[VS] Danzo vs Kakashi

[Apêx1]

True, but Kakashi would have to keep that up.​

No, he doesn't need to use it more then once per 5 minutes. He'll notice the eyes closing and he'll notice the time it took as he did when he figured out the 5 second cd for Deva. Danzo deactivated Izanagi while Sasuke was immobilised iirc. He's not doing it against the likes of Kakashi who can shit on him with either;
[

You must be registered for see links

]
[

You must be registered for see links

]
[

You must be registered for see links

]
[

You must be registered for see links

]

These are all extremely effective given it's a water location. Danzo is not surviving without Izanagi. The electricity from the Raiton Bunshin will be conducted by the water as well making it far worse for Danzo when he attacks it. With or without Kamui, Kakashi is winning this.

 

[Brooks]

No, he doesn't need to use it more then once per 5 minutes. He'll notice the eyes closing and he'll notice the time it took as he did when he figured out the 5 second cd for Deva. Danzo deactivated Izanagi while Sasuke was immobilised iirc. He's not doing it against the likes of Kakashi who can shit on him with either;
[

You must be registered for see links

]
[

You must be registered for see links

]
[

You must be registered for see links

]
[

You must be registered for see links

]

These are all extremely effective given it's a water location. Danzo is not surviving without Izanagi. The electricity from the Raiton Bunshin will be conducted by the water as well making it far worse for Danzo when he attacks it. With or without Kamui, Kakashi is winning this.

None of those are going to work as Baku would completely suck up the water and reduce any
relevance it has to zero and short range Raiton would only led to Kakashi's demise as Danzo can easily place his cruse seal on to Kakashi.

Not only that, but Mokuton blocks any Suiton attempt.​

 

[Apêx1]

None of those are going to work as Baku would completely suck up the water and reduce any
relevance it has to zero and short range Raiton would only led to Kakashi's demise as Danzo can easily place his cruse seal on to Kakashi.

Not only that, but Mokuton blocks any Suiton attempt.​

Too bad Baku disappears the second he's spawned via Katon. And lol, curse mark is not doing shit to Kakashi at CQC range, since he'll only be there if Danzo's Izanagi is deactivated. If Danzo places the mark on Kakashi while Izanagi is deactivated Kakashi can still use Kamui to one shot his head off.

Lol, what Mokuton? I don't recall his feats nor do I recall it being strong enough to counter Kakashi's powerful Suiton's.

 

[Beans2]

Good points. Disagree with a few things though;

1. Baku is too large to be warped by Kamui, Katon is a far easier option.

Kakashi can use Katon? I don't really care since I agree Baku doesn't help Danzo.

2. Kakashi's chakra is outstanding. I can't see him getting low on chakra by just using his regular ninjutsu and forgetting about using MS.

Thing is, he can't hold off Danzo with regular ninjutsu.

3. Kakashi tends to replace himself with a clone in almost all his fights, as shown against Zabuza, Kakashi, Pain, etc. This will be no different and the moment Danzo lands the seal on Kakashi, Kakashi will gain intel on it and know to avoid being touched by his hand at all costs. Given his insane agility, MS pre-cog (superior to 3T) and superior Taijutsu ability, it shouldn't be difficult at all.

If he replaces himself with a clone, Danzo then kills the clone and Kakashi's chakra is cut in half since both lightning clones and shadow clones cut chakra evenly. Danzo also has MS precog and outsped Sasuke on one occasion with shunshin [

You must be registered for see links

]. Kakashi can only run for so long, but when he attacks Danzo, Danzo will land a mutual strike on him with his wind blade or curse seal.

4. His intelligence is also quite a large factor in this fight. I don't see any reason as to why he wouldn't be able to replicate Sasuke's intelligence feat by placing Danzo into Genjutsu after figuring out the workings of Izanagi. He's figured out pretty much every jutsu he's every been up against, Izanagi should be no exception.

Danzo would kill Kakashi before his ten minutes of izanagi are up. Simple.

 

[Brooks]

Too bad Baku disappears the second he's spawned via Katon..

Too bad Kakashi doesn't have Katon.

