Kankuro & Chiyo VS War Kakashi

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  • Adult Kankuro & Chiyo

    Votes: 3 60.0%
  • Executioners Blade Kakashi

    Votes: 2 40.0%

  • Total voters
    5

Bad Touch Yakushi

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Kamui restricted. Has Summons & Executioners Blade.


/ Adult Kankuro has Sasori's 100 Puppet Scroll /
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Location: Valley of the End
Intel: Kakashi has no intel on Chikamatsu or Sasori puppets.
 
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DrProof

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Kakashi. Neg diff. Restrict MS Sharingan, take away his summonings, and Zabuza's blade, and then maybe they can push him to low diff.

Nah. Even then it's still a neg. He's too fast, and has too much versatility to be hindered in this fight.
 
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The sword gives him an easy way to fight off the 100 puppets, your conditions make them tougher but Kakashi will still take this medium difficulty. More likely to get drained imo but yeah, victory
 

Antdog

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Once Kankuro brings out the 100 puppets Kakashi would prolly get overwhelmed, his lack of a good defense is gonna be his down fall when one hit is all it takes to get killed
 

Amenotejikara

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Could go either way, depends whether or not kakashi approaches from flanking with clone as bait to kill the user as their easily vulnerable or he blindly charges forward to inevitably get himself flanked. Thou, kank has been shown to switch himself with the puppet which would be kakashi's undoing if he went with flank -raikiri route.
 
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Bad Touch Yakushi

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Could go either way, depends whether or not kakashi approaches from flanking with clone as bait to kill the user as their easily vulnerable or he blindly charges forward to inevitably get himself flanked. Thou, kank has been shown to switch himself with the puppet which would be kakashi's undoing if he went with flank -raikiri route.
Chiyo's adept ability with the 10 Chikomatsu wouldn't allow her to be approached or sneaked upon. Kankuro without his scroll, who's to say. Kakashi's a fast dude.
 

Oblivionx

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I don't see kakashi winning without MS unless he can pull of some clone strategy and kills one of them in the start. With MS he wins though.
 

Amenotejikara

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Chiyo's adept ability with the 10 Chikomatsu wouldn't allow her to be approached or sneaked upon. Kankuro without his scroll, who's to say. Kakashi's a fast dude.
Puppets are not sensors, they only do what the user wants them to do. The fake kakashi will be fighting or avoiding the puppets while the real one would had already went underground/water to flank chiyo from behind. Then as she draws her last breathe she ask "when did you use bushin" and kakashi will say, "I didnt just used doton wall to block your puppets blades, i quickly used bunshin no jutsu because you couldn't see me....after that, all i needed to do was the clone drag on the fight to make sure you were completely focused on traping it therefore no clue i was already beneath you ready to flank."

These are mangafacts, here ill post this important panel here

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Game over. Every. Single. Time.
lol indeed
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BLAZE

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When people believe kankuro would be able use 100 puppets despite him nvr even been shown to use 5 of them at a time.He is no sasori

Kakashi violates both of them
 

Bad Touch Yakushi

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I'm aware, it's more that she can control them all as if they were independent. It's almost superhuman how she can multi-task and operate them all to do their own function.

My only statement was that she can manage a coordinated multi-attack and defence with puppets to spare. It's not as simple as with the standard puppet user where simply throwing a distraction shuriken and backstabbing suffices like it's Ninja Storm.
 

Amenotejikara

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I'm aware, it's more that she can control them all as if they were independent. It's almost superhuman how she can multi-task and operate them all to do their own function.

My only statement was that she can manage a coordinated multi-attack and defence with puppets to spare. It's not as simple as with the standard puppet user where simply throwing a distraction shuriken and backstabbing suffices like it's Ninja Storm.
I honestly don't know the point you're trying to make. Any logical ninja, would not even bother to engage with swarm of puppets but instead bypass it all and head straight to the source. I see no reason why kakashi can't go from point A to B (chiyo spot) to flank her with raikiri or some sort because despite how skilled chiyo is that her puppets appear to be independent,, they're clearly not. therefore if she doesn't know she's fighting a fake kakashi, while the real one dig his way to her location then neither her or the puppets would have the time to intercept. It's as simple as that if it were 1v1.
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Bad Touch Yakushi

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I honestly don't know the point you're trying to make. Any logical ninja, would not even bother to engage with swarm of puppets but instead bypass it all and head straight to the source. I see no reason why kakashi can't go from point A to B (chiyo spot) to flank her with raikiri or some sort because despite how skilled chiyo is that her puppets appear to be independent,, they're clearly not. therefore if she doesn't know she's fighting a fake kakashi, while the real one dig his way to her location then neither her or the puppets would have the time to intercept. It's as simple as that if it were 1v1.
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Only point: all 10 are not needed for attack. She's a multi-tasker.
 

Bad Touch Yakushi

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When people believe kankuro would be able use 100 puppets despite him nvr even been shown to use 5 of them at a time.He is no sasori

Kakashi violates both of them
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Who's to say what he's capable of as an adult. Anyway, it's a hypothetical fanon version.
 

Marin

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We have no reason to believe Kankuro will EVER reach the level required to use a 100 puppets. I also think it would be physically impossible given how Sasori manipulated all those puppets through his inner body mechanisms. Kankuro lacks the ability to keep track of all those.

Also, Kakashi's Sharingan would be enough to see all the suprise attacks the puppets may have and without those suprise attacks, there is little the puppets can offer. Also, his insane speed to keep up with stage 2 Jinchuuriki's and physical strength to actually push them back, coupled with his huge arsenal, I don't think Kankuro and Chiyo could beat him.

