To be honest Sasuke for most of the manga wasn't the type of guy who seemed interested in girls at all. He actually was all about revenge and then about clan. The lone bond which he formed was with Naruto. Sakura was obsessed with Sasuke and threw herself at him every chance she got what initiated as a baseless, childish and shallow crush turned into a so called one sided love on Sakura's part. It was only when Sasuke got rid of his hatred and obsessions/delusions only then he decided to return Sakura's feeling. The reason wasn't exactly shown to be love rather it was projected as something of gratitude. Well at least it was not pity which most of the haters seem to imply. The panels which have been shown may show a bit of comradeship on Sasuke's part but it wasn't love. Whether it was a forced relationship or not tend to be in favour of forced if one quotes all the panels in which Sakura was either dissed completely or was on the wrong end of a chidori. The only explanation in favour of this relationship is that Sasuke was never upfront about his feelings and after the war was over he came to terms with his positive feelings towards Sakura
The pairing wars are treacherous ordeals. to be fair some ns fans supported sk. Which is not very good either :lol.
OP: There is a thread for this. Please post there. SS was plausible pack in part 1 but part 2 really made it look bad.
Thats abuse, are you that stupid? Do you even know what abuse is? Abuse doesn't only have to come from one or the other, they both abused each other in the past and that suddenly was ok because they got married? You're a joke
The pairing wars are treacherous ordeals. to be fair some ns fans supported sk. Which is not very good either :lol.
OP: There is a thread for this. Please post there. SS was plausible pack in part 1 but part 2 really made it look bad.
I wanted to give better insight on why I don't agree with SasuSaku, and it doesn't have to do with Sasuke cutting his bonds with everyone, because I understood that completely. My only problem about that comes from what Sasuke said towards the end of the Manga when Kakashi was trying to support Sakura's decision in confessing her feelings to him, 'I have given no reason for her to love me, and vice versa' (something on those lines). Given the situation and the conflicts, Sakura really should of dropped those feelings.
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Anyway... incoming wall of text.
In the longer term, I don't quite understand what Kishimoto was going for in their relationship. For instance, what defines the relationship between Sasuke and Sakura? Sakura is the key to nothing. Her love is ineffectual in his redemption. She does not influence or change him. She doesn't help him grow. She doesn't challenge him mentally, physically, or emotionally. She is not someone he identifies with or connects to, the only thing keeping her even the slightest but relevant being she was on Team 7. And what does Sasusaku define or mean to Sakura? Sasuke's love yields to...what? How does it make her grow? How does it make her better? Its funny they say her love is selfless, but that's the only way she ever approaches him. In his big moments, all she can do is confess how much she loves him and wants him to stay with her. In the last chapters of the series, she angsts over if he is noticing her.
I mean, what significance does Sasuke's love have for her? Why will it make her happy to the degree that it she will so readily abandon everything, even her dignity, for even his slightest attention? She sees nothing him. She understands nothing about him. She has no message to give him. Sakura is not trying to "show him its okay to love and be vulnerable" or "to give him a family to love". Not even touching on the fact that Sakura never reflects on anything substantial about her love, or even thought about the Uchiha Massacre, the event that shaped the boy she loves, at any point within the story nor mentioned it. Even in her confessions and pleas, the chances to say what she thinks and what's on her heart, as has been said before me, she says the most irrelevant, ignorant things that actually focus more on herself than him.
I mean I just don't think they work. No, what I mean is they don't fit. Ignoring the murder attempts and abuse accusations, on a purely dynamic, chemistry, interactions, relationship level the manga has spent the entire narrative telling us how much these two don't work.
Sasuke does not need someone like this
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She literally cries all the time.. She can't even say anything about substantial about him. Nothing about his goals for peace, offer up any sort of insightful or intelligent thought about him as a person. For God's sake the most rudimentary shit she doesn't understand. This is a person saying he wants revolution, defined, in laymans terms, as a change and she goes on about "Just come back and everything will go back to the way it used to be" as her tag in her plea? If he wants change he obviously finds issue in the way things used to be, why would you listen to him go on about wanting a revolution then try to appeal to him through another depth-less declaration of love and going back to whatever happy times they used to have, which are apparently define as Sasuke being around while she admires him as that was the extent of their relationship?
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She's clingy and dependent. Even when he's announced he's leaving on a journey to find himself and atone for his crimes, she wants to tagalong for obvious romantic reasons, with no greater purpose than to be with him.
