[Discussion] World War III At Your Doorstep

[Itachi Namikaze]

The innocent deaths in Afghanistan/Iraq are just as tragic as any other innocent death. However the US has more influence and more allies throughout the world so a tragedy that happens on US soil is more likely to get attention than elsewhere. Is it fair? No, but its the reality of the situation. You're more likely to care for the deaths of your own people or allies than others.

What I don't understand is why US gets the full blame for all the innocent deaths. Why doesn't anyone ever talk about the extremists who suicide bomb their own people? Or how they hide in residential areas using innocent communities as human shields? Or dress in civilian clothing to stir up paranoia? Instead of mentioning those things people love to shoulder the entire death toll on our military's shoulders as if we're lining up civilians and gunning them down.

So yes, its true America is responsible for thousands of civilian deaths, but at the same time members of the Taliban and Al Qaeda could be held just as responsible, if not more so.

As for WWIII, I think its most likely not going to happen. Looking back on WWI and WWII the situation of the world in terms of alliances, communication, politics, economics, and really every aspect of life was completely different. People were more nationalistic, nations were more hostile and economies were up and down. The nations of Europe were still wrestling for positions of power within their own continents and abroad, something that we don't see today. There was a lot more personal conflict between nationalities and even leaders. People were much more ready to scream for war to defend their nation's pride than they are today as the world has become much much more globalized. Right here on this website we communicate with others that are halfway around the world, something that didn't exist back then. Especially with nuclear weapons the idea of a world war is terrifying enough to lead any nation to diplomacy instead. The threat of an insane leader like Hitler gaining power is minuscule.

I just think with how globalized the world has become, and the lessons learned from WWI and WWII, its essentially impossible for a third world war.

I agree with 99% of what you said.

People like to blame America because we are an easy target to blame. It is harder for a little kid to accept blame that they did something wrong and so they blame their parents or other kids because it is easier. You see it all the time, "I didn't do that, timmy did" (or whatever) and it is a loose analogy but it still fits here because many countries don't accept that their own people are doing worse to them than what we are and while we may be hurting a little bit we aren't intentionally trying to do so. The American military is not overseas to kill innocent people, tragic as it may be it happens and while it is terrible, it isn't our goal and we certainly regret every innocent lost life but most of us believe that we are actually helping. The change and help might not be apparent right now and it might seem like we are doing more damage but this has been a relatively short amount of time and countries and people don't change quickly.


EDIT: I forgot to write the 1% I disagreed with, I disagree that leaders like Hitler can't come to power. Many are already in power and have been for a while. There are many countries that have had despots until recently and some that still do.

 

[ReLax -]

I agree with you that the terrorist or whatever you want to call them also have a blame (I'm not trying to shoulder this on US) but they (US military) have most of it. The whole situation could have been approached in a different way.

The reason why the US gets a bad name or blame, is just like the reason most Middle Eastern and Muslim are being called terrorist for. What we seen a few groups of people do, has tinted all Muslims as one (terrorist) and what people have seen US do, they tint them for the stupidity or blame. Is it right? No but neither is to the other side.

 

[Itachi Namikaze]

I agree with you that the terrorist or whatever you want to call them also have a blame (I'm not trying to shoulder this on US) but they (US military) have most of it. The whole situation could have been approached in a different way.

The reason why the US gets a bad name or blame, is just like the reason most Middle Eastern and Muslim are being called terrorist for. What we seen a few groups of people do, has tinted all Muslims as one (terrorist) and what people have seen US do, they tint them for the stupidity or blame. Is it right? No but neither is to the other side.

But you did blame us earlier and you kind of still are. Neither of us said that it was Iran, or Iraq, or Pakistan to blame for 9/11 or other attacks on your countries. We said it was terrorists. Despite what you may think the U.S. is almost insanely tolerant of others here on it's soil. There is a huge muslim community here that live in peace and aren't called terrorists. Muslim people are the 6th largest culture here in the U.S.? (not sure about that but I think it is true)

I think most of the Middle Eastern world hates us for only a few reasons, you think that we all think you are terrorists and you hate us for it and generalize and call us stupid, but that isn't true of the majority of Americans. But then people in Middle Eastern countries hate us because they believe we hate them and so when we see on the news people from the Middle East burning American flags or saying "Death to Americans" then we get a little edgy and start to generalize as well.

