kakashi vs tsunade debate?

Tazzilla88

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Kakashi's signature moves include Raikiri and Kamui. He has not been shown using Kamui expertly yet. Fighting for a day doesn't mean much if you aren't using chakra heavy skills and you Gai and other shinobi backing up against Opponents you were already soloing. Which means Kamui is usually a last resort for Kakashi. He has shown good trap setting skills with is lightening clones. Such as when he tricked one of pein's paths. He was capable of dodging Sakura though that isn't a very large feat as she didn't use and kicks or major ground strikes. He can ready movements with his sharigan but that takes an extra toll on him not being an uchiha. He carries no long weapons. Kakashi does have long range attacks via water dragon jutsu and his lightening hounds.

Tsunade strength is unparalleled. Kakashi wasn't much more dodgy than Kabuto and Kabuto took a blood pill and a soldier pill to aid him in the battle because Tsunade had cornered him. Orochimaru was able to keep up with 4 tails Naruto but after one punch from Tsunade called it quits iirc. In addition she has her chakra scapels, Katsuya, her disruption technique, her healing techniques, huge chakra reserves and the ability to alter the batttlefield with pure strength. I think we are underrating Tsunade's intelligence here. She's brilliant really, even beyond her medical field. Take the war with Pein for instance, she strategically sent Naruto away to get stronger rather than following the advice the advisers, rather than taking pein head on, she healed the entire village, she had Katsuya everywhere that way everyone could gain more info on Pein instantly. In the fight with Madara she devised an attack on Madara so that the other kages could attack him while he responded to her attack. When she was fighting kabuto and her lungs were messed up she pseudoparalyzed him so that she could heal. As per her rules for Medical Ninja she understands the strategies necessary to keep a team alive. She tricked Jiraiya into drinking a substance and played it off perfectly. In short she's not going to stand around and allow any attack. She's going to strategize.
So let's recap. Kakashi uses Lightening blade his hand is trapped in her and she kills him with a punch
Kakashi uses Kamui he may get her but she is a fairly small target that moves in very odd ways.
Kakashi summons ninja dogs... either she kills them or she summons katsuya
Kakashi uses lightening beast runner technique she dodges like she was with kabuto's attacks
kakashi uses lightening cutter he has to get close do so and when he does the technique requires both him and his clone if either is destroyed the technique is over aswell
Kakashi has done basic level genjutsu however people who have precise control over their chakra can stop their chakra and end the genjutsu. In addition to fact that she was able to easily undue to the damage done by Itachi's tsukyomi.
Kakashi's water dragon jutsu may give her some problems but for how long can he hold her off at a long distance. He doesn't combine his attacks so I doubt a water dragon kamui combo is going to happen nor is a lightening beast kamui combo .
Based upon the ease of which she is able to treat sharingan related injuries and she lived during the time in which the Uchiha had their power she is most likely fully informed on the sharingan's power. I am also certaint her grandfather and granduncle would have warned her of the dangers.
Kakashi also does not stray away from taijutsu fights which is to is his detriment. You might say that he knows of Tsunade's strength, true, but he also knew of Sakura's and still went toe to toe with her. Beyond that the only ones who know of Creation Rebirth are Kabuto, Naruto and Shizune and her anbu guards. Everyone else is dead or weren't there. And only the four other kage and possibly Kabuto know about Byakougou. Furthermore only Kabuto knows about her body pathway derangement technique.
So against Body Derangement Jutsu Kakashi has nothing
Against Heavenly Kick of Pain he can only dodge
Against her punches he can only dodge
Against Creation Rebirth or Byakougou he has to land Kamui on her head.
Against chakra scapels he has nothing
Against Katsuya who can crush him or melt him he has nothing
You don't blitz Tsunade. Kabuto tried from underground. Raikiri is extremely loud if you remember correctly so he won't sneak up on her with that. She won't fall for headhunter jutsu. And When Tsunade is out for your blood I think we've seen that she stays in constant motion. In addition Kakashi has no idea how durable she is she tanked the Heavenly Transfer Technique, the Susanoo Sword, the Sword of Kusanagi thrice, Yasaka Magatama, Shinra Tensei full force.
Very Simply Kakashi can't take her on. His one ace in the hole is using Kamui against Tsunade when she doesn't stand still and she fights in awkward positions.
When Katsuyu enters the fight what the hell is Kakashi going to do? Let's say he does Kamui Tsunade, Katsuyu is still there and there is no way in hell he will Kamui Katsuyu and Katsuyu would counter katon with acid. He really could kill Katsuyu. So his one ace in the hole fails to Tsunade's full power.
 