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She's ignorant and takes things for granted. Things that, unfortunately, mean the most to Sasuke. Like family and bonds with your important people. She trivializes everyone, her parent, Naruto, Kakashi, all her other friends, and says that if he left it would be the same thing as being all alone. If he left, it would be the equivalent of having her entire family and everyone she cares about murdered by someone she loved. She has all the things Sasuke dreams of having, the very things that he is so pain about, that drives him to such extremes[/i], and she thinks to say that these things mean nothing in the face of her "love" for someone who has never expressed any romantic interest in her who she isn't even close to, even by her own words? She takes for granted the very things that have shaped Sasuke into the individual he is today. Then, they mean so little to her that she would abandon them without a word, as well as her home and village, to defect to Orochimaru, the man who killed the Hokage, with no greater purpose than to be with him? This is supposed to be the confession that shows she understands or knows him?
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She can't stand up to him. She can't be herself around him. She can't handle his darkness or personality at his worst. She can barely even properly comprehend his issues.
But its not just Sakura who isn't suited to Sasuke. Sasuke isn't suited to Sakura.
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Sasuke is blunt. He doesn't sugarcoat. He's not some sensitive, smooth dude. Sakura, despite her bravado, is actually self conscious, deeply insecure, and lakckng in self esteem. One would think that having someone around who'll "give her tough love" will be good for her, but Sasuke proves to only perpetuate her behavior, not have her grow past it. She needs constant reassurance that she is wanted, useful, and liked.
Sasuke is not the perfect bishie boy. He has issues and problems of his own. He doesn't need a love interest who not only doesn't understand (or really even know) him but also barely comprehends his issues. He doesn't need someone who's more emotionally needy than him. Sakura doesn't need someone who makes her insecure behavior and self consciousness worse, who she is constantly being influenced by but never influencing. Does Sasuke even understand Sakura? Can he even fully grasp her issues? I don't see how these two individuals compliment or even bring something to the other that they need. Even Naruhina, their counter pair, at least has the love interest understand the other on some level. Sasuke and Sakura do not make each other better people. In fact, Sasuke takes Sakura's worst qualities and makes them shine while Sakura does nothing for Sasuke except, I guess, give him a child.
Hell, they don't even have an entertaining or interesting dynamic or any chemistry. On an ending note, another problem I have with their relationship stems from Sasuke's side too.
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Whether you think Sasuke cares for Sakura or not, you can't ignore the simple fact that nothing Sakura has done or said has brought forth such raw emotional responses. Having romantic feelings for someone, especially when you're a deeply emotional twelve year old boy wouldn't be something you can minimize the importance of to the point where to pretty much everyone it seems like they aren't there entirely. Love (or even regular romantic attachment) are strong feelings. Sasuke, main character and apple of Kishimoto's eye, would have prominent panels of special reactions to Sakura if they were truly supposed to be a serious relationship. One could argue that it isn't fair to compare Sakura to Naruto because the Naruto-Sasuke bond is supposed to be the center of the manga, but to look at his reaction to the confession, perfectly controlled and a little dismissive, and to look at his reaction to Naruto at Valley of the End, it shows that Sasuke is not this guy who can push down strong emotion.
Indeed I could make a thread about that, but I was more curious as to how people can be so disgusting and support a relationship where two people have tried to kill each other in the past and then even in marriage they barely see each other
Stop being a no fun allowed bot. NDS is dead, and so is the pairing thread. Nothing wrong on creating the thread here if I want to discuss it. Besides, it's a Naruto discussion topic anyway.
I wanted to give better insight on why I don't agree with SasuSaku, and it doesn't have to do with Sasuke cutting his bonds with everyone, because I understood that completely. My only problem about that comes from what Sasuke said towards the end of the Manga when Kakashi was trying to support Sakura's decision in confessing her feelings to him, 'I have given no reason for her to love me, and vice versa' (something on those lines). Given the situation and the conflicts, Sakura really should of dropped those feelings.
And then he remembered his family and claimed it was a thing from past for him now. And the he lost to Naruto and his future plans were also gone.