But still for the most part I don't think Americans as a whole view Muslims as in general as terrorists, just a select few zealots and some crazy people.

 

[ReLax -]

But you did blame us earlier and you kind of still are. Neither of us said that it was Iran, or Iraq, or Pakistan to blame for 9/11 or other attacks on your countries. We said it was terrorists. Despite what you may think the U.S. is almost insanely tolerant of others here on it's soil. There is a huge muslim community here that live in peace and aren't called terrorists. Muslim people are the 6th largest culture here in the U.S.? (not sure about that but I think it is true)

I think most of the Middle Eastern world hates us for only a few reasons, you think that we all think you are terrorists and you hate us for it and generalize and call us stupid, but that isn't true of the majority of Americans. But then people in Middle Eastern countries hate us because they believe we hate them and so when we see on the news people from the Middle East burning American flags or saying "Death to Americans" then we get a little edgy and start to generalize as well.

But still for the most part I don't think Americans as a whole view Muslims as in general as terrorists, just a select few zealots and some crazy people.

The way I say these things at times seems to come out wrong but when I say US, I mean the Government. I don't mean to point out all Americans, as I have friends from there but if you desire to still defend your Government than go a head.

I am a Muslim, and I have a friends who are also, I'm not the religious type but some of my friends are. A few of them went to the States, when they were walking on the streets people said, "OSAMA", "Get out of our damn country.", "You terrorist." The place they rented got trashed and egged. In July this summer, a girl I know went to visit her family in the State, and some guys took her Hijab (the scarf you see girls wear) off and slapped her a few times across the face, there was a cop car but he didn't do anything drove off after they were done (There are tons of these happening everyday but you and the rest of the world aren't always informed). When, we the middle eastern or Islamic society hear this we/they get as edgy and generalize, as you stated American do when you see people burning your flag. I know this happens in other places too before you think, I'm trying to say this only happens in America.

As you said Americans as a whole doesn't view all Muslims, which is true but the same goes in the Middle East and other places, there are people who don't view America like that.

 

[Kyuubikiller]

I'm a pacifist.

 

[Itachi Namikaze]

The way I say these things at times seems to come out wrong but when I say US, I mean the Government. I don't mean to point out all Americans, as I have friends from there but if you desire to still defend your Government than go a head.

I am a Muslim, and I have a friends who are also, I'm not the religious type but some of my friends are. A few of them went to the States, when they were walking on the streets people said, "OSAMA", "Get out of our damn country.", "You terrorist." The place they rented got trashed and egged. In July this summer, a girl I know went to visit her family in the State, and some guys took her Hijab (the scarf you see girls wear) off and slapped her a few times across the face, there was a cop car but he didn't do anything drove off after they were done (There are tons of these happening everyday but you and the rest of the world aren't always informed). When, we the middle eastern or Islamic society hear this we/they get as edgy and generalize, as you stated American do when you see people burning your flag. I know this happens in other places too before you think, I'm trying to say this only happens in America.

As you said Americans as a whole doesn't view all Muslims, which is true but the same goes in the Middle East and other places, there are people who don't view America like that.

It just seems like on the whole Americans are hated over there. And I am extremely sorry that that happened to your friend. I'm sure the police officer didn't really see it because hate crimes are punished very severely here. There are probably racist cops but that behavior is not tolerated anywhere I have been and I live in Texas, a "supposedly" racist state.

 

[ReLax -]

It just seems like on the whole Americans are hated over there. And I am extremely sorry that that happened to your friend. I'm sure the police officer didn't really see it because hate crimes are punished very severely here. There are probably racist cops but that behavior is not tolerated anywhere I have been and I live in Texas, a "supposedly" racist state.

