Naruto Storyline: An analysis.

[MNU]

Awesome i agree and you completely get the true meaning of the show IMO

 

[Chatte]

I completely disagree about Sakura, she's worthless and a failure as a "main" character.

I also disagree about Tsunade; she's powerful, honorable, worthy of the Hokage title and all around great character.

As for the "Kishi is a sexist" argument; I personally don't think that there's enough proof to say he is. Naruto is basically his only anime/manga series he's made (successful one at that). You can't honestly say he's sexist based of one show can you? Now obviously if he were to do that kind of stuff in another anime/manga then yes I would agree with you.

I don't have anything to say about your other "topics" sorry.

Do you even know that Sakura wasn't meant to be the heroine of the show? And for a character that wasn't supposed to be in the main lines, she's doing pretty good.
And if you didn't understood anything from what I wrote, means you didn't get the message. Anyway.

As for the sexism, I had a lot of proofs. I agree it's his only work, but you do an analysis on what you have, right?

Not to mention he is the one who admitted himself that he doesn't know how to handle with powerful women.

Anyway, thanks for commenting.

Awesome i agree and you completely get the true meaning of the show IMO

Well, I haven't watched many anime's in my life, but the ones I watch/watched have a powerful story behind. I like to get around things that can teach me something.

Thanks for commenting!

 

[Nine]

When you say Sakura has so many good characteristics and all, then it is because Kishi made her that way. Same goes for Tsunade , Mei, Hinata etc. So if you agree to this then calling Kishi sexist is a bit too much.

 

[Chatte]

When you say Sakura has so many good characteristics and all, then it is because Kishi made her that way. Same goes for Tsunade , Mei, Hinata etc. So if you agree to this then calling Kishi sexist is a bit too much.

I specified why I call Kishimoto a sexist. And I agree he put some good characteristics, but he did as well with the male characters, yet most of them have their personalities flawless...

Anyway, that's just my opinion.

 

[Dead Ninja]

I specified why I call Kishimoto a sexist. And I agree he put some good characteristics, but he did as well with the male characters, yet most of them have their personalities flawless...

Anyway, that's just my opinion.

Well this show is aimed toward the "male" audience, so obviously he would cater to males more-so than the females. I'm he would do the same if it were the other way around, and then no one else sexist for that.

I interesting to note that I see more people calling an artist/director or basically a creator of some form of entertainment IP, sexist if the IP is aimed more for males (and thusly either have lots of T&A, stronger males, more fighting). Instead of something that aimed for females and does the opposite, but no one is called sexist for it. I guess maybe women are more outspoken about it.....

 

[Frikid]

Well, glad I did, what can I say? Thank you for reading and commenting.
I know it's a lot to read but this is the way I could've done the whole point.

As I am a good reader, I state what I stated previously, again.
And, btw, you contradict yourself. Anyway... Thanks for your opinions...

Lol, actually i typed some part of it(was kinda bad mood and thread is somewhat about sakura, then went to somewhere then came back, read what i wrote again and i thought it was ->:sy:<-

sorry,:ice:

now i am in a nice mood, so i will say it polite

1. You look alot like Kushina
2. You didn't get mad at me unlike other people, and that's a big thing, There are very few people who are like that , you can become a great mod (i think you will become one )

3. Now this is about sakura so

i dislike sakura because she was shown as a stupid character.
now its just a character so i don't know what to say..

She is just a bit messed up teenager.

She is very contradicting. In part 1, she was shown as a very smart and intelligent person, she kicked out Ino from his mind, and Then just in start of part 2, She showed so awesome skills, like tsunade's super strength and healing... and you know what , she is actually a genjutsu type user (maybe you didn't knew that ).

But in that arc in which sasuke goes berserk,break in through the meeting of kages and kills danzo...

She acted really stupid :shrug:
First she lies to naruto about she loves him ... then she tries to kill sasuke and ends up getting protected by naruto.
Basically, she made naruto suffer alot, naruto was like mind F*cked lol,

So i wasn't expecting her to do this...

Again one more thing is that,
She never ever helped naruto, she always messes up things...
her intentions were not bad , but its just like they say in hindi,

mand buddhi , ghar ka naash...

^ it means that stupid people messes up things. (well not exactly this but i can't explain it well =/ )


So i think its just that, the character is like this... :shrug:

I would really like that, if she saves naruto just once for what all he have done for her.
Just like tsunade jumped in front to protect others, she should also do something like that...
that would stfu alot of haters

sorry for the long post

 

[Chatte]

Well this show is aimed toward the "male" audience, so obviously he would cater to males more-so than the females. I'm he would do the same if it were the other way around, and then no one else sexist for that.