In the longer term, I don't quite understand what Kishimoto was going for in their relationship. For instance, what defines the relationship between Sasuke and Sakura? Sakura is the key to nothing. Her love is ineffectual in his redemption. She does not influence or change him. She doesn't help him grow. She doesn't challenge him mentally, physically, or emotionally. She is not someone he identifies with or connects to, the only thing keeping her even the slightest but relevant being she was on Team 7. And what does Sasusaku define or mean to Sakura? Sasuke's love yields to...what? How does it make her grow? How does it make her better? Its funny they say her love is selfless, but that's the only way she ever approaches him. In his big moments, all she can do is confess how much she loves him and wants him to stay with her. In the last chapters of the series, she angsts over if he is noticing her.
His big moments? The big moments you talking about were big negative moments when he was least likable and slipping.
Her love gave him a connection to the village otherwise he had burned the bridges and had no place to go back to. Because of Sakura and Naruto's promise to her he was able to re-establish a connection back. She is one of the reasons Uchiha clan is part of the village once again. Naruto's promise to her and Naruto's own standing in the village carrying a weight enables him to get a pardon without any strings attached.
Forget Sasuke and Sakura- It goes for any relationship-
A relationship doesn't have to be challenging- in fact such relationships do not last unless they evolve and not about challenging each other anymore, not all the time at least. A relationship that lasts has to be based on a wish of permanent companionship and empathy for each other and a certain level of respect for who they are and acceptance (and readiness to put up with each other's BS at least partially)
And no don't get in a relationship expecting them to help you grow, but with a wish to have a loving someone there for you as you grow old. Love doesn't make you better or worse. It may help you finding out what kind of person you are the way you handle disappointments or when things don't go your way but it's not a magic potion that will make you fly or anything. A supporting relationship may be a good support as in " connections" and active help but not to hinder in your growth maybe just as good depending upon the circumstances. Perfections don't exist.
I mean, what significance does Sasuke's love have for her? Why will it make her happy to the degree that it she will so readily abandon everything, even her dignity, for even his slightest attention? She sees nothing him. She understands nothing about him. She has no message to give him. Sakura is not trying to "show him its okay to love and be vulnerable" or "to give him a family to love". Not even touching on the fact that Sakura never reflects on anything substantial about her love, or even thought about the Uchiha Massacre, the event that shaped the boy she loves, at any point within the story nor mentioned it. Even in her confessions and pleas, the chances to say what she thinks and what's on her heart, as has been said before me, she says the most irrelevant, ignorant things that actually focus more on herself than him.
I mean I just don't think they work. No, what I mean is they don't fit. Ignoring the murder attempts and abuse accusations, on a purely dynamic, chemistry, interactions, relationship level the manga has spent the entire narrative telling us how much these two don't work.
They don't fit in your idea of " love". That's ok but what works for you doesn't have to work for everyone.
Accusations of abus/abusive relationship are childish of them all. They are not in a relationship at the time but fighting from two other sides.
Otherwise their other small conflicts can be attributed to helping in growth you were asking about- Sasuke's reaction on calling Naruto being lucky to not have parents, helped Sakura in realizing she was not thinking it through. That in turn made her look at Naruto more sympathetically- that's growth right there. Sasuke trying to kill her for real demonstrates her how far gone he was in his rage. So you cannot claim she was that unaware of the darkness he was going through at the time.
Sasuke ended up needing them all and eating his words. He was just lucky that Sakura or Naruto aren't the kind to rub it in.
She literally cries all the time.. She can't even say anything about substantial about him. Nothing about his goals for peace, offer up any sort of insightful or intelligent thought about him as a person. For God's sake the most rudimentary shit she doesn't understand. This is a person saying he wants revolution, defined, in laymans terms, as a change and she goes on about "Just come back and everything will go back to the way it used to be" as her tag in her plea? If he wants change he obviously finds issue in the way things used to be, why would you listen to him go on about wanting a revolution then try to appeal to him through another depth-less declaration of love and going back to whatever happy times they used to have, which are apparently define as Sasuke being around while she admires him as that was the extent of their relationship?
No one can say anything about Sasuke's goals for most of the manga- his goals were - I want to kill Itachi-> I want to destroy the village-> I want to kill all the Kages -> I will rule them all by ironfist-> I will kill Naruto
That's not a revolutionary shit- from Madara, to Nagato everyone already tried those things over and over and his plan is something in between Madara and Nagato's. Hell Zabuza was more of a revolutionary than him. Though he little understood what he was trying to fight against.
Sakura is there without a baggage of her own to take care of. What Sasuke has so much of it that he won't survive in any relationship if he ended up with a wife with a baggage of her own needing to deal with.