Kakashi only has Suiton, Raiton and Doton.​

And lol, curse mark is not doing shit to Kakashi at CQC range, since he'll only be there if Danzo's Izanagi is deactivated. If Danzo places the mark on Kakashi while Izanagi is deactivated Kakashi can still use Kamui to one shot his head off..

Why in the hell would Danzo face Kakashi in CQC without Izanagi knowing his intention is to place his seal on to Kakashi? Danzo already knows who Kakashi is and facing him in CQC without Izanagi isn't something that's going to happen.​

Lol, what Mokuton? I don't recall his feats nor do I recall it being strong enough to counter Kakashi's powerful Suiton's.

The same Mokuton that can block something the size and force of Susanoo arrow.​

 

[BenjerminGaye]

Except Danzo can undo the effect of Izanagi.​

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

To undo it he has to use seals.

Somthing kakashi can easily pick up on and stop him from doing, and tbh I'm not sure thats what he ment. Seeing as danzo has to manually activate izanagi 10 times he could very well mean let 1 eye run out and simply not activate the next eye. Stopping it half way seems even more hax than it already is.

 

[Manda II]

Kakashi wins irregardless of intel. Stated by Choza and consistently shown in the manga, Kakashi tends to use a bunshin for intel gathering purposes in his fights. Sasuke managed to figure out the mechanics behind Danzo's Izanagi with no prior intel. Kakashi, who not only is at least equal in analytical skill, but was stated and shown to be superior in that regard throughout the war arc, will definitely be able see through the workings of Danzo's Izanagi. This fight would revolve around:

1) Kakashi testing the water with his Raiton bunshin.
2) Kamui being used to see how Izanagi reacts to S/T techniques.
3) A final Kamui being used to teleport Danzo's whole body to the Kamui dimension, which results as a win via BFR.

Izanagi can't nullify the effects of a displacement technique, considering it doesn't fall under the category of re-writing death.

 

[Apêx1]

Kakashi can use Katon? I don't really care since I agree Baku doesn't help Danzo.

He's seen Itachi use Katon, so we can apply that feat to him since he can copy all ninjutsu via Sharingan. Pretty sure he's also seen Kakuzu's Katon's, so those are some he can also probably replicate.

You must be registered for see links

.

Thing is, he can't hold off Danzo with regular ninjutsu.

He sure can. Small scale Futon's can be countered via Suiton Wall. Large Scale Futon's are either countered by Kakashi's Mizu Bunshin feints or Katon's. His speed being superior to Danzo's is also a large factor in this fight, he shouldn't have much trouble closing the distance at any given moment.

If he replaces himself with a clone, Danzo then kills the clone and Kakashi's chakra is cut in half since both lightning clones and shadow clones cut chakra evenly. Danzo also has MS precog and outsped Sasuke on one occasion with shunshin [

You must be registered for see links

]. Kakashi can only run for so long, but when he attacks Danzo, Danzo will land a mutual strike on him with his wind blade or curse seal.

Mizu Bunshin's don't and since this is a water location, using them is the better choice. 10% chakra isn't much. And lol at that being an outspeed, Sasuke was losing the light in his MS and going blind at that point [

You must be registered for see links

]. Danzo evading wouldn't be much of a feat since Sasuke would have a shittier eye sight then Itachi did while he was trying to fight Sasuke. Let's also not forget Kakashi is far faster then both MS Sasuke and Danzo given he was easily outspeeding the v2 Jinchuriki's in the war arc and landing hits, while KCM Naruto was getting absolutely shat on by them [

You must be registered for see links

][

You must be registered for see links

]. Kakashi was even portrayed at 6G Gai speed [

You must be registered for see links

][

You must be registered for see links

], meaning Kakashi's speed is superior to MS Sasuke's and Danzo's. Landing a strike on Kakashi seems fallacious to me, he's far more agile and he's far faster. And the Futon advantage the blade would have can easily be negated by Kakashi changing his jutsu into a Rasengan (after fighting Danzo for a while he would realise his lightning is not as effective).

Danzo would kill Kakashi before his ten minutes of izanagi are up. Simple.

Doubt it.

Too bad Kakashi doesn't have Katon.

Kakashi only has Suiton, Raiton and Doton.​

[/quot]

He can copy any jutsu he's seen, Katon is no exception. DBIV disagrees, he has all elements.