I interesting to note that I see more people calling an artist/director or basically a creator of some form of entertainment IP, sexist if the IP is aimed more for males (and thusly either have lots of T&A, stronger males, more fighting). Instead of something that aimed for females and does the opposite, but no one is called sexist for it. I guess maybe women are more outspoken about it.....

Towards the male audience? When did that happen? Wasn't a show supposed to be for everyone? Being aimed towards a 'male' audience makes is sexist even more. And if it would be the other way around would be sexist as well.

Believe me, I am not talking about this just to talk, I am not stating things just to state, I have even studied stuff like that. So I am not stating child-ish things here.

In every show or you name the creation, has to be a balance. A balance in which, in Naruto, is kind of... gone.

For example you could consider the show Desperate Housewives sexist cause it's talking only about female's problems in marriage, when they could talk about men's as well.

Lol, actually i typed some part of it(was kinda bad mood and thread is somewhat about sakura, then went to somewhere then came back, read what i wrote again and i thought it was ->:sy:<-

sorry,:ice:

now i am in a nice mood, so i will say it polite

1. You look alot like Kushina
2. You didn't get mad at me unlike other people, and that's a big thing, There are very few people who are like that , you can become a great mod (i think you will become one )

3. Now this is about sakura so

i dislike sakura because she was shown as a stupid character.
now its just a character so i don't know what to say..

She is just a bit messed up teenager.

She is very contradicting. In part 1, she was shown as a very smart and intelligent person, she kicked out Ino from his mind, and Then just in start of part 2, She showed so awesome skills, like tsunade's super strength and healing... and you know what , she is actually a genjutsu type user (maybe you didn't knew that ).

But in that arc in which sasuke goes berserk,break in through the meeting of kages and kills danzo...

She acted really stupid :shrug:
First she lies to naruto about she loves him ... then she tries to kill sasuke and ends up getting protected by naruto.
Basically, she made naruto suffer alot, naruto was like mind F*cked lol,

So i wasn't expecting her to do this...

Again one more thing is that,
She never ever helped naruto, she always messes up things...
her intentions were not bad , but its just like they say in hindi,



^ it means that stupid people messes up things. (well not exactly this but i can't explain it well =/ )


So i think its just that, the character is like this... :shrug:

I would really like that, if she saves naruto just once for what all he have done for her.
Just like tsunade jumped in front to protect others, she should also do something like that...
that would stfu alot of haters

sorry for the long post

It's ok, don't worry, I am not minded about the long post.
I have to say actually that now we can talk as mature people. Or at least respect eachother.

I was sure that everyone will call this a "Sakura Thread" just because Sakura is in it.
This is basically a thread for other things, but I decided to discuss Sakura/Tsunade hate first, being a more 'fire subject' for me.

Regarding the mod stuff, meh, don't know. But thanks for the compliment, heh.

As for the Sakura part.

Yes, I know she is a genjutsu type user, that's why I told people around that if Kishi would keep the same path he did with the 3 Sannins, Sakura would become even stronger than Sasuke. And don't jump to conclusions before knowing that he inspired the story of the 3 Sannins from The tales of gallant Jiraya and as we see, he kinda keeps the same path with Team 7.
Imagine a genjutsu type user with those medical training and brute force...

Now, you tell me... How old are you? Show me a teenager that isn't messed-up. That's why we are teenagers in the first place. We learn throughout our experiences not to mess-up things. Even when we grow older we still make mistakes.

Sakura is there to represent the part of feelings. Remember that one of the rules of the shinobi was not to show emotions. Shinobi should be like some sort of robots. Well, she is there to show us we are human beings and we have emotions and that we can't be like a piece of stone.

As for in the arc where Sasuke goest to the Kage meetings, I explained her intentions. She wasn't mind-fu**ing Naruto! She was lying to him in order to protect him!

As for her going after Sasuke, Sai said it better: It's because she loves him that she wants to rescue him from the evil path he currently walks. Even if the only way to do it is to kill him with her own two hands, I believe she's prepared to do it because she loves him. Which also means she's willing to let you hate her forever, Naruto. I think it's her way of atoning for saddling you with the burden of that promise that you held for so many years. She's asked too much of you, so she's trying to end this all herself.

Many of you hated her because of that promise thing, but when she actually decides to do a thing about it, even though in the end she didn't do it - and I explained at the beginning why - you keep on hating her.

Think about it, if it wouldn't be for Sakura, Sasuke and Naruto wouldn't even met.

As someone once said: I'm glad Sakura messes-up things because thanks to her we get to see all the cool fights.

Once again, people don't understand her role in this story.

What about when she had to take care of an entire hospital by herself, on the Pein arc, because Shizune was gone?

And, what about when she risked herself to heal Naruto when he went beserk with the 6 tails?

It seems that this doesn't count at all... And there can be found many other reasons, but because people are busy with hating her that they don't see this moments.

Thanks for your post once again.
Glad we discussed as civilized people.

