[VS] Law & Vergo vs Dolfamingo

[Punk Hazard]

My bad.. I may be wrong here.. I just thought that Gear 4th was mostly based on Haki and of course overall energy. If Luffy was in better shape and didn't let himself be attacked, I thought it made sense that he would be in a better state strength/energy/Haki wise.

I always figured that Gear 4th was more of a "If you use this much Haki for this much period of time(it was like an hour straight of non-stop Haki) then you get a time-out, as opposed to simply losing all your energy, since it only took ten minutes for him to get back enough Haki to use Gear 4 yet again. What you're saying is plausible though.

Wouldn't Doflamingo possibly be in worse shape.. considering he had no Trebol to f*ck with Law, and no Bellamy to stall Luffy? It would be Law and Luffy, together, giving Doflamingo their 100% full attention from the start..

This is what I'm trying to say doesn't make any sense. If he doesn't have Trebol and Bellamy there to do those things, why would he fight in the same way he did when they were? That's the premise that makes no sense to me, the idea that Doflamingo would fight as the same he did when they were there, and not take a better plan of action because they aren't there. This premise is saying that only Luffy and Law would have an adaptation to their methods of combat and that Doflamingo would just be lackadaisical.

 

[LBeezy]

I always figured that Gear 4th was more of a "If you use this much Haki for this much period of time(it was like an hour straight of non-stop Haki) then you get a time-out, as opposed to simply losing all your energy, since it only took ten minutes for him to get back enough Haki to use Gear 4 yet again. What you're saying is plausible though.

Hmmm yeah, now that you mention it, it could easily work the way that you just said.. I honestly have no clue, but I do understand that it is honestly possible that Gear 4th would have actually lasted that same length, no matter what.. idk though..

This is what I'm trying to say doesn't make any sense. If he doesn't have Trebol and Bellamy there to do those things, why would he fight in the same way he did when they were? That's the premise that makes no sense to me, the idea that Doflamingo would fight as the same he did when they were there, and not take a better plan of action because they aren't there. This premise is saying that only Luffy and Law would have an adaptation to their methods of combat and that Doflamingo would just be lackadaisical.

Oohhhh okay.. I see what you mean!

Without Trebol and Bellamy, Doflamingo would obviously change his strategy and fight differently from the start as well.. my bad for not acknowledging that before.. you're absolutely right.

Well with that being said then, it all boils down to you believing Doflamingo would win, and me believing that Luffy and Law would win. Which is okay for us to respectfully agree to disagree..

 

[Punk Hazard]

Hmmm yeah, now that you mention it, it could easily work the way that you just said.. I honestly have no clue, but I do understand that it is honestly possible that Gear 4th would have actually lasted that same length, no matter what.. idk though..

I'm actually leaning more towards what you said now that I think about it. It was said a few times that his Haki ran out and his Haki was coming back, so from a straight fight with just them all at 100%, he'd probably have a longer Gear 4th time.

Oohhhh okay.. I see what you mean!

Without Trebol and Bellamy, Doflamingo would obviously change his strategy and fight differently from the start as well.. my bad for not acknowledging that before.. you're absolutely right.

Well with that being said then, it all boils down to you believing Doflamingo would win, and me believing that Luffy and Law would win. Which is okay for us to respectfully agree to disagree..

Agreed here.

 

[loj]

Law and Luffy couldn't defeat Doflamingo together. I doubt Law and Vergo would fair any better.

Eh? Law and Luffy hardly fought together against Doflamingo...Law and Luffy together with G4 would be mid/high diff at max against Doflamingo

 

[Punk Hazard]

Eh? Law and Luffy hardly fought together against Doflamingo...Law and Luffy together with G4 would be mid/high diff at max against Doflamingo

if you say so

 

[loj]

if you say so

It's Oda who showed it not me >_>

 

[Punk Hazard]

It's Oda who showed it not me >_>

Link me this fanfic please, I'd love to read it. Because, what I did see was that when Law and Luffy were working together, they had two tricks at their disposal that actually worked, with one accomplishing nothing and Doflamingo surviving the other and still coming out on top of Luffy with it.