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She's clingy and dependent. Even when he's announced he's leaving on a journey to find himself and atone for his crimes, she wants to tagalong for obvious romantic reasons, with no greater purpose than to be with him.
She is raising a child as a single mother practically- that's not called being clingy and dependent.
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She's ignorant and takes things for granted. Things that, unfortunately, mean the most to Sasuke. Like family and bonds with your important people. She trivializes everyone, her parent, Naruto, Kakashi, all her other friends, and says that if he left it would be the same thing as being all alone. If he left, it would be the equivalent of having her entire family and everyone she cares about murdered by someone she loved. She has all the things Sasuke dreams of having, the very things that he is so pain about, that drives him to such extremes[/i], and she thinks to say that these things mean nothing in the face of her "love" for someone who has never expressed any romantic interest in her who she isn't even close to, even by her own words? She takes for granted the very things that have shaped Sasuke into the individual he is today. Then, they mean so little to her that she would abandon them without a word, as well as her home and village, to defect to Orochimaru, the man who killed the Hokage, with no greater purpose than to be with him? This is supposed to be the confession that shows she understands or knows him?
Following your reasoning Hinata never grew up either and probably gets unconscious every time Naruto walks in home - although that might tell why he spends so much time in office.
Sakura talks like normal kids. They often complain about their parents, and repeat things they hear from the people around them often without understanding it's full implications. Besides her origins - lack of a strong clan heritage or blood line gets her hated even by fans despite her self achievements. But she is not allowed to have a childish moment of rant moment against her parents even as a child?
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She can't stand up to him. She can't be herself around him. She can't handle his darkness or personality at his worst. She can barely even properly comprehend his issues.
Half the time Sasuke couldn't comprehend his own issues. His final fight with Naruto was a brawl to vent over the whole mess. If he won he would be a very lonely crazy old guy.
She is at least aware of his darkness and ghosts from the past and still willing to be there.
But its not just Sakura who isn't suited to Sasuke. Sasuke isn't suited to Sakura.
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Sasuke is blunt. He doesn't sugarcoat. He's not some sensitive, smooth dude. Sakura, despite her bravado, is actually self conscious, deeply insecure, and lakckng in self esteem. One would think that having someone around who'll "give her tough love" will be good for her, but Sasuke proves to only perpetuate her behavior, not have her grow past it. She needs constant reassurance that she is wanted, useful, and liked.
Sasuke is not the perfect bishie boy. He has issues and problems of his own. He doesn't need a love interest who not only doesn't understand (or really even know) him but also barely comprehends his issues. He doesn't need someone who's more emotionally needy than him. Sakura doesn't need someone who makes her insecure behavior and self consciousness worse, who she is constantly being influenced by but never influencing. Does Sasuke even understand Sakura? Can he even fully grasp her issues? I don't see how these two individuals compliment or even bring something to the other that they need. Even Naruhina, their counter pair, at least has the love interest understand the other on some level. Sasuke and Sakura do not make each other better people. In fact, Sasuke takes Sakura's worst qualities and makes them shine while Sakura does nothing for Sasuke except, I guess, give him a child.
Hell, they don't even have an entertaining or interesting dynamic or any chemistry. On an ending note, another problem I have with their relationship stems from Sasuke's side too.
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Whether you think Sasuke cares for Sakura or not, you can't ignore the simple fact that nothing Sakura has done or said has brought forth such raw emotional responses. Having romantic feelings for someone, especially when you're a deeply emotional twelve year old boy wouldn't be something you can minimize the importance of to the point where to pretty much everyone it seems like they aren't there entirely. Love (or even regular romantic attachment) are strong feelings. Sasuke, main character and apple of Kishimoto's eye, would have prominent panels of special reactions to Sakura if they were truly supposed to be a serious relationship. One could argue that it isn't fair to compare Sakura to Naruto because the Naruto-Sasuke bond is supposed to be the center of the manga, but to look at his reaction to the confession, perfectly controlled and a little dismissive, and to look at his reaction to Naruto at Valley of the End, it shows that Sasuke is not this guy who can push down strong emotion.
They are not comparable because those situations are very different and that's a Sasuke at 12. The feelings of anger, shock, sadness and resentment all at the same time after getting his whole clan wiped of at the age of 12 by his brother had extremely overpowering effect on Sasuke.
