Tobi/ObitoTheories: What, why and how and then some

[Plunge into darkness]

Re: Obito : All plotholes explained

1. Minato become Hokage right after Obito's death, and the 3 great ninja war, one year later he attacked Konoha. Are you telling me he planned all this, got knowledge of Hashirama, Madara, Rikudou sennin and the Juubi in one year? Are you saying that he could controll the Kyuubi in one year? No, this is not explained.

2. He fought equal to Minato and Minato stated that he had a better space time ninjutsu than himself, and Tobirama. Minato even thought it was Madara, but no... It was Obito. Why wouldnt his own Sensei know his chakra? No, this is not explained.

3. Like I said first, Obito were 13 and died, and then after the 3 great ninja war, Minato become Hokage. One year later, he attacked Konoha and that means he was 14 attacking Konoha and controlling the Kyuubi. No, not explained lol.

School now, i'll explain all you replys later. Explain how Tobi could give nagato the rinnegan when Obito wasnt even born, and that was 2. great ninja war

Well for starters information is not something that takes years of training or wisdom to be up on. It comes from word of mouth. It's obvious obito didn't escape the boulder alone so this person informed obito. Think back to what itachi told sasuke in their fight. "we hold on to what we know and label it reality, but is it truly" this person who ruined obito's ideals and reality is uchiha madara. He helped obito, by rescuing him, manipulating his mind, and reviving his body with zetsu, which I believe contains hashi's cells. This would Change obito's chakra sig from what minato was used to, which is why he couldn't sense obito. Madara trained obito, helped him awaken ms and all it's secrets, and the konoha attack and control of kyuubi was his "test of progress". Madara helped itachi massacre the uchiha for vengeance, and passed down his info and plans to tobi or obito to resume madara's identity and carry out what madara can't while 6 feet under. And hatched a plan to be revived at once. IMO there are 2 tobi's and the mystery of madara is the mystery of both obito and zestu, and maybe even rin leading into the details of obito's ms.

 

[Chatte]

Isnt that where kakashi also saw Obito!?!?!?
Yet here we find out that he is alive :/
That could have been just his imagination for all we know......

Than how would Obito know Sakumo Hatake if he was dead?

 

[AbukariDogMan]

Re: Obito : All plotholes explained

"Obito was 14 during the Konoha attack" kakashi is 30 years old, the attack happened 16 years ago, you do the math.

 

[SilverSlick]

Meaning there's a reason why he knows so much, but not knowing the names of the tailed beasts means that whatever is supplying the info also doesn't have that info, which means he looses.

Lol, above was a joke btw. I see what you're saying now.

 

[BloodSeed]

Re: Obito : All plotholes explained

I see people just don't want to burst out of the delusion that Tobi is someone else than Obito. Well this is to help you face your denial, Tobi is Obito and here's a few of your claimed "plotholes" debunked.


"Obito was 14 during the Konoha attack"
I'm yet to see any true evidence about him being 14 during the Konoha attack, and I really don't see where the hell people pulled this crap out of. Anti-Obito theorists just made this up to have the whole timeline plot hole, so I don't see it as a valid argument.

"Obito could not have fought Minato with his combat experience"
Obito did not defeat Minato, he got his ass kicked hard. He didn't even manage to land a blow on Minato. So don't talk as if they were on the same levels.

"Obito could not have summoned the Kyuubi at his age"
Again, there's no evidence about him being 14, but let's assume your nonsense is true and he was 14, so what? Naruto has been cheating his way out of fights with the Kyuubi ever since he was 13. And at 16 he's mastered it to a whole different level than Obito could ever have. When you're a Uchiha and know the right jutsu to do it, what's stopping you from doing so?

"Obito could not have manipulated the Mizukage"
We have very, very little information about this, and everyone's been jumping into the conclusion that the Mizukage was under a genjutsu. But last I checked the only person in the entire shinobi world capable of manipulating people to such an extent is Uchiha Shisui, and his eyes ended up in Itachi and Danzo's possession, not Obito's. What if Obito simply had him blackmailed? We don't know anything about this so this shouldn't even be an argument for any side.

