BSM Naruto vs Nagato

[Kyle storm]

People think Nagato stands a chance :lol

OT : Naruto wins LOW diff .

 

[Awkward Linguist]

So why did you create a thread?​

 

[Holy God]

Nagato probably wins. If Naruto attempts to use his avatar he gets Kurama extracted from him.

 

[KidGamer65]

Nagato is underestimated as always.

Having watched Boruto: Naruto Movie, it's safe to conclude Biju powers are useless against Rinnegan users. Preta Path was canonically shown to have absorbed TBB, Naruto's most powerful Jutsu, which is not a surprise when the said Jutsu has shown to absorb physical and techniques carrying life-force. Naruto's whole arsenal consists of Chakra-based attacks, that will only recharge Preta Path over and over. I know Naruto's supporters will come with the Senjutsu Chakra fallacy, which I might as well address too.

Senjutsu's foundation is Spiritual energy + Physical energy + Natural energy = Senjutsu. This is the formula for it. Here is a diagram:

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For Nagato to actually turn to a stone, he must overload Senjutsu Chakra over his own, which is impossible to do so from absorbing Naruto's techniques. The foundation of Preta Path states that after the Chakra is absorbed, the said Chakra becomes the user's Chakra. This means Senjutsu Chakra is reverted back to Nagato's natural Chakra. The only way for him to turn to stone is to absorb Chakra directly from Naruto and the said Chakra must overload his own. Absorbing Naruto's techniques won't do such thing, because of the reason above but also because of Nagato's gigantic Chakra reserves.

Moving on...Nagato is a Rinnegan wielder and possess the Outer Path; hereby can suppress Naruto's own power with Chakra Chains. [

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] Naruto would be held down pretty easily if he uses BM. Kushina's inferior chains held Kurama, so Nagato's superior chains would do just better. The black rods can pierce Naruto's Chakra points, thus the latter can't create Chakra. [

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] It worked on Hashirama who is to have comparable reserves to Naruto. [

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]

This is a basic example of Nagato's versatility which are Naruto's weaknesses. I have yet to mention the paths, but that should do.

Nagato wins high difficulty.

Uh, no.

1. Momoshiki doesn't use Preta Path first of all.
2. Nagato has never shown usage of the chakra chains thus he doesn't get them unless you can prove that he has that capability. When Obito used them he said it's a far stronger binding than Pain/Nagato's. Don't bother mentioning any Six Paths jutsu that isn't from Deva Path.
3. And that Senjutsu business is based on nothing. You claim that the techs don't work cause Nagato has large reserves even though Bijuu Dama contains a shit load of chakra, Naruto's BD in particular. Then we have the fact that if the Avatar takes him on in CQC and he resorts to absorption (which he will have to do) he gets turned to stone.

Naruto wins, easily.

 

[neosmith500]

BSM Naruto wins med diff..

 

[Edogawa]

Uh, no.

What's the point of reviving an old thread? Just to reply to my comment?

1. Momoshiki doesn't use Preta Path first of all.

Rinnegan users absorb Chakra and Ninjutsu via Preta Path.

2. Nagato has never shown usage of the chakra chains thus he doesn't get them unless you can prove that he has that capability. When Obito used them he said it's a far stronger binding than Pain/Nagato's. Don't bother mentioning any Six Paths jutsu that isn't from Deva Path.

You don't determine what a character gets and what he/she doesn't get. What Obito said about the binding is false, since Pain never used the Outer Path against; actually, Pain can't user the Outer Path when Nagato is the 7th Pain who only he can use it. He never watched Naruto and Pain fighting each other. [

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] Moving on...Chakra Chains derive from the Outer Path, which Nagato is stated to be user of. Obito with one eye was able to use them, and Obito was an inferior Rinnegan user than Nagato. You will have to come up with facts that Nagato can't use them, otherwise, your argument from ignorance isn't worth replying.