Why in the hell would Danzo face Kakashi in CQC without Izanagi knowing his intention is to place his seal on to Kakashi? Danzo already knows who Kakashi is and facing him in CQC without Izanagi isn't something that's going to happen.​

SMH. You are the one who said Danzo can deactivate his Izanagi, don't mention that if you're not going to use it. To activate it he needs seals and to deactivate it he needs seals. It's not a thing he can just instantly do by thinking.

The same Mokuton that can block something the size and force of Susanoo arrow.​

Lol, using that against Suiton is retarded. Karin stated it made his chakra go down tremendously [

You must be registered for see links

], 2 of those and he's losing a limb just like he did when the Mokuton went out of control due to low chakra.

 

[Brooks]

To undo it he has to use seals.

Somthing kakashi can easily pick up on and stop him from doing, and tbh I'm not sure thats what he ment. Seeing as danzo has to manually activate izanagi 10 times he could very well mean let 1 eye run out and simply not activate the next eye. Stopping it half way seems even more hax than it already is.

Stopping him as an how?​

 

[Aikor]

In my opinion

Danzo would probably make kakashi tire himself out

Then proceeds to kill him

If its a Danzo vs Kakashi match with no izanagi allowed

Then kakashi wins this

 

[BenjerminGaye]

Stopping him as an how?​

Genjutsu, shuriken jutsu, cqc via clones. Anything that forces him to use his hands for things other than seals. If hanzo can do it with a sword then surely kakashi can do so with the mentioned techniques.

 

[Beans2]

He's seen Itachi use Katon, so we can apply that feat to him since he can copy all ninjutsu via Sharingan. Pretty sure he's also seen Kakuzu's Katon's, so those are some he can also probably replicate.

You must be registered for see links

.

Alright.

He sure can. Small scale Futon's can be countered via Suiton Wall. Large Scale Futon's are either countered by Kakashi's Mizu Bunshin feints or Katon's. His speed being superior to Danzo's is also a large factor in this fight, he shouldn't have much trouble closing the distance at any given moment.

I honestly cannot see Kakashi feinting Danzo out with clones, over and over again. It will work only once or twice. Mizu bunshins have nowhere near the real Kakashi's level of skill allowing Danzo to casually blitz them like how early part 1 Sasuke blitzed six of Zabuza's water clones. Danzo can spawn behind Kakashi, weave hand seals for wind bullets, and then hold his breath while he engages Kakashi in CQC with his wind blade. Then once he gets up in Kakashi's face, he lets out the wind bullets and shoots him down. This battle will eventually come down to close combat, in which Danzo only needs a mutual strike to win.

Mizu Bunshin's don't and since this is a water location, using them is the better choice. 10% chakra isn't much. And lol at that being an outspeed, Sasuke was losing the light in his MS and going blind at that point [

You must be registered for see links

]. Danzo evading wouldn't be much of a feat since Sasuke would have a shittier eye sight then Itachi did while he was trying to fight Sasuke. Let's also not forget Kakashi is far faster then both MS Sasuke and Danzo given he was easily outspeeding the v2 Jinchuriki's in the war arc and landing hits, while KCM Naruto was getting absolutely shat on by them [

You must be registered for see links

][

You must be registered for see links

]. Kakashi was even portrayed at 6G Gai speed [

You must be registered for see links

][

You must be registered for see links

], meaning Kakashi's speed is superior to MS Sasuke's and Danzo's. Landing a strike on Kakashi seems fallacious to me, he's far more agile and he's far faster. And the Futon advantage the blade would have can easily be negated by Kakashi changing his jutsu into a Rasengan (after fighting Danzo for a while he would realise his lightning is not as effective).

Where was Kakashi outspeeding V2 Jins? I pray you are not implying that Kakashi is faster than KCM Naruto. Here's the thing: Kakashi has to attack at some point. He can't just keep running and running. Shadow clones or lightning clones throw away chakra pointlessly. Water clones serve no purpose as they can get blitzed and don't serve a purpose. When they get into close combat, Danzo has the range advantage by wielding his fuuton blade in one hand and having his other hand prepared to deal a paralyzing seal. Will Kakashi be able to kill Danzo in close combat? Yes, but not before Danzo lands a mutual strike either with his curse seal or his sword, or he just lets off wind bullets in his face which Kakashi can't dodge at close range.