Whether you accept it or not - relatively calm nonjudgmental acceptance offered by Naruto and Sakura and kakashi and thus ultimately the village helped in getting more peaceful Sasuke back. And if Sakura rejects him at this juncture it takes away from Naruto too.
Sasuke felt like he need to see the world and understand it better for his atonement ( and possibly the reason why he refused to accept the hand Tsunade made) adds depth to his character but Sakura and Naruto only lend their support at this juncture. It's a chance given to him that if he chooses so he can have a normal life putting all the years as a missing nin and all the deeds as one, behind.
None of the pairings dwell on demonstrating love. I am not saying it's a great love story. But I wasn't looking for one in Naruto. Kishi is shy that way and sucks at romantic scenes. So no point in getting your hopes up. He shined in action sequences and many of the fights were memorable. Love relationships? Find a romantic manga instead of action one. Or most romance would be stupid in one way or another.
And then he remembered his family and claimed it was a thing from past for him now. And the he lost to Naruto and his future plans were also gone.
His big moments? The big moments you talking about were big negative moments when he was least likable and slipping.
Her love gave him a connection to the village otherwise he had burned the bridges and had no place to go back to. Because of Sakura and Naruto's promise to her he was able to re-establish a connection back. She is one of the reasons Uchiha clan is part of the village once again. Naruto's promise to her and Naruto's own standing in the village carrying a weight enables him to get a pardon without any strings attached.
Forget Sasuke and Sakura- It goes for any relationship-
A relationship doesn't have to be challenging- in fact such relationships do not last unless they evolve and not about challenging each other anymore, not all the time at least. A relationship that lasts has to be based on a wish of permanent companionship and empathy for each other and a certain level of respect for who they are and acceptance (and readiness to put up with each other's BS at least partially)
And no don't get in a relationship expecting them to help you grow, but with a wish to have a loving someone there for you as you grow old. Love doesn't make you better or worse. It may help you finding out what kind of person you are the way you handle disappointments or when things don't go your way but it's not a magic potion that will make you fly or anything. A supporting relationship may be a good support as in " connections" and active help but not to hinder in your growth maybe just as good depending upon the circumstances. Perfections don't exist.
They don't fit in your idea of " love". That's ok but what works for you doesn't have to work for everyone.
Accusations of abus/abusive relationship are childish of them all. They are not in a relationship at the time but fighting from two other sides.
Otherwise their other small conflicts can be attributed to helping in growth you were asking about- Sasuke's reaction on calling Naruto being lucky to not have parents, helped Sakura in realizing she was not thinking it through. That in turn made her look at Naruto more sympathetically- that's growth right there. Sasuke trying to kill her for real demonstrates her how far gone he was in his rage. So you cannot claim she was that unaware of the darkness he was going through at the time.
Sasuke ended up needing them all and eating his words. He was just lucky that Sakura or Naruto aren't the kind to rub it in.
No one can say anything about Sasuke's goals for most of the manga- his goals were - I want to kill Itachi-> I want to destroy the village-> I want to kill all the Kages because I will rule them all by ironfist-> I will kill Naruto
That's not a revolutionary shit- from Madara, to Nagato everyone already tried those things over and over and his plan is something in between Madara and Nagato's. Hell Zabuza was ore of a revolutionary than him. Though he littleunderstood what he was trying to fight against even less than Ino would know about it.
Sakura is there without a baggage of her own to take care of. What Sasuke has so much of it that he won't survive in any relationship if he ended up with a wife with a baggage of her own needing to deal with.
She is raising a child as a single mother practically- that's not called being clingy and dependent.
Following your reasoning Hinata never grew up either and probably gets unconscious every time Naruto walks in home - although that might tell why he spends so much time in office.
Sakura talks like normal kids. They often complain about their parents, and repeat things they hear from the people around them often without understanding it's full implications. Besides her origins - lack of a strong clan heritage or blood line gets her hated even by fans despite her self achievements. But she is not allowed to have a childish moment of rant moment against her parents even as a child?
She can't stand up to him. She can't be herself around him. She can't handle his darkness or personality at his worst. She can barely even properly comprehend his issues.
Half the time Sasuke couldn't comprehend his own issues. His final fight with Naruto was a brawl to vent over the whole mess. If he won he would be a very lonely crazy old guy.
She is at least aware of his darkness and ghosts from the past and still willing to be there.
