(Facts and Manga pages) the Byakugan is the 2nd strongest dojutsu
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swaminaruto
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But what you've said mostly entails how the byakugan defends itself against the sharingan and not how it can retaliate...and also, when it comes to seeing which is better, we should not only consider a byakuan vs sharingan battle but also byakugan vs some-other-guy and sharingan vs some-other-guy battle...For example, I don't think a byakugan user could have pushed hashirama to that limit as madara did ...
bonzai9758
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nice effort. i think you gave to much credit to the byakugan and its users. when it comes to sensing techniques thats great but dodging or blocking is a totally different thing. i doubt their rotation could stop a susanoo arrow or a giant meteor. and i also doubt they have that much speed in them. next is that when danzo released the tree karen stated that his chakra dropped exponentially meaning the tree was a normal tree. but for the most part good job i give the byakugan more credit now. im still partial to the sharingan however.
IMO byakugan= 3 tomoe sharingan at a great potential (by that i mean not necessarily itachis sharingan, by time he got the 3 tomoe he was already doin some crazy crazy stuff, but below itachis level). MS is still sharingan, its not a seperate dojutsu, its just improved, like moving up one tomoe.....or two.
i wonder why neji had a problem fightin the zetsus in the war and atleast he couldnt beat a naruto with his heavenly rotation tech.
and byakugan is not that good.....otherwise madara would fight and obtain a byakugan easily without aiming for a rinnegan
**** UR THOEry
and byakugan is not that good.....otherwise madara would fight and obtain a byakugan easily without aiming for a rinnegan
**** UR THOEry
Very good analysis and thank you for all the effort. I agree that it was meant to be stronger than the sharingan but plot no jutsu killed it and it constantly got weaker compared to all the different sharingan levels. *shrug*
beastlyray
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SageoftheoneWay
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Since Kishimoto doesn't seem to emphasize the byakugan as much as before I highly doubt it will have much significance later in the series. And with all the power-ups of the sharingan and rinnegan, I dont think the byakugan stands a chance.
The strength of the any dojutsu is highly dependent on its user. Even multiple users of the same dojutsu have different degrees of ability. Saying the Byakugan, on its own, surpasses the Sharingan isn't a strong argument.
It would sound more like people saying Rasengan is stronger than Chidori...only to change their conclusion if asked whether Konohamru's Rasengan will surpass Sasuke's chidori.
In summary....do you think Neji (probably the best user of the Byakugan) will defeat Sasuke in a battle?
It would sound more like people saying Rasengan is stronger than Chidori...only to change their conclusion if asked whether Konohamru's Rasengan will surpass Sasuke's chidori.
In summary....do you think Neji (probably the best user of the Byakugan) will defeat Sasuke in a battle?
Zephyrus Uchiha
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Well... We've seen Sasuke beat Tsukuyomi with just a normal 3-Tomoe Sharingan...
So, all we can say is that, as with any weapon or equipment, it depends highly on how the user uses it... U_U
Still, I agree with most of your points... Except Kamui, though...
So, all we can say is that, as with any weapon or equipment, it depends highly on how the user uses it... U_U
Still, I agree with most of your points... Except Kamui, though...
SharinganWarrior
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Dear Unbiased,
(First of all, I've read your ENTIRE post, so please refrain from telling me to go read it again.)
I agree with you on some aspects, but not all. First of all, don't get me wrong, I love Neji and the Byakugan is badass and awesome in so many ways. I LOVEE NEJI & HINATA & the Byakugan period. However, the byakugan is "comparable" to the 3 tamoes sharingan, NOT superior. And it also depends on the user. Let's say for example, a Byakugan genius like Neji would win against any miscelenious ordianary uchiha. BUt, if Neji is up against an uchiha Genius like Itachi, He's roasted (itachi doesn't even need to use MS to finish Neji). Itachi's a master of genjutsu. You said "The Byakugan can sense genjutsu" I agree with that. BUT, that does not mean that he/she's able to "escape" or break from the genjutsu. And when going against an ultimate genjutsu like Tsukyomi, Byakugan won't even be able to sense it, or at least it'll be extremely difficult to sense it becuz those ult genjutsu is so powerful way beyond a byakugan's ability to sense genjutsu. Hence, they fall into the genjutsu & get mind ****ed.
