[VS] Cracker>Doflamingo

[Punk Hazard]

In that hypothetical scenario (since that's not what happened in the manga), I'm gonna say Doflamingo would try to kill Luffy..

Don't you agree?



Luffy defeated Doffy when they actually went all out and fought with everything they had.. now of course it was never a 1v1 the whole time.. (trust me, I wish it was though.)

You feel the need to mention the fact that Luffy received help.. but so did Doflamingo... like a lot of help.. so I don't get why it's so hard for some of you guys to understand that it was never Doflamingo by himself against a whole bunch of people. It was an all out battle with many different fighters on both sides.. (three sides technically, if we include the Marines) and a lot of characters had skirmishes with different opponents throughout the arc.

Luffy wasn't by himself.. yes. This is true.

Doflamingo wasn't by himself either..

Nope. It's cut and dry. What would have happened if Luffy was paralyzed on the ground while Doffy was walking at him, and no one was there to save him?

 

[LBeezy]

Nope. It's cut and dry. What would have happened if Luffy was paralyzed on the ground while Doffy was walking at him, and no one was there to save him?

You say "nope" to what?

What is cut and dry?

If I'm not mistaken, You're asking what would Doflamingo do if he was walking up to a paralyzed, unconscious Luffy laying down on the floor, with no one else around right? That's what you're asking?

If that's exactly what you're asking, then why would Doflamingo not kill Luffy? It would be completely out of character for him to not kill Luffy. In fact, I would like to know what could possibly make Doffy do anything else but kill Luffy? lol

 

[Punk Hazard]

You say "nope" to what?

What is cut and dry?

If I'm not mistaken, You're asking what would Doflamingo do if he was walking up to a paralyzed, unconscious Luffy laying down on the floor, with no one else around right? That's what you're asking?

If that's exactly what you're asking, then why would Doflamingo not kill Luffy? It would be completely out of character for him to not kill Luffy. In fact, I would like to know what could possibly make Doffy do anything else but kill Luffy? lol

Exactly. He'd have been killed. The fact that Luffy would have been killed if he didn't have help=he didn't legitimately beat Doffy like you're saying.

 

[LBeezy]

Exactly. He'd have been killed. The fact that Luffy would have been killed if he didn't have help=he didn't legitimately beat Doffy like you're saying.

But in your hypothetical scenario, it only makes sense for Doflamingo to kill Luffy..

In the actual manga, Luffy and Doflamingo both have help throughout the whole arc, until they finally go all out at the end and give it everything they got 1 on 1. And Luffy beats Doflamingo..

This is in the manga bro..

 

[Punk Hazard]

But in your hypothetical scenario, it only makes sense for Doflamingo to kill Luffy..

In the actual manga, Luffy and Doflamingo both have help throughout the whole arc, until they finally go all out at the end and give it everything they got 1 on 1. And Luffy beats Doflamingo..

This is in the manga bro..

Remove the help Luffy had, and he has nothing to compensate for it.

Remove the help Doflamingo had, and he can compensate with Awakening.

It's simple math.

 

[LBeezy]

Remove the help Luffy had, and he has nothing to compensate for it.

Remove the help Doflamingo had, and he can compensate with Awakening.

It's simple math.

No sir. I'm sorry but if you remove the help Doflamingo had, "Awakening" most definitely doesn't compensate for it at all.


The simple math you speak of is KKG putting Doflamingo to sleep. 100% Manga proof.

 

[Punk Hazard]

No sir. I'm sorry but if you remove the help Doflamingo had, "Awakening" most definitely doesn't compensate for it at all.


The simple math you speak of is KKG putting Doflamingo to sleep. 100% Manga proof.

So you're saying that Trebol and Bellamy are stronger than Awakening, the thing that drew blood from Gear 4th Luffy and kept him on doing nothing but evasion for 30 minutes?

 

[LBeezy]

So you're saying that Trebol and Bellamy are stronger than Awakening, the thing that drew blood from Gear 4th Luffy and kept him on doing nothing but evasion for 30 minutes?

No I'm not saying they're stronger.

But they were more of an annoyance..

Bellamy beating on Luffy when Luffy doesn't want to fight back, does not equal to Doflamingo using Awakening against a Luffy who does want to fight back.

 

[Punk Hazard]

No I'm not saying they're stronger.

But they were more of an annoyance..

Bellamy beating on Luffy when Luffy doesn't want to fight back, does not equal to Doflamingo using Awakening against a Luffy who does want to fight back.

They're stronger than what, Awakening? That's not true at all.