3. And that Senjutsu business is based on nothing. You claim that the techs don't work cause Nagato has large reserves even though Bijuu Dama contains a shit load of chakra, Naruto's BD in particular. Then we have the fact that if the Avatar takes him on in CQC and he resorts to absorption (which he will have to do) he gets turned to stone.

''Bijuu Dama contains a shit load of chakra'' is not a rebuttal. You will have to come up with proof that Naruto's arsenal has more Chakra than Nagato's own reserves, that if the latter absorbed them will turn to a stone. But, you don't have a proof so the situation doesn't happen. Naruto transforming to the avatar leads to his doom. [

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[KidGamer65]

What's the point of reviving an old thread? Just to reply to my comment?

Because I can and because I felt like it. Simple as that.

Rinnegan users absorb Chakra and Ninjutsu via Preta Path.

Again, Momoshiki isn't using Preta Path. Him being a Rinnegan user isn't proof that he's using Preta Path. I highly suggest you actually watch Boruto the Movie, or even just the clips where Momoshiki actually uses his ability since this shouldn't be debatable.

-Momoshiki absorbs attacks into his eye on his hand, then releases them. Tell me where Preta Path has shown such a thing.

You don't determine what a character gets and what he/she doesn't get. What Obito said about the binding is false, since Pain never used the Outer Path against; actually, Pain can't user the Outer Path when Nagato is the 7th Pain who only he can use it. He never watched Naruto and Pain fighting each other. [

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] Moving on...Chakra Chains derive from the Outer Path, which Nagato is stated to be user of. Obito with one eye was able to use them, and Obito was an inferior Rinnegan user than Nagato. You will have to come up with facts that Nagato can't use them, otherwise, your argument from ignorance isn't worth replying.

Sorry pal. When you have panels and or proof that Nagato can use bindings on the level of Obito then we can talk. I don't really care for your nonsensical speculation. Manga has

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that Obito's binding>Pain/Nagato's binding. Anything else coming from you that isn't supported by a statement is nothing but an assumption.

"lolol but Obito didn't see naruto and pain's fight lololol"

Irrelevant since he doesn't need to see that fight in particular to know the strength of Pain's Rinnegan bindings when they have been working together for years. Not sure what you thought you had here. :lol

Try again.

''Bijuu Dama contains a shit load of chakra'' is not a rebuttal. You will have to come up with proof that Naruto's arsenal has more Chakra than Nagato's own reserves, that if the latter absorbed them will turn to a stone. But, you don't have a proof so the situation doesn't happen. Naruto transforming to the avatar leads to his doom. [

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]

Last sentence was already addressed, stop using Obito's feats for Nagato, and the rest is irrelevant. Bijuu Dama doesn't need to have more chakra than Nagato's own reserves individually when Naruto doesn't need to fire a single Bijuu Dama.

 

[Kyle storm]

Nagato probably wins. If Naruto attempts to use his avatar he gets Kurama extracted from him.

Um no it won't , not when it took Nagato and all members of the Akatsuki 1-3 Days to extract a single Bijuu from it's Jinchuuriki :|
Let alone , BM Naruto
Nagato eats a barrage of TBBs , and bits the dust :|

 

[Holy God]

Um no it won't , not when it took Nagato and all members of the Akatsuki 1-3 Days to extract a single Bijuu from it's Jinchuuriki :|
Let alone , BM Naruto
Nagato eats a barrage of TBBs , and bits the dust :|

The technique the Akatsuki used is different than the Demonic Statue using it's chains to drag the Tailed Beast form in. It takes mere seconds and the Tailed Beasts can't defend themselves when attached.

 

[Kyle storm]

The technique the Akatsuki used is different than the Demonic Statue using it's chains to drag the Tailed Beast form in. It takes mere seconds and the Tailed Beasts can't defend themselves when attached.

:|:|:|

They're the exact same thing , " Phantom Dragon Chains " . Nagato and the rest of the Akatsuki were simply far below Madara to do the technique on his level , if Nagato could do this very easy he wouldn't took 3 days to extract a single Bijuu .
And they actually had to KO the Jinchuuriki first before they can do it .
Nagato dies in less than 5 seconds here , nothing he has can even scratch Naruto , he eats a Bijuudama and dies .

