[VS] Neji vs Kimimaro

DrProof

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Skid mark under Neji's feet can be used to show where his spin started and where it ended imo , but common sense is common i guess..

Dude lol. We both agree the skid marks insinuate the rotation had been almost complete IN THAT INITIAL PANEL. But that means nothing when the clash still remained active 2 panels later (which insinuates Neji got off a full rotation, or the clash would've just ended @ the next page), until eventually they were deflected back with such such force it created craters when they landed.

You're right, common sense isn't common. Especially when you can't read what Tenten stated. She blatantly stated: "When Neji does rotation, he spins around in a circle." Then right after says: "Naruto charged straight at Neji." She saw what happened, she's been Neji's teammate all her life. Come on now, if Tenten states her teammate Neji got off a full circle rotation, he did just that. Complimented by the clash remaining two panels later, which can be further reinforced due to the continuing shockwaves.



The whole chapter is right here lol.
 
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neosmith500

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Dude lol. We both agree the skid marks insinuate the rotation had been almost complete IN THAT INITIAL PANEL. But that means nothing when the clash still remained active 2 panels later (which insinuates Neji got off a full rotation, or the clash would've just ended @ the next page), until eventually they were deflected back with such such force it created craters when they landed.

Bold was exactly my point , now tell me why would Neji not being able to complete a full spin IN TIME for the clash not hinder its potential?? I'll wait , a jutsu that works like a spinning top no less.

But the clash was over in the next panel , direcrly after the incomplete Kaiten it was follwed by the BOOM which sent them flying so , No


You're right, common sense isn't common. Especially when you can't read what Tenten stated. She blatantly stated: "When Neji does rotation, he spins around in a circle." Then right after says: "Naruto charged straight at Neji." She saw what happened, she's been Neji's teammate all her life. Come on now, if Tenten states her teammate Neji got off a full circle rotation, he did just that. Complimented by the clash remaining two panels later, which can be further reinforced due to the continuing shockwaves.

It clearly isn't. I know wat she said but clearly im paying attention to more than that obvious fact here. Im glad that we made progress with the skid marks tho..
 
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DrProof

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Bold was exactly my point , now tell me why would Neji not being able to complete a full spin IN TIME for the clash not hinder its potential?? I'll wait , a jutsu that works like a spinning top no less.




It clearly isn't. I know wat she said but clearly im paying attention to more than that obvious fact here. Im glad that we made progress with the skid marks tho..

So if it's an obvious fact, why are you arguing against it? Rotation happened. KN0 destroyed it. It is, what it is.

Quick question. Where did the idea that spinning faster = stronger/more durable defense? At the end of the day its the same amount of chakra emitted. Correct? Spinning faster won't change the quality in strength it possesses. Unless it was stated somewhere in the manga that spinning faster somehow ups chakra strength? If so please link me.

The DB doesn't even state that rotating makes the jutsu stronger or whatever.

KEKKEI GENKAI; Taijutsu: Hakkeshou Kaiten (Titanic Revolution* of the Eight Trigrams Palm)
User: Hyuuga Neji
Defensive; Close range; Rank: none

Main text

A taijutsu where one releases a large amount of chakra from their body's chakra openings to catch the blows from an enemy's attacks, while making one's body spin to repel them. A secret transmitted by oral tradition within the Hyuuga's Main House, though Hyuuga Neji came up with it own his own, despite him being from the Branch House. It stands in the same league as Gaara's Sand as an ultimate protection, and was even called "the other Absolute Defense". This is the high grade taijutsu that made Neji's prodigious talent known during the Chuunin exam.

Caption

-An application of Juuken, the other "Absolute Defense"!!

Picture comment

-The Byakugan's nigh-360? field of vision perceives the rear attack, and Kaiten intercepts it (tn: some words were illegible to me so that sentence is partly made up, and probably wrong).
 

neosmith500

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So if it's an obvious fact, why are you arguing against it? Rotation happened. KN0 destroyed it. It is, what it is.

I never did , reread my first post..


