[Discussion] Rayleigh real strength

[MadaraReturns]

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'The Shadow of the Roger Pirates'



When I watched his scenes again (most important are he vs Kizaru and the line he made against the marines),
I realized something I didn't realize before.

When he fought Kizaru, Kizaru wasn't equal to him. Yes, the thing I realized was that he was much stronger than I imagined.

Back at Sabaody he stopped Kizaru while not even having him on his mind, he was fighting Kizaru merely to stop him, not to defeat him,
and that with his (eyes and) mind on Luffy and the rest. Knowing Kizaru that is dangerous, Whitebeard and Marco had to learn that the hard way. Tho The Dark King didn't get a scratch. Rayleigh was probably much stronger than Kizaru if he intented to be serious.

What proves my point that he is very strong is the slash he made against the marines.

Without putting and effort even the sound the slash made was one of a kind. Rayleigh would by swordman-skills atleast be Mihawk level, chances are high he could even beat Mihawk to be honest.

Only reason people don't mention him when they talk about strong people or skilled swordsmen is because he keeps his profile low.



Question: What are your opinions on who could be able to beat Rayleigh after the timeskip?​

 

[Bimbonium]

The Kizaru part is too much of an assumption, afawk Kizaru has never been serious. The same argument goes for Kizaru too, he had the SHs on his mind and not the dark king.

He his strong, in his prime he was at least admiral level, but at Sabody Kizaru would have won, even if it's just cos of his stamina.

 

[MadaraReturns]

The Kizaru part is too much of an assumption, afawk Kizaru has never been serious and the same argument goes for Kizaru too, he had the SHs on his mind and not the dark king.

He his strong, in his prime he was at least admiral level, but at Sabody Kizaru would have won, even if it's just cos of his stamina.

I disagree, like I already said Kizaru even tried to give him sneaky hits to put him out like he did to Whitebeard and Marco, thought the difference is that Rayleigh blocked them.

 

[WoldOfFingo]

so much bullsh!t in one post

 

[Strict]

Let's not overdo it. Mihawk is labelled as the best swordsman in the world and possesses the best blade. So saying Rayleigh would beat him in just a sword duel is a bit too much.

If Rayleigh would be superior to Kizaru, he would have beaten him in order to help the Strawhat-Crew with Kuma, but he clearly said that, as he gets older, he isn't able to both handle Kizaru and care about them.

I think that prime Rayleigh was on pair with the current Shanks, so Yonkou level. Old Rayleigh is about Admiral level, I guess. Or slightly above (as Kizaru himself is one of the stronger ones).

 

[Sheele]

Rayleigh is god though.

 

[MadaraReturns]

Let's not overdo it. Mihawk is labelled as the best swordsman in the world and possesses the best blade. So saying Rayleigh would beat him in just a sword duel is a bit too much.

If Rayleigh would be superior to Kizaru, he would have beaten him in order to help the Strawhat-Crew with Kuma, but he clearly said that, as he gets older, he isn't able to both handle Kizaru and care about them.

I think that prime Rayleigh was on pair with the current Shanks, so Yonkou level. Old Rayleigh is about Admiral level, I guess. Or slightly above (as Kizaru himself is one of the stronger ones).

I get what you're saying, but I wasn't only talking about his swordman-skills, I meant overall he'd beat him maybe.

If he'd beat Kizaru (badly) he would've been chased by the marines again, nothing has happened now, there are no reasons to chase Rayleigh. And that's exactly what I meant anyway, if he didn't have to worry about the StrawHats he would've been able to beat Kizaru if he wanted to.

 

[Monxstaa]

Ray is stronk its a known fact, i think he is admirallevel or higher

 

[loj]

But no way in hell Kizaru was 4 real.Sure he responded with some hits but these are the moves he always uses nothing special in them.

 

[MadaraReturns]

But no way in hell Kizaru was 4 real.Sure he responded with some hits but these are the moves he always uses nothing special in them.

So who you think'd win in an all out fight?

 

[loj]

So who you think'd win in an all out fight?

Kizaru vs Rayleigh?

Kizaru all day long.Rayleigh alone said that he isn't on level he was before.

Anyways I found this pic on tumblr and changed some colors

 

[WhistleBlower]

Of course he is strong, he was vice captain of the roger pirates!

I reckon he could've taken kizaru if he were serious.