A Hyuuga will die infront of susanoo (susanoo in its skeletal shape with a sword is all it takes). Neji's rotation is strong and i LOVEEE that ability. I agree with you that it can block susanoo's sword attack. However, how long can it block before the byakugan user runs out of chakra? Cuz the user have to constantly release a large amount of chakra during the spin. Susanoo just need to stand there and keep slashing/stabbing until the byskugan user runs out of chakra, stop rotation, and then get stabbed to death and die. lol He'd not even be able to dodge, cuz once neji use up all his chakra and the rotation stops, he would be way to exhausted to even dodge the fast susanoo sword attack.
Also, during the part when sasuke fought naruto when they were young. Ssauke awakened 3 tamoes and saw through and countered every of naruto's movement at first successfully. Naruto had to rely on the 9 tails chakra to counter sasuke's sharingan. Sasuke couldn't read and counter the "9 tail chakra" cuz its reallyyyy fast. The only ninjas that 3 tamoes sharingan couldn't keep up with with be those super fast ppl: like Minato, Raikage, Bee, Naruto with 9-tail chakra, etc. But yet all those ppls have to use their "ultimate" fast jutsus just to counter the sharingan. Without using their ultimate jutsu, the sharingan will defnitely still be able to read and counter thier every move.
For example: during the sasuke vs Raikage during 5 kage summit. when they charge at each other (sasuke using chidori, & raikage using Elbow Bolt). Sasuke was able to read the Raikage's attack, doge underneath the elbow bolt and pierce the Raikage's lightning armor. The raikage even commented that "I wear lightning style armor, yet you managed to actually hit me" SO the sharingan is fully capable to dodging those kind of attacks and counter (eventhough the Raikage was still already reallly fast in his lightning armor state). It's only when the Raikage go Super sayan and fast like minato, thats when the sharingan couldn't keep up. But that's whe the mangekyo comes in handy.
And during his fight with Lee prior to the chuunin exam. I agree with you that Sasuke was "able" to see Lee's attack but its true that he was NOT able to counter it because Sasuke lacked speed at the time. However, during the final chuunin exam match, it was shown that sasuke had trained a lot and his speed got sooo much faster, even paralell to Lee. Lee commented "It took me years to master that speed, yet it only took u one month to master it." So If lee and sasuke were to fight again right after the final match, Sasuke would not only be able to see through Lee's attack, but would have the SPEED to react and counter it. HAAH, ever thought of that? Sasuke would have the advantage, Lee has speed but he can't see through ataks (cuz he has no sharingan duh). Sasuke can see through attacks and have same speed as lee. (Note: This is disregarding Lee entering his 5 gates or watever) The only way for Lee to counter sasuke's sahringan now is to enter the 3rd or 5th gates watever and THEN the sharingan would not be able to keep up. Once again, that's when the MS comes in handy.
Another thing. gentle fists vs susanoo is just completely Pointless. Gentle fist user release their chakra into oponent's body to stop chakra flows and damge internal organ. BUT, susanoo is just gona block it so the user is simply waisting their chakra and putting themselves in danger by coming close to susanoo, they'd just leave themselves open for susanoo to atak & crush them. Gentle fist cannot penetrate susanoo. If anything, you would need to use "Iron fist technigues" that do tremendous physical damage (like Lee & Gai in their opened gates, or Tsunade's & Raikage's ultimate punch). Thus you would need to inflict great physical smashing damage to break susanoo (in which gentle fists fail at cuz that's not the nature of it) Gentle fist is awesome but its just at a complete disadvantage when fighting susanoo. Another thing is I hate when ppl say gentle fist is stronger than iron fist. Both are comparable to each other and strong in different ways. But anyway, there's noway for the gentle fist to disrupt the chakra of a susanoo user if they CAN'T even get through susanoo itself. The source for susanoo is the user's chakra inside their body. like i said, they would need to get pass the susanoo itself to get to the medium. But thats not possible for gentle fist. Sorry if i'm being a litle repetitive but i just wanna make that clear.
about susanoo's Yasaka Magatama: Boy that thing is powerful. Earlier u said that Neji's defense is compared to Gara's ultimate sand defense right? or maybe it's slightly stronger. But anyway, It took the COMBINED ultimate defense of Gaara AND the Tsuchikage's ultimate defense to "barely" managed to hold off the yasaka Magatama during the fight with madara. So neji's Defense alone will definitely NOT be able to withstand that level of atak. Think about it. He'd just get hit and die, or at least seriously injured.