 

[Holy God]

:|:|:|

They're the exact same thing , " Phantom Dragon Chains " . Nagato and the rest of the Akatsuki were simply far below Madara to do the technique on his level , if Nagato could do this very easy he wouldn't took 3 days to extract a single Bijuu .
And they actually had to KO the Jinchuuriki first before they can do it .
Nagato dies in less than 5 seconds here , nothing he has can even scratch Naruto , he eats a Bijuudama and dies .

No they're not. Sealing Technique: Nine Phantom Dragons slowly absorbs the chakra from the host while Madara's technique dragged the entire Tailed Beast form in with chains. Different scenarios and techniques. Nagato can't be killed so instantly in the fight. In the time Naruto activates his avatar and charges a Tailed Beast Bomb, Nagato can enter the air with his bird summoning. If Naruto fires off too weak of an attack it simply gets absorbed. The Demonic Statue can also survive a Tailed Beast Bomb so it can defend.

 

[Kyle storm]

No they're not. Sealing Technique: Nine Phantom Dragons slowly absorbs the chakra from the host while Madara's technique dragged the entire Tailed Beast form in with chains. Different scenarios and techniques. Nagato can't be killed so instantly in the fight. In the time Naruto activates his avatar and charges a Tailed Beast Bomb, Nagato can enter the air with his bird summoning. If Naruto fires off too weak of an attack it simply gets absorbed. The Demonic Statue can also survive a Tailed Beast Bomb so it can defend.

:|:| No
They're the same thing , except Nagato is far far far weaker than Madara and he can not control the Gedo Mazo like Madara .
Instead of putting baseless assumptions , why don't you show me a scan of Nagato using this technique on Madara's level ???
You can't find it , because it doesn't exist , all what we have is the mere fact that Nagato and the Akatsuki's puny members took 3 days just to extract a single Bijuu out of it's Jinchuriki .
Nagato hasn't show the ability to absorb a technique the size of a Bijuudama , and if he try to do that , Naruto will just send another Bijuudama , and call it a wrap . Going airborn isn't gonna help either , Not when Naruto can catch the 7 Tails in the air .
Naruto's techniques are also packed with Senjutsu chakra , if Nagato try to absorb too much he'll turn to a ston .
The Gedo Mazo hasn't show any worth mentioning durability feats , he was knocked down with a single punch , he was held back by Choji , and he got his arm cut off with a small Kamui .

 

[Holy God]

:|:| No
They're the same thing , except Nagato is far far far weaker than Madara and he can not control the Gedo Mazo like Madara .
Instead of putting baseless assumptions , why don't you show me a scan of Nagato using this technique on Madara's level ???
You can't find it , because it doesn't exist , all what we have is the mere fact that Nagato and the Akatsuki's puny members took 3 days just to extract a single Bijuu out of it's Jinchuriki .
Nagato hasn't show the ability to absorb a technique the size of a Bijuudama , and if he try to do that , Naruto will just send another Bijuudama , and call it a wrap . Going airborn isn't gonna help either , Not when Naruto can catch the 7 Tails in the air .
Naruto's techniques are also packed with Senjutsu chakra , if Nagato try to absorb too much he'll turn to a ston .
The Gedo Mazo hasn't show any worth mentioning durability feats , he was knocked down with a single punch , he was held back by Choji , and he got his arm cut off with a small Kamui .

How can they be the same thing if they look and perform different? Besides, I'm basing my opinion of this match on the ability of Nagato being able to extract Kurama from Naruto. You're not going to change that. The Rinnegan hasn't shown a limit of absorption and a Tailed Beast Bomb seems well in the realms of it if it had one. Nagato can absorb sage chakra, he just can't do nature energy itself. If Naruto gets into the air to grab Nagato he's pushed away with Almighty Push since the avatar has no support for gravity in that instance. The Demonic Statue is the husk of the ten-tails and carries it's life force. The only thing able to "damage it" was Kamui, which can affect anything within the realm of space. Pushing it only means one has the power to move it's mass, not damage it.