 

[Frikid]

Towards the male audience? When did that happen? Wasn't a show supposed to be for everyone? Being aimed towards a 'male' audience makes is sexist even more. And if it would be the other way around would be sexist as well.
.....
Glad we discussed as civilized people.

well i look it like this,

for eg, say your friend(sasuke/naruto) is drowning in water, you don't know how to swim, you still jump in water to protect him,
but end up making it even worse...

thanks for reply

i don't hate her, i never hated her but yea ,
i don't wanna see more of sakura until she do something interesting


and just imagine if a chapter about sakura comes ,

100+ hater thread cursing kishi and sakura ,both. :shrug:
i really don't this to happen, hope kishi do something good with her in this war arc atleast .

 

[Chatte]

well i look it like this,

for eg, say your friend(sasuke/naruto) is drowning in water, you don't know how to swim, you still jump in water to protect him,
but end up making it even worse...

thanks for reply

i don't hate her, i never hated her but yea ,
i don't wanna see more of sakura until she do something interesting


and just imagine if a chapter about sakura comes ,

100+ hater thread cursing kishi and sakura ,both. :shrug:
i really don't this to happen, hope kishi do something good with her in this war arc atleast .

Well, at least you know you didn't stood there and did nothing, just watch him going dead. And maybe since I know I don't know how to swim, I would take some pracautions.

You don't kinda can make this comparisons since here is a lot of emotional mixture, and when emotions get in the way, it's pretty hard to decide.

Well, if it's a chapter about Sakura, I don't mind, at all. And if people would be true fans of Naruto, well, they would enjoy every piece.
Or at least that's my opinion.

As for Sakura, as I said, people are too busy looking to the big picture than to acutally notice some of Sakura's actions and more important, understand them, the message behind every action of hers.

Thanks for the reply as well.

 

[Animated]

Wow I loved your thread. Thank you for taking the time to write such an awesome thread.
To be honest naruto inspired me a lot in my writing, specially the bond and friendship themes of the story.

 

[Darkakatsuki]

Hello, everyone!​

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First of all, let me say that before doing this thread, I have been thinking about this for a long time, whether to do this thread or not. (PS: In case you decide to read it, I would recommend to listen to this on the background:

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)

Regarding myself, I am not such a big thread opener, if you count my threads, they're max. 6 or something like that.

Leaving that aside, I don't know how much I am going to be writing here so, if you are not prepared to read a quite long chit-chat thread, I would kindly ask you not to flame the thread - although I am prepared for the flaming, considering the types of subject I want to 'touch'.

My thread it's going to be about the storyline, generally, being it manga or anime - some have only read the manga, some have only seen the anime, some both -, about the whole meaning behind the Naruto tale, about us, the readers, about misconceptions, about us as people and what we have learned from this tale, about everything, don't know, you mean it!

Maybe I won't be touching some subject and you want to do it, please, do it! All I ask is to be presented in a respectful way, if not, than don't post at all, thank you!

I am going to be touching subject that have been very controversial.

So, let me start:

1. Sakura Haruno/Tsunade Senju hate

Just because they're females and they don't have flashy jutsus, they are one of the most hated characters in the whole Naruto verse. Why? Maybe because Kishimoto's sexism got to you too! And I am sure that to some of you it did.
And don't tell me it didn't because I won't believe it not in a million years. It's a proven fact, one leads the way, the others (the majority) follows. Look at the whole democracy thing where we are supposed to have free will but, as a mere fact, we're just some tools. We're given the ideea that we have freedom while we forget to THINK - a simple process - so, in that way, we became useful tools, as I previously stated.
If someone asks himself/herself what I am talking about all I'll have to say is that I am talking about mass-population control. Google it, do whatever you want to do about it, in order to find more about the thing.

Anyway, what I mean is that if Kishimoto is a sexist, it's logical that mostly of its readers become sexists, he just transposes his way to be to the readers through the story.

Why do I say he is sexist? Well look at it: compare the battles in which the men from Naruto series have been portrayed and compare the women's ones.
The most eloquent one: Chuunin exams. All the rest fights compared to Ino-Sakura fight. Clearly the men were the dominant power.
Which, if you ask me, not that I'm a girl, I am the one who believes in equality of the human being, be it woman or man, it's not right.
Ino - Sakura fight could have had the same awesomeness as the boys fights.
If that's not sexism, then what is it?
Secondly, the way he made Sakura all whinny little scared girl.
It's not like that, girls generally are known to be more mature and strong willing than boys - no offense! He just didn't gave her any type of bloodline, nothing. Just a great intellect - she was the one that was the best from team 7 in class.

Another thing is that you say that all she does is count on Naruto. It's not like that, the biggest thing that made the majority of you think that, was the Sasuke retrieval arc.

