old Hiruzen vs 4 tailed Naruto

[NarutoX28]

^^ No because Orochimaru didn't and couldn't.

Hiruzen can't tag KN4 Naruto or physically overpower him anyways. Hiruzen is less agile than Orochimaru, so he has no way of even tagging Naruto.

 

[Brother Numpsay]

Lol what, are we reading the same manga here? DB portrayed Old Hiruzen Taijutsu to be superior then Oro. We also have feats of Hiruzen overpowering Orochimaru in CQC. And people says his less agile then Orochimaru? Lol please stop.

Hiruzen smacks KN4 around with Enma.

 

[Draegod]

Databook Hiruzen is overkill. Old Hiruzen is a match.

 

[DrProof]

Lol what, are we reading the same manga here? DB portrayed Old Hiruzen Taijutsu to be superior then Oro. We also have feats of Hiruzen overpowering Orochimaru in CQC. And people says his less agile then Orochimaru? Lol please stop.

Hiruzen smacks KN4 around with Enma.

Databook Hiruzen is overkill. Old Hiruzen is a match.

My mans. But what does Hiruzen actually have to put down KN4? Manga wise Old Hiruzen hasn't shown shit, if we're being 100%. Sure if we take DB in to consideration, but most people play on what they will, and won't accept in the DB entries. Not to mention those statements regarding Hiruzen knowing all of Konoha's techniques hasn't been shown canonically.

I mean what can we Hiruzen really do here?

EJ, Hiruzen wasn't overpowering Orochimaru, Orochimaru was playing with his Sensei, he could have went all out, and you know this.

 

[Draegod]

My mans. But what does Hiruzen actually have to put down KN4? Manga wise Old Hiruzen hasn't shown shit, if we're being 100%. Sure if we take DB in to consideration, but most people play on what they will, and won't accept in the DB entries. Not to mention those statements regarding Hiruzen knowing all of Konoha's techniques hasn't been shown canonically.

I mean what can we Hiruzen really do here?

EJ, Hiruzen wasn't overpowering Orochimaru, Orochimaru was playing with his Sensei, he could have went all out, and you know this.

He cannonly used a jutsu he's only seen once that you cannot practice (RDS), Used the same hand seals and matched the chakra of the Zetsu statue budha instantly despite never ever seeing it. JMAN cannonly stated that the reason he didnt wanna show Hiruzen his new jutsu (when young) was because Hiruzen steals jutsu's (lmao I know, such a D!ck). Manga fact from Oru he can use jutsu's from konoha, Crystal ball allows him to see every ninja with in its wall at all times anytime he chooses. Kishi in multiple Databooks confirm he uses all Jutsu bar KKG. Kishi confirms he was better then Tobirama. etc

Bro... Databook info matches manga info as fact. Only ppl who don't agree are Ass hurt fans who don't want him over there favs (not talking about you).

If you give me Databook Hiruzen in Prime, There isn't many ninjas he can't beat besides the God or Demi god tiers.

 

[DrProof]

He cannonly used a jutsu he's only seen once that you cannot practice (RDS), Used the same hand seals and matched the chakra of the Zetsu statue budha instantly despite never ever seeing it. JMAN cannonly stated that the reason he didnt wanna show Hiruzen his new jutsu (when young) was because Hiruzen steals jutsu's (lmao I know, such a D!ck). Manga fact from Oru he can use jutsu's from konoha, Crystal ball allows him to see every ninja with in its wall at all times anytime he chooses. Kishi in multiple Databooks confirm he uses all Jutsu bar KKG. Kishi confirms he was better then Tobirama. etc

Bro... Databook info matches manga info as fact. Only ppl who don't agree are Ass hurt fans who don't want him over there favs (not talking about you).

If you give me Databook Hiruzen in Prime, There isn't many ninjas he can't beat besides the God or Demi god tiers.

I'm going to check out Hiruzen then fam, I literally only know so much about him. Gotta run by a question about Kidomaru with you btw in your VMS.

 

[Brother Numpsay]

My mans. But what does Hiruzen actually have to put down KN4?

Multiple Raiton of this caliber.

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Manga wise Old Hiruzen hasn't shown shit, if we're being 100%.

Bro, as Edo Tensei he wasnt at full power

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Yet demonstrated high level element blast from all natures. What Kishimoto decided for Hiruzen to hold back in Part 1, is not my problem. Now that his feats are even backed up even more from his hype.

Sure if we take DB in to consideration, but most people play on what they will, and won't accept in the DB entries. Not to mention those statements regarding Hiruzen knowing all of Konoha's techniques hasn't been shown canonically.

We accepted it as hype back in Part 1 DB, even though it was supported by Orochimaru's statement straight from the manga. NOW, we have another DB giving much more details explaining the very same hype. At this point theres no denying even from the fact that using all chakra natures at high level was demonstrated in the manga. So why is it even debatable for him using the elements jutsus we seen Konoha's users have done?

I mean what can we Hiruzen really do here?

Addressed

EJ, Hiruzen wasn't overpowering Orochimaru, Orochimaru was playing with his Sensei, he could have went all out, and you know this.

Nah bro, he was toying with him with ET. Once ET was sealed Orochimaru had to deal with Hiruzen by himself.

[

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] He got overpowered and his face expression shows it all [

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]

 

[Draegod]

I'm going to check out Hiruzen then fam, I literally only know so much about him. Gotta run by a question about Kidomaru with you btw in your VMS.

Bet, hit me up. And yes bro Databook Kishi Hiruzen is boss as fuq! He can Battle with some of the best and hold his own.