They are not comparable because those situations are very different and that's a Sasuke at 12. The feelings of anger, shock, sadness and resentment all at the same time after getting his whole clan wiped of at the age of 12 by his brother had extremely overpowering effect on Sasuke.
Whether you accept it or not - relatively calm nonjudgmental acceptance offender by Naruto and Sakura and kakashi and thus ultimately the village helped in getting more peaceful Sasuke back. He felt like he need to see the world and understand it better for his atonement ( and possibly the reason why he refused to accept the hand Tsunade made) adds depth to his character but Sakura and Naruto only lend their support at this juncture. It's a chance given to him that if he chooses so he can have a normal life putting all the years as a missing nin behind.
None of the pairings dwell on demonstrating love. I am not saying it's a great love story. But I wasn't looking for one in Naruto. Kishi is shy that way and sucks at romantic scenes. So no point in getting your hopes up. He shined in action sequences and many of the fights were memorable. Love relationships? Find a romantic manga instead of action one. Or most romance would be stupid in one way or another.
Her love gave him a connection to the village otherwise he had burned the bridges and had no place to go back to. Because of Sakura and Naruto's promise to her he was able to re-establish a connection back. She is one of the reasons Uchiha clan is part of the village once again. Naruto's promise to her and Naruto's own standing in the village carrying a weight enables him to get a pardon without any strings attached.
Rofl, what connection to the Village? No connection go to back to? Are you ... delusional? Hell, even in the final moments of the Manga, Sasuke only mentions to Hagoromo, and Naruto, that he considered his bond with the MC, to be the last thing clinging into the world for him to be truly alone. Their married life isn't exactly my problem, despite that own train wreck. Her importance to his character is rather vague, if not, ignored.
Forget Sasuke and Sakura- It goes for any relationship-
A relationship doesn't have to be challenging- in fact such relationships do not last unless they evolve and not about challenging each other anymore, not all the time at least. A relationship that lasts has to be based on a wish of permanent companionship and empathy for each other and a certain level of respect for who they are and acceptance (and readiness to put up with each other's BS at least partially)
And no don't get in a relationship expecting them to help you grow, but with a wish to have a loving someone there for you as you grow old. Love doesn't make you better or worse. It may help you finding out what kind of person you are the way you handle disappointments or when things don't go your way but it's not a magic potion that will make you fly or anything. A supporting relationship may be a good support as in " connections" and active help but not to hinder in your growth maybe just as good depending upon the circumstances. Perfections don't exist.
Who said he did? It's a rather objective statement, their relationship together doesn't help the other out - Which was the point. You don't get into relationships based on how you both dislike the things about each other. Though I highly doubt that if you were Sakura in the Manga, or story, your life style or choices would pertain in the same format.
Otherwise their other small conflicts can be attributed to helping in growth you were asking about- Sasuke's reaction on calling Naruto being lucky to not have parents, helped Sakura in realizing she was not thinking it through. That in turn made her look at Naruto more sympathetically- that's growth right there. Sasuke trying to kill her for real demonstrates her how far gone he was in his rage. So you cannot claim she was that unaware of the darkness he was going through at the time.
Sadly her growth only stemmed as far as when Sasuke criticized her for not being self conscious about someone else's feelings, or their conflicts. But she was, when has Sakura took the gravity of Sasuke's situation, the person who lost his entire family and Clan? Have any of them? It's not just her, but the other females, or males, who have a strong relationship with Sasuke, rarely contemplate on what he even goes/went through as a person.
This idea is what baffles me the most - If you were in love, or liked someone. And you had heard or found out that their loved one's had passed away, what would your thoughts be? Or at least the narrative? How would your interactions go with that? How would you handle the situation?
Not really sure if he needs everything that he mentioned. I do think that Sasuke needed to understand he doesn't have to do everything alone, and that his idea was just plain twisted, in a way.
But I can't necessarily argue that he wasn't completely wrong in some of his standpoints. Naruto too, of course. I guess where the new series ends up as, it'll focus on which one held the most credibility. Because again we face the same situation revolving around the whole 'Ninja system' or just shinobi in general.
Sakura is there without a baggage of her own to take care of. What Sasuke has so much of it that he won't survive in any relationship if he ended up with a wife with a baggage of her own needing to deal with.
Following your reasoning Hinata never grew up either and probably gets unconscious every time Naruto walks in home - although that might tell why he spends so much time in office.