And I love how you said Byakygan can dodge kamui, susanoo arrow, meteor, etc so easily. Are you kidding me?? I agree that he might be able to sense the attack, but The attacks are way too fast for him to be able to "react". Ok, i give him credit for being able to slightly change the course of kidimaro's arrow, but it was too fast to be dodged "complete." Thus neiji still got shot with the arrow and got seriously wounded (thank god he managed to dodged slightly and didn't die or else i'll cry). kidimaro's arrow is already capaple of doing that to neji. So imagine Sasuke's susanoo arrow! Boy that thing is HUge and super fast. which means that it will damage a larger area of neji's body and it'll require neji to release A LOT more chakra and power to "attempt" to change the course of the arrow due to it being so large, powerful, and fast. Hence, neji would need the speed similar to that of raikage in order to dodge completely without getting injure. However, neji DOES NOT have that kinda speed, and its too fast even for the byakugan to sense. Thus, he'd either gets seriously wounded, or die cuz he's incapable of dodging it. So sensing it is useless if one is not capable of reacting fast enough and dodging it. Sasuke's and itachi's speed on the other hand is way superior to neji's speed. that combined with their sharingan. They can sense/see through AND are fast enough to react to "most" attacks effectively (once again, this is disregarding ultimate super FAST jutsu, thats the only time where sasuke/itachi cant dodge effectively)
I can clarify on and on about the other stuff you said and more, but i'm too tire for that and I have to go do my college hw. Lol
But one last thing for you to think about. If you say byakugan is superior and can counter every sharingan , Ms, EMS jutsu. Then so you're basically saying that Neji can defeat madara and counter all his EMS jutsu??? Neji can defeat sasuke with EMS??? Moreover, The 2 most powerful ninjas at the end of the manga will be naruto & sasuke (come on, we all see that coming). Hence, neji byakugan will be no where near a match for sasuke's EMS. I'm sorry dude but I think you are out of your mind. lol
So in conclusion, the order goes:
1. Rinnegan
2. Sharingan
3. Byakugan
But it is possible that the EMS is even more powerful than Rinnegan. I forgot what episode or manga that caused me to have doubts on Rinnegan being #1 dojutsu. But Remember Tobi said. "Sasuke will be even more powerful than Nagato." Sasuke's EMS will be superior to Nagato's Rinnegan maybe? Just a thought.
And DON'T call me an Uchiha/sharingan fan boy because i'm not. I AM A BYAKUGAN AND NEJI/HINATA FAN BOY!!!!. I just learn to accept facts and see the obvious so I don't just make it sound like they're "unbeatable" just cuz im a fan of them.
But anywya, I still love Neji & Hinata regardless. Byakugan is Epic!!, I know that's one thing we have in common and both agrree on.
(First of all, I've read your ENTIRE post, so please refrain from telling me to go read it again.)
I agree with you on some aspects, but not all. First of all, don't get me wrong, I love Neji and the Byakugan is badass and awesome in so many ways. I LOVEE NEJI & HINATA & the Byakugan period. However, the byakugan is "comparable" to the 3 tamoes sharingan, NOT superior. And it also depends on the user. Let's say for example, a Byakugan genius like Neji would win against any miscelenious ordianary uchiha. BUt, if Neji is up against an uchiha Genius like Itachi, He's roasted (itachi doesn't even need to use MS to finish Neji). Itachi's a master of genjutsu. You said "The Byakugan can sense genjutsu" I agree with that. BUT, that does not mean that he/she's able to "escape" or break from the genjutsu. And when going against an ultimate genjutsu like Tsukyomi, Byakugan won't even be able to sense it, or at least it'll be extremely difficult to sense it becuz those ult genjutsu is so powerful way beyond a byakugan's ability to sense genjutsu. Hence, they fall into the genjutsu & get mind ****ed.