Bellamy was able to overwhelm Luffy for a short period of time due to the advantage of Luffy's emotions. He didn't defend because he couldn't bring himself to hurt Bellamy.

Awakening accomplishes the same result in different execution: It will overwhelm Luffy through sheer brute force. Gear 2 and Gear 3 were 100% useless against Cracker and his shield. His Haki deflected them both like nothing, and Luffy couldn't do even a scratch of damage. However, one Kong Gun broke through Cracker's shield and damaged him. This establishes that Gear Fourth is levels beyond Gear 2 and Gear 3.

By the same measure, that means that Awakening is also far beyond Gear 2 and 3. Awakening fended off Gear Fourth Luffy for 30 mins. Meanwhile, one instance of Gear 4th immediately broke through something that rendered 2 and 3 useless. Doflamingo just has to separate Law and Luffy using Awakening, injuring them both. Law ends up defeated, and Luffy goes Gear Fourth as planned, except this time, Luffy doesn't have Colosseum fighters to protect him when Gear 4th fails.

If we start off with Luffy and Doflamingo alone, Awakening can intercept Luffy while he's going Gear 4th.

 

[LBeezy]

They're stronger than what, Awakening? That's not true at all.

I didn't say that. I literally said the opposite...

Bellamy was able to overwhelm Luffy for a short period of time due to the advantage of Luffy's emotions. He didn't defend because he couldn't bring himself to hurt Bellamy.

Awakening accomplishes the same result in different execution: It will overwhelm Luffy through sheer brute force.

No it doesn't. Luffy wanting to kick Doflamingo's ass is completely different then the Bellamy situation.

Plus Trebol's assistance during the fight wasn't even really based on physical strength and power.. it was more troublesome and annoying for Law and Luffy.. Doffy's awakening doesn't produce the same effectiveness just because it's physically stronger..

Gear 2 and Gear 3 were 100% useless against Cracker and his shield. His Haki deflected them both like nothing, and Luffy couldn't do even a scratch of damage. However, one Kong Gun broke through Cracker's shield and damaged him. This establishes that Gear Fourth is levels beyond Gear 2 and Gear 3.

By the same measure, that means that Awakening is also far beyond Gear 2 and 3. Awakening fended off Gear Fourth Luffy for 30 mins. Meanwhile, one instance of Gear 4th immediately broke through something that rendered 2 and 3 useless. Doflamingo just has to separate Law and Luffy using Awakening, injuring them both.

And if he doesn't separate them? I mean, come on, you act as though that's guaranteed, when I can argue that Law's abilities can prevent that from happening.. in fact, Law can actually make sure that him and Luffy stick together against Doffy.. without any Trebol or Bellamy to interfere.

Law ends up defeated, and Luffy goes Gear Fourth as planned, except this time, Luffy doesn't have Colosseum fighters to protect him when Gear 4th fails.

If we start off with Luffy and Doflamingo alone, Awakening can intercept Luffy while he's going Gear 4th.

Two can play at that sense of logic.. I would say Law doesn't get defeated.. and I would also say that Luffy uses his G4 and KKG earlier on, granting them the win sooner than later.



You see, I'm not saying Luffy > Doflamingo based on my opinion.. it's 100% in the Manga.. there's no way around it. KKG puts Doffy to sleep. Both Doflamingo and Luffy had help during the fight. (I wish Oda didn't do it that way, trust me.. I wish Oda gave us a fair 1 on 1 fight between the two of them.. that way it wouldn't even be up for discussion. But unfortunately this is the reality of what we have to go by.)

 

[OG sama]

I don't think Oda cares about the amount of help or how weakened either Luffy or Doflamingo is. He seems to just want us to know they were both weakened, he could care less how much weakened.

In Odas mind he probably thinks some of you are just overcomplicating things. In reality, GK would be a life ending attack but this is a manga, in the end DDs organs weren't really shredded or gone because then he would have died.

People get slashed up all the time and a bomb literally blew up in Pells face that was suppose to blow up a kingdom and he somehow didn't die.

In a manga where characters don't ever die, I can't believe how many people take GK so seriously.

 

[Punk Hazard]

I don't think Oda cares about the amount of help or how weakened either Luffy or Doflamingo is. He seems to just want us to know they were both weakened, he could care less how much weakened.

In Odas mind he probably thinks some of you are just overcomplicating things. In reality, GK would be a life ending attack but this is a manga, in the end DDs organs weren't really shredded or gone because then he would have died.

People get slashed up all the time and a bomb literally blew up in Pells face that was suppose to blow up a kingdom and he somehow didn't die.