The only possible argument in favor of the two would be that they have the potential to overpower him if they both use, say 10 puppets each. Still, any long range jutsu will be able to destroy these puppets, or K.O. the user. Chiyo may be harder to hit given her insane dodging skills, but wreck her puppets and there's nothing she can do to you. Also, since you gave Kakashi summonings that would give him some back up in distracting the puppets, hence reducing the only advantage the two may have - numbers.
 

Bad Touch Yakushi

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We have no reason to believe Kankuro will EVER reach the level required to use a 100 puppets. I also think it would be physically impossible given how Sasori manipulated all those puppets through his inner body mechanisms. Kankuro lacks the ability to keep track of all those.
It makes no realistic sense for Chiyo to be able to master 10 and coordinate them at once but yet she does it. It's only hypothetical but imagine that 20 puppets all move at once with one movement for the sake of simplification. Clumsier than Sasori's swarm but just as wide-scale an attack.

Also, Kakashi's Sharingan would be enough to see all the suprise attacks the puppets may have and without those suprise attacks, there is little the puppets can offer.
Interesting point, could you elaborate on the surprise attacks for me? Outside of the poisoned blades and projectiles, very few of their attacks are merely gimmicks to me.

Also, his insane speed to keep up with stage 2 Jinchuuriki's and physical strength to actually push them back, coupled with his huge arsenal, I don't think Kankuro and Chiyo could beat him.
Yeah, his performance against the Edo Jin Paths is great and why I thought him a good candidate.
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I like the idea of Chiyo using her puppet anatomy, shield and her secret ace taijutsu mastery.
 

Marin

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It makes no realistic sense for Chiyo to be able to master 10 and coordinate them at once but yet she does it. It's only hypothetical but imagine that 20 puppets all move at once with one movement for the sake of simplification. Clumsier than Sasori's swarm but just as wide-scale an attack.
This isn't about realism. If it were we could just take the whole manga, throw it in the trash can and go read something more down to earth. Rather, the point was that it makes no sense, physically (according to the Narutoverse standards) to control that many puppets. Chiyo was able to control 10 of them because she atleast had them attached to a finger which she could move in different ways. The problem with a 100 puppets is that there is simply no more fingers you can hook them on.

(You may argue that he could hook them on to his toes but that would be just lol-worthy.)

As for the hypothetical scenario, moving 20 puppets in one line would be a terrible move, since the point of numbers is to surround your opponet and/or distribute attacks from various angles so as to put the target in a corner. If they're just going to all act the same, Kakashi would easily see through it.

Interesting point, could you elaborate on the surprise attacks for me? Outside of the poisoned blades and projectiles, very few of their attacks are merely gimmicks to me.
Almost all of the puppet's big moments we saw were in forms of hidden weapons, functionalities which the victim didn't know of and this put them in a tight position. First puppet performance, Shino vs Kankuro - all the hits at Shino came from hidden, unpredictable weapons. Skip to Shippuden, Sasori won because he knew all the secrets the puppets held (including their weakspots which Kakashi may well be able to see with his Sharingan) and destroyed them with ease while deploying a secret weapon himself (the poison of which Kankuro was unaware). Moving on to the big Sasori fight, it was all a matter of: "oh look, he upgraded the puppet be careful", "he has Iron Sand poisoned as well??!", "100 puppets u wot m8?" - Sasori had a huge advantage there because the two didn't know what to expect (even Chiyo was suprised by the stuff Sasori threw at them).

Even if there were some significant attacks which weren't secret, their strongest abilities do require the element of suprise. Also don't say aside from poisoned blades like it's a small thing considering how almost all puppets' arsenal boils down to hidden weapons and projectiles. Do note that I'm counting unpredictable behavior (such as Chiyo's puppets combining their limbs) as gimmicks here.

Yeah, his performance against the Edo Jin Paths is great and why I thought him a good candidate.
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I like the idea of Chiyo using her puppet anatomy, shield and her secret ace taijutsu mastery.
I forgot about puppet anatomy. Still don't think it would mean much considering how skilled Kakashi is in hand to hand combat.
 

Bad Touch Yakushi

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This isn't about realism.
Exactly my point, Ninja have unreal standards of multi-tasking.

As for the hypothetical scenario, moving 20 puppets in one line would be a terrible move, since the point of numbers is to surround your opponet and/or distribute attacks from various angles so as to put the target in a corner. If they're just going to all act the same, Kakashi would easily see through it.[/quote]

Definitely lesser effect but far from useless, making a stronger and wider-scale attack that can't be simply deflected. Just like how it operates for Sasori in the Storm games.

Almost all of the puppet's big moments we saw were in forms of hidden weapons, functionalities which the victim didn't know of and this put them in a tight position. "he has Iron Sand poisoned as well??!", "100 puppets u wot m8?" - Sasori had a huge advantage there because the two didn't know what to expect (even Chiyo was suprised by the stuff Sasori threw at them).
Nice point here. The sharingan gives reaction times but Kakashi specialises in planning before he engages an enemy. (Figuring out the mechanics of Kamui from a distance, trapping Zabuza and striking through the hounds) and loses battles without it (Pain/Itachi)

I get your point, but it's no Byakugan, it can't see within the puppets to see what they're about to do. And with the puppetry style it's that prior knowledge that stops you from being defeated. When all it takes is one scrape. Puppet users are best for fighting puppet users.

I forgot about puppet anatomy. Still don't think it would mean much considering how skilled Kakashi is in hand to hand combat.
Oh, that was more a half-joke. Her taijutsu is oddly good though.
 
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