Hashirama vs Tobi

[Midday]

So this is your comparison. Where is the different from Jiraiyas sage oil and a Katon technique? Both are Chakra-attacks, while the Mokuton is a physical material, it is life in form of trees, create by using Chakra. Absorbing the trees would be like saying Preta Path can absorb not only the humans Chakra but the human himself. Of course Preta could absord the Chakra out of the trees, but only in the case he'll touch it. And this is, considered the impact the Mokuton causes, impossible. So stop talking nonsense.

Oil is a physical as well that's why I used the comparison, since it clearly shows physical attacks made from chakra can be absorbed. As for your human analogy, the difference is he creates the trees, not just manipulates with chakra.

Also you don't necessarily have to touch the trees to take the chakra out, petra path works as a barrier around the user, the impact from the trees wouldn't matter(assuming they're not absorbed) since it's possible to use several paths at the same time such as deva path's shinra tensei/intangibility, even though it would make the absorbing the chakra out redundant.

 

[TobisPawn]

kabuto already said that hashirama>tobi.

Spoiler

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>Implying that Hashirama has seen Tobi's power and/or his S/T techs in action.

I'm still lol'ing at the poll votes.

 

[Sonin]

>Implying that Hashirama has seen Tobi's power and/or his S/T techs in action.

I'm still lol'ing at the poll votes.

People really give Hashi too much.. I mean his abilities have proven problems for the 5 kages... But none of them have abilities like tobi.. People just take hype too far. Tobi sat down in front of all the kages like nothing. Because none of them could do anything against him.

 

[Joki]

SMH U_U not even going to reply seriously to this U_U

And wow look at the poll, people actually think that hashirama stand a chance :flaw:

Because you know you're wrong and replying seriously would mean you have to admit so? Ok.

Yes, It's Proves that no Current Living Ninja that Kabuto knows of is on Hashirama's level, (he doesn't know of Bm naruto). Plus as far as i know Kabuto hasn't witnessed Tobi's Biiju/jinchuuriki in action.

Just because he is stronger than current living shinobi doesn't make him the strongest ever.
Kabuto using the word Anymore means that at one point in time there were ninja on hashirama's level.

Yeah exactly. Madara said Hashirama utterly shits on all 5 kages as well, and it's proven fact Hashirama was above Madara's power level and the map would have to be redrawn more drastically than if it were Just Madara vs kages. Who casually shattered a mountain. And Hashirama beat perfect susano'o.

I'm surprised I'm saying this, but Hashirama is very surprisingly underrated on this site. You people have a personal vendetta against him or some shit like that. Refuse to give him any credit

 

[Raito]

Oil is a physical as well that's why I used the comparison, since it clearly shows physical attacks made from chakra can be absorbed. As for your human analogy, the difference is he creates the trees, not just manipulates with chakra.

Also you don't necessarily have to touch the trees to take the chakra out, petra path works as a barrier around the user, the impact from the trees wouldn't matter(assuming they're not absorbed) since it's possible to use several paths at the same time such as deva path's shinra tensei/intangibility, even though it would make the absorbing the chakra out redundant.

Oil is physical? Since when?

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The oil looks like a sea or water stream, I don't get your point. Preta Path creates a barrier in order to stop Chakra, the Mokuton isn't chakra, so the barrier won't work and Tobi would been forced to touch them in order to suck up its chakra. While the Shinra Tensei and especially the intangibility is a valid defense, Preta Path won't work. Just as I said, this would be like saying, Preta Path can hold a humans physical attack back with Pretas barrier and absorb them.

Maybe Preta can absorb Edo Tensei Zombies, since they are just a Ninjutsu, or further a part of it..

 

[TobisPawn]

All Tobi needs to win are Shinra Tensei and his S/T techs. Gedo Mazo and anything else is overkill.

EDIT: And I thought Minato fanboys were insane..

 

[Midday]

Oil is physical? Since when?

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The oil looks like a sea or water stream, I don't get your point. Preta Path creates a barrier in order to stop Chakra, the Mokuton isn't chakra, so the barrier won't work and Tobi would been forced to touch them in order to suck up its chakra. While the Shinra Tensei and especially the intangibility is a valid defense, Preta Path won't work. Just as I said, this would be like saying, Preta Path can hold a humans physical attack back with Pretas barrier and absorb them.