Quick question. Where did the idea that spinning faster = stronger/more durable defense? At the end of the day its the same amount of chakra emitted. Correct? Spinning faster won't change the quality in strength it possesses. Unless it was stated somewhere in the manga that spinning faster somehow ups chakra strength? If so please link me.

If the jutsu works by spinning and gains its power from it , then it doesn't take a genius to figure that Rotation w/Faster and complete full spin>> a Rotation in which the user didn't have time to complete a full 360 spin in time for a clash..
 
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DrProof

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I never did , reread my first post..




If the jutsu works by spinning and gains its power from it , then it doesn't take a genius to figure that Rotation w/Faster and complete full spin>> a Rotation in which the user didn't have time to complete a full 360 spin.
[/QUOTE]

Where in the manga, or databook does it state the chakra in rotation increases, or gets stronger if completed? I don't remember a single panel where it says that. The chakra quality stays the same, therefore KN0 chakra > CE Neji's rotation.
 
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neosmith500

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Where in the manga, or databook does it state the chakra in rotation increases, or gets stronger if completed? I don't remember a single panel where it says that. The chakra quantity stays the same, therefore KN0 chakra > CE Neji's rotation.

What are you even talking about? Its basically the same as a fan's repelling ability and a Spinning TOP , fan which spins faster>>same fan spinning slower , get it??

If the Rotation works and gets its reflective power from Spinning in a full circle , then clearly not being able to complete said circle would hinder the jutsu..
 
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Ace of the fire fist

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rotation have same concept as fan

when a fan is maximise and you want full effectiveness of fan you turn it all way up making fan blow wind at much stronger and faster rate

a slow fan only generate little bit of wind in comparison

speed obviously make it more powerful just like in most cases
 

DrProof

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What are you even talking about? Its basically the same as a fan's repelling ability and a Spinning TOP , fan which spins faster>>same fan spinning slower , get it??

If the Rotation works and gets its reflective power from Spinning in a full circle , then clearly not being able to complete said circle would hinder the jutsu..

rotation have same concept as fan

when a fan is maximise and you want full effectiveness of fan you turn it all way up making fan blow wind at much stronger and faster rate

a slow fan only generate little bit of wind in comparison

speed obviously make it more powerful just like in most cases

Lol you're both not understanding what I'm saying. Does the quality of chakra change? I'm saying. If KN0 chakra went up against rotation, would the chakra to form the rotation be anymore stronger than if it were a half rotation? I'm asking this because no where in the DB, or manga does it state, or imply that the chakra EMITTED to perform rotation gets any more stronger (chakra quality wise).

So ask yourself. Why would it spinning at full, or half momentum make any difference in CHAKRA QUALITY? It'd still be the same chakra, just rotating. So KN0 chakra > CE Neji chakra = KN0 > rotation chakra.
 

Ace of the fire fist

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chakra quality is irrelevant to rotation being stronger jutsu though that is where you are mistaken brother. speed alone makes technique stronger due to increase in velocity and force equal power x velocity
 

DrProof

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chakra quality is irrelevant to rotation being stronger jutsu though that is where you are mistaken brother. speed alone makes technique stronger due to increase in velocity and force equal power x velocity

If the chakra quality doesn't change then KN0 chakra would still overwhelm it due to power superiority. It's a known fact that the stronger the chakra wins.
 

Ace of the fire fist

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If the chakra quality doesn't change then KN0 chakra would still overwhelm it due to power superiority. It's a known fact that the stronger the chakra wins.

that not what im arguing brother I just said faster rotation obviously mean stronger rotation. i agree kn0 Naruto would overwhelm regardless because on kn0 present him with extreme strength and enhance speed to point of neji panicking about it during they fight
 

neosmith500

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Lol you're both not understanding what I'm saying. Does the quality of chakra change? I'm saying. If KN0 chakra went up against rotation, would the chakra to form the rotation be anymore stronger than if it were a half rotation? I'm asking this because no where in the DB, or manga does it state, or imply that the chakra EMITTED to perform rotation gets any more stronger (chakra quality wise).

So ask yourself. Why would it spinning at full, or half momentum make any difference in CHAKRA QUALITY? It'd still be the same chakra, just rotating. So KN0 chakra > CE Neji chakra = KN0 > rotation chakra.

