Minato Vs Hiruzen

[Houssem]

Hiruzen has never beaten Hashirama and Tobirama, he has beaten Orochimaru, who was using two brainwashed puppets with Hashirama's and Tobirama's abilities. You can blame Oro for not making full use of the Hokage's abilities they have shown or are supposed to have, but don't give Hiruzen undeserved credit. Did he go against the pollen jutsu? Did he fight against ~25 Wood-Clones? Did he have to deal with Tobirama's Space/Time Techniques? No, he didn't... and worst of all: despite that he had to use a suicide jutsu ( created by minato ) to deal with them, which is hardly a "win" as far as I'am concerned.

And again: Matchups matter... I don't know how often I have to say this. Kisame was overall much more powerful and useful then Gai, yet he lost the battle because his abilities where not suited to deal with a certain rare jutsu used by Gai.

Hiruzen prime woud have all 5 in stats , yes. He has 5 in genjutsu, so does itachi. does that mean they're equal ? no.
I would rather master koto'a than a 1000 genjutsus. As for kishi saying they're equal i cant confirm that. Yes hiruzen was said to be the strongest of 5 kage ( not hokages ) and the strongest of all ( stated by iruka, and that cant be right ). Kishi always come back on his words.
I would Give it to both, but when people say hiruzen > hashirama that brings the shit out of me. like are you serious or are you a fanboy ?

 

[Owarij]

Please show me where it states that Minato was never in his prime and I will stand corrected. As for me being a newbie...you are correct, but does that matter to me....no, so you talking shit like you know everything doesn't matter to me either. Judgeing from all the posts that you have made tells me that you spend way to much time on this site. For the record, Minato lived up to his talents.

You must be registered for see images

Stand corrected yet?

Minato was like 25/26
That is no body's prime...Kakashi is 30 or so , and even he said he isn't in his prime, and that he still has tons of jutsu to learn..

Itachi was 21, also not even close to his prime..
Prime is around what 40 is? something hiruzen, hashirama etc would have All reached.. the peak of their abilities , minato just reached the very start

hiruzen > hashirama that brings the shit out of me.

Hiruzen> Hashirama, bringing the shit out of you yet? you talk shit about hiruzen never faced tobirama's s/t etc... DO you not understand that's because of the power gap in part 1 and part 2?
Only because of that power gap does it seem that The entire fight was weak...

Tobirama's biggest feat,that received awe by the watched, was spitting out water and making a water dragon with it..
Something , kisame, darui, and many other ninja have done in part 2....


If kishi was to rewrite the whole of part 2 , that hokage fight , the sannin fight, and many others would change entirely..


Understand this, and understand it well..Orochimaru's edo tensei was PERFECTED ... as stated by kabuto himself... they were operating just like his edos were, fighting just like they were in their life...

 

[Son of God]

You must be registered for see images

Stand corrected yet?

Minato was like 25/26
That is no body's prime...Kakashi is 30 or so , and even he said he isn't in his prime, and that he still has tons of jutsu to learn..

Itachi was 21, also not even close to his prime..
Prime is around what 40 is? something hiruzen, hashirama etc would have All reached.. the peak of their abilities , minato just reached the very start

Hiruzen> Hashirama, bringing the shit out of you yet? you talk shit about hiruzen never faced tobirama's s/t etc... DO you not understand that's because of the power gap in part 1 and part 2?
Only because of that power gap does it seem that The entire fight was weak...

Tobirama's biggest feat,that received awe by the watched, was spitting out water and making a water dragon with it..
Something , kisame, darui, and many other ninja have done in part 2....


If kishi was to rewrite the whole of part 2 , that hokage fight , the sannin fight, and many others would change entirely..


Understand this, and understand it well..Orochimaru's edo tensei was PERFECTED ... as stated by kabuto himself... they were operating just like his edos were, fighting just like they were in their life...

We don't know this for sure (the battles being better). You spout that as if it was fact, yet you cling to manga statements so much.

Either way - both hokages have had hype. The only difference is, Minato's was made on a cover - outside character bias.

 

[Owarij]

We don't know this for sure (the battles being better). You spout that as if it was fact, yet you cling to manga statements so much.

Either way - both hokages have had hype. The only difference is, Minato's was made on a cover - outside character bias.

it is fact.... oro's edo tensei was perfected, nothing was wrong with them... the anbu and orochimaru were all like "Wow, he did such a jutsu with no water source.."

that sht was done many times in part 2....You think kishi meant to have tobirama looking so pitiful he could be compared to darui in water release? when that's not even his main element?

there was a massive change from part 1 to 2...

now meteors are falling from the sky etc...
kishi is now making up for what he did in part 1 , by showing some more oper hashirama justsu.. he would have done the same with tobirama and hiruzen if he could...