Well, let me say something to you: IF it wouldn't be for Sakura to ask Naruto to bring Sasuke back, the bond between both of them (Sasuke and Naruto) wouldn't have been that strong. Why? Because Sakura was the one who strengthened that bond, she told Naruto that HE was the only one able to bring him back so that made Naruto think more about his connection/bond to Sasuke.

Yes, that whinny little girl did that, she is the balance between Naruto and Sasuke. Sakura always loved Sasuke, who was too busy playing cool, who made Naruto in the progress of gaining more of Sakura's attention compete with him, who made Sasuke knowledge Naruto's power, which made them rivals/best friends.

Most of you don't understand these little hidden things because all you are busy with power displays and flashy jutsus.

Secondly, you don't seem to understand emotions. Sakura cries, yes, she does that a lot, but she doesn't cry because she's weak, she cries because she's too powerful mentally, that somehow she has to let it all out.

Tears are not of those who are weak, but of those who have been strong for too long.
​

And, yes! Even if you deny this, the facts show it, and maybe not in a regular day by day basis where you wouldn't understand, but in a fight.

Remember when she just kicked Ino out of her head? Well that's mental power! Pure raw mental power.
Besides that, let's bring it down to the human part - how many of you have loved? But truly loved! I am talking to those of you who know what love is. Do you know how it feels when your love is unshared? Do you have any ideea? Just because the majority of you are boys and boys usually don't display emotions, doesn't mean that you can hide the fact that we all feel/have feelings. Because, in the end, that's what Naruto is about. Human things like feelings, bonds etc.
Maybe someday when you'll love and get hurt and be somewhere alone in a corner, crying your asses out, maybe that some day you will remember this annoying character who just used to express her feelings too much - for some.

Another thing, you keep blaming her for telling Naruto that she loved him, that she doesn't love Sasuke anymore and you say that she was just being bitchy.

Does any of you have any idea on how much pressure was on her heart? Does any of you think about the torment in her mind? Having to protect her good friend and killing the one she loves.
She didn't tell Naruto she loved him because she was trying to act as a bitch, she did it because she was trying to PROTECT him. As best as she could! How do you think Naruto would have react if she just told him the truth? She just needed to know Naruto safe, not being exposed to any threats. Even if Naruto in the end found out and got there.

Which led me to the next subject I want to expose. That she was weak when she got there to kill Sasuke and then, again, she had to be saved. Ok, I agree, she had to be saved... but my question to you is this: how many of you can kill the one you love? Do you think it was so easy for Sakura to go there and try in doing it? No, it wasn't!

Maybe this was the wake-up call for her, this was necessary for her to finally see that Sasuke is not the Sasuke she once knew and that next time she will need to be more careful. Although she will keep hoping that someday Sasuke will come back and be the Sasuke she knew.
Admit it, we all hope! That's the main thing we do when things usually get ****ed-up, we still damn hope! Because this is what hope is, a lying bitch that makes us believe everything will get better and so she manages to lie ourselves until we're bye-bye, if you know what I mean.

Sakura once again has to be thanked because she saved both of them, Naruto and Sasuke. Remember the first part, against the Sound team. She wasn't that great, didn't had that many flashy jutsus but she fought until the last moment to protect both of them. She showed then how powerful is, how strong her will is! She didn't cared about the sacrifice she had to make in order to keep both Sasuke and Naruto alive. She cut her hair - a very precious thing for her. Tell me how many of you gave up to a very very very precious thing for your friends. But truly did. Because we have to admit, we tend to be pretty selfish people. Her will for the ones she love is just among the most powerful ones in the whole Narutoverse.

For example, here you have a pretty clear view of her will:

"I'll get you! Even if you blow off my arms and legs, if I take in your poison and it paralyzes me, I'll get you I swear it! No matter how much you resist, no matter what you do.... I'll beat you half to death and make you talk about Orochimaru!! Got it?"​

- this is Sakura to Sasori. So yes, she's strong willed when she wants something. Doesn't matter what she has to do, she just does it! And in the end she did it.

Now, most of you will probably say that it was thanks to Chyio, that it wasn't an unfair fight and so on.
Well, let me tell you, it wasn't!
If it wouldn't have been for Sakura, Chyio would have died more quickly. Tell me how Chyio would have been able to dodge the iron sand if it wasn't for Sakura?
It was a fair fight, Sasori had the main puppet, himself and the other 100 puppets while Chyio had Sakura and the 10 puppets. It was even in power display. So stop saying it was an unfair fight. It was! And Sasori himself acknowledged Sakura's power and admitted she is not a brat to be played with.

And don't worry, if Sasori was defeated, it's not such a big deal. He still remains the Sasori of Great Red Sand, a true worthy shinoby of his name. He just died with honor, fighting!
So in terms of will and raw power, Sakura rocks hard! Yes, even without all those flashy jutsus.