"Obito could not have given Rinnegan to Nagato"
It wasn't Obito who gave him Rinnegan, it was Madara himself before he died.

"Obito could not have helped Yahiko start the Akatsuki"
People think Tobi started the Akatsuki with Yahiko because they believe he's Madara's secret assistant. Well sorry to burst your bubble but Madara's almost certainly been referring to Zetsu as his assistant all this time. We know Madara got his hands on Hashirama DNA, and it's easy to assume he just somehow got Zetsu made out of it. Zetsu got entrusted the mission of recruiting members and finding someone like Obito to take over later on.

"Obito would not have turned evil"
Because "turning" evil isn't a part of these series, I mean Sasuke, Nagato, Konan, and a few others didn't just decide to have their justice done against Konoha. Unless you watch this through Kishimoto's eyes where Naruto is the ultimate form of justice, there's no good and evil in these series, Konohagakure are also jerks who've been abusing of plot no jutsu since the dawn of time to dictate their rules over others, including a clan of their own, the Uchiha. There's plenty of reasons to "turn evil".

"Obito was dead"
Well clearly he's not so dead given he's walking around right now. Orochimaru got killed and then sealed for eternity in a sword that can never be recovered again (due to Itachi being dead), yet he just walked back into the series as if it were is daily routine. So why are you surprised that Obito somehow survived that boulder?

"Obito was unskilled"
So was Naruto and how he's completely overpowered.

... if you got any more ideas bring them in, getting bored now.

EDIT: Here's some more

Obito could not know about Hashirama and Madara
Why the hell not? Everyone who's curious enough does. Besides, he just got all he needed to know from Zetsu. Everything Madara knew, Zetsu knows. Everything Zetsu knows, Obito knows. It's that simple.

yeah minato was a midjet thats why they are the same height

You must be registered for see images

 

[KidGamer65]

Re: Obito : All plotholes explained

I see people just don't want to burst out of the delusion that Tobi is someone else than Obito. Well this is to help you face your denial, Tobi is Obito and here's a few of your claimed "plotholes" debunked.


"Obito was 14 during the Konoha attack"
I'm yet to see any true evidence about him being 14 during the Konoha attack, and I really don't see where the hell people pulled this crap out of. Anti-Obito theorists just made this up to have the whole timeline plot hole, so I don't see it as a valid argument.

"Obito could not have fought Minato with his combat experience"
Obito did not defeat Minato, he got his ass kicked hard. He didn't even manage to land a blow on Minato. So don't talk as if they were on the same levels.

"Obito could not have summoned the Kyuubi at his age"
Again, there's no evidence about him being 14, but let's assume your nonsense is true and he was 14, so what? Naruto has been cheating his way out of fights with the Kyuubi ever since he was 13. And at 16 he's mastered it to a whole different level than Obito could ever have. When you're a Uchiha and know the right jutsu to do it, what's stopping you from doing so?

"Obito could not have manipulated the Mizukage"
We have very, very little information about this, and everyone's been jumping into the conclusion that the Mizukage was under a genjutsu. But last I checked the only person in the entire shinobi world capable of manipulating people to such an extent is Uchiha Shisui, and his eyes ended up in Itachi and Danzo's possession, not Obito's. What if Obito simply had him blackmailed? We don't know anything about this so this shouldn't even be an argument for any side.

"Obito could not have given Rinnegan to Nagato"
It wasn't Obito who gave him Rinnegan, it was Madara himself before he died.

"Obito could not have helped Yahiko start the Akatsuki"
People think Tobi started the Akatsuki with Yahiko because they believe he's Madara's secret assistant. Well sorry to burst your bubble but Madara's almost certainly been referring to Zetsu as his assistant all this time. We know Madara got his hands on Hashirama DNA, and it's easy to assume he just somehow got Zetsu made out of it. Zetsu got entrusted the mission of recruiting members and finding someone like Obito to take over later on.