No , why would the quality of Chakra change? the question itself does not correlate with any of the points i brung up making them irrelevant in correlation to my posts. The only thing that changes is its repelling power , not the quality of the Chakra being spun only the velocity of said Chakra being spun which would OBVIOUSLY affect its repelling power which derives from the physical rotation of the user.

It'd still be the same chakra, just Rotating which is wat gives it its ability to repel so again it doesn't take a genius to figure that a hindered Rotation which didn't even complete that of a single 360 turn would yield less repelling power than a perfectly timed Rotation that was able to build decent spinning momentum , just like a fan or spinning top of which it was directly correlated to in the Manga making my whole logic towards the importance of a proper spin 100% valid in context.

This quality of chakra talk is something im not interested because im directly addressing the function of the jutsu in which was incomplete. If we actually followed the manga then it would be KNO Chakra charge=CE Neji's incomplete Rotation which didn't even build up enough speed/momentum to complete a single spin in time for the clash..
 
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DrProof

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No , why would the quality of Chakra change? the question itself does not correlate with any of the points i brung up making them irrelevant in correlation to my posts. The only thing that changes is its repelling power , not the quality of the Chakra being spun only the velocity of said Chakra being spun which would OBVIOUSLY affect its repelling power which derives from the physical rotation of the user.

It'd still be the same chakra, just Rotating which is wat gives it its ability to repel so again it doesn't take a genius to figure that a hindered Rotation which didn't even complete that of a single 360 turn would yield less repelling power than a perfectly timed Rotation that was able to build decent spinning momentum , just like a fan or spinning top of which it was directly correlated to in the Manga making my whole logic towards the importance of a proper spin 100% valid in context.

This quality of chakra talk is something im not interested because im directly addressing the function of the jutsu in which was incomplete. If we actually followed the manga then it would be KNO Chakra charge=CE Neji's incomplete Rotation which didn't even build up enough speed/momentum to complete a single spin in time for the clash..

All that you just typed is uneccessary because you just gave me the answer I wanted. The quality of chakra doesn't change. KN0 chakra overpowered rotation chakra. And as you just admitted, the quality never changes. Thus KN0 chakra > CE Neji rotation chakra.

End of story. So you continuing to argue is moot, because my entire goal was to prove KN0 > pt.1 Neji's rotation. Which you just helped me do.

Also, I apologize for implying the battle went on for extra panels, but it was the only way to get you to say what I needed you too, and ultimately admit the chakra of rotation doesn't elevate, or descend, it stays the same.

KN0 chakra > pt.1 Neil's rotation.
 
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neosmith500

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All that you just typed is uneccessary because you just gave me the answer I wanted. The quality of chakra doesn't change. KN0 chakra overpowered rotation chakra. And as you just admitted, the quality never changes. Thus KN0 chakra > CE Neji rotation chakra.

End of story. So you continuing to argue is moot, because my entire goal was to prove KN0 > pt.1 Neji's rotation. Which you just helped me do.

Also, I apologize for implying the battle went on for extra panels, but it was the only way to get you to say what I needed you too, and ultimately admit the chakra of rotation doesn't elevate, or descend, it stays the same.

KN0 chakra > pt.1 Neil's rotation.

U didn't address a thing i said about why the spin is important , and u still cant seem to get that i already proved my case over and over in correlation to my first post by attributing it to a spinning top/fan which clearly gets their power from velocity makin ur question about Chakra quailty moot since Rotation gets its repelling power from spinning fast not quality of Chakra. Yes quaily of Chakra does affect power but in Rotation's case the spin affects the core function of the jutsu.

-So again if we actually follow the manga like wat im doing and add a bit of ur logic , then Neji w/low quality Chakra and a delayed spin = KN0 w/high Quality Chakra since the two things tied on page , none was> the other so drop that now.

If this quality nonsense was even half way valid then KN0 would've busted straight through the incomplete Kaiten without getting repelled at all since by ur logic the QUALITY of KN0 would simply overpower Neji's without being challenged at all , which didn't happen since they Tied in canon.......