Heck garp even hyped him when he heard rumours that Rayleigh was a prisoner in the "human trade shop". Ahem ahem "trade". XD
Anyways i recall him saying something like "Don't alert sengoku , we can't deal with two legends at the same time" to an marine. Lol, he even laughed at the fact that rayleigh being a slave.

 

[JDtheAlchemist]

I'd say old Rayleigh is still at least Admiral level. Given that he's a master of all 3 types of Haki, he'd probably beat Kizaru who relies on his Devil Fruit powers too much. Those sword skills are definitely underrated but I wouldn't say as good as Mihawk's.

 

[Dęvîa Puęrî]

i think reighlee is admiral level in terms of battle prowess.. and technique however he does not have the stamina to contend a even match with the admirals as for fighting kizaru kizaru did not fight how he ususallty does i dont even think he used any lazors at all...
if u see how (even though its not cannon) reighlee fought with that old admiral dude zeff in the movie u see clearly how kizaru was not fighting rieghlee anyway serious...

 

[Hexuze]

Kizaru would of killed Rayleigh if the fight had continued...

 

[Rikudou Tobi]

It's very much possible, the only thing that was keeping him from decapitating Kizaru was his age.

 

[MadaraReturns]

Of course he is strong, he was vice captain of the roger pirates!

I reckon he could've taken kizaru if he were serious.

Heck garp even hyped him when he heard rumours that Rayleigh was a prisoner in the "human trade shop". Ahem ahem "trade". XD
Anyways i recall him saying something like "Don't alert sengoku , we can't deal with two legends at the same time" to an marine. Lol, he even laughed at the fact that rayleigh being a slave.

Completely agree with u

I'd say old Rayleigh is still at least Admiral level. Given that he's a master of all 3 types of Haki, he'd probably beat Kizaru who relies on his Devil Fruit powers too much. Those sword skills are definitely underrated but I wouldn't say as good as Mihawk's.

Not only that but overall I think Rayleigh (even with his 'bad' stamina) outclasses Kizaru. Nothing showed that Kizaru would beatbhim by stamina, he was easily keeping up even defending against suprise attacks when he was looking at the crew

i think reighlee is admiral level in terms of battle prowess.. and technique however he does not have the stamina to contend a even match with the admirals as for fighting kizaru kizaru did not fight how he ususallty does i dont even think he used any lazors at all...
if u see how (even though its not cannon) reighlee fought with that old admiral dude zeff in the movie u see clearly how kizaru was not fighting rieghlee anyway serious...

Maybe Kizaru was fighting like that becausebhe knew he couldn't do anything else, if I fight a kid I can show much more than when I fight a 30 year old man, that's also a possibility ofcourse..

Kizaru would of killed Rayleigh if the fight had continued...

I don't think that'd happen, he would've done it if he could.

It's very much possible, the only thing that was keeping him from decapitating Kizaru was his age.

I was thinking more about his mindset, he wasn't looking for trouble anymore as he stated himself. He left hose things behind and kept a low profile

 

[Rikudou Tobi]

Completely agree with u



Not only that but overall I think Rayleigh (even with his 'bad' stamina) outclasses Kizaru. Nothing showed that Kizaru would beatbhim by stamina, he was easily keeping up even defending against suprise attacks when he was looking at the crew



Maybe Kizaru was fighting like that becausebhe knew he couldn't do anything else, if I fight a kid I can show much more than when I fight a 30 year old man, that's also a possibility ofcourse..



I don't think that'd happen, he would've done it if he could.



I was thinking more about his mindset, he wasn't looking for trouble anymore as he stated himself. He left hose things behind and kept a low profile

Yeah his mindset or intent rather was just to stall kizaru. I'm sure that Rayleigh could beat Kizaru too.

 

[KingHashirama]

He would've lost against Kizaru. What the rayleigh supporters are not taking into account is the following:

1. He hadn't been fighting actively like Garp, Whitebeard, and Sengoku (so to put him on their level is just an insult to them in my opinion). This was visible when he started breathing hard in his clash with Kizaru.



Flawed reasoning of : "His mindset was to stall, so if he was serious he would've beat him".


Thats just simply wrong. He had to resort to stalling because he couldn't overpower Kizaru. At the best he could do was stall. If he was able to overpower Kizaru, he would've been able to go over to help with the Pacifista situation that Luffy was facing.

 

[ToshiZO]

lmao this notion that Kizaru is never serious, needs to end. Kizaru in his deathbed would still have the same trollface and way of talking.

Kizaru is a lowkey tryhard second only to Akainu when it comes to the Marines.