"Obito would not have turned evil"
Because "turning" evil isn't a part of these series, I mean Sasuke, Nagato, Konan, and a few others didn't just decide to have their justice done against Konoha. Unless you watch this through Kishimoto's eyes where Naruto is the ultimate form of justice, there's no good and evil in these series, Konohagakure are also jerks who've been abusing of plot no jutsu since the dawn of time to dictate their rules over others, including a clan of their own, the Uchiha. There's plenty of reasons to "turn evil".

"Obito was dead"
Well clearly he's not so dead given he's walking around right now. Orochimaru got killed and then sealed for eternity in a sword that can never be recovered again (due to Itachi being dead), yet he just walked back into the series as if it were is daily routine. So why are you surprised that Obito somehow survived that boulder?

"Obito was unskilled"
So was Naruto and how he's completely overpowered.

... if you got any more ideas bring them in, getting bored now.

EDIT: Here's some more

Obito could not know about Hashirama and Madara
Why the hell not? Everyone who's curious enough does. Besides, he just got all he needed to know from Zetsu. Everything Madara knew, Zetsu knows. Everything Zetsu knows, Obito knows. It's that simple.

Most of these reasons are pure bullshit, especially the bolded since Kishimoto said that they know each other, Kishimoto's word>Your BS

 

[NarutoKage2]

Re: Obito : All plotholes explained

Than explain the particular use of the explanatory note. Why wouldn't he state that "He is Obito" instead of "His name is Obito".

His name is Obito = / = He is Obito.

The manga is in japaneese, but even then its pretty fcking clear that tobi is obito. Hint: read the title of the chapter.

 

[Honord Sage]

Re: "tobi" is not obito

Read the chapter that shows the masked man tell Konan that he gave it to Nagato and spurred Yahiko to starting Akatsuki. Madara was dead which we all know now since hes been revived

Like Obama saying you din't built that. Just because He said it doesn't make it so Ego,Ego makes fools of manny.

 

[NarutoKage2]

Re: Obito : All plotholes explained

Most of these reasons are pure bullshit, especially the bolded since Kishimoto said that they know each other, Kishimoto's word>Your BS

Kishis words= his name is obito. Now fck off.

 

[Shouten]

Re: Obito : All plotholes explained

How do you explain them knowing each other then?

How do you explain something that never happened in the first place?

Unless you are the author or part of the animation team or scriptwriters, you can never explain something like that. A lot of theories are too complicated and far fetched in the first place.

 

[KidGamer65]

Re: Obito : All plotholes explained

Kishis words= his name is obito. Now fck off.

What the hell are you talking about moronic troll, i didn't say he was Obito. OP is saying the interview with Kishimoto was fake so i'm telling him it wasn't, so why don't you learn how to read before coming back on here, dumbass.

 

[Plunge into darkness]

Re: Obito : All plotholes explained

Obito only connects to Kakashi and just barely Guy. It canonically makes no sense for Tobi to be Obito, not complaining, it makes for better story, but it makes no sense whatsoever. Shisui influenced many events due to his Kotoamatsukami, which makes him a main storyline character, and Izuna with being the cause of Madara's evolution into extreme power with the EMS and possible further evolution into the Rinnegan.
But in the timeline of events, nothing makes sense.....

Obito connects with sasuke because he once loved and ended up carrying hatred because of his love in the end.
He connects with naruto because they shared similar traits paths and dreams as children, but obito's path is the flipsise to naruto's
He connects with kakashi for deep friendship and emotional reasons and is also the man who changed his life
He grew up with gai asuma shikaku chouza Rin kurenai anko etc.
He relates to Sakura for being the black sheep of his team and feeling useless at times
He feels like he gave his life for his comrades which was in vein since they didn't keep their promises anyway ( which he mentioned to naruto at the land of iron ) and breeds a hatred of konoha, feeling them being responsible for his twist of fate and has been manipulated by madara and his pain into obtaining a sick kind of peace.