A Hyuuga will die infront of susanoo (susanoo in its skeletal shape with a sword is all it takes). Neji's rotation is strong and i LOVEEE that ability. I agree with you that it can block susanoo's sword attack. However, how long can it block before the byakugan user runs out of chakra? Cuz the user have to constantly release a large amount of chakra during the spin. Susanoo just need to stand there and keep slashing/stabbing until the byskugan user runs out of chakra, stop rotation, and then get stabbed to death and die. lol He'd not even be able to dodge, cuz once neji use up all his chakra and the rotation stops, he would be way to exhausted to even dodge the fast susanoo sword attack.
Also, during the part when sasuke fought naruto when they were young. Ssauke awakened 3 tamoes and saw through and countered every of naruto's movement at first successfully. Naruto had to rely on the 9 tails chakra to counter sasuke's sharingan. Sasuke couldn't read and counter the "9 tail chakra" cuz its reallyyyy fast. The only ninjas that 3 tamoes sharingan couldn't keep up with with be those super fast ppl: like Minato, Raikage, Bee, Naruto with 9-tail chakra, etc. But yet all those ppls have to use their "ultimate" fast jutsus just to counter the sharingan. Without using their ultimate jutsu, the sharingan will defnitely still be able to read and counter thier every move.
For example: during the sasuke vs Raikage during 5 kage summit. when they charge at each other (sasuke using chidori, & raikage using Elbow Bolt). Sasuke was able to read the Raikage's attack, doge underneath the elbow bolt and pierce the Raikage's lightning armor. The raikage even commented that "I wear lightning style armor, yet you managed to actually hit me" SO the sharingan is fully capable to dodging those kind of attacks and counter (eventhough the Raikage was still already reallly fast in his lightning armor state). It's only when the Raikage go Super sayan and fast like minato, thats when the sharingan couldn't keep up. But that's whe the mangekyo comes in handy.
And during his fight with Lee prior to the chuunin exam. I agree with you that Sasuke was "able" to see Lee's attack but its true that he was NOT able to counter it because Sasuke lacked speed at the time. However, during the final chuunin exam match, it was shown that sasuke had trained a lot and his speed got sooo much faster, even paralell to Lee. Lee commented "It took me years to master that speed, yet it only took u one month to master it." So If lee and sasuke were to fight again right after the final match, Sasuke would not only be able to see through Lee's attack, but would have the SPEED to react and counter it. HAAH, ever thought of that? Sasuke would have the advantage, Lee has speed but he can't see through ataks (cuz he has no sharingan duh). Sasuke can see through attacks and have same speed as lee. (Note: This is disregarding Lee entering his 5 gates or watever) The only way for Lee to counter sasuke's sahringan now is to enter the 3rd or 5th gates watever and THEN the sharingan would not be able to keep up. Once again, that's when the MS comes in handy.
Another thing. gentle fists vs susanoo is just completely Pointless. Gentle fist user release their chakra into oponent's body to stop chakra flows and damge internal organ. BUT, susanoo is just gona block it so the user is simply waisting their chakra and putting themselves in danger by coming close to susanoo, they'd just leave themselves open for susanoo to atak & crush them. Gentle fist cannot penetrate susanoo. If anything, you would need to use "Iron fist technigues" that do tremendous physical damage (like Lee & Gai in their opened gates, or Tsunade's & Raikage's ultimate punch). Thus you would need to inflict great physical smashing damage to break susanoo (in which gentle fists fail at cuz that's not the nature of it) Gentle fist is awesome but its just at a complete disadvantage when fighting susanoo. Another thing is I hate when ppl say gentle fist is stronger than iron fist. Both are comparable to each other and strong in different ways. But anyway, there's noway for the gentle fist to disrupt the chakra of a susanoo user if they CAN'T even get through susanoo itself. The source for susanoo is the user's chakra inside their body. like i said, they would need to get pass the susanoo itself to get to the medium. But thats not possible for gentle fist. Sorry if i'm being a litle repetitive but i just wanna make that clear.
about susanoo's Yasaka Magatama: Boy that thing is powerful. Earlier u said that Neji's defense is compared to Gara's ultimate sand defense right? or maybe it's slightly stronger. But anyway, It took the COMBINED ultimate defense of Gaara AND the Tsuchikage's ultimate defense to "barely" managed to hold off the yasaka Magatama during the fight with madara. So neji's Defense alone will definitely NOT be able to withstand that level of atak. Think about it. He'd just get hit and die, or at least seriously injured.
