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Varrah

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Divinity:


An infinite volume or volumes are and is an unstructured field; the distance to which something can expand or is expanded. It is the distance or amount of expansion. This volume or volumes represents a formless state; a state devoid of any event, any motion, and any existence, aside from the prime mover. The prime mover is an initial force that engages or directs energy towards a goal. The prime mover is the Deidarabotchi or Jūbi; an entity that predates all events, all motion, and all existence. For these reasons, the Jūbi is nature itself and thus, everything is from it.

Possessing consciousness, Jūbi, whether advertently or inadvertently; it is the object that created all material, potency, and potential for any and all material and substance to mature or regress. The infinite volume(s) that the Jūbi preceded served as the space for the creation of the Earth. And out of nothing, the Earth was formed, and from the Earth organisms were produced, and these organisms that possessed the Jūbi attributes matured. Thus, Jūbi is the progenitor of the world. It is because of its attributes that Earth was created, and it is because of its characteristics that the organisms of the Earth developed and could grow.

Several characteristics of the Jūbi call importance, they are, creation, chakra, transformations, and an undying existence or immortality, it keeps these qualities as a natural body—that when compared to other bodies is unnatural—as they are but an offspring from the source. It is through this body and its transformations that the Jūbi engages or directs energy to and from. The point will be regurgitated: everything, whether conscious or unconscious is a creation from the Jūbi.​


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Peculiarities:


Jūbi is nature itself; therefore, nature is the strongest energy that exists. This energy is natural energy. Natural energy is energy that exists within the material of Earth. It is the pulse of the world, the existing energy within the atmosphere and the scenery or bodies of it. It is tied to the material of the world or products of the world that emit this energy and as a result any material that comes into contact with this energy can be subjected to it or advanced by it because of its properties, and because of those properties; it is the strongest energy that exists.

The aforementioned points: creation, chakra, and transformations, and an undying existence or immortality are the chief sources to the seen capacities laced within the story, all of which stem from the Jūbi. Creation is a unique product of imagination; a designed garment. For contextual purposes, creation is form; form is a designed garment distinguished from its substance governing its shape and structure. Jūbi as the initial force stimulates the events in the by its being by imagining form and creating its structures out of nothing—the degrees of its sapience may dictate the productivity of the created material. Fundamentally, its essence is sapience and its imagination allows creation, and that creation is formed from nothingness; taking on a shape based on substance that it is made from. Its eye is responsible for this.

Chakra is a natural product that turns into energy drawn from the trillions of cells that constitute an object’s body. It is a natural product because it is created from an object’s or person’s existing energies: spiritual and physical. Spiritual energy is the animated force in a living object credited with the faculties of thought, action, and emotion and it is often conceived as an immaterial thing—likened to the soul or consciousness. Physical energy is the animated force in a living object credited with the faculties of bodily application: exercise, stimulants, and training and it is often conceived as a material thing—material substance. Spiritual energy is the soul and springs from an object’s mind or consciousness. Physical energy exists is the body and is derived from every cell of object’s body. These energies exist within all living beings, and are therefore a supplemented effect stemming from Jūbi.

Chakra follows a strict framework: it can only be made at any single [given] time in occurrence to an object’s stamina. When created, chakra travels through a circulatory system—a system that interacts with every single cell and passes through every organ present in an object body—and is brought to one of 361 chakra release points known as tenketsu. For humans, these points release chakra and within these points are eight gates; they serve as the body’s limiter; making an object’s body weaker in turn for prolonging its freshness or liveliness. Bypassing these limiters enables an object to surpass their physical limits, at the cost of damaging, or rupturing the cells and organs present in the circulatory system. The circulatory system is damaged this way because the body lacks the vitality necessary to withstand such harm.

The quality of chakra can be altered to change its composition or convert it into substances or elements: these substances are lighting, water, wind, earth, and fire; yin and yang are energies that act as undertones to these fives and can be mastered as well. These alterations are known as nature transformations, nature types, or chakra types. All persons can use all elements to an extent, but having an affinity to one or more of these elements allows a person to control their chakra into a particular composition that allows them to manipulate that specific chakra type more easily and use stronger jutsu in that field; this is seen with the Sarutobi clan and their affinity with fire, and Kakashi’s affinity with lighting.