He connects deeply with the main characters and the ideas displayed in shippuden overall, you're ignorant to miss this. He is the ultimate 180, flipside when pure becomes tainted, to change lives for the better yet put pasin and suffering in them, to love and hate, and most importantly to want to be a protector of peace but become a harbinger of war. He is the best choice hands down explain to me if izuna would offer all of this. Sure izuna and shish were powerful interesting and we're all curious but they don't bring what obito does plot wise.

 

[SSJ3Gotenks]

Re: "tobi" is not obito

The anime is almost exactly the same as the manga so ur argument is invalid.

Are you high????

The anime is almost never the same as the manga and when it is right it is so mixed up and interlaced with fillers that it is almost impossible to tell the truth unless you have actually read the manga so no your argument is invalid.

 

[Shouten]

Re: Obito : All plotholes explained

Not that I disagree with you or anything (in fact, I don't give theories, I just wait) but how would you explain this...

How did Obito know so much about the Juubi, SO6P, Rinnegan etc.? The youngsters of that time believed SO6P was a myth.

How about stop questioning someone who does not have the means the know the entire plot of the story.
That answer to your question is obviously going to be revealed by a story to be told by Obito.

 

[alexu9696]

Re: "tobi" is not obito

This is getting so pathetic, You will go mad next chapter when Obito tells Kakashi what happen that day. And even after you here and see it you may still be in denial.

if that happen nobody will be in denial ... but we need some good explination

 

[esaboturaneht]

Re: Obito : All plotholes explained

Obito could have been 15, not everyone in all the teams are exactly the same age.
A year went by for naruto and look how much he's improved. He started off at chuunin level and now hes high kage level. Whose to say the same didn't happen to obito? As far as i can remember obito hadn't unlocked the full sharingan and if you watch naruto vs sasuke part 1 you'll see how stronger you get when you do unlock the 3rd part. Obito was blessed with amazing ocular powers that don't seem too hard to use and thats all he used against minato other than the kyuubi that had been successfully controlled by every other ninja who tried Madara and sasuke (sasuke dispelled the 9 tails inside naruto if you remember) So as long as you know the right jutsu, maybe its not too hard. But obito still got his arse kicked anyway. It couldn't have been anyone else since it was obito's eye powers being used, so unless someone took obito's eye and gave it back it wasn't anyone other than obito. The guy standing before kakashi now looks like and obito and from what we've seen so far still has obito's personality (or at least some of it) why? Because he knows kakashi and guy personally, Izuna and kagami do not. He also has a grudge against kakashi probably cause he failed to protect Rin which were Obito's 'dying' words. and so blamed the war for her death and decided to do the Moon's eye plan.

9 tailed attack plot hole... Check

 

[Sentinelsgalore]

Re: Obito : All plotholes explained

Kisame regonized Madara and Obito as the same person, therefore Obito must have been the one at the Uchiha massacre and the one who controlled the Fourth Mizukage. My question is how could Obito have controlled the Mizukage if he was supposed to be 9? Zabuza is the same age as kakashi and Zabua was 9 when he ended the period of the bloody mist.

 

[Shouten]

Re: Obito : All plotholes explained

They are both underachievers.
Both are a disgrace. Naruto being a jinchuriki and Obito being a weak Uchiha.
However, both took the opposite paths.
Naruto has Senju's/Uzumaki's/Konoha's will of fire, and he strive to be the best, making him overpowered as we know him now. However, Obito has the Uchiha's curse of hatred.
Unlike the ALL the other villains who are described to be inborn geniuses and have amazing skill since there were fetuses, Obito is once an utter failure.
Obito is the mirror villain of Naruto, which would make him perfect as the bad guy.