But now , somehow a perfectly timed Rotation with stronger repelling power somehow does worse than a hindered one which already tied with KN0? Yea no , that logic doesn't work , so if ur entire goal was to prove KN0 > pt.1 Gimped rotation then u have failed again since the Manga already showed us wat happend and it was an exact Tie , meaning KN0 = pt.1 Gimped rotation and anything else is fan-fiction unless u can show both not getting repelled in the exact same way.

-Facts i've proven which u need to address , Rotation works like a spinnin top in canon which means faster spin = more reflective power and duration as was shown in the War. So no , the power of the Rotation does not stay the same with a gimped spin and yea ENd of story since im seeing ntn but lies and wrong notions.
 
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Hakke

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I don't know why people use the Kn0 clash to downplay Rotation when it is actually a great feat.

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This is the AoE of Kn0 Naruto's attack and it's power was praised by a Jounin. Yet, An incomplete Rotation (where Neji only spun about 90 degree) was able to repel it. If he managed to complete the Rotation he would've repelled it with zero difficulty.
 

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U didn't address a thing i said about why the spin is important , and u still cant seem to get that i already proved my case over and over in correlation to my first post by attributing it to a spinning top/fan which clearly gets their power from velocity makin ur question about Chakra quailty moot since Rotation gets its repelling power from spinning fast not quality of Chakra. Yes quaily of Chakra does affect power but in Rotation's case the spin affects the core function of the jutsu.

-So again if we actually follow the manga like wat im doing and add a bit of ur logic , then Neji w/low quality Chakra and a delayed spin = KN0 w/high Quality Chakra since the two things tied on page , none was> the other so drop that now.

If this quality nonsense was even half way valid then KN0 would've busted straight through the incomplete Kaiten without getting repelled at all since by ur logic the QUALITY of KN0 would simply overpower Neji's without being challenged at all , which didn't happen since they Tied in canon.......

But now , somehow a perfectly timed Rotation with stronger repelling power somehow does worse than a hindered one which already tied with KN0? Yea no , that logic doesn't work , so if ur entire goal was to prove KN0 > pt.1 Gimped rotation then u have failed again since the Manga already showed us wat happend and it was an exact Tie , meaning KN0 = pt.1 Gimped rotation and anything else is fan-fiction unless u can show both not getting repelled in the exact same way.

-Facts i've proven which u need to address , Rotation works like a spinnin top in canon which means faster spin = more reflective power and duration as was shown in the War. So no , the power of the Rotation does not stay the same with a gimped spin and yea ENd of story since im seeing ntn but lies and wrong notions.



Très impressionnant --

This is a very notable argument that even I failed to take into consideration. You have my respect.

 

DrProof

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U didn't address a thing i said about why the spin is important , and u still cant seem to get that i already proved my case over and over in correlation to my first post by attributing it to a spinning top/fan which clearly gets their power from velocity makin ur question about Chakra quailty moot since Rotation gets its repelling power from spinning fast not quality of Chakra. Yes quaily of Chakra does affect power but in Rotation's case the spin affects the core function of the jutsu.

-So again if we actually follow the manga like wat im doing and add a bit of ur logic , then Neji w/low quality Chakra and a delayed spin = KN0 w/high Quality Chakra since the two things tied on page , none was> the other so drop that now.

If this quality nonsense was even half way valid then KN0 would've busted straight through the incomplete Kaiten without getting repelled at all since by ur logic the QUALITY of KN0 would simply overpower Neji's without being challenged at all , which didn't happen since they Tied in canon.......

But now , somehow a perfectly timed Rotation with stronger repelling power somehow does worse than a hindered one which already tied with KN0? Yea no , that logic doesn't work , so if ur entire goal was to prove KN0 > pt.1 Gimped rotation then u have failed again since the Manga already showed us wat happend and it was an exact Tie , meaning KN0 = pt.1 Gimped rotation and anything else is fan-fiction unless u can show both not getting repelled in the exact same way.

-Facts i've proven which u need to address , Rotation works like a spinnin top in canon which means faster spin = more reflective power and duration as was shown in the War. So no , the power of the Rotation does not stay the same with a gimped spin and yea ENd of story since im seeing ntn but lies and wrong notions.