 

[Son of God]

it is fact.... oro's edo tensei was perfected, nothing was wrong with them... the anbu and orochimaru were all like "Wow, he did such a jutsu with no water source.."

that sht was done many times in part 2....You think kishi meant to have tobirama looking so pitiful he could be compared to darui in water release? when that's not even his main element?

there was a massive change from part 1 to 2...

now meteors are falling from the sky etc...
kishi is now making up for what he did in part 1 , by showing some more oper hashirama justsu.. he would have done the same with tobirama and hiruzen if he could...

It isn't fact. I agree with you that seems to be the case, but it isn't fact set in stone. No interviews, no sidenotes, no annotations. Nothing was written to say that part 1 is weaker.

 

[moudhgalya]

Viz official manga scans had that statement as "he was a noble man, a finer shinobi never existed"

Nothing to do with his power they were talking about his qualities as a man

LOLwut ?

The context clearly implies that he was talking about strength . Raikage was whining about how inspite of being called as "Saviour" by Jiraiya..he died..referring to his strength .

Then he proceeded to say the following thing ..followed by the flashback which showed Minato getting the better of A .

Everything shows that he was talking about his "Ability as a Ninja" i.e how strong he was.

Urm, these are Jiraya's and tsunade's words..

i recomend you read the manga..

MINATO HAD TALENT to become extremely strong, and died young.. he was never in his prime..

jiraya and tsunade told naruto this

you think i was making it up? .sigh
nbers gonna nb

How does "Not reaching his Prime" has to do with him being weaker than Hiruzen ?

Define "Minato Prime" ?

The Minato that we have seen and the one that has been talked about easily rivals Hiruzen Prime in strength .

 

[Owarij]

The Minato that we have seen and the one that has been talked about easily rivals Hiruzen Prime in strength .

And obviously that's when i stop replying to you

 

[moudhgalya]

And obviously that's when i stop replying to you

Eh ?

You base your claim on what exactly ? A single panel back in Part 1 .

Minato stomps the Hiruzen we saw .

Minato rivals the Hiruzen by hype .

Stop trolling.

Edit :And Hiruzen beating Hashirama and Tobirama ? Are you serious ?

It was stated time and again that Orochimaru was cocky and was toying with Hiruzen . He basicallly allowed himself to get hit by Shikifujin.

And yet you have the balls to call me out . LMAO

 

[Owarij]

Minato rivals the Hiruzen by hype .

Lols, once again, had to laugh at this
:')

 

[moudhgalya]

Lols, once again, had to laugh at this
:')

Obviously that's the only thing you can do because you can't refute my points . Good luck Trolling LMAO

 

[Owarij]

Obviously that's the only thing you can do because you can't refute my points . Good luck Trolling LMAO

Your points? what points?

Rediculous statement that minato rivals hiruzen's hype?
bahahah , only in your little dream world , would Minato be able to Rival

God of Shinobi
Professor
Strongest kage
Strongest hokage



Minato wasn't even called the strongest of his time..
You have jiraya and tsunade saying minato died before he could become extremely strong and top rated
sigh, the fanboys

 

[moudhgalya]

Your points? what points?

Are you blind ?

God of Shinobi
Professor
Strongest kage
Strongest hokage

Each of those titles are relative..and guess what All those Part 1 hype got debunked when A inspite of knowing Hiruzen and his hype called Minato "Unsurpassable" shitting on Hiruzen's hype.

Minato wasn't even called the strongest of his time..

Bullshit .

You have jiraya and tsunade saying minato died before he could become extremely strong and top rated

As I asked you before..define "Minato Prime"

sigh, the fanboys[/COLOR]

Sigh..the trolls.

 

[Owarij]

All those Part 1 hype got debunked when A inspite of knowing Hiruzen and his hype called Minato "Unsurpassable"

Are you retarded? not only did A say "He THOUGHT"
thus stating it's an opinion

But did A witness Hiruzen in his prime? Did A witness hashirama and madara's reign?
A is in NO poistion to talk about ANYONE other than who he directly knows.. GTFO

As I asked you before..define "Minato Prime"

Minato's prime would be the pinnacle of the power he would acheive in life.. the strongest he could possibly get... Which is for most around 40 ish..

This is what jiraya and tsunade was telling naruto.. Minato had potential/ talent / container
to become very strong and become top rated, but he died young

it's clear as the blue sky

Minato wasn't even called the strongest of his time..

Bullshit

FIND me the scan where minato is called the strongest of his time

The only people that were ever given titles like those were i believe
Hashirama, Tobirama, Hiruzen

Third kazekage was called the strongest kazekage by far..

THAT'S all... maybe i missed one or two, but Minato wasn't given any hype like that at all...
Hiruzen however as i said, was not only given strongest kage of his time , but strongest hokage

 

[Son of God]

Are you retarded? not only did A say "He THOUGHT"
thus stating it's an opinion

But did A witness Hiruzen in his prime? Did A witness hashirama and madara's reign?
A is in NO poistion to talk about ANYONE other than who he directly knows.. GTFO

Minato's prime would be the pinnacle of the power he would acheive in life.. the strongest he could possibly get... Which is for most around 40 ish..