In a manga where characters don't ever die, I can't believe how many people take GK so seriously.

Luffy acknowledged that it did critical damage. That validates taking it seriously. Doffy said he stitched the organs back together, so they were ripped apart as illogical as it may be.

 

[OG sama]

Luffy acknowledged that it did critical damage. That validates taking it seriously. Doffy said he stitched the organs back together, so they were ripped apart as illogical as it may be.

He said there was no way the attack didn't effect him, that's kinda it from what I remember at least.

They can be stitched apart and all but crazier things have happened like what I said about Pell. If a point blank explosion from a kingdom busting bomb can't obliterate you then some torn organs aren't no real big deal.

 

[LBeezy]

I don't think Oda cares about the amount of help or how weakened either Luffy or Doflamingo is. He seems to just want us to know they were both weakened, he could care less how much weakened.

In Odas mind he probably thinks some of you are just overcomplicating things. In reality, GK would be a life ending attack but this is a manga, in the end DDs organs weren't really shredded or gone because then he would have died.

People get slashed up all the time and a bomb literally blew up in Pells face that was suppose to blow up a kingdom and he somehow didn't die.

In a manga where characters don't ever die, I can't believe how many people take GK so seriously.

I agree.

I think this was pretty much how Oda was thinking while writing this part of the story.. he just wanted to show us readers that this wasn't a regular 1 on 1 fight. It was almost like a mini war type of deal.

I also think Oda wanted to make things clear, that no matter what, both Luffy and Doffy had help during the fight but at the end they each went all out and gave it everything they had.. Luffy being the stronger out of the two and taking the win.

 

[OG sama]

I agree.

I think this was pretty much how Oda was thinking while writing this part of the story.. he just wanted to show us readers that this wasn't a regular 1 on 1 fight. It was almost like a mini war type of deal.

I also think Oda wanted to make things clear, that no matter what, both Luffy and Doffy had help during the fight but at the end they each went all out and gave it everything they had.. Luffy being the stronger out of the two and taking the win.

Bingo. Oda isn't a complicated man so we as fans just need to quit over exaggerating things.

 

[Punk Hazard]

He said there was no way the attack didn't effect him, that's kinda it from what I remember at least.

They can be stitched apart and all but crazier things have happened like what I said about Pell. If a point blank explosion from a kingdom busting bomb can't obliterate you then some torn organs aren't no real big deal.

He called it a "monster of an attack," which is acknowledgment of how critical it is.

Outer durability has been stated to not be as good as inner. Law commented that you can't strengthen your organs, and even Zoro said no matter how tough you are, freezing weather will still affect you like a normal person. Busted organs are very much a big deal.

If you ARE trying to say that organs are strengthened like flesh and muscle, then you can't ever compare that bomb to Gamma Knife because that'd be saying Pell and Doflamingo have the same durability which is lmfaoo

 

[OG sama]

He called it a "monster of an attack," which is acknowledgment of how critical it is.

Outer durability has been stated to not be as good as inner. Law commented that you can't strengthen your organs, and even Zoro said no matter how tough you are, freezing weather will still affect you like a normal person. Busted organs are very much a big deal.

If you ARE trying to say that organs are strengthened like flesh and muscle, then you can't ever compare that bomb to Gamma Knife because that'd be saying Pell and Doflamingo have the same durability which is lmfaoo

That's not the point smh. If a bomb that's suppose to wipe out a kingdom doesn't even wipe out a single person INSIDE AND OUT then how are you going to take some shredded organs that were even stitched up seriously in this manga?

And there you go comparing Doflamingo to this, Mingo to that please just stop, that ain't the point.

 

[Uzumaki Macho]

Luffy acknowledged that it did critical damage. That validates taking it seriously. Doffy said he stitched the organs back together, so they were ripped apart as illogical as it may be.

And then right after that, DD said that Luffy has taken quite a bit of damage.

 

[Punk Hazard]

And then right after that, DD said that Luffy has taken quite a bit of damage.

That's good and all, but you're retarded if you think it was the same amount of damage that Gamma Knife did.

 

[iEspada]

Even if ruffy wins extreme dif against cracker with G4, Doflamingo" is stronger since ruffy needed help until he recovered. Not to mention gamma knife. and dont even start with "doflamingo merely managed to stalemate ruffy in g4". He stalemated him for 20 minutes (next page of awakening said "20 minutes later"). and no matter how it is achieved, doffy managed to keep up with g4 20 minutes until it run out. so if healthy cracker loses a doffy with destroyed organs didnt 1on1, doffy > cracker. period.