In addition, these transformations or types of chakra cannot be combined unless a person possesses the genetic ability or Kekkei Genkai to fluently mold their chakra into different ratios; creating new forms of chakra—this is seen with Hashirama’s Mokuton and Terumī‘s Futton. To further expound, Kekkei Genkai are the physical traits of an object or person existing on a molecular level.

Jūbi has a near limitless supply of chakra because of its framework: it is nature itself. Its anatomical structure should be antecedent or come before many of the organisms of the Earth as they are but byproducts of it, therefore, Jūbi—as nature itself—can biological alter its structure using this energy to strengthen itself. This biological change within the Jūbi creates transformations. Theoretically, this anatomically happens by the Jūbi passively absorbed natural energy amplifying the cells traveling through its composition and heightening the effects of its body—causing instability for defined moments. The spiritual energy or mental functions would become able to transcend certain boundaries and matter to be control through imagination. The physical energy or body functions would be subject to alterations, due to the body constantly surpassing its limit; possibly changes the appearance of the object—and only when calmed would these effects be subject to end. Those effects create or created points that allow the energy to be manipulated; which are then once again bolstered by the Jūbi’s rapidly produced cells. These points then can be manipulated because of the abnormal unpredictability and succession rate that the cells are created, dwelling the time the Jūbi needs to build up chakra; inadvertently leading to the Jūbi’s consciousness instability and the telomeres in its cells being regenerated. Because of its undying existence or immortal body, Jūbi can withstand such force for indefinite amounts of time, which in turn causing it to go undergo various transformations. These transformations or rather its body itself may potentially give it access to any and all bodily capabilities that its derivatives have or developed.
It was because of these peculiarities; the manipulation of nature as nature that the Jūbi possessed that created chaos centuries ago; and was not until order arrived that chaos was remanded.

To summarize what was said:

  • Jūbi—by itself—created the Earth and its forms.
  • The eye of Jūbi is capable of creation.
  • The body of Jūbi is immortal; it possessing an undying or limitless amount of vitality.
  • All organisms and their forms originate from Jūbi. This includes any and all structures they have.


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Order:


The Sage of Six Paths or Rikudō Sennin is a vital figure and mythic individual who discovered the truth of chakra and with it taught its importance to the individuals of the world. These teachings would become known as Ninjutsu: an art that uses chakra to allow people to perform paranormal effects. Rikudō Sennin possessed an ability known as the Rinnegan. An ability that can be seen as a dōjutsu: a skill stemming from the unique qualities of the users' genetics. A dōjutsu allows an object or person to use the inherent skill in their eyes to use chakra diversity in many forms. But unlike dōjutsu’s, it affects the user’s entire body and is known as Six Paths.

The Six Paths are:

  • The Deva Path or Tendō, it allows a person to manipulate both attractive and repulsive forces.
  • The Asura Path or Shuradō, it endows a person with mechanical limbs, artillery and armor.
  • The Human Path or Ningendō, it allows a person to read a mind of any target, which removes its soul.
  • The Animal Path or Chikushōdō, it allows a person to summon a wide variety of creatures.
  • The Preta Path or Gakidō, it allows a person to absorb all forms of chakra, including most Ninjutsu.
  • The Naraka Path or Jigokudō, it allows a person to summon and control the King of Hell: an unearthly being that can remove or restore the life-force of an individual.
  • The Outer Path or Gedō, it allows a person to rule over life and death.

These abilities are only found in the Rinnegan and they represent the Six Realms of Existence. Rikudō Sennin had access to Six Paths. The Rinnegan steered Rikudō Sennin to discovering the truth of chakra. It is an ability that originates in Jūbi, but eventually manifested itself within Rikudō Sennin from the unique qualities that sprung from his genes. It allowed Rikudō Sennin to learn the oddities of chakra, create jutsu’s, and spread his philosophy of it.