Ridiculous man. You're rambling on, and on when the point is. The chakra quality in rotation does not change, completed or not. It's the same chakra irregardless. And, no where in the manga, or databook does it STATE that the chakra placed in rotation gets stronger. It just doesn't, unless you can find me a panel, or panels saying this then just drop it, because you're wrong.

This is the main point, and all the other stuff your'e saying is irrelevant: the chakra in rotation doesn't change -> KN0 chakra overpowers rotation chakra -> KN0 chakra is superior to pt.1 Neji's rotation. It's just that simple.

You can argue up and down that the faster Neji gets, the stronger rotation gets, but that's not support by the manga. No where does it state that the chakra in rotation ups its quality. No where. I'm done if your next post isn't linking any type of canonical proof of your claim that rotation gets stronger full spin, especially when you already admitted that the quality of chakra doesn't change. Which was my point to begin with.

KN0 quality >/= chakra for rotation's quality = KN0 Chakra >/= rotation. It doesn't matter how you spin it, my main propose was that KN0 busted rotation. Equal, or superior, it doesn't matter to me, at the end of the day, KN0 chakra was all that it took.

Also. @ First bold: Yes. This is the entire purpose my argument, and that sole statement you just made is the most true you've spat this entire argument.

@ Second bold: So you're telling me that spinning somehow makes chakra stronger? Do you not realize how asinine that sounds? It doesn't work like that, nor is it supported in the manga, or DB. It's just a fanmade claim until I can see a panel or something supporting that nonsense.
 
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neosmith500

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This has become tedius af , im glad there are peope who get wat im saying because this guy clearly doesn't.

-Rotation works like a Spinning Top , bottom right panel.
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So now this guy is telling me that spinning faster doesn't make the repelling power stronger as if he doen't know how a Fan or Spinning top works smfh , Do you not realize how asinine that is ? It works exactly like a spinning top and is supported by the manga so come back when u get some logic like most others who read and understand my posts.
 
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Imperious

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Ridiculous man. You're rambling on, and on when the point is. The chakra quality in rotation does not change, completed or not. It's the same chakra irregardless. And, no where in the manga, or databook does it STATE that the chakra placed in rotation gets stronger. It just doesn't, unless you can find me a panel, or panels saying this then just drop it, because you're wrong.
I would like to state that chakra potency varies from person to person, so the very quality of chakra exercised in the usage of rotation might differ. Also, "irregardless" is not a word.​
You can argue up and down that the faster Neji gets, the stronger rotation gets, but that's not support by the manga. No where does it state that the chakra in rotation ups its quality. No where. I'm done if your next post isn't linking any type of canonical proof of your claim that rotation gets stronger full spin, especially when you already admitted that the quality of chakra doesn't change. Which was my point to begin with.
I do agree that KN0 chakra is superior to the chakra utilised in Neji’s rotation, but that is where the inconsistency in your argument begins. It is made quite apparent from the provided panels that an incomplete rotation was able to repel Naruto who, of the two, had the superior chakra. If the potency of chakra is not a notable factor in the rotation’s ability to repel “KN0” Naruto, then it is implied that the speed of the rotation must have provided the augmentation that allowed Neji to repel Naruto.​
So you're telling me that spinning somehow makes chakra stronger? Do you not realize how asinine that sounds? It doesn't work like that, nor is it supported in the manga, or DB.
I think what he is implying, and logically so, is that the force generated from the rotation can be augmented by the momentum given from the speed and weight of the user.​
 

DrProof

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This is horrendously ridiculous. I ask for scans proving that rotation's chakra gets stronger in full transition -> none are provided. Strictly talking about the chakra here. If rotation's chakra doesn't get stronger/the quality isn't boosted/refined as has been already said, then KN0 chakra that busted rotation is =/> rotation. It's just the simple lmfao.

I'm done w this though. Not turning this into a horrendous 20 page debate when its clear either of us isn't willing to agree with one another.

& lmfao, Neo. Don't try to diss me bruh. You don't want to @shots with me :lol
 
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