Maybe Preta can absorb Edo Tensei Zombies, since they are just a Ninjutsu, or further a part of it..

You're confusing physical with solid objects. Oil is a liquid but it's also tangible as it can be touched making it physical.

Mokuton is a ninjutsu, therefore it's more than likely that it can be absorbed. It's not just using chakra to manipulate trees.

Spoiler

This ability was primarily defensive in nature as it is capable of absorbing any ninjutsu-based technique, thereby nullifying its effect. This technique can also take the form of a barrier around the user's entire body, allowing them to absorb attacks from all directions. In addition to this the Preta Path is able to absorb chakra from an individual through physical contact.

Definitions are out of the way. "It's capable of absorbing any ninjutsu based technique" not just chakra, so mokuton not being chakra doesn't prove me wrong. Humans aren't ninjutsu so why do you keep bringing that up.

I don't know why you're bothering to be sarcastic at the end. Also edo tensei isn't even a ninjutsu...

Hashirama having more votes than Tobi reflects the amount of fanboyism on this site.

 

[TobisPawn]

You're confusing physical with solid objects. Oil is a liquid but it's also tangible as it can be touched making it physical.

Mokuton is a ninjutsu, therefore it's more than likely that it can be absorbed. It's not just using chakra to manipulate trees.


Definitions are out of the way. "It's capable of absorbing any ninjutsu based technique" not just chakra, so mokuton not being chakra doesn't prove me wrong. Humans aren't ninjutsu so why do you keep bringing that up.

I don't know why you're bothering to be sarcastic at the end. Also edo tensei isn't even a ninjutsu...

Hashirama having more votes than Tobi reflects the amount of fanboyism on this site.

I've given up on Hashirama threads. :/

 

[TrollingSage]

You're confusing physical with solid objects. Oil is a liquid but it's also tangible as it can be touched making it physical.

Mokuton is a ninjutsu, therefore it's more than likely that it can be absorbed. It's not just using chakra to manipulate trees.


Definitions are out of the way. "It's capable of absorbing any ninjutsu based technique" not just chakra, so mokuton not being chakra doesn't prove me wrong. Humans aren't ninjutsu so why do you keep bringing that up.

I don't know why you're bothering to be sarcastic at the end. Also edo tensei isn't even a ninjutsu...

Hashirama having more votes than Tobi reflects the amount of fanboyism on this site.

Well one thing to think about. When a ninja uses his chakra to create oil or water and he dies, the water or oil disappears. When Hashirama creates wood, they keep on living even after he's gone. Which means the trees he creates are actual living breathing trees.

 

[TheSages456]

>Implying that Hashirama has seen Tobi's power and/or his S/T techs in action.

I'm still lol'ing at the poll votes.

i dont think minato had knowledge during his fight with tobi. hashirama is much stronger than minato and dont try to pull the bullshit a-b-c logic doesnt work. it does in this case.

You're confusing physical with solid objects. Oil is a liquid but it's also tangible as it can be touched making it physical.

Mokuton is a ninjutsu, therefore it's more than likely that it can be absorbed. It's not just using chakra to manipulate trees.


Definitions are out of the way. "It's capable of absorbing any ninjutsu based technique" not just chakra, so mokuton not being chakra doesn't prove me wrong. Humans aren't ninjutsu so why do you keep bringing that up.

I don't know why you're bothering to be sarcastic at the end. Also edo tensei isn't even a ninjutsu...

Hashirama having more votes than Tobi reflects the amount of fanboyism on this site.

it failed to absorb narutos shadow clone so that proves that it cant absorb all ninjutsu.

 

[TobisPawn]

Well one thing to think about. When a ninja uses his chakra to create oil or water and he dies, the water or oil disappears. When Hashirama creates wood, they keep on living even after he's gone. Which means the trees he creates are actual living breathing trees.

Its fine if you're debating on Preta Path vs Mokuton, but if you honestly think that makes the difference in Hashirama vs Tobi, you're confused.

i dont think minato had knowledge during his fight with tobi. hashirama is much stronger than minato and dont try to pull the bullshit a-b-c logic doesnt work. it does in this case.