These abilities allowed Rikudō Sennin to seal the ancestor of the world or Jūbi into his body becoming the first Jinchūriki or tailed beast keeper in the world using. Fūinjutsu or sealing techniques is the only method that can work against the Jūbi as its body is immortal and only binding the entity to an object proves effective for extended periods of time. Upon becoming a Jinchūriki, Rikudō Sennin was viewed as a God. He was not reputed as a God until after sealing the Jūbi into himself. As a Jinchūriki, Rikudō Sennin created the bijū, chakra constructs and his children: an elder son, and a younger son.


  • The Elder Son inherited the eyes of Rikudō Sennin and his powerful chakra: the spiritual energy.
  • The Younger Son inherited the body or life-force and vitality and will of Rikudō Sennin: the physical energy.
  • Their descendants are the Uchiha and Senju.


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Lineage:


It is regurgitated; all organisms are a offspring of Jūbi no matter if consciously or unconsciously aware. As said before, the younger son inherited the body or vitality and the will of Rikudō Sennin. Mere fragments of the undying existence or immortality possessed by the Jūbi. The body of the younger son because of its vitality or strength is able to endure the distresses or transformations of natural energy. This body and its vitality, through unfamiliar means was scattered during the course of time, but stuck close to the recognized descendants of Younger Son: the Senju. However, because of the body being scattering through unknown means during the course of time, the abilities of it—to endure the transformations of natural energy—were found in individuals of parties or clans outside the Senju.
The known clans and individuals that possessed the body and its vitality of the younger son are:

  • Jūgo's Clan, for their ability to passively absorb natural energy from their surroundings, which causes their bodies to undergo various drastic physical alterations known as “Sennin Transformations” or Sage Transformations. These transformations allow individuals to attain achievements ranging from creating various weapon-like appendages to even consuming other human beings, as well as a general increase in their physical capabilities; but due to continuously absorbing of natural energy, it causes uncontrollable streams of power within individuals with this ability. Resulting in them periodically going into a raging state or psychosis within the individual(s).
  • Uzumaki Clan, for their incredible longevity and life force.
  • Kaguya Clan, for their ability to manipulate their own skeletal structure.
  • Any individual that has the ability to use or has the ability to use physical traits on a molecular level or Kekkei Genkai.
  • Any individual capable of becoming a Jinchūriki. Uchiha fall into this field, only because of their common ancestry with the Senju: Rikudō Sennin and by extension, Jūbi.

Though, they are outside of the Senju clan, they are all distantly related because they share the same common ancestors: the younger son, [except for Uchiha] and Jūbi.

The Uchiha are descendants of the Elder Son. They inherited the eyes and overpoweringly spiritual energy that create chakra, which in turns, creates their powerful chakra. Because of their inheritance of powerful spiritual energy, the Uchiha have an affinity to Yin. Yin is chakra that is created from a higher ratio of spiritual energy than physical energy and dictates the imagination of an object or person, and allows form to be created from nothingness. The stronger this chakra is, the stronger jutsu can become. This is different from the Senju who inherited a vitalize body or powerful physical energy, and therefore have an affinity to Yang—chakra created from a higher ratio of physical energy than spiritual energy, and dictates the vitality of an object and allows life to be breathed into form. The Sharingan is the result of an emotional stimuli that affected an Uchiha’s personality, and to this change, a special chakra was formed in response to his emotions. The higher states of the Sharingan or Mangekyou, allow creation to be made from nothing; an effect stemming from nature itself: Jūbi.

Switching between the forms or stages of the Sharingan, and possessing a certain body may be essential to gaining the eminence that Rikudō Sennin held, God, when he acted as a cover to nature.