"I may not have amazing weapons in me like a puppet, but what I do have is my masters contempt for losing... what I also got from my master was unarmed combat skills" ​

So, yeah, whenever you say you hate her just because she's weak and she cries a lot, think about the cause first, don't go directly to the effect!

Speaking of will power, here I pass down to Tsunade.
The legendary kunoichi Tsunade. Just because she was Senju and happens to be Senju Hashirama's granddaughter, and just because she doesn't have a mokuton bloodline, no flashy jutsu, just raw power and EXCELLENT medical ninja skills, she is trashed/bashed/hated however you want to say.
Most of you criticized her in the Pein arc just because she stood there and, supposedly to you, didn't do nothing. But the fact that she kept alive the whole village, it's nothing to you.
Maybe she should have left everyone to die? Maybe that's how you would have loved her? I don't know.
That's a thing that bothers me, if it's not about pure flashy jutsus - as I like to call them, you don't care at all. You don't see behind that stuff, the human part, as I previously said.
You forget that big things are done from many small things. A small gesture here, a small gesture there, and in the end gets something big.
The spring doesn't come with one flower.
And to return at the Pein arc, even after she used most of her chakra, Tsunade came down to fight Pein, as weakened as she was. Only that Naruto appeared in the main stage and asked her to back off. She did that because Naruto asked her, not because that was her intention. NO!
Her intention was to protect the Leaf, even with the cost of her life.

"Why am I putting my life on the line? Because now… I am the Fifth Hokage of Konohagakure!"
​

Speaking of life, here I go to the next one.
Some of you keep accusing her that she left Jiraya die. No, she didn't! She actually wanted to go with him, be there with him, but Jiraya asked her to stay in the village. And she had to stay, the village cannot stay without a Hokage. Besides, she trusted him as he trusted her.
And that means with the title of Hokage! All of you keep saying that she is crappy as a Hokage but look at the war arc how badass she is. She was the only one who could smash into Madara's Susano'o. I don't think that's nothing. I mean, come on, she is best known for her raw power who cannot be matched by anyone in the Narutoverse. If she wouldn't have been great, Jiraya wouldn't have searched for her if he wouldn't have been sure she is a great candidate. Even with hall his power he admitted it that she is a strong ninja. Remember that he has been close to death twice. One of them was because of Tsunade.
But about Tsunade, so I won't make it long, I would love to show you some of Tazzilla's posts. That man is an encyclopedia when it comes to explaining her feats.
The most important thing that Tsunade has, even if it's not the most powerful from the Hokages and stuff like that, she has the most powerful will of FIRE! Besides Hashirama, of course.
Speaking of will of fire, I will pass to the next topic I want to share my opinion about.

2. Hokages display of power.

What do I refer on when I say Hokage's display of power?
Well, generally what I've seen on NB is people arguing on who is the most powerful Hokage. Whether is Hashirama, Tobirama, Hiruzen or Minato.
All those threads started hatred amongst yourselves making you forget the true purpose of a hokage.
And when I say the true purpose, I refer to that little teaching Hiruzen gave to Asuma about the King, who later, passed to Shikamaru.
The true Hokage purpose lies withing the "king' theory and into the will of fire.

I will let you some quotes here, maybe you'll think more about this whole power thing, and maybe you'll start to appreciate/value more every Hokage Konoha had, instead of arguing amongst yourselves.

"Konoha is my home! The Hokage is one who continues to act as the main pillar of the house, protecting it!! He's the one who carries the will of Konoha, entrusted with it…"

"To me Konoha isn't just an organisation. Every year there are a lot of ninja born and raised in Konoha… They live, fight to protect this village and what is precious they would go to their death. Even if we are not related by blood, those of the village like these are, to me, my most precious, most important… family!"

"Even if you were to kill me, the pillar would not crumble. I'm the man who inherited the will of Konoha, the will of the First and Second. I am the Third Hokage!!! No matter how much you target Konoha, there'll be a new Hokage who'll inherit my will… and become the pillar to protect Konoha!"


"And Shikamaru. You're so smart… and have great sense as a shinobi. You could definitely become Hokage. But… you're too lazy… You'd probably hate it. I never even beat you once at shōgi… Ah, yes… Remember our talk about the King?…"

"The "kings" are the unborn children who will grow up to take care of the leaf."

Don't you get the message from all of it? Well if you don't, the great 3rd Hokage put it all together for us. So:

"In this society, true power is not attained from mastering all the world's techniques. This is something I have already taught you. When there is something important to protect… that's when a shinobi's true power emerges."

And with that, I rest my case with this topic. U_U

Another thing I want to discuss is about us, readers.

