[Suggestion] Potentially a new section?

[UchihaBrat]

please read the whole thread if you wish to discuss the topic, at least that is an advice, seeing as how I wish for dialogue to improve, rather than the first post being definite argument. Leaving non-discussion comments wouldn't recquire this in order to provide an 'updated' retort, as you're not participating in the discussion, please.​

I've been wondering a little lately about whether to suggest this or not, if so, how to and why.
So I post now with the intention of, rather than suggesting, hearing everyone's thoughts on it, as I haven't much of a clue about the design of it all, and maybe we can crack some ideas together about it?
Anyway, I'll add a poll about it as well.

The thought is a new section focused merely on Japan, its culture/tradition and maybe even history, is there interest for that. I haven't contemplated much over it.

Here are my arguments:

• Collective interest: Now, this isn't a certain thing, but I would assume given the shared interest in Naruto and many other series; that there is also a collective interest in Japan in general, if not that, then the culture shown through the series, especially Naruto as it is about ninjas and has tons of other cultural and religious/mythological references etc.
  You really can't read Naruto and not be thrown into a world of all these.
  
  I know, you could just google or use wikipedia for most of it, however that is not the intention with all this. Rather than having to open a new tab wanting to research about something on another site(Because we know how tedious this is ;D), let's have it here on NB(in form of threads on the subjects made by members), moreover, let's be able to give opinions and have discussions/debates about whatever it is we're reading, which you can't if you're not a member of wikipedia(I believe).
  
  I've seen threads explaining about some of the mythological references, if my memory isn't failing me. So why not collect these and whatever extends beyond just Naruto references, in one section/forum or whatever it is called, a section, its sub-sections??
  
  
• Overshadowed: Another of my reasons for presenting this is because of my experience throughout my time here.
  Many Japanese related threads, be they about culture, music or whatever, often get overshadowed and aren't as easy to find as one might think, in my own experience at least.
  The threads don't all contain Japanese symbols(Hiragana/Katakana/Kanji) showcasing their content, only ever hinting at most, unless the thread title is "Hey, Japanese rock here!."
  I myself make some of these threads but name them "Visual Kei," "Antic Cafe" or the like, not easily identified by those not already somewhat versed in it(Japanes music(bands and styles/genres) in this particular case).
  
  My thought here is that when you want Japanese as opposed of what you get from elsewhere in the world, go to this section, excluding the occasional wrong section posters and such.
  
  

I won't end the thread without having provided suggestions of my own about what this section could contain, and I want suggestions as well as opinions from you guys also!
Note though, these suggestions works both as such and much like arguments themselves, arguing usefulness.

Suggestions:

1. Cultural notes (sub-section or sticky thread): A simple thread or whatnot, where info is given on various cultural particularities of our Japanese friends, and also on what is shown in manga/anime, as I've come across people asking whatever it means when someone is having a nosebleed, what Tsundere means and why it's 'Tsunade-sama' and not just Tsunade, when Shizune calls her at least.
   
2. Mythological references(sub-section or sticky thread): What's Susanoo? Amaterasu? Do these mean anything but what is explained in our encyclopedia?
   This could be explained here.
   
3. Japanese music(personal request of mine): Often do I see threads about Japanese bands and their music miss their time in the spotlight because they're somewhat, I believe, alien to some. With which I mean that maybe because they aren't explicitly understood as "awesome Japanese music", which, in my honest opinion often is what is being shared, people just don't pay it much attention.
   I mean, if you've watched the anime, then you must have at least one favourite opening/ending song right?
   For me, I get so hyped watching the first opening of part two of Naruto(Shippuden, that is).
   
   Quality could be better, I know, but that isn't important here, it's awesome, that's it.
   
   
   
   
   Going beyond only openings and ending as well as OST, we could post about Nobodyknows+, know what this is?
   It's the name of the group that made the song, and guess what, they made others!!WTH

Anyway, these suggestions are but conjectures at what might be interesting to include in a hypothetical section, you have others, I'm sure you do! So please, come! Make them!



P.S. I would gladly help in planing/formulating this as I brought it up, even become a mod for it if I have to, would it help make this possible.


Edit: As another suggestion I might add that I have quite the insight on japanese comedy, at least for your regular NB member I dare say. I would definitely be sharing a ton of stuff about that!