This is what jiraya and tsunade was telling naruto.. Minato had potential/ talent / container
to become very strong and become top rated, but he died young

it's clear as the blue sky




FIND me the scan where minato is called the strongest of his time

The only people that were ever given titles like those were i believe
Hashirama, Tobirama, Hiruzen

Third kazekage was called the strongest kazekage by far..

THAT'S all... maybe i missed one or two, but Minato wasn't given any hype like that at all...
Hiruzen however as i said, was not only given strongest kage of his time , but strongest hokage

Wait, isn't ANY statement made by a manga character an opinion then? And I'd like to think A's opinion of a hokage's strength surpasses Iruka fanboy and Kabuto.

I should say this: If you disregard feats made in part 1, we should disregard statements.

 

[Owarij]

Wait, isn't ANY statement made by a manga character an opinion then? And I'd like to think A's opinion of a hokage's strength surpasses Iruka fanboy and Kabuto.

I should say this: If you disregard feats made in part 1, we should disregard statements.

urm when did i disregard feats?

and iruka never said "I think hiruzen is the strongest hokage" nor did kabuto , they both said it was widely considered that hiruzen was the strongest ho/kage , that's not just an opinion is it? it's a consensus of many.. from konoha and other villages.. it may be an opinion, sure , but it was the opinion of MANY ....You can't be revered(According to databook) as the strongest hokage, when only 1 person in the village thinks you are... utter bs...

 

[~Uzumaki~]

Because I hate unproven hype, I go for Minato.

 

[Owarij]

Because I hate unproven hype, I go for Minato.

No, You hate hiruzen!

If This thread was Ten ten vs White fang

I bet every single person was saying white fang right?

you wouldn't see anyone comment on ten ten's unproven hype?

this is favoritism!! simply put

 

[~Uzumaki~]

No, You hate hiruzen!

If This thread was Ten ten vs White fang

I bet every single person was saying white fang right?

you wouldn't see anyone comment on ten ten's unproven hype?

this is favoritism!! simply put

if it were Tenten vs Hiruzen, I'd go for Hiruzen, why? Cuz of his hype, the reason I didn't here is because Minato is also an Hokage so their levels are close and their hype is close but one has hype only and the other has feats as well and favoritism does come in play I'll agree.

 

[SoundBar]

i agree with ur every point , however when it is a fight , it's not always about power and who is strong , definitely hiruzen was more powerful
not only in terms of chakra reserves , but had more jutsus also , but a fight is not decided by raw strength or the no. of technique , but how useful ur techniques are against ur enemy and how much killer instinct u have .

i saw minato in 3 fights vs A, tobi ,earth shinobi s . and also have seen hiruzen in 1 fight against oro and 2 hokages .
and i found minato was more profound , calm ,battle smart and with more killer instinct . i mean always one step ahead from the enemy .

quote from tobi - u got me , this is what is meant by elusive .
tobi was surprised 3 times by minato , even if he was aware of his speed and knew about him already ,

now here we r considering a fight which never happened , that means we have to consider their abilities shown or heard as whole , and we have to analyse .
now if u ask who is more powerful , i say hiruzen

but
if u talk about
who will be the winner if they fight , well then i say minato wins .
why
it's simple he will execute his techniques very well , he is fast and smart , i see every possibility of minato winning but i see very less possibility of
hiruzen winning .



i agree to this too that he was never said strongest ,
even kabuto underrated him saying he was nothing compare to hashirama , however i see this as underestimating rather than anything else , no different then people underestimating naruto while he was fighting neji and then getting surprised after he beat him .

also none of minato's abilities were of kabuto's interest he didn't have senju DNA neither had rapid healing or kekkei genkai mokutoun . it's obvious he underrated him .
however if again it comes to fight i see minato doing better than even hashi . cuz no matter how fast healing u can't survive when ur head chopped off . that's what i think .

+ Rep, I agree with you 100 percent. And it's funny how the guy you're replying to had nothing to say to this, yet he can reply to everyone else. I think he knows the truth xd

 

[Son of God]

urm when did i disregard feats?

and iruka never said "I think hiruzen is the strongest hokage" nor did kabuto , they both said it was widely considered that hiruzen was the strongest ho/kage , that's not just an opinion is it? it's a consensus of many.. from konoha and other villages.. it may be an opinion, sure , but it was the opinion of MANY ....You can't be revered(According to databook) as the strongest hokage, when only 1 person in the village thinks you are... utter bs...

You try to explain away why Hiruzen looked like poop in part 1, as well as the edos.

And again, Minato was stated to have unrivaled strength - on a cover! Not by Konoha fanboys.