Ero sennin jiraiya

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Tsunade would win IMO. You can say kakashi would win with kamui in any versus thread, if its undodgeable as people claim
 

EdoItachi

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Kakashi wins this IMO. Kakashi has a ton of jutsu and is extremely intelligent he would know better than too got head to head with Tsunade in a battle of taijutsu. Kakashi also has his sharingan genjutsu which he could use to make an opening long enough too cut off Tsunade's head with Raikiri not to mention with a combination of KB's or lightning clones he could keep himself safe from Tsunade and in the process damage her. Kakashi is not necessarily a better ninja than her but he is however a bad matchup for her.
 

Tazzilla88

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Kakashi wins this IMO. Kakashi has a ton of jutsu and is extremely intelligent he would know better than too got head to head with Tsunade in a battle of taijutsu. Kakashi also has his sharingan genjutsu which he could use to make an opening long enough too cut off Tsunade's head with Raikiri not to mention with a combination of KB's or lightning clones he could keep himself safe from Tsunade and in the process damage her. Kakashi is not necessarily a better ninja than her but he is however a bad matchup for her.

He went hand to hand with Sakura he has a disregard for brute strength. Tsunade has the best chakra control in the show next to Tobirama, there is no reason she can't end the genjutsu.
Lightning Clones use have his chakra as do Shadow Clones. ...
 

EdoItachi

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He went hand to hand with Sakura he has a disregard for brute strength. Tsunade has the best chakra control in the show next to Tobirama, there is no reason she can't end the genjutsu.
Lightning Clones use have his chakra as do Shadow Clones. ...

Comparing Sakura to Tsunade really? Sakura is nothing compared to Tsunade which is why Kakashi went hand to hand with her not to mention he did not know of her brute strength, Kakashi is not stupid enough to take Tsunade on hand to hand he knows her reputation. Also Kakashi has the sharingan which would help him loads if they did end up in a taijutsu battle. About the clones a lightning clone will consume alot of chakra yes but it will create a great opening for him to finish Tsuande off.
 

Tazzilla88

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Comparing Sakura to Tsunade really? Sakura is nothing compared to Tsunade which is why Kakashi went hand to hand with her not to mention he did not know of her brute strength, Kakashi is not stupid enough to take Tsunade on hand to hand he knows her reputation. Also Kakashi has the sharingan which would help him loads if they did end up in a taijutsu battle. About the clones a lightning clone will consume alot of chakra yes but it will create a great opening for him to finish Tsuande off.

He did know of Sakura's brute strength as she'd already forced him above ground. And He wasn't yet aware of her prowess or lack thereof in taijutsu but considering he knew Tsunade trained her, it was a risky move. That suggests he's daring enough to try taijutsu on Tsunade. By your reasoning Kakashi wouldn't be stupid enough to fight her at all because her reputation alone would be enough to tell him he'd die. Yes the Sharingan would help, but for how long. In terms of battles of attrition, she wins.
How much of a opening does he need. She won't be paralyzed long. His one hope is Kamui and praying Katsuyu will just go away...
 

Insubstantial

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Kakashi is said to be as or almost as intelligent as Shikamaru, with over 100 jutsu's, his sharingan, long, short, and mid range, tactical, he was an Anbu agent when he was 13, he is known to be extremely tricky and a Kamui would instantly silence her even with her healing seal


Tsunade would have to reach Kakashi to hurt him and there is her one big problem, she would never catch him, he would leave a clone or hide or use range he has so much he can use but all her moves are close quarters This fight is hugely disadvantageous to Tsunade, it is unfortunate but Kakashi is just her weakness in every way.


ALso someone said he can't use Kamui expertly, well he stopped a speeding nail shot with Shinra Tensei by making a tiny Kamui and hiding that fact quite expertly.
 