Er. You seem to have this thing where I'm trying to write up my post based on their relationship post-forced. When in reality, the post was dealing with how they were coming together before the end.
Of course most of the problems these relationships have (since you wanted to bring Hinata up for example): Like barely talking to each other, or 'fainting' -- Would be resolved. That's the whole idea of this, which again I will ask, how did you miss this?
Sakura talks like normal kids. They often complain about their parents, and repeat things they hear from the people around them often without understanding it's full implications. Besides her origins - lack of a strong clan heritage or blood line gets her hated even by fans despite her self achievements. But she is not allowed to have a childish moment of rant moment against her parents even as a child?
Half the time Sasuke couldn't comprehend his own issues. His final fight with Naruto was a brawl to vent over the whole mess. If he won he would be a very lonely crazy old guy.
She is at least aware of his darkness and ghosts from the past and still willing to be there.
They are not comparable because those situations are very different and that's a Sasuke at 12. The feelings of anger, shock, sadness and resentment all at the same time after getting his whole clan wiped of at the age of 12 by his brother had extremely overpowering effect on Sasuke.
Yes they are not comparable because Sakura can barely get a emotion from Sasuke while Naruto can do it so easily. You act as if Sasuke is some closed off subject which no one can actually extract raw, and physical feelings. But that's not the case.
Whether you accept it or not - relatively calm nonjudgmental acceptance offender by Naruto and Sakura and kakashi and thus ultimately the village helped in getting more peaceful Sasuke back. He felt like he need to see the world and understand it better for his atonement ( and possibly the reason why he refused to accept the hand Tsunade made) adds depth to his character but Sakura and Naruto only lend their support at this juncture. It's a chance given to him that if he chooses so he can have a normal life putting all the years as a missing nin behind.
Not really sure why this is even being mentioned. There's no reason to deny that Sasuke was brought back thanks to Naruto - And now he has the support of his friends again, the problem with the scan is that Sakura constantly tries to add herself in the situation despite the fact that Sasuke said he wants to leave to atone for his sins, he wants to see the world differently not that he is looking at it from a different standpoint.
That's like me telling my girlfriend, after going through so much trauma and heartache, that I want to accompany her through her 'much needed time away from everyone' because I want to spend time together. It's mainly my intentions and feelings over what she feels, plus disregarding her situation all together.
None of the pairings dwell on demonstrating love. I am not saying it's a great love story. But I wasn't looking for one in Naruto. Kishi is shy that way and sucks at romantic scenes. So no point in getting your hopes up. He shined in action sequences and many of the fights were memorable. Love relationships? Find a romantic manga instead of action one. Or most romance would be stupid in one way or another.
Yes for him nothing mattered more till he had his chance at brawling. He is lucky to have a friend like Naruto. Now imagine if Sakura had to do that for him- beat him up before she could take him home- now that indeed would be a twist and will leave people wondering what a marriage it was. :|
Look above- the interaction involved a brawl. Not many people fancy marrying someone to have it out with their partner in an arena and spend their rest of their time counting who won more matches.
Yeah, a relationship doesn't have to be challenging, it's fine if the significant other is belittled into being made out as worthless.
When one has to eat his words little after that he already have learned his lesson.
Who said he did? It's a rather objective statement, their relationship together doesn't help the other out - Which was the point. You don't get into relationships based on how you both dislike the things about each other. Though I highly doubt that if you were Sakura in the Manga, or story, your life style or choices would pertain in the same format.
You said. You were going on and on about how relationship should be. The moment you accept it's subjective, is the point I expect you to drop repeating that argument in future.
^^
They don't fit in any idea of love. Unless you view this as romantic, or anyone, but I highly doubt anyone views their relationship as realistic, too.
Sadly her growth only stemmed as far as when Sasuke criticized her for not being self conscious about someone else's feelings, or their conflicts. But she was, when has Sakura took the gravity of Sasuke's situation, the person who lost his entire family and Clan? Have any of them? It's not just her, but the other females, or males, who have a strong relationship with Sasuke, rarely contemplate on what he even goes/went through as a person.
The reason Sasuke had so much sympathy from everyone male or female was loss of his clan. Exactly how much demonstration do you expect after 3-4 years of incident? He was not the only one to lose his family in the village. People like Haku's mom not only lost her clan and family she was persecuted and rejected personally years after the marriage even - by her own husband. Haku was abandoned kid when Zabuza found him. Kimimaro lost them, Kushina had lost hers. Even in village many had lost families due to various reasons.