3. Expressing opinions about the Naruto storyline.

This ideea of mine started after reading SasukeTheViper EMS's thead about Neji.
Here is the link if anyone is interested:

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What the man was saying is that he was basically disappointed because Kishi kind of screwed-up with the storyline and, for example, he trolled one of the best characters from Part 1, Neji.
And well, he got the typical brainless response that 'gtfo, don't watch it, bla, bla'.
People, have some of you ever heard about constructive critique?
I'll quote myself from the topic, so I won't have to write again.



So, basically here you have the definition of constructive criticisim:

"Constructive criticism is criticism kindly meant that has a goal of improving some area of another’s person’s life or work. Often constructive criticism refers specifically to the critique of someone else’s written or artistic work."

So, if I say that I don't like this, or that, it's not because, oh my God, I hate the story/show, no! Because I want it to get better. Tell me, how many of you wouldn't have loved this war to be more bad-ass?
Because we have to admit it, until now, everything around this war was rushed, unfortunately. The Sage mode was too trolled, same as the Edo Tensei who was supposed to be pretty bad-ass, the Kages were too low-dropped on power, seemed like they haven't had anything compared to Madara who was OP'd as hell and so on and so forth.
Don't get me wrong, I love Madara, Madara was into the first things that got me into Naruto, the first Naruto avi/sig I did was with Madara, I loved the mistery that surrounded him, the legends that were told about him.
That's why, unfortunately I was a little disappointed in Madara's way of being now. I would have expected him to not be so full of himself. I agree, he is one of the most bad-ass shinobi in Naruto verse, and as I previously told you, I like him very much, only that I would have loved him to be a more..how should I say it? Upright? More of a 'do-er". Instead, until he does something he has to babble about how great he was and stuff like that.
Well, we all know that he was the legendary Uchiha Madara and the merely pronunciation of his name would make many tremble, we don't need to be reminded.
I mean, I personally don't like people who worship themselves, and that's how Madara is right now. I would have loved to be the way Kishi made us believe he is in the first part.
All I am talking about here is the personality part, not the powers. The powers, hands down! Speak right of himself.
But the personality has some gaps if you ask me.
Probably some of you are going to flame me, so that's why I feel the necessity to once explain you, this is a constructive critique.
I am just expressing my opinion on how could have Kishi made Madara even greater.
If he is going to show Hashirama, I hope his personality remains intact as in the first series. A righteous person, calm, calculated with the same will of fire.

Now you've probably asking yourself why the hell have I've written so much about some uninteresting things - for some of you, or why have I written so much about this story if it's just pure fiction.
Well, until a point I will agree with you... Until a point.

4. Naruto's connections to real life

Well, now I'm going to answer you why I have written so much about this.
Well, this story is very important to me as I have learned strong lessons from it. Naruto will mean a lot for me even when I'll be older. Why?
Because I have met many things from real life and Naruto made me learn values that I never knew they existed. That's why I cherish it so much.
As well Naruto made me ask myself questions over life that I don't know if I'll ever get the answer to them.
Of course, in the story everything will end nicely, because it has to, we have to learn again the good triumphs over evil every time, so all the problems will be done. Don't get me wrong, I agree with the good vs. evil thing, I like the fact that good always triumphs over evil but, what about real life?
Is it that way?
Many of Pein's questions got stuck in my head and I still ask myself those question and try to get answers. But, for now, I haven't.

And not to mention the right to the subject quotes. I read them and I can't amaze myself that they are so true! And I ask myself what's the resolve to all of this.

As I pleasure I will let some of his quotes.

"We're both of the same breed, after all… motives for war are of no concern. Religion, ideology, resources, land, grudges, love, or just because… No matter how pathetic the reason, it's enough to start a war. War will never cease to exist… Reasons can be thought up after the fact. Human nature pursues strife."


"We are both but men, driven to seek vengeance under the banner of justice. However… if there is justice in vengeance, then justice will breed only more vengeance… thus forging more links in a chain of hatred."

I see… That is noble of you. That is justice indeed. However… My family… My friends… My village… They suffered the same fate as this village by you ninja of Konoha. How is it fair to allow only you people to preach about peace and justice?"

"Dying like trash… never ending hatred… pain that never heals… that is war…"
​

And so many others. I bet you know them.
Well, for the moment I cease my pledge here.
I know it's long, many of you will probably show me the laughing faces with I haven't read, lol, but for those who did, I thank you!
I am waiting for opinions, comments, critiques, anything except bashing and being disrespectful.
If you don't like it, SIMPLY, don't answer it! Close it. You have many options.

Its not sexism, its realism, while there may be some exceptions here and there, overall men are better warriors/fighters and are much more aggressive then women, thats a fact. Our bones are densor, our muscles are bigger and stronger, we're faster as well (Compare Usain Bolt's record to the female world record), etc etc, the list goes on, kishi isnt a racist, he's a realist.

I'm pretty sure there are many things that females match or even surpass males at, but this is just not one of them, live with it and stop whinning!