A partially theory to the whole is that the Uchiha Clan releases natural energy throughout their cranial nerves or the brain of an Uchiha, when they are struck with a particular emotion. As a result, for the formation of the Sharingan; the brain mixes natural energy in with their chakra; particularly their spiritual energy to form a specialized chakra. This specialized chakra may be Senjutsu and is released more and more through the maturity of stages that the Sharingan has as it travels through the eyes. This influence causes an Uchiha eye to produce abnormal effects such as, seeing chakra, distinguishing forms of chakra, giving higher degrees of perception, and copying abilities that can be replicated on a physical scale. It cannot copy abilities that physically exist on molecular level or Kekkei Genkai. The higher the level of the Sharingan, the higher the volumes of natural energy that is released within the brain of an Uchiha. By obtaining the Mangekyou—an advanced form of Sharingan that creates powerful imaging from nothing: Amaterasu, Tsukuyomi, Susanoo etc.—the brain begins producing uncontrollable amounts of natural energy in them which immediately stresses the eyes, slowly causing the organs to deteriorate and gradually resulting in blindness. With each use of Mangekyou, the eyes deteriorate faster, as the natural energy is forming into the specialized chakra and is passing directly through the eyes. The Eternal Mangekyou, as a fusion of both eyes, filters the specialized chakra in a way that curves the blindness of Mangekyou while allowing the person to use their talents more leisurely.​



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End:


The Rinnegan has Six defaults abilities, the Six Paths. The Younger Son/ Rikudō Sennin are the source for all bodies capable of enduring natural, which resulted in transformations. These bodies are found outside of the Younger Son known descendants: the Senju, and are all individual bodies capable of having physical traits existing molecularly. These traits extend to Jūgo's clan, the Uzumaki clan, the Kaguya clan, and once more, any individual body that is capable of enduring natural energy. The Elder Son’s and his descendants: the Uchiha, are the source of creation. Their eyes can create form from nothingness and the eye higher the form of the eye, the more powerful the creation becomes. To say it again: all organisms are an offspring of Jūbi rather consciously or unconsciously and Jūbi is nature itself, the strongest energy that exists because of this it has the potential to alter its characteristics from the vitality of its body, and gain a particularly transformation or transformations.

The Ten Tails Jinchūriki gains from the Jūbi, its ability to create form from nothingness, chakra, its transformations and undying existence or immortality. Its ability to create form or a designed garment from nothing supplements and arranges the abilities of the Paths, which creates the full power of the paths: the ten worlds. The ten worlds are four additional paths to the already established Six Paths: Deva, Asura, Human, Animal, Preta, Naraka, and Outer.

The four additional paths are:

  • Shoumon
  • Engaku
  • Bosatsu
  • Hotoke

The Sharingan creates additional paths for the Rinnegan to use, and supplements the Rinnegan ability to switch between them. The Ten Tails Jinchūriki also gains its limitless volumes of chakra, and the ability to convert natural energy to chakra, and chakra to natural energy, which may be one of the four newer paths abilities. The Jūbi’s Jinchūriki also gains the undying existence or vitality of the Jūbi and its transformations; these transformations can be altered and allow the person or Jinchūriki of the Jūbi to change the structure of their genomes; resulting in the acquisition of all Kekkei Genkai such as Jūgo's clan, the Uzumaki clan, Kaguya clan, and any other Kekkei Genkai, including the Hyūga clan. This feat may be one of the four possible newer paths abilities. They are from Jūbi, and may be gained by becoming its Jinchūriki, elevating their power to that of Rikudō.

Well, that’s the hypothesis: Sharingan chief ability is creation of form, its secondary ability is switching between stages. Rinnegan has Six default Powers. Bodily abilities stem from the progenitor, and were scattered throughout the persons on the world. Jūbi is the height of all these powers, and, its Jinchūriki gains the ability to use them in totality. The Sharingan creates more Paths for the Rinnegan, and allows it to switch to these newly created abilities. The body of Jūbi allows it and its Jinchūriki access to all Kekkei Genkai, but mainly Kekkei Genkai abilities such as Jūgo's and Kimimaro's.​


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Homoousia
 

Cosman

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I think this needs to go to the manga section. Hate for it to get lost in the traffic. Gonna read it thoroughly and I can already appreciate the work ya put in.
 

Pavoneo

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While I never come to Naruto Discussion anymore, I see you've taken the time out of your day to come up with a rather brilliant thread, so I'll take the time to read it. Thanks for trying to up the quality of this forum section^^. Commence reading.
 

Transcendence

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I skimmed through it due to lack of time (I'm gone in a couple of minutes). Your hypothesis for Rikudou states his genes were the key to awaken the Rinnegan because of the inherent relation to the Jubi (as is for everything in the world). Would that not apply for someone to have the full, sapient Juubi inside them, as they have the full influence of the progenitor upon them?
 