And I love how you said Byakygan can dodge kamui, susanoo arrow, meteor, etc so easily. Are you kidding me?? I agree that he might be able to sense the attack, but The attacks are way too fast for him to be able to "react". Ok, i give him credit for being able to slightly change the course of kidimaro's arrow, but it was too fast to be dodged "complete." Thus neiji still got shot with the arrow and got seriously wounded (thank god he managed to dodged slightly and didn't die or else i'll cry). kidimaro's arrow is already capaple of doing that to neji. So imagine Sasuke's susanoo arrow! Boy that thing is HUge and super fast. which means that it will damage a larger area of neji's body and it'll require neji to release A LOT more chakra and power to "attempt" to change the course of the arrow due to it being so large, powerful, and fast. Hence, neji would need the speed similar to that of raikage in order to dodge completely without getting injure. However, neji DOES NOT have that kinda speed, and its too fast even for the byakugan to sense. Thus, he'd either gets seriously wounded, or die cuz he's incapable of dodging it. So sensing it is useless if one is not capable of reacting fast enough and dodging it. Sasuke's and itachi's speed on the other hand is way superior to neji's speed. that combined with their sharingan. They can sense/see through AND are fast enough to react to "most" attacks effectively (once again, this is disregarding ultimate super FAST jutsu, thats the only time where sasuke/itachi cant dodge effectively)
I can clarify on and on about the other stuff you said and more, but i'm too tire for that and I have to go do my college hw. Lol
But one last thing for you to think about. If you say byakugan is superior and can counter every sharingan , Ms, EMS jutsu. Then so you're basically saying that Neji can defeat madara and counter all his EMS jutsu??? Neji can defeat sasuke with EMS??? Moreover, The 2 most powerful ninjas at the end of the manga will be naruto & sasuke (come on, we all see that coming). Hence, neji byakugan will be no where near a match for sasuke's EMS. I'm sorry dude but I think you are out of your mind. lol
So in conclusion, the order goes:
1. Rinnegan
2. Sharingan
3. Byakugan
But it is possible that the EMS is even more powerful than Rinnegan. I forgot what episode or manga that caused me to have doubts on Rinnegan being #1 dojutsu. But Remember Tobi said. "Sasuke will be even more powerful than Nagato." Sasuke's EMS will be superior to Nagato's Rinnegan maybe? Just a thought.
And DON'T call me an Uchiha/sharingan fan boy because i'm not. I AM A BYAKUGAN AND NEJI/HINATA FAN BOY!!!!. I just learn to accept facts and see the obvious so I don't just make it sound like they're "unbeatable" just cuz im a fan of them.
But anywya, I still love Neji & Hinata regardless. Byakugan is Epic!!, I know that's one thing we have in common and both agrree on.
SharinganWarrior
Member
That wprks with ordinary genjutsu. However, IF the genjutsu is too powerful,then the Byakugan user would lose control of their chakra flow, because the genjutsu user would be sooo good at minipulating/disrupting the chakra of the byakugan in such a skilled way that the byakugan cna't sense or break through it. That's what you call "POWERFUL GENJUTSU" like Tsukiomi or KA. Itachi stated "Only those with skilled sharingan can have a chance to break through Tsukyomi." Kota Amatsukami is just out of the question. It's just way too powerful. The byakugan can definitely sense and see "someone else" using or being manipulated through genjutsu (like danzo minipulating mifune during the summit). But once the Byakugan user "themselves" get caught in Kotoamatsukami or susanoo, they're done for.
SharinganWarrior
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