 

[Drakengard]

Do muscle size and bone density mean much when Naruto characters casually slap gigantic creatures using chakra control as a means of strength? ;P

 

[Chatte]

Wow I loved your thread. Thank you for taking the time to write such an awesome thread.
To be honest naruto inspired me a lot in my writing, specially the bond and friendship themes of the story.

Thank you very much for your kind words
Naruto is inspirational to many of us, indeed. I see you're one of those people who got more beyond in the story.

Its not sexism, its realism, while there may be some exceptions here and there, overall men are better warriors/fighters and are much more aggressive then women, thats a fact. Our bones are densor, our muscles are bigger and stronger, we're faster as well (Compare Usain Bolt's record to the female world record), etc etc, the list goes on, kishi isnt a racist, he's a realist.

I'm pretty sure there are many things that females match or even surpass males at, but this is just not one of them, live with it and stop whinning!

Well, thanks for replying. But I think you have your answer on the next poster. Drakengard said it well. And I've said it myself in my previous posts.

Do muscle size and bone density mean much when Naruto characters casually slap gigantic creatures using chakra control as a means of strength? ;P

Exactly my point!

 

[Darkakatsuki]

Do muscle size and bone density mean much when Naruto characters casually slap gigantic creatures using chakra control as a means of strength? ;P

Couldnt help but roll my eyes at this, which woman in the naruto series is able to keep up with the top tier men or even middle tier men in speed?

NONE:

In strength? only tsunade and sakura, and that is only because of a secret chakra control technique, not because of natural strength like for example kisame and the raikages.

It is important to remember that Kishi is using real life as inspiration for his fiction, like buddism (Pein's paths), japanese mythology (Tsukiyomi, Orochimaru. Amateresu etc) and shinobi arts of Japan (ninjutsu,taijutsu, genjutsu).

Subsequently, in the real world, men are better warriors then women (not counting the few exceptions offcourse), if kISHI IS USING REAL LIFE AS INSPIRATION, THEN OBVIOUSLY WE CANT HAVE A NINJA WORLD DOMINATED BY WOMEN, I'm pretty sure that if women were better warriors in real life, then Madara, Hashirama, Minato, Pein etc would all be women.

 

[Drakengard]

Couldnt help but roll my eyes at this, which woman in the naruto series is able to keep up with the top tier men or even middle tier men in speed?

NONE:

In strength? only tsunade and sakura, and that is only because of a secret chakra control technique, not because of natural strength like for example kisame and the raikages.

It is important to remember that Kishi is using real life as inspiration for his fiction, like buddism (Pein's paths), japanese mythology (Tsukiyomi, Orochimaru. Amateresu etc) and shinobi arts of Japan (ninjutsu,taijutsu, genjutsu).

Subsequently, in the real world, men are better warriors then women (not counting the few exceptions offcourse), if kISHI IS USING REAL LIFE AS INSPIRATION, THEN OBVIOUSLY WE CANT HAVE A NINJA WORLD DOMINATED BY WOMEN, I'm pretty sure that if women were better warriors in reqal life, then Madara, Hashirama, Minato, Pein etc would all be women.

I'm not saying anything about women being born as more potent warriors or anything, just that criteria like muscle strength and the like are pretty meaningless in the Naruto Universe when you put things like chakra control into play. Eg. top tier speedsters in the Narutoverse don't have to have the things that normal people in real life would.

 

[Alcamea]

Chatte.... I expectet nothing less than this thread about naruto, it's great!
To think about it...I can't remember any "string" woman in Naruto. Of cause, Tsunade and Sakura are great but Hinata loses every time she does anything, Ino chose the the mdeical jutsu too (that so many woman do that ... well I think that is kind of sexism - not a bad one though) Tenten is....well...weak I think I didn' observated her in the last time ^^ Temari is one of the stronger ones but all in all.... I think women are showed much too weak in the Narutoverse and the boys just to op. Which girl in the manga has Susano'o or any "really" strong technique? Hinatas (one of my favorite chars *sniff*) new twin dragon fist technique is not more powerful than her gentle fist but in style. And she landed not even one single hit and WHY THE HELL IS EVERY GIRL IN LOVE WITH NARUTO!? Sakura, Hinata, Ino said something about him in this way every one adores him and he is with sasuke the strongest character ever (madara not included) and I expect really really really much from the final epic fight between them. By the way: I totally agree with you what you said about Madaras behaviour. He is a bit eloquent and talks a lot and it angers me a bit that even the five kage can't land a single hit on him without exhausting/use unique dangerous techniques....Doesn't sound like Naruto or anyone could beat him but I am sure Kishi will find a way to power the kage up, unite their strength and beat him...anyhow... At the end: great thread *just to say it once more*


AHH another btw: I didn't meant this sasuke and naru are the strongest for sure.... I know if we discuss it all night we would come to the end that there are of cause many more powerful ninjas but it looks so like that right now (and no I don't want to look on 376 different possible situations in which an enemy could oppose Naruto and beat him....)