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It (Rinnegan) is an ability that originates in Jūbi, but eventually manifested itself within Rikudō Sennin from the unique qualities that sprung from his genes. It allowed Rikudō Sennin to learn the oddities of chakra, create jutsu’s, and spread his philosophy of it.

This actually raises more questions than answers, why was Rikudou the only human to "awaken" the Rinnegan? What were the predisposing qualities that enabled him to acquire the said Doujutsu? why was he special?
 

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This actually raises more questions than answers, why was Rikudou the only human to "awaken" the Rinnegan? What were the predisposing qualities that enabled him to acquire the said Doujutsu? why was he special?

Was gonna ask this myself :|

At Varrah, I somewhat guessed that the sons were made and not born. Seems the easiest avenue for Kishi to explain this as seamlessly as possible.

And again, a sapient juubi might have taught him the ropes. It's quite possible those two struck a deal of some sort. Rikudou promising to teach the world of ninjutsu and that that would lead to peace. The juubi allowing him to do such a thing. His genes may not have played a part at all.
 

ethris

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This actually raises more questions than answers, why was Rikudou the only human to "awaken" the Rinnegan? What were the predisposing qualities that enabled him to acquire the said Doujutsu? why was he special?

i love how when a theory says something that implies the so6ps to be from the uzumakis, your all great theory!(insert intelligent words here) and than usually end it with becasue the so6ps is an uzumaki. but now that this theory says the uzumakis fall under the younger brothers lineage(atleast i think thats what part of the theory says), you try to contradict what he says by only pointing out that it raises new questions..and dont even try to comment on the things that make sense...smh..
 

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i love how when a theory says something that implies the so6ps to be from the uzumakis, your all great theory!(insert intelligent words here) and than usually end it with becasue the so6ps is an uzumaki. but now that this theory says the uzumakis fall under the younger brothers lineage(atleast i think thats what part of the theory says), you try to contradict what he says by only pointing out that it raises new questions..and dont even try to comment on the things that make sense...smh..

He raised a more than valid question. His own bias towards an idea doesn't discredit the question being asked.

All signs in this thread point to Rikudou being something more than special, and considering the themes in Naruto (like hardwork and so on) it would be somewhat diminishing to have something like that.
 

Transcendence

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i love how when a theory says something that implies the so6ps to be from the uzumakis, your all great theory!(insert intelligent words here) and than usually end it with becasue the so6ps is an uzumaki. but now that this theory says the uzumakis fall under the younger brothers lineage(atleast i think thats what part of the theory says), you try to contradict what he says by only pointing out that it raises new questions..and dont even try to comment on the things that make sense...smh..
You lack any kind of reading comprehension skill. Derp wasn't hitting out at lineage at all. He was specifically asking about Rikudou awakening the Rinnegan through the means Varrah described. Try harder.


Was gonna ask this myself :|

At Varrah, I somewhat guessed that the sons were made and not born. Seems the easiest avenue for Kishi to explain this as seamlessly as possible.

And again, a sapient juubi might have taught him the ropes. It's quite possible those two struck a deal of some sort. Rikudou promising to teach the world of ninjutsu and that that would lead to peace. The juubi allowing him to do such a thing. His genes may not have played a part at all.

I just find it a logical impossibility that they were biological at all. The chakra split (Yin and Yang) is too even. If it was through biological means, then there would have been a huge possibility that one of the two sons would have gained both characteristics of the body and of the eyes.
 

Varrah

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This actually raises more questions than answers, why was Rikudou the only human to "awaken" the Rinnegan? What were the predisposing qualities that enabled him to acquire the said Doujutsu? why was he special?


In layman terms, consider it a hereditary design: Rikudō Sennin possessed characteristics advantageous for survival in his environment; natural selection took place. These genetics obviously waver for his children in this thread, who I assume were created from Banbutsu Sōzō.


And Ethris, I understand your view, but don't bash others—nothing comes of it.
 