Does Hashirama have an S/T tech to counter Tobi's? That was one of the only things that gave Minato his victory over Tobi. And I think you're completely forgetting that Tobi has the Rinnegan, which alone can defeat Hashirama. You're a crap debater who is relying solely on Kabuto's words in this thread, and not actual abilities, so I'm not going to bother. And do you think Kabuto really likes Tobi enough to complement him?

And I don't need to bring in Gedo Mazo. And the A-B-C logic wouldn't even work, because its more like Rinnegan Tobi > Minato or Hashirama. Hell, A-B-C actually would work here, because Tobi>Hashirama>Minato, and he's still >Minato too.

 

[TrollingSage]

Its fine if you're debating on Preta Path vs Mokuton, but if you honestly think that makes the difference in Hashirama vs Tobi, you're confused.

Relax, am not debating mokuton vs preta path.

 

[TheSages456]

Its fine if you're debating on Preta Path vs Mokuton, but if you honestly think that makes the difference in Hashirama vs Tobi, you're confused.



Does Hashirama have an S/T tech to counter Tobi's? That was one of the only things that gave Minato his victory over Tobi. And I think you're completely forgetting that Tobi has the Rinnegan, which alone can defeat Hashirama. You're a crap debater who is relying solely on Kabuto's words in this thread, and not actual abilities, so I'm not going to bother. And do you think Kabuto really likes Tobi enough to complement him?

And I don't need to bring in Gedo Mazo. And the A-B-C logic wouldn't even work, because its more like Rinnegan Tobi > Minato or Hashirama.

actually i used facts and you use bullshit speculation. hashiramas power was said to be a myth and you kept saying "oh it was because he was the only mokuton user" to downplay him. your crappy arguments are not working here. tobi>>>>>>>>>>>minato. i meant that he was able to counter the space-time ninjutsu without knowledge. hashiramas counters tobi warping him by having mokuton clones back him up or growing wood from his body. it doesnt matter if kabuto doesnt like tobi. if the person is strong then they are strong. its the same way madara hates hashirama but is still praising him because of his strength.

mokuton takes gedo mazo out of the picture. hashirama countered madaras susano, who took out a meteor, 2 mountains and the miles of landscape behind it with a casual swing of its sword. please stop spewing nonsense. you are obviously a hashirama hater. you dont want to acknowledge his strength because you cant stand the thought of tobi losing. its rather sad.

 

[TobisPawn]

actually i used facts and you use bullshit speculation. hashiramas power was said to be a myth and you kept saying "oh it was because he was the only mokuton user" to downplay him. your crappy arguments are not working here. tobi>>>>>>>>>>>minato. i meant that he was able to counter the space-time ninjutsu without knowledge. hashiramas counters tobi warping him by having mokuton clones back him up or growing wood from his body. it doesnt matter if kabuto doesnt like tobi. if the person is strong then they are strong. its the same way madara hates hashirama but is still praising him because of his strength.

mokuton takes gedo mazo out of the picture. hashirama countered madaras susano, who took out a meteor, 2 mountains and the miles of landscape behind it with a casual swing of its sword. please stop spewing nonsense. you are obviously a hashirama hater. you dont want to acknowledge his strength because you cant stand the thought of tobi losing. it rather sad.

And now you're bringing your shit about Hashirama being a myth again. If you want me to play that way, I can say that Tsunade called Tobi immortal. So he can't die!!

And you're implying that Hashirama is fast enough to use handseals and grow wood out of his body, when Tobi is already distorting and him and practically done with warping him? Nice half-assed argument to counter Tobi's S/T techs, because you have no real argument. And again, Kabuto hasn't seen Tobi's power. Your argument is invalid here. As for the clones covering Hashirama, Tobi can easily kill them (Rinnegan) or warp Hashirama from below him.

Madara didn't have intangibility, did he? Tobi can turn Gedo Mazo intangible and avoid any Mokuton. Hell, he can use Shinra Tensei OR Gedo Mazo's yell to wipe away any Mokuton. All Tobi has to really do, though, is use Chibaku Tensei, Shinra Tensei, and warp Hashirama in the confusion.