 

[Edogawa]

Momoshiki absorbs attacks into his eye on his hand, then releases them. Tell me where Preta Path has shown such a thing.

Then it means he uses Preta Path to absorb Jutsu's and uses separate technique to release. Nowhere in the movie it states he used a separate absorption, so he used Preta Path like all Rinnegan users.

Sorry pal. When you have panels and or proof that Nagato can use bindings on the level of Obito then we can talk. I don't really care for your nonsensical speculation. Manga has stated that Obito's binding>Pain/Nagato's binding. Anything else coming from you that isn't supported by a statement is nothing but an assumption.

You sound very salty here.

Well, for starters, the manga doesn't say anything; the character does. You need to differentiate between manga and character.

Moreover, your debating skills, you technically have none, are terrible. The argument from ignorance is automatic loss in the moment of academic discussion/debate, because one party (me) proposed two official evidences that have not been seen, but are official, and other party (you) base the argument on ''has yet to be seen'' despite the existence of official evidence.

Obito said the binding is stronger than Pain, yet Pain doesn't have the ability to use Outer Path, where the chains derive from, so the statement itself is false. The statement itself is not factual. You need to examine the debunked content.

What official proof that Nagato can use Chakra Chains on Obito's level? There are sufficient proofs: Nagato is a superior Rinnegan user than Obito - able to handle two Rinnegan from childhood without any side-effects, whereas Obito self-admitted that he could barely handle one; Nagato is confirmed to be Outer Path user, and Outer Path: Chakra Chains derive from the said Jutsu, means Nagato can use them.

Irrelevant since he doesn't need to see that fight in particular to know the strength of Pain's Rinnegan bindings when they have been working together for years. Not sure what you thought you had here.

Pain can't use the Outer Path. This is addressed.

Last sentence was already addressed, stop using Obito's feats for Nagato, and the rest is irrelevant. Bijuu Dama doesn't need to have more chakra than Nagato's own reserves individually when Naruto doesn't need to fire a single Bijuu Dama.

Naruto can shoot more TBB if he desires to by your premise, but to do that he needs to go to BM, then he gets shot with black rods and Chakra Chains suppressing his Biju's power, rendering it useless.

 

[Kyle storm]

How can they be the same thing if they look and perform different? Besides, I'm basing my opinion of this match on the ability of Nagato being able to extract Kurama from Naruto. You're not going to change that. The Rinnegan hasn't shown a limit of absorption and a Tailed Beast Bomb seems well in the realms of it if it had one. Nagato can absorb sage chakra, he just can't do nature energy itself. If Naruto gets into the air to grab Nagato he's pushed away with Almighty Push since the avatar has no support for gravity in that instance. The Demonic Statue is the husk of the ten-tails and carries it's life force. The only thing able to "damage it" was Kamui, which can affect anything within the realm of space. Pushing it only means one has the power to move it's mass, not damage it.

A - because Nagato is :
* not on Madara's level
* not the the actual weilder of the Rinnegan

B - Nagato can not extract Kurama out of Naruto because :
* naruto won't let him
* naruto needs to be KO'ed first
* nagato is way weaker than Naruto
* nagato needs the other members of the Akatsuki to extract a Bijuu from it's Jinchuriki
* nagato needs 1-3 days to to ectract a single Bijuu from it's Jinchuriki

C - Nagato will try to absorb a Bijuudama , and he'll :
* either turn to a ston , because he is not trained in Senjutsu
* Naruto throws another Bijuudama while Nagato is still absorbing the first one
* Naruto can throw a multi Bijuudama at the same time , turning Nagato to a red paste

D - Shinra Tensei isn't gonna help him because :
* Kurama's avatar will overpower it , just like KN6 did , and he'll blow it in his face just like he did to his Deva path .

E - the Gedo Mazo got knocked out and held back by a far weaker things , so Kurama's avatar will tear it apart .

