Does Indra have Rikudou Chakra?

[NarutoX28]

I noticed most have come with the assumption that Indra has Hagoromo's chakra meaning that he possesses both his Yin and Yang and people constantly refer to the fact that Indra was able to use his Perfect Susano'o w/ MS rather than requiring EMS to support that. This is simply not true and I wanted to address this idea first before I debunk the idea that he had Rikudou's Chakra.

First, Indra being able to manifest a PS w/ just an MS is not proof that he has the Sage's Chakra. This can easily be explained from what Obito has stated:

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Their blood thinned over future generations which is an indication that Indra's chakra grew weaker throughout future generations, so Indra being capable of using PS with his MS is an indication that he simply has a stronger chakra than Madara and Sasuke who required the EMS as they had weaker chakras than Indra.

As for proof that Indra did not have Rikudou's Chakra, this is outright stated here:

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Indra inherited only Hagoromo's Spiritual Energy. He never inherited the Yang component as that went to Ashura instead. This is further supported here:

Inton (Yin/Dark), which creates form from nothing, and Youton (Yang/Light), which breathes life into form. Skillfully manipulating these two elements, the Sage of Six Paths, Ootsutsuki Hagoromo, developed the Banbutsu Souzou (Creation of All Things) Jutsu. Creating the nine Bijuu out of the Juubi's chakra was also the result of Onmyouton. Afterwards, Inton was inherited more predominately in the Uchiha clan, while Youton was inherited more predominately in the Senju clan.

Why did the Uchiha inherit only Yin Release whereas the Senju only inherited Yang Release? Because their ancestors Ashura and Indra only inherited Yang Release or Yin Release respectively. If Indra possessed both components, then the Uchiha Clan would've inherited Yin and Yang yet they only received one component of Hagoromo's Power.

Additionally, Hagoromo's Power is referred to as the Power of the Uchiha and Senju:

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Are you suddenly going to make such a bold claim that Indra possessed the Senju's Power as well? I hope not because it's made clear that the Senju's power stemmed from Ashura, not from Indra. Furthermore, the Uchiha and Senju used to be one and the same:

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If it used to be one and the same, then that implies that it isn't anymore, but how did it branch off if Indra and Ashura had Hagoromo's complete chakra? Hagoromo was hyped up as the Sage who possessed both powers. Why would that have meaning if Indra and his descendants possessed Hagoromo's Yin and Yang?

Finally, Indra never had Rikudou's chakra as he never possessed the Rinnegan:

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We know Indra's Chakra never possessed the Yang component because it required Ashura's chakra to mix and form Rikudou's Chakra:

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If he had Rikudou's Chakra, he should've awakened the Rinnegan as he inherited the Sage's eyes correct?

I know people use this as a common rebuttal, "But Indra inherited Hagoromo's chakra genez" without even understanding the context of the statement. Hagoromo was clearly referring to the idea that Ashura had none of Rikudou's natural potential whereas Indra received it. This is explained here:

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Hagoromo initially stated that Ashura didn't have the chakra genes whereas Indra did. Naruto's confused, so Hagoromo explains it in a better way and refers to the fact that Ashura had no potential whereas Indra did. This makes it clear that Hagoromo stated that Indra had Hagoromo's chakra genes because he inherited his potential, not because he literally had Hagoromo's chakra.

That's all for now. Hopefully that gave some insight on the fact that Indra did not have the Sage's Chakra.

 

[Styles]

Yes Hagoromo said so himself.

 

[NarutoX28]

Yes Hagoromo said so himself.

No he didn't. Already debunked it because I knew someone would waltz in and say that exact thing.

 

[Styles]

No he didn't. Already debunked it because I knew someone would waltz in and say that exact thing.

Because it's true. What do you think "one inherited my powerful chakra" mean?

 

[NarutoX28]

Because it's true. What do you think "one inherited my powerful chakra" mean?

Hagoromo outright stated that Ashura's Chakra bloomed and reached a potency equal to Indra's. It makes more sense that this was because Indra had Rikudou's potential and Ashura didn't. At least read my last scan please.

 

[Styles]

Hagoromo outright stated that Ashura's Chakra bloomed and reached a potency equal to Indra's. It makes more sense that this was because Indra had Rikudou's potential and Ashura didn't. At least read my last scan please.