Doubt it.[/QUOTE]

 

[Brooks]

Genjutsu,

Not going to work as Danzo seen through Mangekyō Sharingan Sasuke's Genjutsu.​

shuriken jutsu,

No use either and don't bring up the one against Sasuke as he was in mid air(the same way Gaara could block V2 Ei in mid air or a bloody Kunai thrown by 6-Gate Lee out-speeding 8-Gate Gai in mid-air).​

cqc via clones.

An enhanced Fūton: Shinkū Renpa destroys them.​

Anything that forces him to use his hands for things other than seals. If hanzo can do it with a sword then surely kakashi can do so with the mentioned techniques.

I don't completely understand the Hanzo part of your post.​

 

[Apêx1]

I honestly cannot see Kakashi feinting Danzo out with clones, over and over again. It will work only once or twice. Mizu bunshins have nowhere near the real Kakashi's level of skill allowing Danzo to casually blitz them like how early part 1 Sasuke blitzed six of Zabuza's water clones. Danzo can spawn behind Kakashi, weave hand seals for wind bullets, and then hold his breath while he engages Kakashi in CQC with his wind blade. Then once he gets up in Kakashi's face, he lets out the wind bullets and shoots him down. This battle will eventually come down to close combat, in which Danzo only needs a mutual strike to win.

He's done it to the likes of Kakashi twice, he's done it to Zabuza like 3 times, he's done it to Pain once. I mean, doing it to someone as perceptive as Itachi should mean he can do it to Danzo as much as he wants. I'm genuinely not sure what way Danzo could counter it, sure he would anticipate it, but he'd still have nothing to do about it. And I'm not saying the clones will fight lol, I am just saying they are used to feint Danzo's attacks/gain intel. Also, I'm sure using one Kage Bunshin could be more then a game changer. It has equal ability to Kakashi so it's not going poof either, all it has to do is fight Danzo with it while he's hiding underground. The clone will be fighting Danzo in Taijutsu and once Danzo uses the seal he'll lose. But that's no problem since the real Kakashi now has intel on how Danzo fights in CQC and Danzo's cursed seal. Once he realises that to be the case he can just fight Danzo at a range, or fight in CQC with caution. @your strategy, it's countered via Suiton Wall. Also, my bad I thought I showed you the abilities he could use to kill off Danzo;
[

You must be registered for see links

]
[

You must be registered for see links

]
[

You must be registered for see links

]

Where was Kakashi outspeeding V2 Jins? I pray you are not implying that Kakashi is faster than KCM Naruto. Here's the thing: Kakashi has to attack at some point. He can't just keep running and running. Shadow clones or lightning clones throw away chakra pointlessly. Water clones serve no purpose as they can get blitzed and don't serve a purpose. When they get into close combat, Danzo has the range advantage by wielding his fuuton blade in one hand and having his other hand prepared to deal a paralyzing seal. Will Kakashi be able to kill Danzo in close combat? Yes, but not before Danzo lands a mutual strike either with his curse seal or his sword, or he just lets off wind bullets in his face which Kakashi can't dodge at close range.

I gave you the chapter link so you could scroll through [

You must be registered for see links

]. Kakashi landed his hit with the Chidori, and seemingly struck the Bijuu here [

You must be registered for see links

], meaning he was keeping up just fine while Naruto was not. Kakashi is far too fast for Danzo to land a mutual strike on him. Rasengan shits on Danzo's Futon Blade and makes him fly back, no chance Danzo is using his other hand before Kakashi has blasted Danzo 10 meters away. Genjutsu is also a massive factor in this fight, using it like Sasuke did could win him the fight in a similar way.