LOL I live in Canada, so relax

The stuff being called to my friend was in Texas. I have no hard feelings of anything people are like that. When I was 10, 9/11 first happen, I was walking to school and some elder guy pushed me, he also called me a terrorist and also a racist word. I hate no one but I feel pain from both sides and I hear things (complaints, racism, and etc) from both. I'm not trying to pick on your nation but most of it comes from America (Government, News, etc).

America isn't hated as a whole but the Government and when people (civilian) give side than people blame majority of America. In the Middle East people will fight the Government but in American you really can't

 

[IntrovertedKittenNinja]

I've read a good number of articles and seen a good number of documentaries that states that we're extremely close to burning out the earth's supply of oil... And with China and India and the huge population they have needing more and more of it, do any of you think it's possible that a large scale war might be fought over resources? Not necessarily between the U.S. and China or whatever, but I mean, any nation which needs more resources. Though I highly doubt that if any WWIII were to occur it would resemble nothing like WWII. It'd probably be mostly air force and long range missles and drones and stuff.

Also, some things I wanted to point out:

To the person who thinks the U.S. is still dominant in the economy-- I'm not going to say we're third world or anything, but the U.S.'s trade relations with China are highly favorable to China, not really us. I mean sure we get cheaper chinese labor and neat stuff that gets sold at your local Walmart, but if we're importing all this stuff, or buying it, then that means we're missing out on selling it.

To the person who said the U.S. dominated Japan in WWII prior to the atomic bombings, yes, that is true, but you can't really use the death tolls and stuff as an indicator, because Japanese suicidal bonzai charges and stuff and their preference to die rather than surrender creates a super high death toll for the Japanese and a lower one for Americans, who obviously didn't share the same ideals and didn't have a problem with surrendering if it meant surviving.

To the person who says Russia has superiority in nukes because it has two times the amount the U.S. has, yes, Russia may have more nukes, but it kinda doesn't matter. If two guys have a gun to each others' heads, and one gun happens to just fire another bullet after the first, I mean... both are dead either way, a second shot isn't really going to matter. What I mean is, both countries have enough nukes to destroy the entire world hundreds of times over, just maybe the U.S. can destroy the world a few hundred or so less. Lol.

Uhh.. what else?

Oh, and yeah, despots like Hitler aren't likely because in this day and age, with technology and social networking (we've seen social networking play a part in two huge revolutions already) it's easier to overthrow a regime than in the days where all people could use is a telegram or something. I think the only kinda "despot" that could exist is a really sneaky anti-christ kinda one, one that is malevolent but in a way you can't really pick up on.

oops. I forgot about the Vietnam point. Yes, it's possible for the U.S. to lose a war, but we only lose when we're trying to occupy and suppress a determined guerrilla force. And really, ANY nation that tries to invade a country and suppress a determined guerrilla force will ALWAYS lose out. I'd also point out that the Soviet Union lost to Afghanistan for the same reason...

I think though if a large scale, OPEN war were fought between the U.S. and another country, the U.S. would win. I mean, the U.S. may have a crappy education and health system, a lot of extremely obese and extremely ignorant people, but when it comes to giant freaking guns, we have a lot. >.>

 

[Rei]

Capitalist forces know better than starting or allowing a WW III to start.

It is much more profitable to them to design the need for every country to have expensive defense industries or nuclear weapons since they provide these mechanisms.
So no, as long as there's capitalism that profits 'enough' from defense systems there won't be a WW III.

 

[Caliburn]

Capitalist forces know better than starting or allowing a WW III to start.

It is much more profitable to them to design the need for every country to have expensive defense industries or nuclear weapons since they provide these mechanisms.
So no, as long as there's capitalism that profits 'enough' from defense systems there won't be a WW III.

More or less what I said weeks ago somewhere in the beginning of this thread, only in other terms.

The primary reason as why people go to war is to benefit from it, however in the current situation you get more benefit from avoiding war than going to war as you potentially would loose a lot.

 

[-God of War-]

There will be a WW III!! Everyone wants to take revenge! A lot of states, countries,etc hate each-other!There are so many conflicts, unavoidable ones which cannot be left behind. Also terrorizem is a problem. All those things revenge, lose, terrorizm, politic etc will create the new WW! Also a lot of peoles will take part at WW III cause they want to protect their family and their country!