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Bogard

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He went hand to hand with Sakura he has a disregard for brute strength. Tsunade has the best chakra control in the show next to Tobirama, there is no reason she can't end the genjutsu.
Lightning Clones use have his chakra as do Shadow Clones. ...
So far we know the fight between Sakura and Kakashi wasn't present in the mangas. It was only fillers. U_U
 

EdoItachi

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So far we know the fight between Sakura and Kakashi wasn't present in the mangas. It was only fillers. U_U

^This, not to mention that was a training exercise this is a real battle Kakashi would adjust accordingly.
 

naruto kyuubi

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This is why we know Tsunade>>>>>Kakashi

For all of Kakashi skills, the only way anyone can think of Kakashi beating Tsunade is with this one jutsu.And Tsunade can counter Kamui by simply placing something in front of her to block Kamui path or moving out of the his field of vision while attacking.Kamui isn't instantaneous like some of his fanboy want you to believe, so her base speed along with lateral movement should be enough to counter Kamui.

kakashi is a master tactician he will not be so easy to dispatch but tsunade's healing will make the battle much tougher
 

Frikid

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kakashi have 1000 jutsus, enough to kill tsunade.

kakashi is faster,smarter and chidori can kill tsunade... i am shocked no one mention it.
 

kakashi owns all

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kakashi wins mid to high dif

tsunade battles in a well stupid way just rushing in and well kakashi is smart and will use clones at first and say she hits a lighting clone with he fist well she be dead
 

Tazzilla88

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kakashi wins mid to high dif

tsunade battles in a well stupid way just rushing in and well kakashi is smart and will use clones at first and say she hits a lighting clone with he fist well she be dead

Do you call this stupid in battle
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Apparently she messed up his nervous system which allowed her to attack, and to heal herself.
What about this:
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She used the tools of her surrounding to defeat Manda with one move. She just put Orochimaru in check.
What about this:
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She just put Orochimaru in Check Mate by ensuring he had no choice but to take the full brunt of her punch. She decided to end the battle with one punch.
Or this:
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She figured out exactly where Kabuto was going to attack, dodged, and counter attacked.
How about this:
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She was well aware of the potential damage done by a complete rasengan and decided not to tank the jutsu but to diffuse the power before it even reached her.
Even This:
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She completely disarmed him and attacked a pressure point.
This:
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She must have calculated the force necesssary to send Naruto away and making him feel pain in conjunction to how much force to put into throwing the kunai in order to make sure she didn't kill him but scare him and make realize she could've killed him. And the timing necessary for the dramatics.
And This
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Healing the other kages was a very bad idea because Oonoki was on his death bed.... This was a great a move.
Just from the rules of medical ninja you can tell she understands warfare and battle strategy.
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I know you may try to use this as a counter-argument
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But all of the kage were tricked, WE don't even know when he switched himself with a clone, he said he was the only person able to see through the wood clone, and Tsunade had enough sense to prepare Byakougou in advance in case she should be surprised by something.
This was also intelligent
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As you can see it actually pierced Susanoo
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but she used the attack as a distraction
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And as Tsunade points out they did force Madara into a position where the wood clone he used was necessary.
 
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JSS

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Kakashi owns this even without kamui he would still win. If kabuto can dodge tsunade, kakashi can, i dout kakashi would even use hand to hand combat, he would just win using mid ranged ninjutsu. Kakashi is faster, smarter, more diverse and equally experianced. I am not saying tsunade is weak but kakashi would win 8/10 times.
 

Chatte

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So far we know the fight between Sakura and Kakashi wasn't present in the mangas. It was only fillers. U_U

Still he disregarded Sakura when he was below and caught him up surprise.
 

KidGamer65

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Kakashi owns this even without kamui he would still win. If kabuto can dodge tsunade, kakashi can, i dout kakashi would even use hand to hand combat, he would just win using mid ranged ninjutsu. Kakashi is faster, smarter, more diverse and equally experianced. I am not saying tsunade is weak but kakashi would win 8/10 times.

Mind explaining this, because Kakashi has no way to kill Tsunade without Kamui..
 

Chatte

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Kamui... really people?
By that logic he should be able to Kamui everything and everyone and by now he should've ended Obito and every other ninja he encountered.
HELL, he can even Kamui The sage himself!
 
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