FTG and SUMMONING defined!

[ajpn920]

After my thread about Minato having YIN YANG because of FTG, some people questioned it because they believe that FTG and summonings are the same. In this discussion, I will point out the difference between FTG and summoning. This is to further strengthen my claim that FTG was created with the use of YIN YANG.

FTG: A space/time technique. It allows the user to transport themselves to a marked location in the blink of an eye. It can also be used to teleport other objects.

Summoning: Is a space–time ninjutsu that allows the summoner to transport animals across long distances instantly. Before an animal summoning can be performed, a prospective summoner must first sign a contract with a given species.

Some people will argue because they believe that FTG and Summonings are the same, hence, all that can summon and Minato have the same affinity. Their logical interpretation goes like this:

FTG=Space-time tech; Summoning= Space-time tech

therefore FTG=Summoning: Minato=Summoners

Are they correct? No! FTG and Summonings are related in a way that both of them are space/time ninjutsu but it does not mean that they are the same. And to explain my point further, Minato vs someone that can summon are different in terms of affinity.

Let’s take a look at this:

If I’ll say that to be able to summon one must have a contract to a specie. One may say that I am speculating and will obviously ask some proof. If I can only give logical explanations, they will not believe. I’ll now prove what a logic can do to produce something closely or equal to that of an actual FACT.

Example: “to summon one must have a contract to a specie”
Oro can summon Manda! Fact
Jiraiya can summon Gamabunta! Fact
Since both of them can summon, can Oro summon Gamabunta? No! Can Jiraiya summon Manda? No.

Therefore I conclude that a summoner can only summon if he/she had a contract with the specie. This will support my statement “to summon one must have a contract to a specie” even without an actual FACT.

Conclusion: If there are no contracts to a specie available, then no one can summon a specie. CONTRACTS with specie=SUMMONS

So, how can Minato be the same with the summoners? Minato can teleport himself without the help of a contract to any specie. Is it clear now that they are not the same? In addition, here is the actual FACT!

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For those with YIN YANG questions, I'll answer that on my next thread YIN YANG. I'll take a break for now.

NOTE: The purpose of this thread is to answer all questions about summonings all at once in this thread:

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[BelievesItsNotButter]

Not only did Naruto get reverse summed to the frog villiage he was able to summon his clones. It is not restricted to animals

 

[JojocIaw]

So why didn't you finish? You left me hanging.

Most of all of that is confusing.

 

[laggygaga]

You can not propose something is something just because its not something else.

You haven't said anything to strengthen your claim that FTG is ying and yang.

You merely claimed that FTG isn't summoning...and so what? Just because one thing is not black, does it make it white then?

 

[ajpn920]

Not only did Naruto get reverse summed to the frog villiage he was able to summon his clones. It is not restricted to animals

Clone techniques are not summoning. If you say so, please give reference.

So why didn't you finish? You left me hanging.

Most of all of that is confusing.

I'm sorry, but it will take long to explain YIN YANG. This thread is somewhat a continuation to the 1st thread:

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I can't answer one by one so it's better to answer them by making a new thread.

 

[warlee]

I won't debate w/ u this thread is not getting to the hottest.

 

[warlee]

You can not propose something is something just because its not something else.

You haven't said anything to strengthen your claim that FTG is ying and yang.

You merely claimed that FTG isn't summoning...and so what? Just because one thing is not black, does it make it white then?

kudos to you

 

[ajpn920]

You can not propose something is something just because its not something else.

You haven't said anything to strengthen your claim that FTG is ying and yang.

You merely claimed that FTG isn't summoning...and so what? Just because one thing is not black, does it make it white then?

Please check this sir:

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there are question/confusions about ftg and summoning in relation to FTG having YIN YANG. Since I can't answer all of them at once, I'm making a thread instead.

 

[NLee]

Clone techniques are not summoning. If you say so, please give reference.

I think he's talking about when Naruto Reverse Summoned his Sage Clones in his fight with Pain

 

[ajpn920]

I won't debate w/ u this thread is not getting to the hottest.

That's ur choice. Well, how can you debate when there is an actual fact included? My purpose is to answer all questions about summonings in the other thread

I think he's talking about when Naruto Reverse Summoned his Sage Clones in his fight with Pain

Yes, i think so but it doesn't mean that a clone is a summoning tech. I have a included a scan there so I guess my argument is strong enough to support my claim.

 

[BelievesItsNotButter]

If you want to defend your argument your main point should be that the user does not need their own blood for the summon. In addition, they also do not need to place their hand upon the scroll to travel. It may do the same thing as summoning but it requires two less steps.

 

[BelievesItsNotButter]

Clone techniques are not summoning. If you say so, please give reference.

Would have responded sooner but my internet dropped. When Naruto fought pein it was not practical for him to stop for 5 minutes to return sage mode so he had 3 backup clones in the frog villiage and summoned them one at a time to regain sage mode

 

[ajpn920]

If you want to defend your argument your main point should be that the user does not need their own blood for the summon. In addition, they also do not need to place their hand upon the scroll to travel. It may do the same thing as summoning but it requires two less steps.