 

[Rei]

More or less what I said weeks ago somewhere in the beginning of this thread, only in other terms.

The primary reason as why people go to war is to benefit from it, however in the current situation you get more benefit from avoiding war than going to war as you potentially would loose a lot.

We usually agree, that's a given. As long as there's enough money invested in defense there's no need for wars.
I have just read the previous posts here and, in my understanding, capitalism has unfortunately succeed. There are those who compare which country is richer or has more nuclear weapons; which only proves how profitable the business of defense is.

 

[Swizzik]

We usually agree, that's a given. As long as there's enough money invested in defense there's no need for wars.
I have just read the previous posts here and, in my understanding, capitalism has unfortunately succeed. There are those who compare which country is richer or has more nuclear weapons; which only proves how profitable the business of defense is.

people gain from war all the time even when theyre not in it....like when countries sponsoring wars nowadays its for political advantage

 

[Caliburn]

people gain from war all the time even when theyre not in it....like when countries sponsoring wars nowadays its for political advantage

There's a big difference between a war and a World War.

 

[Swizzik]

There's a big difference between a war and a World War.

true....

 

[darkheart]

Hey guys.

I was reading a thread on here talking about Hitler and it got my brain churning. I was thinking about the imminent third world war. As much as the world tries to avoid another world war, I believe based on basic understanding of human nature, that we will face a unavoidable situation that will lead to war.

As long as there are people there will always be a difference in choice. When these two choices collide with each other you get friction. When the friction peaks then the result is an unavoidable conflict despite any effort to stop it.

We will face a lot of hardships during this time, assuming you or I are still alive and well. We may be friend or foe depending on the circumstances. These moments may be the last ones we share together. I wonder if the loss of life will be greater than what we have seen. For what ideals will the enemy be fighting for? Who will ally to stop the enemy? Which nation will betray which? Who will lead this group of people to cause so much destruction?

I hope that we do not live to see such a thing but I can ascertain that it will happen nonetheless. I will leave you with this quote:


"Man achieves what he want's to achieve irregardless of his motives. Whether or not that equates to peace or war, that is for him to decide and for us to bear. We are merely the pawns in his game of chess."

Leopoldo Rodriguez

It's not a possibility; it's an inevitability. Though, the world may not have to worry about it getting to the point that it is called WW III in the near (five to ten years) future, however, the world is on the path to it as we speak.

More than likely, as other posters have hypothesized, it will come near the end of the supply of oil as oil is the lifeblood of any nation. The population is exploding at an unprecedented rate and as that continues, the demand for oil will sky-rocket and the end of oil will come much sooner than projected.

Then will come the inevitability of forging alliances. This may very well be what is happening now- the way that it seems the Western world is against Eastern world. Western: U.S., Europe, Israel (because Europe and the U.S. consider Israel "their baby"). Eastern: Muslim countries and all those who despise the U.S. and Europe... like Venezuela and Russia. Russia because, after the end of the Cold War, their country was left in shambles and many of them yearn for a return of Communism; take a look at Vladimir Putin who is really pulling the strings of Medvedev because he cannot legally be president until he can figure a way to stage a coup (and I think he is one shrewd and cunning cookie and will eventually figure it out).

China is a "wild card" and I am unsure which side it will take, or it will wait out the conflict and then ally itself with whomever seems to be emerging as the victor. Or China will wait it out, dormant and swoop in to duke it out with the victor. China will play a huge role in this as it seems to be the next world power to take the place of the U.S.

And it will be both thermonuclear and biological. What a killer combination: either weaken a country so that it cannot fight and then obliterate it, or wipe it out and leave the survivors infected.

As for how it will all play out to the end, that has yet to be seen. The only thing we can count on is the fact it WILL happen. Besides death and taxes being an inevitability, war is one as well. It is a depressing fact, but one that humanity, unless we find a way to band together to defeat the things that don't discriminate in who they destroy (AIDS, other viruses, hunger, etc), cannot avoid.