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Cosman

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You lack any kind of reading comprehension skill. Derp wasn't hitting out at lineage at all. He was specifically asking about Rikudou awakening the Rinnegan through the means Varrah described. Try harder.




I just find it a logical impossibility that they were biological at all. The chakra split (Yin and Yang) is too even. If it was through biological means, then there would have been a huge possibility that one of the two sons would have gained both characteristics of the body and of the eyes.

Considering this is shounen, Kishi could more than pass that off as "Yo, dis be fiction!". I was afraid he would cut corners on some of these things, but the easy split of the brothers using COAT is too easy for Kishi to ignore. You are right, sir!

edit: Actually what I should say is this appears to have been panned out quite well.
 
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Transcendence

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Considering this is shounen, Kishi could more than pass that off as "Yo, dis be fiction!". I was afraid he would cut corners on some of these things, but the easy split of the brothers using COAT is too easy for Kishi to ignore. You are right, sir!

I still have faith in Kishi. He'll take the proper root for this. It's one of the bigger cliffhangers left in the story.
 

Sir Blades

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Interesting, It amazes me how a human defeated the juubi.
 

phantomlord22

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This actually raises more questions than answers, why was Rikudou the only human to "awaken" the Rinnegan? What were the predisposing qualities that enabled him to acquire the said Doujutsu? why was he special?

cuz he was an uzumaki!!! :sweat:
 

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In layman terms, consider it a hereditary design: Rikudō Sennin possessed characteristics advantageous for survival in his environment; natural selection took place. These genetics obviously waver for his children in this thread, who I assume were created from Banbutsu Sōzō.


And Ethris, I understand your view, but don't bash others—nothing comes of it.

From a literary perspective that is Deus ex machina that suddenly nature (possessing characteristics advantageous for survival in his environment) deemed Rikudou Sennin "special" that he awoke the Rinnegan, Kishimoto does not work on that paradigm, it doesn't have literary gusto.

The problem I see here is that you are generalizing that evolution and natural selection are the only causatives in the existence of Chakra, KKG and the creation of Ninjutsu. Take for example the Elder and Younger Sons, they were, as we agreed, a product of Banbutsu Sozo, that in itself is not an evolutionary mechanism but rather a product of Intelligent Design. So logically, the origin of those powers directly coming from the Juubi like the Rinnegan must also be a result of Intelligent Design, and not a product of evolution.
 
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Waltz

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Grand thread, Varrah.

Though you generalized it: what would you say to Rikudō's discovery of chakra and surfacing of the Rin'negan having some ritualistic rudiments as regards the nature of his office----and possible access to the six states of existence?
 

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SirDerpObito said:
From a literary perspective that is Deus ex machina that suddenly nature (possessing characteristics advantageous for survival in his environment) deemed Rikudou Sennin "special" that he awoke the Rinnegan, Kishimoto does not work on that paradigm, it doesn't have literary gusto.

Scratch ‘n’ sniff the Uchiha.

SirDerpObito said:
The problem I see here is that you are generalizing that evolution and natural selection are the only causatives in the existence of Chakra, KKG and the creation of Ninjutsu. Take for example the Elder and Younger Sons, they were, as we agreed, a product of Banbutsu Sozo, that in itself is not an evolutionary mechanism but rather a product of Intelligent Design. So logically, the origin of those powers directly coming from the Juubi like the Rinnegan must also be a result of Intelligent Design, and not a product of evolution.

Correspondences amid assemblies of organisms were reflected as marks of affiliation, which fit proposed evolutionary alterations.

And Jūbi, I’d appreciated if you used the word logically better. Logically, speaking Rikudō Sennin sense of creation does not warrant the Jūbi acting it out. It may look but not do.

Furthermore, I recall myself explaining to your the sparks of this thread; all resolutions should have been handled there; unless you are still inquiring?
 

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Scratch ‘n’ sniff the Uchiha.



Correspondences amid assemblies of organisms were reflected as marks of affiliation, which fit proposed evolutionary alterations.

And Jūbi, I’d appreciated if you used the word logically better. Logically, speaking Rikudō Sennin sense of creation does not warrant the Jūbi acting it out. It may look but not do.