LOL I can't handle Tobi losing? This is coming from the guy who's put EMS Madara ABOVE Tobi. And I've already stated that Kabuto >> Tobi, so I don't see why I can't accept him losing. I'm acknowledging Hashirama's strength, buddy. Its just that he has literally no counter to a Rinnegan user, let alone a Rinnegan user with OP Genjutsu, 7 Bijuus (inside Gedo Mazo), and S/T techs.

I'm bored of debating with you and your half-assed arguments. And LOOOOOOOOOL, exactly what facts did you use here? A 21 year old guy, who hasn't seen Tobi's power, saying that Hashirama is unmatched?

 

[Exaar]

]

Yeah exactly. Madara said Hashirama utterly shits on all 5 kages as well, and it's proven fact Hashirama was above Madara's power level and the map would have to be redrawn more drastically than if it were Just Madara vs kages. Who casually shattered a mountain. And Hashirama beat perfect susano'o.

I'm surprised I'm saying this, but Hashirama is very surprisingly underrated on this site. You people have a personal vendetta against him or some shit like that. Refuse to give him any credit

As we know Susanoo is chakra based, Hashi can suppress chakra, So i see no reason why he couldn't suppress susanoo like he does Biiju chakra.

Just because hashirama can beat Perfect susanoo doesn't make him stronger than it.
In terms of raw power the kyuubi is above both Hashirama and Uchiha madara but they can beat it Why? Becuase they have Sharingan/Wood that are the perfect counters to any Biiju.

A battle of Ninja is more about counters than it is pure Power/Strength. as sasuke proved in his fight with deidara

 

[Sonin]

.. People are getting this mixed up.. Hashi didn't beat this madara.. This madara is much stronger than the one.. Renengan.. chakra.. healing.. techniques.. All are on a new level via the amount of chakra and the mixture of senju and uchiha chakra.. Hashi wouldn't beat the current madara imo.

 

[TobisPawn]

Oh, and Sages, mind telling me what speculation I used?

 

[TheSages456]

And now you're bringing your shit about Hashirama being a myth again. If you want me to play that way, I can say that Tsunade called Tobi immortal. So he can't die!!

And you're implying that Hashirama is fast enough to use handseals and grow wood out of his body, when Tobi is already distorting and him and practically done with warping him? Nice half-assed argument to counter Tobi's S/T techs, because you have no real argument. And again, Kabuto hasn't seen Tobi's power. Your argument is invalid here. As for the clones covering Hashirama, Tobi can easily kill them (Rinnegan) or warp Hashirama from below him.

Madara didn't have intangibility, did he? Tobi can turn Gedo Mazo intangible and avoid any Mokuton. Hell, he can use Shinra Tensei OR Gedo Mazo's yell to wipe away any Mokuton. All Tobi has to really do, though, is use Chibaku Tensei, Shinra Tensei, and warp Hashirama in the confusion.

LOL I can't handle Tobi losing? This is coming from the guy who's put EMS Madara ABOVE Tobi. And I've already stated that Kabuto >> Tobi, so I don't see why I can't accept him losing. I'm acknowledging Hashirama's strength, buddy. Its just that he has literally no counter to a Rinnegan user, let alone a Rinnegan user with OP Genjutsu, 7 Bijuus (inside Gedo Mazo), and S/T techs.

I'm bored of debating with you and your half-assed arguments. And LOOOOOOOOOL, exactly what facts did you use here? A 21 year old guy, who hasn't seen Tobi's power, saying that Hashirama is unmatched?

dont try some bullshit about tsunade calling tobi immortal. hashiramas strength was a myth and its obvious why its a myth as he beat madara who is already one of the strongest entities in the narutoverse by himself and 100% kyuubi(the strongest tailed beast who neither gedo mazo or tobis arsenal of tailed beasts can beat). even 50% kyuubi took out the beasts with a little help from bee. 100% kyuubi would stomp them.

correction. hashirama just claps his hands together to use mokuton. danzo grew an entire tree from his arm with no handseals so thats a moot point. kabuto knows that tobi has the rinnegan and the tailed beasts with gedo mazo. he sent the edo jins to tobi so he knows about them.

