds are too fast for Darui's perception and he is naturally stationary using the technique and has only been able to hit one target at a time with it leaving him open for other attacks in the case of Deidara's 2 homing birds.

 

[Zexion~]

I Knew it wouldnt Finish Deidara i just said it might go far enough to hit him .. But no matter what kind of jutsu it is as long As Its Raiton it would Would Deactivate the Guided Missiles or the dragon ..

Aah to your scans about The Bombs detonating because impact doesn't prove anything ? The shurikan Stopped It And Deidara Blew it up with his own hand sign? it wasn't Because of the impact.. And as you can see deidara is only worried that he is landing on the mines ... if it would blow up due to impact then he would of been more worried about the dragon he was sitting on .. as you said hes not stupid .

 

[Waltz]

I Knew it wouldnt Finish Deidara i just said it might go far enough to hit him .. But no matter what kind of jutsu it is as long As Its Raiton it would Would Deactivate the Guided Missiles or the dragon ..

Aah to your scans about The Bombs detonating because impact doesn't prove anything ? The shurikan Stopped It And Deidara Blew it up with his own hand sign? it wasn't Because of the impact.. And as you can see deidara is only worried that he is landing on the mines ... if it would blow up due to impact then he would of been more worried about the dragon he was sitting on .. as you said hes not stupid .

Sasuke's chidori spear (pure raiton) didn't nullify the Dragon, why do you think Lazer circus (Unpure raiton) would do so? You must be fantasizing if you think that a single spear of raiton is enough to dismantle the C2 Dragon.

The falsity; bold:

[

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] [

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]