Another time they attempted to work together, Law got a Full Bright to the chest and Luffy got a kick to his face. And before you say "Trebol and Bellamy," Doflamingo wasn't using Awakening. Place Awakening where either Trebol or Bellamy were and he'd accomplish the same thing, probably better.

 

[loj]

Link me this fanfic please, I'd love to read it.

Doffy wasn't alone anyways I really don't know what scenario are you picturing xd Luffy and Law alone vs Doffy alone is no way in hell Doffy would have won xd the G4 combo and Law's DF...just how would Doffy counter that is beyond me.Both Law and Luffy were alone while pulling off GK and G4.

 

[Punk Hazard]

Doffy wasn't alone anyways I really don't know what scenario are you picturing xd Luffy and Law alone vs Doffy alone is no way in hell Doffy would have won xd the G4 combo and Law's DF...just how would Doffy counter that is beyond me.Both Law and Luffy were alone while pulling off GK and G4.

1. How could Law and Luffy be alone while pulling off Gamma Knife when they worked together to pull of Gamma Knife?

2. Knew you were gonna bring up Bellamy and Trebol. Doflamingo's Awakened attacks pack more power than those two clowns. Like I've said before in this thread, if Doflamingo doesn't have Bellamy and Trebol, he can just use his Awakened attacks instead to accomplish the same effectiveness their presence brought.

 

[loj]

1. How could Law and Luffy be alone while pulling off Gamma Knife when they worked together to pull of Gamma Knife?

2. Knew you were gonna bring up Bellamy and Trebol. Doflamingo's Awakened attacks pack more power than those two clowns. Like I've said before in this thread, if Doflamingo doesn't have Bellamy and Trebol, he can just use his Awakened attacks instead to accomplish the same effectiveness their presence brought.

That's a situation where we didn't know Luffy had G4 in the first place idk which Law and Luffy are we talking about now but no way in hell G4 Luffy with Law would lose against Doflamingo.If it's Law and not G4 Luffy then I can agree.

Sure Doflamingo could of used that,but Luffy could of used G4 way before then so it's nothing accomplished with it.It's obvious Oda wanted to create that moment to see Law injured and Luffy going all out but we all know Luffy could of used G4 way before Law injuring happened.Luffy didn't need any preparation or anything.

 

[Punk Hazard]

That's a situation where we didn't know Luffy had G4 in the first place idk which Law and Luffy are we talking about now but no way in hell G4 Luffy with Law would lose against Doflamingo.If it's Law and not G4 Luffy then I can agree.

Sure Doflamingo could of used that,but Luffy could of used G4 way before then so it's nothing accomplished with it.It's obvious Oda wanted to create that moment to see Law injured and Luffy going all out but we all know Luffy could of used G4 way before Law injuring happened.Luffy didn't need any preparation or anything.

You're severely underestimating Doflamingo's Awakening. It was powerful enough to keep Gear 4 Luffy at a considerable distance away for over 20 minutes. It forced him into a corner where, for 20 mins, all he could do was dodge. Took Gear 4 Luffy 20 mins to find an opening to exploit when facing Doflamingo's Awakening, and here you think Luffy would just rolfstomp past it.

 

[loj]

You're severely underestimating Doflamingo's Awakening. It was powerful enough to keep Gear 4 Luffy at a considerable distance away for over 20 minutes. It forced him into a corner where, for 20 mins, all he could do was dodge. Took Gear 4 Luffy 20 mins to find an opening to exploit when facing Doflamingo's Awakening, and here you think Luffy would just rolfstomp past it.

I am underastimating Doffy's awakening since that wouldn't be enough for G4 Luffy and Law,It's Luffy and Law vs Doffy not G4 Luffy alone vs Doffy.In the end Luffy clearly did find a way to injure Doflamingo anyways and I don't think Luffy would of needed the 10 min wait after overusing Haki.