 

[Chatte]

Couldnt help but roll my eyes at this, which woman in the naruto series is able to keep up with the top tier men or even middle tier men in speed?

NONE:

In strength? only tsunade and sakura, and that is only because of a secret chakra control technique, not because of natural strength like for example kisame and the raikages.

It is important to remember that Kishi is using real life as inspiration for his fiction, like buddism (Pein's paths), japanese mythology (Tsukiyomi, Orochimaru. Amateresu etc) and shinobi arts of Japan (ninjutsu,taijutsu, genjutsu).

Subsequently, in the real world, men are better warriors then women (not counting the few exceptions offcourse), if kISHI IS USING REAL LIFE AS INSPIRATION, THEN OBVIOUSLY WE CANT HAVE A NINJA WORLD DOMINATED BY WOMEN, I'm pretty sure that if women were better warriors in real life, then Madara, Hashirama, Minato, Pein etc would all be women.

I'm not saying anything about women being born as more potent warriors or anything, just that criteria like muscle strength and the like are pretty meaningless in the Naruto Universe when you put things like chakra control into play. Eg. top tier speedsters in the Narutoverse don't have to have the things that normal people in real life would.

As always Drakengard responds in my place, somehow, hehe.
I am not saying dominated, I was talking about equality here.

Chatte.... I expectet nothing less than this thread about naruto, it's great!
To think about it...I can't remember any "string" woman in Naruto. Of cause, Tsunade and Sakura are great but Hinata loses every time she does anything, Ino chose the the mdeical jutsu too (that so many woman do that ... well I think that is kind of sexism - not a bad one though) Tenten is....well...weak I think I didn' observated her in the last time ^^ Temari is one of the stronger ones but all in all.... I think women are showed much too weak in the Narutoverse and the boys just to op. Which girl in the manga has Susano'o or any "really" strong technique? Hinatas (one of my favorite chars *sniff*) new twin dragon fist technique is not more powerful than her gentle fist but in style. And she landed not even one single hit and WHY THE HELL IS EVERY GIRL IN LOVE WITH NARUTO!? Sakura, Hinata, Ino said something about him in this way every one adores him and he is with sasuke the strongest character ever (madara not included) and I expect really really really much from the final epic fight between them. By the way: I totally agree with you what you said about Madaras behaviour. He is a bit eloquent and talks a lot and it angers me a bit that even the five kage can't land a single hit on him without exhausting/use unique dangerous techniques....Doesn't sound like Naruto or anyone could beat him but I am sure Kishi will find a way to power the kage up, unite their strength and beat him...anyhow... At the end: great thread *just to say it once more*


AHH another btw: I didn't meant this sasuke and naru are the strongest for sure.... I know if we discuss it all night we would come to the end that there are of cause many more powerful ninjas but it looks so like that right now (and no I don't want to look on 376 different possible situations in which an enemy could oppose Naruto and beat him....)

First of all, thank you very much for your reply!
Exactly my point. I felt that many things are somehow unbalanced. And somehow the women are put in disatvantage towards men. Few exceptions out.
And some say that he ispires from the real world. Well, real world nowadays we have maany powerful women conducting different things. Examples are very much to be given.

And I am not criticizing Kishimoto, I am just saying that he can do better. The whole storyline overall is a great one! But just some modifications here and there.

And yeah, that thing with Madara having no weakness kinda gave me head aches. Metaphorically speaking, of course. I am curious of how Kishi will make them all win against him. Hope that not plot-no-jutsu. If it's talk-no-jutsu and it's interesting, weeelll... I could live with that, heh.

Regarding the talking all night long thing, well I would mind doing that with you. Because you're one of those type of person that you can actually HAVE a conversation with. A rational one, based on respect of the other one's opinion etc.

Glad you took time to reply this thread! ^.^

 

[UzumakiNaruto49]

Thank you very much. It means a lot to me to actually be able to read something from someone who really understands the meaning of Naruto. People need to look deeper into the story. I appreciate this post, and the heart you put into it.

 

[Chatte]

Thank you very much. It means a lot to me to actually be able to read something from someone who really understands the meaning of Naruto. People need to look deeper into the story. I appreciate this post, and the heart you put into it.

And I thank you for your kind words! One of the replies that really touched my heart.
Thank you as well for taking the time to read and reply.

 

[|Apathy|]

It is a great analysis, but it was not the type of Naruto timeline analysis I thought it would be. I thought you would be talking about the literacy devices that make the timeline what it is and how the author was going to use that to explain the events happening in the Naruto storyline. Nevertheless it is a great look into the characters, and the lack of the author’s handling of such characters. +Rep.