Would have responded sooner but my internet dropped. When Naruto fought pein it was not practical for him to stop for 5 minutes to return sage mode so he had 3 backup clones in the frog villiage and summoned them one at a time to regain sage mode

I know that. Where does it say that clone techniques are summoning? By the way, you may not get the point but the purpose of that is to differentiate Minato vs summoners and FTG and summoning. I have given the link to my other thread and there are lots of questions there. Some say that if FTG is YIN YANG then those who can summon have YIN YANG.

One more thing. A characteristic that is unique to the Shadow Clone Technique is that any experience the clones gain during their existence is transferred to the user once they are dispersed.

 

[laggygaga]

In the thread you directed me to you were talking about the possible reason why Tobi didn't put Minato in a genjutsu by stating 'is it possible for Minato to counter YIN release techniques with his own YIN techniques?'

Is genjutsu a yin technique?
If its not then why is it important whether or not Minato can counter Yin techiques or not?

Also you should keep in mind, it's just a story, it's bound to be flawed and Kishi can make it whatever he wants it to be. He himself might not have thought about all the little details we scrutinize over. And sometimes things are just the way they are to prolong the story. It does have to give a HINT to anything else.

 

[-Hades-]

Of course FTG and the Summoning jutsu are not the same thing, but they basically work on the same principle... The summoned one (either Minato or the Creature) enters a dimensional void that instantaneously transports themselves to the location of the seal. With FTG Minato is basically reverse summoning himself to a marked destination (his FTG seal)
Why need a contract with a specific creature? That is how you know what to summon... The summoning jutsu is the same, requires the same hand seals for whatever creature or object you want to summon. Therefore the contract is needed.
The same things happens with Minato but in a different way (and in a manner i cannot explain, and no one can currently) when he chooses where to appear, to which mark to teleport.

BTW what's the point of this thread?

 

[Shisui Namikaze]

I thought FTG was a reverse summon technique. That sends the user to the mark.
There are a few differences. Like having to draw blood to summon an animal. I think both techs are different. But that's just me.

 

[ajpn920]

In the thread you directed me to you were talking about the possible reason why Tobi didn't put Minato in a genjutsu by stating 'is it possible for Minato to counter YIN release techniques with his own YIN techniques?'

Is genjutsu a yin technique?
If its not then why is it important whether or not Minato can counter Yin techiques or not?

Also you should keep in mind, it's just a story, it's bound to be flawed and Kishi can make it whatever he wants it to be. He himself might not have thought about all the little details we scrutinize over. And sometimes things are just the way they are to prolong the story. It does have to give a HINT to anything else.

Is genjutsu a yin technique?
If its not then why is it important whether or not Minato can counter Yin techiques or not?

This is to kill all fanboys saying Minato can be defeated by genjutsu easily.

Also you should keep in mind, it's just a story, it's bound to be flawed and Kishi can make it whatever he wants it to be

Correct, but you can also keep in mind that no stories are all plot and HINTS do exists. How can anyone tell that it is a plot? Why can't we look both ways then try to think which one is more logical or near to the truth.

 

[BelievesItsNotButter]

I know that. Where does it say that clone techniques are summoning? By the way, you may not get the point but the purpose of that is to differentiate Minato vs summoners and FTG and summoning. I have given the link to my other thread and there are lots of questions there. Some say that if FTG is YIN YANG then those who can summon have YIN YANG.

I am not claiming the clone techniques are summons. He made the clones before he went to fight pein in Konoha. When he got there he was already in sage mode while the clones he made we were back on the mountain in the frog village. While in the village they stayed in their meditation state to remain in sage mode. When Naruto's sage mode wore off, he would summon one of the clones from the mountain and then end the shadow clone jutsu to regain his sage mode. I did not say that making shadowclones was a summoning.

Like I said though. I don't think your wrong that they are 2 different techniques otherwise everyone would use it. Summoning is super common but FTG isn't and it is incredibly OP. The fact that it doesn't use blood and a person to place their hand on the scroll is enough to prove it isnt the same thing. I just think you are arguing your point the wrong way.

I don't understand what the Yin and Yang thing has to do with anything. From what you are saying the Yin and Yang is purely speculation in the first place and there is no merit to it in the first place.

 

[ajpn920]

Of course FTG and the Summoning jutsu are not the same thing, but they basically work on the same principle... The summoned one (either Minato or the Creature) enters a dimensional void that instantaneously transports themselves to the location of the seal. With FTG Minato is basically reverse summoning himself to a marked destination (his FTG seal)
Why need a contract with a specific creature? That is how you know what to summon... The summoning jutsu is the same, requires the same hand seals for whatever creature or object you want to summon. Therefore the contract is needed.
The same things happens with Minato but in a different way (and in a manner i cannot explain, and no one can currently) when he chooses where to appear, to which mark to teleport.

BTW what's the point of this thread?

The point of the thread as indicated in the note section is to answer all summoning questions in the other thread:

You must be registered for see links

 

[Watatsumi]

FTG and summoning are similar, in the sense that both of them fall in the category of S/T Ninjutsu.

I don't see how it can be Yin/Yang, though.