 

[Warlocks]

Naruto win

 

[Holy God]

A - because Nagato is :
* not on Madara's level
* not the the actual weilder of the Rinnegan

B - Nagato can not extract Kurama out of Naruto because :
* naruto won't let him
* naruto needs to be KO'ed first
* nagato is way weaker than Naruto
* nagato needs the other members of the Akatsuki to extract a Bijuu from it's Jinchuriki
* nagato needs 1-3 days to to ectract a single Bijuu from it's Jinchuriki

I already told you I'm basing my argument upon Nagato being able to. You're not going to change my mind, especially when you're evidence that they are the same technique is simply because Nagato is weaker, which is invalid. They looked and performed different. Even Obito was able to use it with one Rinnegan.

C - Nagato will try to absorb a Bijuudama , and he'll :
* either turn to a ston , because he is not trained in Senjutsu
* Naruto throws another Bijuudama while Nagato is still absorbing the first one
* Naruto can throw a multi Bijuudama at the same time , turning Nagato to a red paste

I already explained why he wouldn't turn to stone. If Naruto uses another Tailed Beast Bomb while Nagato is absorbing one he simply side steps and stops absorbing the first so that it continues to travel past him and proceeds to absorb the second. Naruto using multiple at the same time is a wasted effort since they only detonate on collision and Nagato would be in the air.

D - Shinra Tensei isn't gonna help him because :
* Kurama's avatar will overpower it , just like KN6 did , and he'll blow it in his face just like he did to his Deva path .

I already explained why this isn't possible. Naruto only overpowered him before because he was able to stick his tails in the ground. In the air, the avatar has no support and cannot overpower gravity.

E - the Gedo Mazo got knocked out and held back by a far weaker things , so Kurama's avatar will tear it apart .

There's no evidence that Kurama is physically any much stronger than Choji. I do expect the Demonic Statue to lose in a close-quarters battle, but not without a fight. The thing is however that Naruto will also have to defend against the multi-headed dog, to which he cannot incapacitate mind you, and Nagato in the air. If at any moment he's too occupied then the Demonic Statue could extract Kurama from him.

 

[Kyle storm]

I already told you I'm basing my argument upon Nagato being able to. You're not going to change my mind, especially when you're evidence that they are the same technique is simply because Nagato is weaker, which is invalid. They looked and performed different. Even Obito was able to use it with one Rinnegan.


I already explained why he wouldn't turn to stone. If Naruto uses another Tailed Beast Bomb while Nagato is absorbing one he simply side steps and stops absorbing the first so that it continues to travel past him and proceeds to absorb the second. Naruto using multiple at the same time is a wasted effort since they only detonate on collision and Nagato would be in the air.


I already explained why this isn't possible. Naruto only overpowered him before because he was able to stick his tails in the ground. In the air, the avatar has no support and cannot overpower gravity.



There's no evidence that Kurama is physically any much stronger than Choji. I do expect the Demonic Statue to lose in a close-quarters battle, but not without a fight. The thing is however that Naruto will also have to defend against the multi-headed dog, to which he cannot incapacitate mind you, and Nagato in the air. If at any moment he's too occupied then the Demonic Statue could extract Kurama from him.

@Bold , concession eccepted , you could not bring any proof that Nagato is able to use the same techniue that madara could use .
If Nagato can really use it , he would not waste 3 days extracting one Bijuu
Nagato can not extract a Bijuu without the Akatsuki by his side , so your argument is destroyed/disproved , by Manga facts
Obito could use the same technique as Madara because the Bijuu were already linked and sealed to the Gedo Mazo via Chakra rods embeded in them .
If Obito could do this , then why he didn't do it to extract Kurama and Hachibi out of Naruto and Killer bee
Know why ? because he can't , and neither can't Nagato

Nagato is not trained in Senjutsu = he will turn to a ston , simple as that , that's why he couldn't handle SM Naruto and got his Ashura mode turning to ston
A big LOL @Nagato just stop absorbing and side stepping a Bijuudama
If he stop absorbig , the Bijuudama will blow up in his face , and if he stood there and absorb , another bijuudama will hit the first bijuudama and turn him to a red paste on the ground

Naruto was able to overpower Shinra Tensei when he was in the water , and if Nagato is in the air , he will blow him up to smear with Bijuudama barrage .