 

[Ōkami]

i think this is a brilliant idea actually and i support it

 

[Zlad]

Nah, music is music

 

[UchihaBrat]

Nah, music is music

That's not the only reason you know~
What about the other suggestions?

 

[Ōkami]

Nah, music is music

he's talking about the culture as a whole not just the music

 

[UchihaBrat]

he's talking about the culture as a whole not just the music

Indeed!
about the music, it's just a personal persistence of mine not wanting people to miss the cultural richness there is to get!
Also, you might educate yourself in Japanese, listening to a lot of music and reading the lyrics! =DD *cough*

 

[Sasunarufan13]

It's an interesting idea - it would certainly help clearing some misconceptions about the culture - for example I get tired of explaining that Haku is not wearing a dress, but a kimono and that it's something worn by men, women and children -_-
Maybe there could be a small thread about the holidays even, which would maybe help stop the amount of complaining threads if there is no new chapter because it's Golden week for example.

But this would mean that there is extra work for the moderators - they already have enough with checking reports, moving, merging and deleting threads etc. An extra section would provide more work.

But I like the idea

 

[UchihaBrat]

It's an interesting idea - it would certainly help clearing some misconceptions about the culture - for example I get tired of explaining that Haku is not wearing a dress, but a kimono and that it's something worn by men, women and children -_-
Maybe there could be a small thread about the holidays even, which would maybe help stop the amount of complaining threads if there is no new chapter because it's Golden week for example.

But this would mean that there is extra work for the moderators - they already have enough with checking reports, moving, merging and deleting threads etc. An extra section would provide more work.

But I like the idea

Oh dear! Another great example why we should go through with this! People need education, lest we be flooded with prejudice!

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I've even seen some complain about Kishi and Co. being lazy, I mean, seriously??

Yeah, partly a reason as to why I'd offer up time to do that work myself, it'd be really interesting I think!

Thanks for your input!
thank you all so far~

 

[KiraGirl K]

I don't think it's necessary.
There are plenty of other sites and possibilities in the internet or elsewhere to get info about the Japanese culture.

At NB you can ask in the chatterbox or general discussion sections. You could also make a group for people who want to discuss about Japan in detail.

Also I don't think such a section will stop misconceptions about Japan. xd

However overall I think it's nice that somebody at least thought a bit about it.

 

[UchihaBrat]

I don't think it's necessary.
There are plenty of other sites and possibilities in the internet or elsewhere to get info about the Japanese culture.

At NB you can ask in the chatterbox or general discussion sections. You could also make a group for people who want to discuss about Japan in detail.

Also I don't think such a section will stop misconceptions about Japan. xd

However overall I think it's nice that somebody at least thought a bit about it.

Indeed there are!
However I doubt the amount of Naruto fans you'll find there range as many as here. Liking the same series is a good foundation for conversation, and as I mentioned, as opposed to wikipedia, you'd be able to directly interact with fellow members on whatever topic is being discussed.

The point of making it a section lies within giving it attention, chiefly. And as Bleach and One Piece have their own sections/sub-sections, there is less of a spread of threads on these series as well. You go there for OP or Bleach specifically and my hope is that for this there is enough interest, and as such I believe it would be beneficial to make a section solely for this.
The thought also, with exposure, is to more easily give members access to educative information, right here on the base, where again, you could discuss it with other members.

Hahaha!xd Well, just a wish I guess? Depending on how it is formulated/planned, it might at least lessen them, educating us all!

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I'm even thinking a light version of Japanese language learning threads/sub-sections. I do think some have an interest in the language itself, though seeing how poorly tended such sections are in other forums, it'll just be light, no hardcore lessons on different Japanese accents and how you speak them! Maybe the Hiragana/Katakana tables to help people get started and so on.

 

[Wesobi]

Though I'm pretty sure on of the gmods will respond, I'll just respond anyway.

If you suggest something, remind yourself the question: Do we need it/Is it necessary?

There is hardly any talk about the Japanese culture in general. Sure, sometimes a thread here or there, in the music section or general discussion but in total it just seems like a waste of time to make it and slows the servers down unnecessary.

 

[UchihaBrat]

Though I'm pretty sure on of the gmods will respond, I'll just respond anyway.

If you suggest something, remind yourself the question: Do we need it/Is it necessary?

There is hardly any talk about the Japanese culture in general. Sure, sometimes a thread here or there, in the music section or general discussion but in total it just seems like a waste of time to make it and slows the servers down unnecessary.