 

[Punk Hazard]

I am underastimating Doffy's awakening since that wouldn't be enough for G4 Luffy and Law,It's Luffy and Law vs Doffy not G4 Luffy alone vs Doffy.In the end Luffy clearly did find a way to injure Doflamingo anyways and I don't think Luffy would of needed the 10 min wait after overusing Haki.

In all honesty, yes it would. If the strings can keep Luffy at bay for 20 minutes, it can definitely do the same thing for Law. Add in the fact that Law doesn't seem to be able to transverse battlefields at the same rate that Luffy can, and he'd be in a much worse position. Masses upon masses of Awakened strings from multiple angles coming from below would definitely keep both of them off of their feet long enough for Doflamingo to capitalize. He wouldn't even need to do both at once. Use Awakenings to separate Law and Luffy by having them target Luffy and keeping him at bay, and Doflamingo can physically engage and pick apart Law, then engage Luffy, which we know he'd win in a straight 1 vs 1.

 

[loj]

In all honesty, yes it would. If the strings can keep Luffy at bay for 20 minutes, it can definitely do the same thing for Law. Add in the fact that Law doesn't seem to be able to transverse battlefields at the same rate that Luffy can, and he'd be in a much worse position. Masses upon masses of Awakened strings from multiple angles coming from below would definitely keep both of them off of their feet long enough for Doflamingo to capitalize. He wouldn't even need to do both at once. Use Awakenings to separate Law and Luffy by having them target Luffy and keeping him at bay, and Doflamingo can physically engage and pick apart Law, then engage Luffy, which we know he'd win in a straight 1 vs 1.

Quiet unlikely if Law could of pulled GK again and Luffy with G4 help Law not being rekt like he was in the first place.So we are having again injured Doffy against Law and Luffy tag.Doflamingo was not able to resist Luffy's G4 and if you add Law's hax powers I honestly can't see how can Doffy beat that if he got "destroyed" by Luffy's G4 alone.

 

[Punk Hazard]

Quiet unlikely if Law could of pulled GK again and Luffy with G4 help Law not being rekt like he was in the first place.So we are having again injured Doffy against Law and Luffy tag.Doflamingo was not able to resist Luffy's G4 and if you add Law's hax powers I honestly can't see how can Doffy beat that if he got "destroyed" by Luffy's G4 alone.

With how long it took Law to pull off Gamma Knife with Doflamingo and Luffy holding back, there's probably no chance of him pulling it off if Doflamingo went all out from the beginning. Especially considering that Luffy has to inflate his body to go Gear 4, while Doflamingo's Awakening can be set off much faster. While Luffy is doing Muscle Balloon and Law is doing whatever, Doflamingo can just interrupt the process by having his strongest Awakened strings burst from below.

With Gear 4 Luffy having trouble with the Awakened strings once they came at him, interrupting his charge, they'd almost certainly interrupt whatever Law could be doing to occupy Doflamingo as Luffy starts his Muscle Balloon while also engaging Luffy during this vulnerable moment.

 

[loj]

With how long it took Law to pull off Gamma Knife with Doflamingo and Luffy holding back, there's probably no chance of him pulling it off if Doflamingo went all out from the beginning. Especially considering that Luffy has to inflate his body to go Gear 4, while Doflamingo's Awakening can be set off much faster. While Luffy is doing Muscle Balloon and Law is doing whatever, Doflamingo can just interrupt the process by having his strongest Awakened strings burst from below.

With Gear 4 Luffy having trouble with the Awakened strings once they came at him, interrupting his charge, they'd almost certainly interrupt whatever Law could be doing to occupy Doflamingo as Luffy starts his Muscle Balloon while also engaging Luffy during this vulnerable moment.