Furthermore, I recall myself explaining to your the sparks of this thread; all resolutions should have been handled there; unless you are still inquiring?


That is the problem with previous Tobi theorists, they only think from a plot logical perspective and not from the writer's perspective himself, they argued that Tobi could not be Obito because Obito was "too young" to have fought on equal footing with Minato, and that Madara could not have been alive when Obito was crushed by the boulder, and that Obito could not have grown so powerful in such a short span of time, then we find out that through Kishimoto's "divine intervention" Madara was kept alive by the Gedo Mazo, and that Obito was strengthened with Madara's training and White Zetsu.

And Obito being Tobi was done, in accordance with Kishimoto's style, for dramatic impact, what would create the most dramatic impact of Tobi's identity? his identity's relation with the protagonists (Kakashi) and the resolution of the question regarding the "unkept promise" of protecting Rin, compared to the other apathetic Tobi candidates like Izuna, Kagami, Elder Son, etc. and also the tension that would arouse between the Real Madara and Tobi, if Tobi was made Izuna then there would have been no friction between Madara and Tobi which would have ultimately lead to his defiance like we see in Obito now.

Kishimoto works on the paradigm of protagonist-antagonist "bonds" that a relationship existed between the former and the latter, ultimately ending in schism (eg. Hashirama -Madara) that is what we call "dramatic literary impact" so from Kishimoto's perspective, what would be the relationship of Rikudou and the Juubi? protagonist and antagonist? simple, they were once friends who became enemies.

It is a classic example of Tariki (他力) or obtaining knowledge and power from an outside source or Divinity, the Juubi, being friends with Rikudou, taught him the nature of Chakra which the latter used its principles in the foundation of Ninshū.
 
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KingHashirama

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That is the problem with previous Tobi theorists, they only think from a plot logical perspective and not from the writer's perspective himself, they argued that Tobi could not be Obito because Obito was "too young" to have fought on equal footing with Minato, and that Madara could not have been alive when Obito was crushed by the boulder, and that Obito could not have grown so powerful in such a short span of time, then we find out that through Kishimoto's "divine intervention" Madara was kept alive by the Gedo Mazo, and that Obito was strengthened with Madara's training and White Zetsu.

And Obito being Tobi was done, in accordance with Kishimoto's style, for dramatic impact, what would create the most dramatic impact of Tobi's identity? his identity's relation with the protagonists (Kakashi) and the resolution of the question regarding the "unkept promise" of protecting Rin, compared to the other apathetic Tobi candidates like Izuna, Kagami, Elder Son, etc. and also the tension that would arouse between the Real Madara and Tobi, if Tobi was made Izuna then there would have been no friction between Madara and Tobi which would have ultimately lead to his defiance like we see in Obito now.

Kishimoto works on the paradigm of protagonist-antagonist "bonds" that a relationship existed between the former and the latter, ultimately ending in schism (eg. Hashirama -Madara) that is what we call "dramatic literary impact" so from Kishimoto's perspective, what would be the relationship of Rikudou and the Juubi? protagonist and antagonist? simple, they were once friends who became enemies.

It is a classic example of Tariki (他力) or obtaining knowledge and power from an outside source or Divinity, the Juubi, being friends with Rikudou, taught him the nature of Chakra which the latter used its principles in the foundation of Ninshū.

@bold... nah the fans simply over think stuff. Hence, why the author suceeds in creating a good manga, fans like yourself create theories and so on. But from a writer's point of view.... things are never that complicated.


Juubi is to Rikudou, as Kurama was to Naruto. I'm pretty Rikudou wasn't just born without a rival , and immediately was hailed as a God. Considering that the Sage is shown to face the Juubi as a adult, it totally cancels off the Madara and Hashirama perspective for rikudou and Juubi.

As for the Obito part.. are you claiming you knew everything that happened with Obito before it happened?

However, Kishimoto from the start had already set up the character of "OBITO" , and the resemblance between the character of "Tobi" and "Obito" was too high, for it to have been anyone else. If Tobi wasn't going to be Obito, then the showcasing the Kakashi story would've been a waste of manga.

So Obito was already set in Part 1 to be Tobi.
 
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