Hmm.. Well, contrary to need I was thinking interest.
If it's cold then it is.

 

[Wesobi]

If it's solely on interest we need to base our sections, we could add one for god knows what.

 

[UchihaBrat]

If it's solely on interest we need to base our sections, we could add one for god knows what.

Yes, that might be an option as well I say!

Edit: As mentioned, this is only at its early stages, discussion and suggestions are much appreciated, as I'd like it a, if not even section, maybe a sub-section based on what people want, related to Japan of course.

 

[KiraGirl K]

Well...
if you open a section/thread/group whatever for ADVANCED Japanese language learners I am in.

(But I guess I would be the only one )

 

[UchihaBrat]

Well...
if you open a section/thread/group whatever for ADVANCED Japanese language learners I am in.

(But I guess I would be the only one )

Ah, as Wesobi suggested, if anything, we start lightly with just a small part of the forum, only if the interest is there.
Moreover, as I'm about to learn Japanese at university, that kind of thread might not be far to distant a dream ;D Bet there are those here whom speak Japanese to begin with, we'll just have to attract them~ I've got cookies.

 

[Avani]

I have been at this forum for 4 years and I cannot remember when people showed that much of an actual interest in Japanese culture to have a section of it's own. When was the last time a thread about Japanese culture posted?( the Tsunami threads do not count :|) Hardly anyone makes any thread about Japan unless they don't get manga that week.

The topics you mentioned belong to the Manga/anime related sections which are using those mythologies not in a separate section about Japan. What is the point of discussing Susano's story in Japanese culture section instead of in a Naruto section where we are discussing how it is used in the manga?

The random bits about what a Kimono or Yukata is; why characters have a nosebleed or what are the honorific used in Japan, the manga culture and history etc can be discussed in any discussion section and if it's a well written and interesting thread we can sticky it. It may make a good addition in anime manga section.

The threads related with Japanese culture do not come up or not get that active because not that many people are that much interested in that. At the most 10-15 threads will cover everything NBers want to talk about Japan if we take the current trend at NB.

But to have a forum of it's own- people need to show much more interest in the topic and make original and real contribution. Otherwise making a section for Copy pasting Wiki articles will only get us DMCA notices probably.

 

[UchihaBrat]

I'll get back to you shortly Ira, please don't close the thread yet, I'm about to prove a point.

Edit: let's see here, this is what I've been researching as a result of your reply/arguments.
Some points I already had an idea of which manner I should retort in, others points I'm making clearer, because reading your post, I can't help but think you missed some of the points I'm trying to make(sorry if it's a bit long, but it's my wanting you to understand here):

Having been a member for a long time doesn't really matter as this is about interest AND exposure.
Interest is a present thing, if you've lost it, it's in the past(can be rekindled though, but that IMO, wouldn't really be lost interest, just simmering). So what better way than to inquire about it right now?
Here's what I've been up to, and before you make your judgement, try to understand what I'm trying to drive through here:
It's exposure as relative to interest. Not what Wesobi told of; clear necessity or need.

So, as you understand, this is a forum for the series Naruto, not explicitly Japan and its culture, those are of secondary interests here I dare say as Bleach and whatnot. Which is why I think exposure, if anything, would show the actual interest there is in Japan and its culture.
So, I made this thread in order to investigate just that interest, which(evidently, I'll get to that) shows how there actually is an interest, just that the subject doesn't get the exposure it could have in order to show it.

The intent of the thread is to see whether people actually do have an interest in it or not.
If you think it's unfairly made in someway, please comment upon that, I'll gladly elaborate.
Also, this thread asks merely of the interest in Japan and its culture etc., it does not ask about whether making a forum/sub-section for it is in demand or not(only hinting at it). That's what this thread does, and just look at what I did, I'm sure you'll see the logic in it:

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Instead of, I'm sorry and am aware, posting the thread in the chatterbox, which I'm sure would be a more fitting section, I posted it in the GD section. I did read your thread and Caliburn's post about guidelines.
Anyway, posting it in the chatterbox would hardly be getting it as much attention as it did in the GD section, no?
My point here is that, and correct me if I'm wrong, when people want attention(exposure), they usually choose to risk an infraction posting their threads in the GDs, knowing or maybe not knowing(misreading descriptions) it would be better fitted for the chatterbox, because it gets more visitors and not to mention, it shows in the 'latest threads' at the home page.
Exposure is kind of important if you want the attention, but in this case, also to show that there is interest. I bet a lollipop on it(I seriously love candy, don't think I'd just share with anyone if I had some O_O)!