 

[Beans2]

He's done it to the likes of Kakashi twice, he's done it to Zabuza like 3 times, he's done it to Pain once. I mean, doing it to someone as perceptive as Itachi should mean he can do it to Danzo as much as he wants. I'm genuinely not sure what way Danzo could counter it, sure he would anticipate it, but he'd still have nothing to do about it. And I'm not saying the clones will fight lol, I am just saying they are used to feint Danzo's attacks/gain intel. Also, I'm sure using one Kage Bunshin could be more then a game changer. It has equal ability to Kakashi so it's not going poof either, all it has to do is fight Danzo with it while he's hiding underground. The clone will be fighting Danzo in Taijutsu and once Danzo uses the seal he'll lose. But that's no problem since the real Kakashi now has intel on how Danzo fights in CQC and Danzo's cursed seal. Once he realises that to be the case he can just fight Danzo at a range, or fight in CQC with caution. @your strategy, it's countered via Suiton Wall. Also, my bad I thought I showed you the abilities he could use to kill off Danzo;
[

You must be registered for see links

]
[

You must be registered for see links

]
[

You must be registered for see links

]



I gave you the chapter link so you could scroll through [

You must be registered for see links

]. Kakashi landed his hit with the Chidori, and seemingly struck the Bijuu here [

You must be registered for see links

], meaning he was keeping up just fine while Naruto was not. Kakashi is far too fast for Danzo to land a mutual strike on him. Rasengan shits on Danzo's Futon Blade and makes him fly back, no chance Danzo is using his other hand before Kakashi has blasted Danzo 10 meters away. Genjutsu is also a massive factor in this fight, using it like Sasuke did could win him the fight in a similar way.

You're ignoring vital points of my argumentation. This battle will come down to CQC and when it does, Danzo takes the win. Kakashi can't counter wind bullets from point blank range. Water clones are nuisances that get blitzed. Gaining intel on curse seal doesn't guarantee a win for Kakashi, and Danzo has no reason to use it on a clone when he can just kill it with his vacuum blade.

You are overrating clone feints. The most they can do here is allow Danzo to attack a clone instead of Kakashi, but then the clone will get killed, so now what? Kakashi can't just fight Danzo from a range, because suitons will be read with sharingan and evaded, and lightning running dog or lightning clone can be defused with wind blade.

Kakashi was NOT outspeeding V2 Jins. Reacting to them=/= outspeeding them. He only managed to keep up with them for a little bit, shortly after he gets

You must be registered for see links

and hit back. For your speed comparison to work you would have to seriously believe that Kakashi is faster than KCM Naruto, who outright dodged Ay's top speed punch. I'll tell you what Kakashi CAN'T do with the reaction feats he has:

-Dodge wind bullets from a point blank range.
-Kill Danzo in CQC without Danzo landing a mutual strike on him with a wind blade which has both the range and element advantage.

 

[Apêx1]

You're ignoring vital points of my argumentation. This battle will come down to CQC and when it does, Danzo takes the win. Kakashi can't counter wind bullets from point blank range. Water clones are nuisances that get blitzed. Gaining intel on curse seal doesn't guarantee a win for Kakashi, and Danzo has no reason to use it on a clone when he can just kill it with his vacuum blade.

Again, the first CQC confrontation will be with a Kage Bunshin. The Kage Bunshin will give Kakashi intel on the curse seal and Kakashi can simply either keep Danzo at range with his elemental ninjutsu or blitz him every now and then. Every jutsu Danzo uses bar the massive ones can be copied, meaning those along with the ones he copied against Kakuzu and Zabuza will give him the win. Kakakshi countered Suiton bullets from a 360 degree angle at the very last second in part 1, doing so with his War Arc reaction feats is a piece of cake. Danzo's Futon's are not bypassing his Suiton Wall. @bold, you are assuming he knows it's a clone when Kakashi has a variety of ways to remove LoS and go underground via hiding like a mole as he did against Kakashi. Katon is one way, Doton is another, and Suiton on the scale of the one he used against Zabuza/Kisame (he copied his Suiton Shark) is the last one.

You are overrating clone feints. The most they can do here is allow Danzo to attack a clone instead of Kakashi, but then the clone will get killed, so now what? Kakashi can't just fight Danzo from a range, because suitons will be read with sharingan and evaded, and lightning running dog or lightning clone can be defused with wind blade.

Not really, they are just an extremely effective way to buy Kakashi time. And I'm not really saying he will use it 10 times, I'm saying he'll use it when absolutely necessary, and at second 5 of the fight when he's switching with a Kage Bunshin for intel. Kakashi's massive Suiton is not being evaded here, especially when he's controlling the Suiton. And Futon does not defuse Raiton in the same way Raiton defuses Doton. It simply is insulated by the Futon, but that wouldn't 'defuse' the Raiton Bunshin. Agree on Lightning Running Dog.