This idea is what baffles me the most - If you were in love, or liked someone. And you had heard or found out that their loved one's had passed away, what would your thoughts be? Or at least the narrative? How would your interactions go with that? How would you handle the situation?
Yes because for some strange reason you think Sasuke was the only one who had lost his family and in a village full of ninjas and even after 4 years everybody will be constantly keeping a grave face around him - that will definitely improve things for him seeing everyone visibly pitying him for so long.
Not really sure if he needs everything that he mentioned. I do think that Sasuke needed to understand he doesn't have to do everything alone, and that his idea was just plain twisted, in a way.
But I can't necessarily argue that he wasn't completely wrong in some of his standpoints. Naruto too, of course. I guess where the new series ends up as, it'll focus on which one held the most credibility. Because again we face the same situation revolving around the whole 'Ninja system' or just shinobi in general.
You aren't talking about any build up there. You are implying she is over dependent emotionally as a person when there is evidence to contrary which she is clearly not even if she wishes Sasuke would open up more.
There was a lot of moments where Sakura acted dependently in the Manga, but, the the talk about their interactions .... Somehow you missed it.
That's her way of showing she cares about his particular opinion because she likes him. That's different than being dependent and clingy in general. Or she had found Naruto and Lee's shoulder readily.
Er. You seem to have this thing where I'm trying to write up my post based on their relationship post-forced. When in reality, the post was dealing with how they were coming together before the end.
Their relationship is not forced. You can say it's not romantic but hardly forced. Some compromises on the road - yeah but not forced. No different than Naruto's marriage to Hinata.
Of course most of the problems these relationships have (since you wanted to bring Hinata up for example): Like barely talking to each other, or 'fainting' -- Would be resolved. That's the whole idea of this, which again I will ask, how did you miss this?
Repeating same thing in n ways doesn't make it a new point. I replied it when I replied your whole paragraph about how you deem a relationship should be and later when you were still comparing randoms incidence which had years between them as if all that happened at the same time while they were in relationship.
Indra said:
Jean Grey said:
Sakura talks like normal kids. They often complain about their parents, and repeat things they hear from the people around them often without understanding it's full implications. Besides her origins - lack of a strong clan heritage or blood line gets her hated even by fans despite her self achievements. But she is not allowed to have a childish moment of rant moment against her parents even as a child?
She is offering her love and companionship and help as much as he would let her in, not psychiatric evaluation session.
Yes they are not comparable because Sakura can barely get a emotion from Sasuke while Naruto can do it so easily. You act as if Sasuke is some closed off subject which no one can actually extract raw, and physical feelings. But that's not the case.
It's about boy's bonds for a teen manga. Nothing more.
Not really sure why this is even being mentioned. There's no reason to deny that Sasuke was brought back thanks to Naruto - And now he has the support of his friends again, the problem with the scan is that Sakura constantly tries to add herself in the situation despite the fact that Sasuke said he wants to leave to atone for his sins, he wants to see the world differently not that he is looking at it from a different standpoint.
Sakura doesn't tries to add her to the situation. Shikamaru pulled a whole idiotic plan blaming Sakura and Naruto's promise to her without which he was ready to kill him. Either that didn't happen and Naruto's promise to Sakura played no role or that did happen and enough of Konoha nins saw it as a commitment that had to be respected because it was Naruto's word.
Can you tell the difference between seeing the world differently and from different stand point? I don't know what you mean by that sentence.
That's like me telling my girlfriend, after going through so much trauma and heartache, that I want to accompany her through her 'much needed time off' because I want to spend time together. It's mainly my intentions and feelings over what she feels.
If you don't even offer to company knowing what she is going through that too would make you look like someone who is there only for fun moments. Key is offering and then accepting the reply. Telling someone wanting to accompany her/him if not imposing the feeling but telling them one own's intentions only and letting them know you are willing if they wish. They don't have to do it alone.
]Duh. What do you think I was writing about in the posts before? Somehow it was missed.
It was missed because you chose to give your reasons that were little more than how you think a relationship should be and only way it's supposed to be like. You then tried to augment on it based on supposed shortcomings of characters to suit your purpose but did so unfairly and in exaggerated way.
but nice fanfic tho about your main account
