BM Naruto and EMS Sasuke vs. EMS Madara

[KidGamer65]

Lol good thing he doesn't have it, otherwise they'd get obliterated. Naruto and Sasuke win mid-high diff then. Not a complete obliteration.

-Sasuke is useless here offensively. His only job is to provide an extra boost in defense to the team.
-Naruto's offense remains the same as it does before, and Madara can take his strongest attack with low-moderate damage.

Madara's PS blade should be as strong at least (probably stronger, definitely more focused) than a hypothetical downscaled PS Chidori from VoTE 2 Sasuke. Thus Madara should be capable of chipping away at their Avatars little by little, but not before Naruto kills him with Flash BD.

Commonly since it is inside Naruto, it shouldn't be applicable in my opinion. Manda is dead but people still say Sasuke can summon him even though he isn't alive because he was once part of his arsenal...MS Obito lost his contract but Kurama was once part of his arsenal.

Hebi Sasuke lost his CM2 then later formed Taka after but people still give this to Hebi Sasuke even though Taka was confirmed after this loss. EMS Madara at a point didn't have Kurama like MS Obito did and didn't. It should obviously be specified to us whether he has access to it or not. If we had EMS Madara vs Naruto, are you still going to say he'll summon Kurama? I'm just trying to be realistic. Also, if we're going to say Obito lost his, then it should stated if or if not Hebi Sasuke has access to CM2 and Manda in VS threads since he lost them

As I said above, terrible logic. Again.

1. Your "It's in Naruto" thing makes no sense since while EMS Madara was in the Manga, Kurama was accessible to him.
2. Your "Manda is dead" example makes no sense since while Hebi Sasuke was in the Manga, Manda was accessible to him. MS Sasuke and later don't get access to Manda. Where have you ever seen anyone say that he does?
3. EMS Madara had Kurama right up until Hashirama killed him. :lol So that example is flawed for obvious reasons.
4. MS Obito doesn't have Kurama as an adult, which is why MS Obito doesn't get him.
5. Hebi Sasuke lost access to CM2 at the end of his career, where he then became MS Sasuke shortly after. Once again. Flawed example, just like the rest of them.

If I used the logic you were using in 3 and 5 and the bold, I'd be asking OP to specify whether or not War Arc Naruto should get Kurama in threads since he lost it at one point. :lol

Simple fact is that EMS Madara made a contract with Kurama, and didn't lose that contract. Thus EMS Madara at his best would be with Kurama.

Well, I should pobably say that clearly in OP, I already edited it. I just thought it was it obvious, becuase if Kurama was in Madaras arsenal this thread would be pointless. Besides, in OP I only mentioned about Madaras PS, I never said anything about Kurama in his arsenal.

Yet you make a thread and put BM Naruto AND EMS Sasuke against EMS Madara with only PS and then act like it's not a pointless thread when Madara would already have trouble getting past one of their Avatars let alone both combined together.

Lord. :lol

BM Naruto and EMS Sasuke vs. Madara w/o Kurama isn't a stomp, but Naruto and Sasuke are obviously going to win, and that isn't debatable. Thus no real meaningful discussion can come from this match up regardless of Kurama's restriction.

 

[PT1990]

Yet you make a thread and put BM Naruto AND EMS Sasuke against EMS Madara with only PS and then act like it's not a pointless thread when Madara would already have trouble getting past one of their Avatars let alone both combined together.

Lord. :lol

I see nothing strange with that. Separately they could give him some problems but would be nowhere near strong enough to defeat him. This thread is not pointless at all.

 

[KidGamer65]

I see nothing strange with that. Separately they could give him some problems but would be nowhere near to defeat him. This thread is not pointless at all.

Yeah, separately they'd lose rather easily. They aren't separate. They are together and Madara can't even get past their defenses while they have the firepower to eventually get past his. Like I said, not a stomp, but it's not debatable as there is no way Madara can get through their Avatars, so this is by definition a pointless thread.

Unless you or anyone else has some groundbreaking feat from Madara, because his PS's best feat is splitting multiple Mountains, and while that would eventually let him get past either of their Avatars one on one, that won't fly when their Avatars have merged together.

 

[PT1990]

Yeah, separately they'd lose rather easily. They aren't separate. They are together and Madara can't even get past their defenses while they have the firepower to eventually get past his. Like I said, not a stomp, but it's not debatable as there is no way Madara can get through their Avatars, so this is by definition a pointless thread.

Unless you or anyone else has some groundbreaking feat from Madara, because his PS's best feat is splitting multiple Mountains, and while that would eventually let him get past either of their Avatars one on one, that won't fly when their Avatars have merged together.

Well, thats your opinion. Thank you. Now lets hear what other have to say about that.

 

[KidGamer65]

Yes, it's my opinion backed by Manga feats. But we'll see.

 

[ARGUS]

how many flash TBBs from BM naruto would it take to bust madaras PS?
im of the opinion that itll take 4 of them

 

[Haizaki]

As I said above, terrible logic. Again.