Now, how does this relate to focus?
Simple: if there's interest, such as there was for bleach(for example), that would mean that centralising/focusing it in a section/sub-section or whatever, would be rather convenient.
Easily accessible, you would find what interests you. And interest there is. Just looking at what Caliburn is doing here goes for show:

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He's asking for interest, not really necessity nor need! Making a sub-section for any of these is convenient.

About the contents, yes, copy/pasting wiki stuff isn't really something I'm for either. When I think about it, personal experience/knowledge is much more interesting, which is why at least a 'cultural notices' part could work. After all, I know lots about Japanese customs without having read each and every wiki page about it. There are lots of other sources available as well! Versuvio makes example of one, personal! Personal experience would be elemental in such a forum/sub-forum, section.
Then there's music, food, language and whatnot!

As I said in my first post, these a merely conjectures, I haven't thought about it too much because thinking about it together would better answer to demand and interest. I couldn't ask for a forum of my own now could I(... Can I?xd)?


All in all, rather than having it scattered, for convenience and interest, making this kind of section(or whatever, as long as it gets a decent amount of exposure(proportionate to interest)) would, I believe and hope, be worth it.

Thank you for reading this tediously long post, sorry for that:ghehe:


Edit: please do not feel the need for excessive haste, I know patience(not being sarcastic, trust me on this one).

 

[EtherealBoss]

You know what, I've been following this thread for a few days, and I for one cannot understand why the mods are so definitely against creating such a section. UchihaBrat here had made a logical, interesting and perfectly workable suggestion about a sub-forum that would elaborate on many issues shown in the manga/anime that is the FOCAL point of this site. And what he has gotten is a fully negative attitude from the start!

Wesobi says we should ask ourselves whether such a section is necessary. Well... seeing as Naruto is set in Japan, and as such many japanese customs are shown multiple times, I for one would think that a Japanese Culture section would be rather relative and interesting, right? If anything, most of us are not from Japan, and we have very few chances to learn about the country's history and civilization. If one, let's say, cannot understand something in the manga/anime, they could come to this new section, and have their questions answered. And clearly, UchihaBrat is not intending to simply post articles from Wikipedia, otherwise he wouldn't be so serious about it. No-one who wants to copy-paste Wikipedia articles writes huge (xd) posts to prove their point.

So our mods are talking about need of a section; first of all, this site is not a business site, it's an entertainement site. I would think that, in an entertainement site, interest and further growth of the forum would go over simple need. So, would it only be acceptable to create a Japan section if General Discussion was flooding with japanese-related threads? You want us to believe that, let's say, the Sports sub-forum was created because GD was full of people talking about sports? In a Naruto site? What are the chances? It was probably just a few guys doing so and, seeing as mostly men are interested in Sports forums and there are mostly men in NB, the sub-forum was set up.

And to take this point even further, do we really need Naruto in our lives? Is it necessary? Do we earn anything from reading/watching it? Not in a practical sense. However, it is a medium that provides us with entertainement and the occasional informational bit, that would be elaborated on for all interested in the Japan section. Do we really need a forum to talk about a manga/anime? Not really, but it always feels better to share our views on what we like with other people, because we can understand each other. Is it necessary to have Naruto Roleplay? Not really, like before, it doesn't offer us anything practically. But I believe most RPers feel that RP is an interesting way to occupy one's time, put your mind to work while thinking up strategies, make friends, have a laugh etc. In all these cases, the profit is entertainement. Is it so outrageous to set up a Japan sub-forum, just because it would only provide knowledge and entertainement, like everything else on this site?

As for interest itself, as UchihaBrat very nicely explains, exposure of the section and its themes on the users of NB will certainly bring interest, as it probably happened with the Sports sub-forum. Even if the section doesn't prove to be a success, it won't really weigh down the site, it will just be staying there empty. Still, I can't help but think that there may be more interested users than you would expect. This

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here may give you a bit of better insight on the matter.

To sum up, I am sorely disappointed that the mods tend to easily approve uninteresting changes in technical issues, yet when the opportunity presents itself to enhance NB with an interesting, deep section with great potential, they are completely against it from the very beginning. I am expecting a logical answer to my points.