Indra was born with his dad's powerful chakra. Ashura did too but Indra's was natural while Ashura had to train to awaken his.

 

[Ansatsuken]

He inherited the potency of Hagoromo's chakra as Uchiha chakra always been about potency.

Hence Hago said "his strong chakra"

 

[NarutoX28]

Indra was born with his dad's powerful chakra. Ashura did too but Indra's was natural while Ashura had to train to awaken his.

But Hagoromo stated that he didn't inherit his chakra. You're just cherrypicking a part of Rikudou's statement and ignoring the rest of it because it goes against your argument.

 

[Styles]

But Hagoromo stated that he didn't inherit his chakra. You're just cherrypicking a part of Rikudou's statement and ignoring the rest of it because it goes against your argument.

How did Hagoromo not say that but he even said Indra inherited his strong chakra genes?

 

[Angelic.]

Too complicated

 

[NarutoX28]

How did Hagoromo not say that but he even said Indra inherited his strong chakra genes?

I meant that you're ignoring the rest of the statement.

Hagoromo stated that Ashura did not inherit his chakra genes whereas Indra did yet Ashura's bloomed to reach a level that rivaled Indra's.

So how did Ashura's chakra reach a level on par with Indra's Chakra if he himself didn't have Rikudou's Chakra?

Before debating any further, can you please read my post? I already explained what Rikudou Sennin was referring to when he stated that Indra inherited his chakra genes.

 

[Styles]

I meant that you're ignoring the rest of the statement.

Hagoromo stated that Ashura did not inherit his chakra genes whereas Indra did yet Ashura's bloomed to reach a level that rivaled Indra's.

So how did Ashura's chakra reach a level on par with Indra's Chakra if he himself didn't have Rikudou's Chakra?

Before debating any further, can you please read my post? I already explained what Rikudou Sennin was referring to when he stated that Indra inherited his chakra genes.

Because it's nothing to debate about i'm not ignoring anything when Hagoromo himself said Indra inherited his strong chakra genes.
If anything Ashura had the same chakra as Indra but he had to train to awaken it the opposite of Indra who was the genius of the 2.

Besides with EMS for Indra's reincarnation(s) is needed for PS but with rikudou chakra you can use it with MS because your chakra is strong enough to use it. It's the same as Hagoromo and Hamura they both inherited Kaguya's chakra/powers except her RinneSharingan became a pure Rinnegan in Hagoromo while Hamura got her Byakugan/Tenseigan.

Did one have the the power first before the other? Who knows. But it's no different imo. Unless Hagoromo lied and Indra didn't inherit his chakra but that's impossible seeing as though once Ashura's chakra bloomed he had a avatar somewhat like kurama's with something that looks like TSB's.

 

[~Ethereal~]

Maybe.

 

[NarutoX28]

Because it's nothing to debate about i'm not ignoring anything when Hagoromo himself said Indra inherited his strong chakra genes.
If anything Ashura had the same chakra as Indra but he had to train to awaken it the opposite of Indra who was the genius of the 2.

Of course it's not and it shouldn't be debatable.

You're ignoring the context of Hagoromo's statement and I already explained why in my OP. Hagoromo flat out explained what he meant when he stated that Indra inherited his chakra genes while Ashura didn't.

Besides with EMS for Indra's reincarnation(s) is needed for PS but with rikudou chakra you can use it with MS because your chakra is strong enough to use it. It's the same as Hagoromo and Hamura they both inherited Kaguya's chakra/powers except her RinneSharingan became a pure Rinnegan in Hagoromo while Hamura got her Byakugan/Tenseigan.

Refuted in my OP. Later Indra Transmigrants required the EMS to awaken PS because Indra's chakra weakened over future generations. Indra's chakra is the strongest among Indra Transmigrants which is why he could use PS with his MS. It just shows you did not read my post at all.

Did one have the the power first before the other? Who knows. But it's no different imo. Unless Hagoromo lied and Indra didn't inherit his chakra but that's impossible seeing as though once Ashura's chakra bloomed he had a avatar somewhat like kurama's with something that looks like TSB's.