No it's not terrible lol.

1. Your "It's in Naruto" thing makes no sense since while EMS Madara was in the Manga, Kurama was accessible to him.
2. Your "Manda is dead" example makes no sense since while Hebi Sasuke was in the Manga, Manda was accessible to him. MS Sasuke and later don't get access to Manda. Where have you ever seen anyone say that he does?
3. EMS Madara had Kurama right up until Hashirama killed him. :lol So that example is flawed for obvious reasons.
4. MS Obito doesn't have Kurama as an adult, which is why MS Obito doesn't get him.
5. Hebi Sasuke lost access to CM2 at the end of his career, where he then became MS Sasuke shortly after. Once again. Flawed example, just like the rest of them.

1. Yes it does..Madara actually lost his access to the beast when Hashirama removed it from his control and it was sealed in Mito Uzumaki from what I recall. That's a loss regardless of the contract..Simply because he didn't have access to this anymore.

2. I didn't mention MS Sasuke did I?...Hebi Sasuke lost Manda in the Deidara fight but he still fought Itachi as Hebi. Question is why do people give him this when he lost it but don't give MS Obito Kurama even though the same applies? Right before Manda dies, you already see it fading slowly off the scroll

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. Then it was lastly summoned shortly before it died.

3. EMS Madara didn't have accessto Kurama after Hashirama's fight..When he used Izanagi, he still had his EMS but no access to the beast since it was sealed inside a person known as Mito Uzumaki. Read the bottom left of this scan where it was mentioned about the fight between Madara and Hashirama (

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) then it says here Hashirama gained control during the fight and it was sealed(

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). Hence he lost access to it. If not Edo Madara should gain access to the beast since he tried to summon it but it was inside Naruto. Why doesn't he get it? Not seeing what's bad in my logic.

4. Madara didn't have access to it after his fight with Hashi...Sasuke too didn't have access to his summon after his fight with Deidara.

5. I can let this point slide but he lost it in his fight with Itachi? Not to mention the others should suffice.

If I used the logic you were using in 3 and 5 and the bold, I'd be asking OP to specify whether or not War Arc Naruto should get Kurama in threads since he lost it at one point. :lol

Did he get it back? Of course he did. How about Madara? He lost access to it and never got it back. This should be clear that it needs to be specified.

Simple fact is that EMS Madara made a contract with Kurama, and didn't lose that contract. Thus EMS Madara at his best would be with Kurama.

At his best and Obito at his best should get what he had in his arsenal if we'll be using this. Losing contract is the same as not having access to it. Madara didn't have access to it when it was in Mito when Hashi gained control of it regardless of his contract. Sasuke lost his summon like that scan I showed but he still gets access to it. Why is Obito now different? It's best to specify EMS Madara with Kyuubi or I don't see why Edo Madara doesn't get it as well. EMS Madara had it which isn't something I'm denying. However that scan I showed said Hashirama gained control of it during their fight and Mito then sealed it in her. Tell me then why Edo Madara doesn't get this? He obviously lost access to it since it was sealed in a person regardless of him using it before. Obito as well lost access to his regardless of how different the scenario was. This is why we need the OP's specification on these things...Don't see the bad logic you're accusing me of.

 

[BLAZE]

This right here. Not to mention MS Obito is a terrible terrible example since the MS Obito that is usually involved in these vs. threads is the one who lost his contract with Kurama.

Manda died when Hebi Sasuke fought Diedara so by that logic we cannot use Manda for Hebi sasuke :|

 

[Transcendence]

Manda died when Hebi Sasuke fought Diedara so by that logic we cannot use Manda for Hebi sasuke :|

It depends at which state the character is at. Post or Pre-Deidara fight Sasuke. What he meant by Obito was that MS Obito, the one most debate with, is the Adult version that was in and made the Akatsuki. By that point, Kurama was already sealed in Naruto and the contract didn't work anymore. Young Obito is the one with Kurama, but he's also not anywhere near as proficient with Kamui. In the case of Madara, he was in his living Prime when he had Kurama, that's why it's such a huge difference in power and the entire argument as a whole.

 

[Haizaki]

My last post very well addresses any difference.

 

[BLAZE]

It depends at which state the character is at. Post or Pre-Deidara fight Sasuke. What he meant by Obito was that MS Obito, the one most debate with, is the Adult version that was in and made the Akatsuki. By that point, Kurama was already sealed in Naruto and the contract didn't work anymore. Young Obito is the one with Kurama, but he's also not anywhere near as proficient with Kamui. In the case of Madara, he was in his living Prime when he had Kurama, that's why it's such a huge difference in power and the entire argument as a whole.

But madara was alive thanks to Izanagi when Kurama was sealed in Mito and he hasn't awakaned Rinnegan :|

 

[Apêx1]

Madara uses Iso Susanoo and obliterates them regardless of Sasuke getting a cloak.