Agaisnt KN4 Naruto he uses The barrier Minato used on 100% Kyubi with lowering the earth and watch as he nukes himself, while casually sipping Tea. Hiruzen needs 6 tails Naruto to make it a No diff-still No diff. lol

 

[MickNerks]

^^ No because Orochimaru didn't and couldn't.

Hiruzen can't tag KN4 Naruto or physically overpower him anyways. Hiruzen is less agile than Orochimaru, so he has no way of even tagging Naruto.

Orochimaru didnt because he could use jutsu at the time because hiruzen sealed his arms... So saying hiruzen cant because orochimaru didnt is inaccurate, since orochimaru DID do it when he could use his arms in the scan I showed.

 

[Curse Mark]

That's actually a good point, but all I can see is Hiruzen playing defensively here. I can't see him doing anything offensively as he doesn't have the agility needed to do so.

He outlasts until naruto runs out of chakra or elemental attacks kill him.

This.

I disagree.

 

[NarutoX28]

He outlasts until naruto runs out of chakra or elemental attacks kill him.

How?

Old Hiruzen's Stamina is very low unlike Naruto's who has tens of times more chakra than Kakashi does with little Kurama influence. KN4 Naruto doesn't merely get outlasted, not even close.

 

[NarutoX28]

Orochimaru didnt because he could use jutsu at the time because hiruzen sealed his arms... So saying hiruzen cant because orochimaru didnt is inaccurate, since orochimaru DID do it when he could use his arms in the scan I showed.

That's true, but Orochimaru couldn't make contact with KN4 Naruto long enough to even use the seal.

 

[NarutoX28]

Lol what, are we reading the same manga here? DB portrayed Old Hiruzen Taijutsu to be superior then Oro. We also have feats of Hiruzen overpowering Orochimaru in CQC. And people says his less agile then Orochimaru? Lol please stop.

Hiruzen smacks KN4 around with Enma.

Why does that matter?

KN4 Naruto easily applies the pressure on Hiruzen as Hiruzen has no speed feats needed to reach KN4 Naruto, not even, so CQC is pointless when he can't even reach him in the first place.

 

[Curse Mark]

How?

Old Hiruzen's Stamina is very low unlike Naruto's who has tens of times more chakra than Kakashi does with little Kurama influence. KN4 Naruto doesn't merely get outlasted, not even close.

Hiruzen could outlast like we discussed- enma cage anchored into the ground.. I don't think his stamina is quite as low as people make it out to be.

 

[NarutoX28]

Hiruzen could outlast like we discussed- enma cage anchored into the ground.. I don't think his stamina is quite as low as people make it out to be.

Then a Chakra Roar can fit through the gaps of the cage.

His Stamina was low. He was exhausted after using 3 techniques and engaging in a short CQC exchange.

 

[Curse Mark]

Then a Chakra Roar can fit through the gaps of the cage.

His Stamina was low. He was exhausted after using 3 techniques and engaging in a short CQC exchange.

The dude used multi shadow clones, 3 reaper death seals, a summoning, shadow clone on his shuriken, etc.

 

[Brother Numpsay]

Why does that matter?

KN4 Naruto easily applies the pressure on Hiruzen as Hiruzen has no speed feats needed to reach KN4 Naruto, not even, so CQC is pointless when he can't even reach him in the first place.

Please stop the down playing. Hiruzen has the speed to keep up with Orochimaru 1. 2 Hiruzen has the speed to catch up with Hashirama and Tobirama's movement speed when they all shared the same distance away from Juubito[

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]<--He was one of the corners using Barrier jutsu, and caught up with them on top of SM Deity Gates[

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].

 

[NarutoX28]

The dude used multi shadow clones, 3 reaper death seals, a summoning, shadow clone on his shuriken, etc.

The dude split his chakra further into thirds. I agree, he certainly had chakra, but he was fatigued and panting which meant that he was running low on chakra.

Each Reaper Death seal was done with each clone individually, so it's not like he's using up extra chakra on top of his clones.

Summoning doesn't consume that much chakra. Not even.

And Minato used Reaper Death Seal and sealed 50% Kurama into himself while he hardly had any chakra, so Reaper Death Seal hardly requires that much chakra.

And the Shurikens were included in his "3 techniques".

 

[EZQ]

Bet, hit me up. And yes bro Databook Kishi Hiruzen is boss as fuq! He can Battle with some of the best and hold his own.

Agaisnt KN4 Naruto he uses The barrier Minato used on 100% Kyubi with lowering the earth and watch as he nukes himself, while casually sipping Tea. Hiruzen needs 6 tails Naruto to make it a No diff-still No diff. lol

Databook Hiruzen is a hyperbol m8. He clearly can't perform every jutsu in konoha to a level they are useful in battle. Why?

When he was brought back as edo, he didn't have the old body problems (pain and low stamina) so there were absolutely no reasons to not use the best in his arsenal. If he could perform every jutsu in Konoha, he'd have used a lot of OP jutsus we've seen and soloed the Guguru. But the only thing he made was stalemate it until it got destroyed by Karin. (He could also have used Karin's same jutsu to destroy it)

 

[NarutoX28]

Please stop the down playing. Hiruzen has the speed to keep up with Orochimaru 1. 2 Hiruzen has the speed to catch up with Hashirama and Tobirama's movement speed when they all shared the same distance away from Juubito[

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]<--He was one of the corners using Barrier jutsu, and caught up with them on top of SM Deity Gates[

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].

Hiruzen has the reflexes to keep up with Orochimaru, not the speed or mobility that Orochimaru possessed due to his elasticity. Databook even supports that notion when Hiruzen is 3 tiers below Orochimaru in speed. That's absolutely massive.

How do we know this?

Except there's no indication that Hashirama was moving at his fastest as even he admitted that he didn't stand a chance against Juubito.