 

[thai sage]

Re: Obito : All plotholes explained

I see people just don't want to burst out of the delusion that Tobi is someone else than Obito. Well this is to help you face your denial, Tobi is Obito and here's a few of your claimed "plotholes" debunked.


"Obito was 14 during the Konoha attack"
I'm yet to see any true evidence about him being 14 during the Konoha attack, and I really don't see where the hell people pulled this crap out of. Anti-Obito theorists just made this up to have the whole timeline plot hole, so I don't see it as a valid argument.

"Obito could not have fought Minato with his combat experience"
Obito did not defeat Minato, he got his ass kicked hard. He didn't even manage to land a blow on Minato. So don't talk as if they were on the same levels.

"Obito could not have summoned the Kyuubi at his age"
Again, there's no evidence about him being 14, but let's assume your nonsense is true and he was 14, so what? Naruto has been cheating his way out of fights with the Kyuubi ever since he was 13. And at 16 he's mastered it to a whole different level than Obito could ever have. When you're a Uchiha and know the right jutsu to do it, what's stopping you from doing so?

"Obito could not have manipulated the Mizukage"
We have very, very little information about this, and everyone's been jumping into the conclusion that the Mizukage was under a genjutsu. But last I checked the only person in the entire shinobi world capable of manipulating people to such an extent is Uchiha Shisui, and his eyes ended up in Itachi and Danzo's possession, not Obito's. What if Obito simply had him blackmailed? We don't know anything about this so this shouldn't even be an argument for any side.

"Obito could not have given Rinnegan to Nagato"
It wasn't Obito who gave him Rinnegan, it was Madara himself before he died.

"Obito could not have helped Yahiko start the Akatsuki"
People think Tobi started the Akatsuki with Yahiko because they believe he's Madara's secret assistant. Well sorry to burst your bubble but Madara's almost certainly been referring to Zetsu as his assistant all this time. We know Madara got his hands on Hashirama DNA, and it's easy to assume he just somehow got Zetsu made out of it. Zetsu got entrusted the mission of recruiting members and finding someone like Obito to take over later on.

"Obito would not have turned evil"
Because "turning" evil isn't a part of these series, I mean Sasuke, Nagato, Konan, and a few others didn't just decide to have their justice done against Konoha. Unless you watch this through Kishimoto's eyes where Naruto is the ultimate form of justice, there's no good and evil in these series, Konohagakure are also jerks who've been abusing of plot no jutsu since the dawn of time to dictate their rules over others, including a clan of their own, the Uchiha. There's plenty of reasons to "turn evil".

"Obito was dead"
Well clearly he's not so dead given he's walking around right now. Orochimaru got killed and then sealed for eternity in a sword that can never be recovered again (due to Itachi being dead), yet he just walked back into the series as if it were is daily routine. So why are you surprised that Obito somehow survived that boulder?

"Obito was unskilled"
So was Naruto and how he's completely overpowered.

... if you got any more ideas bring them in, getting bored now.

EDIT: Here's some more

Obito could not know about Hashirama and Madara
Why the hell not? Everyone who's curious enough does. Besides, he just got all he needed to know from Zetsu. Everything Madara knew, Zetsu knows. Everything Zetsu knows, Obito knows. It's that simple.

Finally more people coming out with some sense, I knew they're we're some more of you out there int he base. I do find it really funny though how people are so vehemently against the idea of obito being tobi, I think it fits into the story that Kishi has layed out so far, people just really don't like admitting that they're wrong I mean look at our goverment

 

[EternalMangekyouRinnegan]

Re: Obito : All plotholes explained

Than explain the particular use of the explanatory note. Why wouldn't he state that "He is Obito" instead of "His name is Obito".

His name is Obito = / = He is Obito.

*********** has a better translation.

Their translation says - It's finally surfaced, the name "Obito".

Which implies that whoever is Tobi, might not really be Obito despite the looks.