you keep pulling out a half-assed argument about tobi turning gedo mazo intangible. from what we have seen, he doesnt even fight with gedo mazo. he is just standing at the back controlling it. so its either tobi fights with 6 paths or gedo mazo or using his own body. why the hell did you list OP genjutsu. its not like hes beating hashirama with genjutsu and its obvious why. as for the bijuus. whats mokuton special ability again? the gedo mazo is handled the same way the bijuus are. hashirama just uses clones to help restrain it in a team effort.

shinra tensei- countered by healing or tanking it with mokuton clones

preta path- tobi wont have time to absorb the chakra inside mokuton as the trees with be coming at him with so much force and impact that trying to absorb them would basically be suicide.

asura path- missles are tanked by wood walls

human path- tobi wont lay a hand on hashirama due to this:

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animal path- summons are restrained by mokuton. hashirama can make clones do this while he concentrates on tobi

hell realm- its useless as tobi wont be able to revive himself when he dies.

space-time- its been shown that most of the times tobi has to be touching you to warp you so this is countering it:

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.
tobis warping is also an extremely close range move.

 

[~MC117~]

Because you know you're wrong and replying seriously would mean you have to admit so? Ok.
Yeah exactly. Madara said Hashirama utterly shits on all 5 kages as well, and it's proven fact Hashirama was above Madara's power level and the map would have to be redrawn more drastically than if it were Just Madara vs kages. Who casually shattered a mountain. And Hashirama beat perfect susano'o.

LOL OK. How is hashirama going to deal with 6 bijuu's, gedo mazo, the rinnegan, and tobi's S/T jutsu? He has no way of winning this and he is just overrated. Kishi why do you hype characters so much!!? U_U

 

[Exaar]

dont try some bullshit about tsunade calling tobi immortal. hashiramas strength was a myth and its obvious why its a myth as he beat madara who is already one of the strongest entities in the narutoverse by himself and 100% kyuubi(the strongest tailed beast who neither gedo mazo or tobis arsenal of tailed beasts can beat). even 50% kyuubi took out the beasts with a little help from bee. 100% kyuubi would stomp them.

correction. hashirama just claps his hands together to use mokuton. danzo grew an entire tree from his arm with no handseals so thats a moot point. kabuto knows that tobi has the rinnegan and the tailed beasts with gedo mazo. he sent the edo jins to tobi so he knows about them.

you keep pulling out a half-assed argument about tobi turning gedo mazo intangible. from what we have seen, he doesnt even fight with gedo mazo. he is just standing at the back controlling it. so its either tobi fights with 6 paths or gedo mazo or using his own body. why the hell did you list OP genjutsu. its not like hes beating hashirama with genjutsu and its obvious why. as for the bijuus. whats mokuton special ability again? the gedo mazo is handled the same way the bijuus are. hashirama just uses clones to help restrain it in a team effort.

shinra tensei- countered by healing or tanking it with mokuton clones

preta path- tobi wont have time to absorb the chakra inside mokuton as the trees with be coming at him with so much force and impact that trying to absorb them would basically be suicide.

asura path- missles are tanked by wood walls

human path- tobi wont lay a hand on hashirama due to this:

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animal path- summons are restrained by mokuton. hashirama can make clones do this while he concentrates on tobi

hell realm- its useless as tobi wont be able to revive himself when he dies.

space-time- its been shown that most of the times tobi has to be touching you to warp you so this is countering it:

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.
tobis warping is also an extremely close range move.

Two Problems with your Post.

Saying Tobi wouldn't be able to absorb it with preta path because of the Force/impact would be suicide?.

I mean what kind of argument is that?,

Tobi Stopped Zabuza's sword with his Arm. Taking zero damage

Spoiler

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Even a frail/cruppled Nagato was able to take a Punch from bee in his 8tailed biiju cloke.

So i Highly doubt a direct hit from Mokuton will do any serious damage to Tobi, Thats even if he lets it hit him and doesn't just Phase through it.

As for Tobi's S/T, Hashirama wouldn't be fast enough to counter it, Even with FTG minato barely escaped it.
asoon as he grabbed minato the Warping had already started.

Spoiler

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he was forced to use FTG to escape it.

Tobi even Hinted he could of warped him even faster the second timeround.

So i fail to see how Hashirama is countering it in a Split second.