Hagoromo didn't lie. He literally explained what he meant when he said that. Read the last scan I presented and you'll see it.

Ashura inherited Rikudou's Yang as Obito stated. He lacked the Yin component that Indra had which is why he could not awaken a Rinnegan. The only reason he received RSM is because Rikudou Sennin gave him that chakra which is why he could manifest TSB. He could not before because he never had the Yin component needed to create TSB, so the most logical assumption that could be made is that he received the Yin component from Hagoromo, the son he entrusted everything to.

 

[Simbv]

Im going to go with the manga that explicitly said he inherited his fathers chakra. It gets no simpler than that. You're looking in too deep IMO, he could have just inherited thr Yin part.

 

[NarutoX28]

Im going to go with the manga that explicitly said he inherited his fathers chakra. It gets no simpler than that. You're looking in too deep IMO, he could have just inherited thr Yin part.

This is what I'm saying. He only inherited his Spiritual Energy (Yin), not his full chakra (Yin + Yang).

The last scan I presented disproves that he received Rikudou's Chakra (Yin + Yang) and I gave a very simple explanation for that. You can omit everything in my post besides the last 2 paragraphs and that would get the point across.

 

[Simbv]

This is what I'm saying. He only inherited his Spiritual Energy (Yin), not his full chakra (Yin + Yang).

The last scan I presented disproves that he received Rikudou's Chakra (Yin + Yang) and I gave a very simple explanation for that. You can omit everything in my post besides the last 2 paragraphs and that would get the point across.

Who said that he inherited both parts? It was obviously split inbetween Yin and Yang, just like Kaguya split her Rinnegan and Byakugan between Hamura and Hagoromo. If he dis inherit both, then Ashura simply needed to train to be on par.

 

[Styles]

Of course it's not and it shouldn't be debatable.

You're ignoring the context of Hagoromo's statement and I already explained why in my OP. Hagoromo flat out explained what he meant when he stated that Indra inherited his chakra genes while Ashura didn't.



Refuted in my OP. Later Indra Transmigrants required the EMS to awaken PS because Indra's chakra weakened over future generations. Indra's chakra is the strongest among Indra Transmigrants which is why he could use PS with his MS. It just shows you did not read my post at all.



Hagoromo didn't lie. He literally explained what he meant when he said that. Read the last scan I presented and you'll see it.

Ashura inherited Rikudou's Yang as Obito stated. He lacked the Yin component that Indra had which is why he could not awaken a Rinnegan. The only reason he received RSM is because Rikudou Sennin gave him that chakra which is why he could manifest TSB. He could not before because he never had the Yin component needed to create TSB, so the most logical assumption that could be made is that he received the Yin component from Hagoromo, the son he entrusted everything to.

What context of what Hagoromo said am I ignoring then?

Even with that Madara and Sasuke was the first ones to use PS other than Indra he had Hagoromo's chakra but it weakened over time but his strong chakra was still there just not rikudou enhanced anymore. I did read the post and the OP but i disagree with it.

Exactly Hagoromo didn't lie. Then Indra did inherit his strong chakra which is rikudou chakra. He didn't get Rinnegan the same reason Hagoromo and Hamura didn't get RinneSharingan/Byakugan. Her RinneSharingan in it's purest form became Rinnegan in Hagoromo's eyes. And supposedly Hamura had Tenseigan not Byakugan. Hagoromo's chakra made Indra awaken or born with a sharingan which is why sharingan can evolve into the Rinnegan.

Ashura had rikudou chakra too maybe but it was dormant and for it to blossom he had to train with others with cooperation like Naruto and his BM mode.

 

[NarutoX28]

Who said that he inherited both parts? It was obviously split inbetween Yin and Yang, just like Kaguya split her Rinnegan and Byakugan between Hamura and Hagoromo. If he dis inherit both, then Ashura simply needed to train to be on par.

And there's no possible way Ashura could reach Indra's chakra potency without Rikudou's Chakra. Rikudou's Chakra is literally the strongest aside from Kaguya's which can only be obtained through the Juubi and Shinju.

I've noticed people claiming that he received both his Yin and Yang even though manga claims that he only inherited his Yin Energy.

 

[Simbv]

I don't know man i agree with Musica and Narutox28.