 

[UchihaBrat]

You know what, I've been following this thread for a few days, and I for one cannot understand why the mods are so definitely against creating such a section. UchihaBrat here had made a logical, interesting and perfectly workable suggestion about a sub-forum that would elaborate on many issues shown in the manga/anime that is the FOCAL point of this site. And what he has gotten is a fully negative attitude from the start!

Wesobi says we should ask ourselves whether such a section is necessary. Well... seeing as Naruto is set in Japan, and as such many japanese customs are shown multiple times, I for one would think that a Japanese Culture section would be rather relative and interesting, right? If anything, most of us are not from Japan, and we have very few chances to learn about the country's history and civilization. If one, let's say, cannot understand something in the manga/anime, they could come to this new section, and have their questions answered. And clearly, UchihaBrat is not intending to simply post articles from Wikipedia, otherwise he wouldn't be so serious about it. No-one who wants to copy-paste Wikipedia articles writes huge (xd) posts to prove their point.

So our mods are talking about need of a section; first of all, this site is not a business site, it's an entertainement site. I would think that, in an entertainement site, interest and further growth of the forum would go over simple need. So, would it only be acceptable to create a Japan section if General Discussion was flooding with japanese-related threads? You want us to believe that, let's say, the Sports sub-forum was created because GD was full of people talking about sports? In a Naruto site? What are the chances? It was probably just a few guys doing so and, seeing as mostly men are interested in Sports forums and there are mostly men in NB, the sub-forum was set up.

And to take this point even further, do we really need Naruto in our lives? Is it necessary? Do we earn anything from reading/watching it? Not in a practical sense. However, it is a medium that provides us with entertainement and the occasional informational bit, that would be elaborated on for all interested in the Japan section. Do we really need a forum to talk about a manga/anime? Not really, but it always feels better to share our views on what we like with other people, because we can understand each other. Is it necessary to have Naruto Roleplay? Not really, like before, it doesn't offer us anything practically. But I believe most RPers feel that RP is an interesting way to occupy one's time, put your mind to work while thinking up strategies, make friends, have a laugh etc. In all these cases, the profit is entertainement. Is it so outrageous to set up a Japan sub-forum, just because it would only provide knowledge and entertainement, like everything else on this site?

As for interest itself, as UchihaBrat very nicely explains, exposure of the section and its themes on the users of NB will certainly bring interest, as it probably happened with the Sports sub-forum. Even if the section doesn't prove to be a success, it won't really weigh down the site, it will just be staying there empty. Still, I can't help but think that there may be more interested users than you would expect. This

You must be registered for see links

here may give you a bit of better insight on the matter.

To sum up, I am sorely disappointed that the mods tend to easily approve uninteresting changes in technical issues, yet when the opportunity presents itself to enhance NB with an interesting, deep section with great potential, they are completely against it from the very beginning. I am expecting a logical answer to my points.

Sorry for writing huge posts..

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( )
It's actually just that, when I really want something said and understood, I can't really be short and concise. Gotta practice that I guess?xd

Not that I entirely disagree with you, there's a few points however, that I'd like to share my point of view on:

When you talk about need and necessity, I'd say that; rather than it being a sort of initial need(perhaps making it a bit more complex:ghehe, we make it one later.
I can definitely imagine how manga and/or anime becomes an oasis for many in the dessert that so wears us down(real life).
My point being; we make it a necessity, not entirely in a practical sense as you say, but for our mind's respite, though I'm not one to say whether that holds true for all or isn't related.

As for the forum, I think it's about making it a need/necessity there as well, and of course, not nearly as essential as food, that'd be kind of.. Sad.
Anyway, you can see how some really try to be recognized here on the forum, because irl there is little chance for that I think, as dependent on various factors(no one in the vicinity with similar interest etc. etc.).
So this forum has become essential for many in that way, and as for the practical sense again, I can't speak for all.
Entertainment is a given.

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That link, I'm ashamed~

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Hohoho~ It's as said in my previous post, a way to clarify my point ;D

Now, so as to not make my post seem as if it was meant to counter your arguments altogether, I'll add:

This section has as much potential to become necessity for members as many other sections do and has become, or so I'd like to believe.
Taking into account that; most of the sections on the base came to, I'd bet, existence because there was interest in them, as there would be in this(I hope).