How does that make sense? Non-cloak=3x boost, cloak is like a 50x boost and I can't imagine the boost a BM cloak would give. His PS would shit all over Madara, all over.

 

[LuckyMan]

How does that make sense? Non-cloak=3x boost, cloak is like a 50x boost and I can't imagine the boost a BM cloak would give. His PS would shit all over Madara, all over.

The cloak was for defense/armor. Its how they survived Jubi sized Katons, Jubis nuke, and all those other attacks. The boost should still be the same, which was 3× and it would logically double to 6× when Minato gives them Yin Kurama cloaks on top of it. I guess what I'm trying to say is that the quantity of chakra given won't change its quality (boost).

 

[KidGamer65]

How does that make sense? Non-cloak=3x boost, cloak is like a 50x boost and I can't imagine the boost a BM cloak would give. His PS would shit all over Madara, all over.

For the last time now, where is this 50x boost coming from? Lol. The cloak is nowhere near a 50x boost nor does Sasuke stand a chance against Madara even with the cloak.Where is the evidence for this 50x boost stuff anyway?

Sasukes V3 Susanoo is not 50x larger or stronger than it was before the boost and that was with yin and yang kurama. Lol

 

[Apêx1]

The cloak was for defense/armor. Its how they survived Jubi sized Katons, Jubis nuke, and all those other attacks. The boost should still be the same, which was 3× and it would logically double to 6× when Minato gives them Yin Kurama cloaks on top of it. I guess what I'm trying to say is that the quantity of chakra given won't change its quality (boost).

For the last time now, where is this 50x boost coming from? Lol. The cloak is nowhere near a 50x boost nor does Sasuke stand a chance against Madara even with the cloak.Where is the evidence for this 50x boost stuff anyway?

Sasukes V3 Susanoo is not 50x larger or stronger than it was before the boost and that was with yin and yang kurama. Lol

Uh, no. Akimichi's could now hold the Juubi's tail when they could barely push the Gedo Mazo a meter backwards, Hinata went from a fist sized air palm to an Air Palm repelling the Juubi's tail, etc. The boost is HUGE, regardless of how you look at it. More chakra=greater boost, it's always been like this and it will always be like this.

It doesn't necessarily have to be 50x, but the boost is massive regardless of how you look at it. Size isn't necessarily indicative of the boost. If it's making something like the v3 equal to PS then there's a clear HUGE boost.

 

[Zee U]

Apéx, the cloak can't be a x50 boost, remember that Lee or Minato said that Hachimon gave Gai a x50 boost, and he would shit all over KN1 Gai. Stills it's huge, Jirobo in pt1 when he saw Butterfly Choji said that manifesting so much chakra to the point it takes a physical form is beyond ridicolous. It's way bigger than the boost Kakashi had (Kurama gave him chakra and he didn't manifest a cloak at all) going by that statement.

 

[Apêx1]

Apéx, the cloak can't be a x50 boost, remember that Lee or Minato said that Hachimon gave Gai a x50 boost, and he would shit all over KN1 Gai. Stills it's huge, Jirobo in pt1 when he saw Butterfly Choji said that manifesting so much chakra to the point it takes a physical form is beyond ridicolous. It's way bigger than the boost Kakashi had (Kurama gave him chakra and he didn't manifest a cloak at all) going by that statement.

Let's look at Hinata's air palm evolution. [

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]---->[

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]. Please do look closely.

Edit: When was that 50x boost stated? Pretty sure Lee got like a 10x boost from going 5th Gate in p1, and each subsequent Gate increases power exponentially. Don't get me started on 8th Gate.

 

[Unorthodox]

Team Sasuke shits

 

[KidGamer65]

I'll respond to the other posts later.

Uh, no. Akimichi's could now hold the Juubi's tail when they could barely push the Gedo Mazo a meter backwards, Hinata went from a fist sized air palm to an Air Palm repelling the Juubi's tail, etc. The boost is HUGE, regardless of how you look at it. More chakra=greater boost, it's always been like this and it will always be like this.

So? :lol Holding and punching are two completely different actions. Not to mention Gedo Mazo is sturdier than the Juubi's tail and far far larger. Hinata's Air Palm being able to push back a Bijuu sized entity doesn't even come close to indicating a 50x boost. Not. Even. Close.

It doesn't necessarily have to be 50x, but the boost is massive regardless of how you look at it. Size isn't necessarily indicative of the boost. If it's making something like the v3 equal to PS then there's a clear HUGE boost.

We already knew it was huge. I'm just wondering where 50x came from. :lol

 

[Zee U]

Let's look at Hinata's air palm evolution. [

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]---->[

You must be registered for see links

]. Please do look closely.

Edit: When was that 50x boost stated? Pretty sure Lee got like a 10x boost from going 5th Gate in p1, and each subsequent Gate increases power exponentially. Don't get me started on 8th Gate.

Got it mixed up sorry, it's actually 100 times your original strenght

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.