Kakashi was NOT outspeeding V2 Jins. Reacting to them=/= outspeeding them. He only managed to keep up with them for a little bit, shortly after he gets

You must be registered for see links

and hit back. For your speed comparison to work you would have to seriously believe that Kakashi is faster than KCM Naruto, who outright dodged Ay's top speed punch. I'll tell you what Kakashi CAN'T do with the reaction feats he has:

-Dodge wind bullets from a point blank range.
-Kill Danzo in CQC without Danzo landing a mutual strike on him with a wind blade which has both the range and element advantage.

Ok, he was not outspeeding them, but he was keeping up perfectly fine; you can't deny that. Naruto on the other hand was not. And wrong, my speed comparison is not taking into account Naruto's Shunshin, it's taking into account his regular speed and reaction speed granted by the Kyuubi's chakra. Let's not overrate it like the rest of this forum, because Gai was keeping up with Obito no problem while KCM Naruto was getting raped by that same Obito 2 minutes earlier. But that KCM Naruto had shown to be able to block v1 Ay's hits and keep up with Edo Itachi for a few seconds. So by that alone he's far above Danzo but still inferior to Kakashi.

-Sasuke dodged them from a distance while turned around and suffering from the backlash of Amaterasu and Susano being used at the same time. Kakashi should have no problem anticipating it by seeing his mouth being puffed up [

You must be registered for see links

] and hearing the intake of air that Danzo must perform. Seeing the chakra within his mouth via Sharingan is another option. Suiton Wall then counters it at any moment, or depending on how close Danzo actually is, Kakashi can outright evade it by moving.
-Keeping up with v2 Jin's means Danzo is never landing a mutual strike. It's a huge feat, stop trying to downplay it. And again, there will be no elemental advantage when Kakashi uses Rasengan after noticing all of Danzo's jutsu are Futon. Kakashi just hits his rasengan onto the blade and the blade gets smashed and Danzo loses an arm to the explosion of the rasengan (having intel on his cursed seal he won't try to touch Danzo's main body).

 

[BenjerminGaye]

Not going to work as Danzo seen through Mangekyō Sharingan Sasuke's Genjutsu.​

false. Seeing as genjutsu was the reason he lost.

No use either and don't bring up the one against Sasuke as he was in mid air(the same way Gaara could block V2 Ei in mid air or a bloody Kunai thrown by 6-Gate Lee out-speeding 8-Gate Gai in mid-air).​

What? If a kunai is thrown at you instead of weaving seals you block the kunai. Can't do both at the same time. Tbh I don't even understand the situations you brought up. Haku, hanzo, and others made it clear. When 1 hand is occupied making seals is impossible. The only work around is 1 handed seals (only minato, itachi and Haku showe such things) or justu without seals (part of reason why rasengan was created). It's already been shown that it takes time to activate and deactivate izanagi(a time window kakashi can exploit seeing as he exploited windows as small a 5 seconds) and it's already been shown that even kage lvl ninja can be forced not to weave seals or not weave seals quick enough (mei for example on multiple occasions, Itachi on occasion)

An enhanced Fūton: Shinkū Renpa destroys them.​

That jutsu requires seals. My argument shuts that down

I don't completely understand the Hanzo part​

I ment mifune. Sorry.​

 

[EZQ]

If kakashi sends Danzo away with kamui, does danzo respawn on the real dimension or on the pocket dimension?

Kakashi wins. Baku gets decapitated with Kamui and Danzo doesn't have the speed to keep up with Kamui. If Danzo uses the contact seal Kakashi puts himself on a safe place by kamui'ing himself to the other dimension. Then he can take care of the seal, as we saw in part 1, he's good in that category, he sealed sasuke's CM afterall.

Danzo wins too, damn. Danzo has a pretty good chance too. I guess it depends on where does Danzo respawn if he's sent away with kamui

 

[King Of Pop]

i think this is the kind of match that can go either way high dif

 

[EZQ]

Danzo wins this. I changed my mind. Beans is right up there^^