While Luffy doing his proces Law could of defend him.Either way the split situation just wouldn't happen since it would be to careless from both that 2v1 some split happens where I just can't see it happening.And who said it would take Luffy 20 mins getting through awakened strings? He is not alone now with Law's teleport skills and shiz they can easily counter Doffy.Doffy isn't admiral lvl to defeat Law and Luffy alone especially that far in the story.G4 Luffy is easily bit (?) bellow admiral and adding Laws power I'm certain they would of defeated Doflamingo.Doflamingo isn't that strong to defeat 2 powerhouses at once,I just can't see it happening where Doffy alone I agree would defeat both...but with tag? naah.

 

[Punk Hazard]

While Luffy doing his proces Law could of defend him.

Not when the same Awakened attacks that forced Luffy to fly through the air constantly in order to avoid being impaled by them are sprouting from below and all around him. He'd be too distracted and occupied avoiding those to protect Luffy. Keep in mind that with Luffy giving his full attention to the strings, he was only barely able to dodge them before he found his opening. If Law tries to split his attention between protecting himself and Luffy from those same strings, he's gonna **** up.

And who said it would take Luffy 20 mins getting through awakened strings?

I didn't say it WOULD. I said that it DID take Luffy, in the canon manga drawn by Oda, 20 mins to find an opening to strike Doflamingo. When Doflamingo started using Awakening, Oda included "20 minutes later" in one of the following pages, and Luffy was still just dodging around them.

He is not alone now with Law's teleport skills and shiz they can easily counter Doffy.

Shambles has only ever worked on Doflamingo when his guard was down. Since Trebol and Bellamy aren't there as back-up it's highly unlikely he'd drop his guard for that to work.

Doffy isn't admiral lvl to defeat Law and Luffy alone especially that far in the story.

It's been two weeks since Dressrosa...

 

[loj]

Not when the same Awakened attacks that forced Luffy to fly through the air constantly in order to avoid being impaled by them are sprouting from below and all around him. He'd be too distracted and occupied avoiding those to protect Luffy. Keep in mind that with Luffy giving his full attention to the strings, he was only barely able to dodge them before he found his opening. If Law tries to split his attention between protecting himself and Luffy from those same strings, he's gonna **** up.


I didn't say it WOULD. I said that it DID take Luffy, in the canon manga drawn by Oda, 20 mins to find an opening to strike Doflamingo. When Doflamingo started using Awakening, Oda included "20 minutes later" in one of the following pages, and Luffy was still just dodging around them.


Shambles has only ever worked on Doflamingo when his guard was down. Since Trebol and Bellamy aren't there as back-up it's highly unlikely he'd drop his guard for that to work.


It's been two weeks since Dressrosa...

I was aiming on who said it would take 20 mins with Law tagging Luffy.Luffy is not alone now.Come on if you are saying Luffy wouldn't be able to go G4 'cause of strings then WTF xd even if Luffy gets hit no way in hell Doffy would one shot Luffy.

 

[Punk Hazard]

I was aiming on who said it would take 20 mins with Law tagging Luffy. Luffy is not alone now.Come on if you are saying Luffy wouldn't be able to go G4 'cause of strings then WTF xd even if Luffy gets hit no way in hell Doffy would one shot Luffy.

Of ****ing course the strings can prevent Luffy from going Gear 4. If a forest of strings burst up from directly below Luffy while he's inflating his arm, he's gonna be wide open to being skewered and impaled. Law wouldn't be able to protect him since he'd have the exact same thing coming for him as well. Luffy BARELY avoided them while only having to worry about himself, it's stupid as hell to think him or Law would be able to effectively dodge them while also trying to protect another person.

 

[loj]

Of ****ing course the strings can prevent Luffy from going Gear 4. If a forest of strings burst up from directly below Luffy while he's inflating his arm, he's gonna be wide open to being skewered and impaled. Law wouldn't be able to protect him since he'd have the exact same thing coming for him as well. Luffy BARELY avoided them while only having to worry about himself, it's stupid as hell to think him or Law would be able to effectively dodge them while also trying to protect another person.

So you are telling me after 800 chapters Luffy would still get one shoted after one attack? Wow!? Doffy is some yonko lvl then...G4 would eventually happen and Doffy would of been defeated...it's not like Law can't cut the strings with his DF or anything...