Right now , you are either :
- relying on fanfiction
- Or giving Nagato other people's feats
Now are you gonna debate using Nagato's feats , or just gonna keep giving him Madara's feats ???

 

[Holy God]

@Bold , concession eccepted , you could not bring any proof that Nagato is able to use the same techniue that madara could use .
If Nagato can really use it , he would not waste 3 days extracting one Bijuu
Nagato can not extract a Bijuu without the Akatsuki by his side , so your argument is destroyed/disproved , by Manga facts
Obito could use the same technique as Madara because the Bijuu were already linked and sealed to the Gedo Mazo via Chakra rods embeded in them .
If Obito could do this , then why he didn't do it to extract Kurama and Hachibi out of Naruto and Killer bee
Know why ? because he can't , and neither can't Nagato

Obito didn't do it because he couldn't knock out the Tailed Beasts like Madara could and Nagato didn't do it because he was performing it on the body, not the Tailed Beast form. Either way, you can either continue to argue with me assuming he can use it, or you can stop meaning you'd think he could win with the ability.

Nagato is not trained in Senjutsu = he will turn to a ston , simple as that , that's why he couldn't handle SM Naruto and got his Ashura mode turning to ston

For one, that was Pain, not Nagato. We already saw Pain absorb sage chakra from Rasenshuriken and directly from Naruto's body which ended up completely removing his Sage Mode. Nagato should have no problem, especially when he can expel chakra from experiencing this method.

A big LOL @Nagato just stop absorbing and side stepping a Bijuudama
If he stop absorbig , the Bijuudama will blow up in his face , and if he stood there and absorb , another bijuudama will hit the first bijuudama and turn him to a red paste on the ground

The Tailed Beast Bomb only explodes upon collision. If Preta Path counted as such then he wouldn't be able to absorb it in the first place. The time to absorb an attack like that is also only mere seconds. Even if he couldn't side-step it, the weakened Tailed Beast Bomb can be negated (without it blowing up) by Almighty Push as Pain has done to Rasenshuriken.

Naruto was able to overpower Shinra Tensei when he was in the water , and if Nagato is in the air , he will blow him up to smear with Bijuudama barrage .

The only thing I can remember is Naruto sticking his tails in the ground for support. Nagato simply outmaneuvers any Tailed Beast Bombs in the air and Naruto is attacked by summons on the ground. He can't deal with so many targets so easily.

 

[Kyle storm]

Obito didn't do it because he couldn't knock out the Tailed Beasts like Madara could and Nagato didn't do it because he was performing it on the body, not the Tailed Beast form. Either way, you can either continue to argue with me assuming he can use it, or you can stop meaning you'd think he could win with the ability.


For one, that was Pain, not Nagato. We already saw Pain absorb sage chakra from Rasenshuriken and directly from Naruto's body which ended up completely removing his Sage Mode. Nagato should have no problem, especially when he can expel chakra from experiencing this method.


The Tailed Beast Bomb only explodes upon collision. If Preta Path counted as such then he wouldn't be able to absorb it in the first place. The time to absorb an attack like that is also only mere seconds. Even if he couldn't side-step it, the weakened Tailed Beast Bomb can be negated (without it blowing up) by Almighty Push as Pain has done to Rasenshuriken.


The only thing I can remember is Naruto sticking his tails in the ground for support. Nagato simply outmaneuvers any Tailed Beast Bombs in the air and Naruto is attacked by summons on the ground. He can't deal with so many targets so easily.

I guess we're gonna have to agree to disagree then , you can't back up your argument , and you give Nagato other people's feats , that besides relying on fanfiction because Ngato's feats aren't enuff for him to sand a chance .