Onoki vs Danzo
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solorflare99
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Onoki stamina won't keep up with Izanagi.
Beans2
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Onoki wins this mid diff. Onoki's war arc stamina feats are quite impressive including matching multiple jintons with Muu off panel. Jinton is not a good attack to employ against an izanagi user so Onoki will use Doton to take out Danzo. First off, Danzo will have to maintain izanagi for the vast majority of the battle due to the constant threat of jinton which would one shot Danzo if he turns off izanagi. Second off, Onoki will be using his rock golem throughout the battle to repeatedly take down Danzo with its punches much like Sasuke who used Susanoo to take him down over and over again. The golem is very fast given its feat against 5 Susanoo clones and Onoki can lighten it to make its movements faster, and make it weighted for extra attack power, and it can also go underground. Baku is not a threat, as Onoki has several ways to counter it a) Anchor himself with weighted rock technique then use Jinton to kill it b) Use mobile core to go underground and escape its suction then take it out with jinton c) use mobile core on the Baku to trap it underground, then fly up aboveit and one shot with Jinton.
solorflare99
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You've must have missed the part of the war where his back went out and he had to be saved. Or the part where after only one fight in which he had help in, he wasn't able to use jinton.
Beans2
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-His back gave out at a crucial moment due to bad luck.
-Onoki was spamming Jinton the whole off panel battle to match Muu's jinton. Of course he needed some time to recover. Then lateron in the same day against Madara, he used Jinton x2, super jinton, rock golem x2, weighted boulder tech x5, mobile core, and who knows how many times he used lightened rock tech to fly.
Rιver
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Onoki does not have the arsenal required to fight off Izanagi properly with no intel; 1) he lacks the sensory to tell whether one is affected by Izanagi 2) he lacks the speed to outspeed Danzos handseals 3) he lacks the stamina to keep shooting Jinton while he has little to no clue when Izanagi is being active. When fighting a man with 11 minutes of immortality and no sensory skills, you have to guess each time you use your jutsu. And to someone as old as Onoki that is crucial.
We also shouldn't forget that Danzo possesses Sharingan and is able to tell his handseals beforehand; giving him the slight edge in handseals and thus he is able to outmaneuver Onokis tactics. We also should factorize his slight edge in speed and Taijutsu. His Fuuton jutsus combined with his summon that can dent Susanoo. His ability to use genjutsu. And lastly, his ability to completely confuse his opponent.
KCN
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If this doesn't end after the first Izanagi spawn blindsiding Onoki, Rock golems are slowly but surely taken down by multiple Vacuum bullets which were large enough to encompass Sasuke's V3 Susano'o entirely height. Onoki will slowly but surely tire allowing Danzo to apply his seal giving him the victory.
Beans2
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True, Onoki won't necessarily know when Danzo is using izanagi but Jinton is not needed to beat Danzo, except for one time to kill Baku.
Having the sharingan doesn't mean Danzo can evade Onoki's attacks.
-Madara didn't predict Onoki shifting the earth below him [
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]-Onoki managed to tag 5 Susanoo clones with his weighted rock jutsu without being struck down [
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]-Rock golem strikes fast enough to snatch up Ay before 5 Susanoo clones landed a hit [
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] and can be formed fast enough to intercept Magatamas [
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] the golem can also be lightened for an even further speed boost.-Onoki doesn't use hand seals for any Doton jutsu except to form the rock Golem or make rock clones, meaning faster jutsu execution speed (generally he just slaps his hand on the ground or the target). He also has clones at his disposal to execute multiple techniques at the same time.
Having better speed and taijutsu doesn't mean much since this battle won't ever reach close combat. The rock golem will smash him each time he tries getting close, plus Onoki can fly away if Danzo comes too close for comfort.
I don't see Danzo's fuuton putting down the rock golem unless it's enhanced by Baku. The golem's durability is on par with Gaara's sand mother [
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] which tanked Joki Boy's explosion without damage. A much weaker golem already tanked
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and Onoki's is
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compared to that one. When Baku begins to use suction, Onoki will use the weighted rock technique to anchor himself and the golem, then cast Jinton to kill the summon. It takes only a few seconds to execute this strategy, but if you say Danzo attacks with his Baku enhanced fuuton in this window of time, well Onoki can first just sink the Baku into the ground with
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to escape its suction range.Onoki is very well adapted to fighting sharingan genjutsu.
-Knows not to look at the sharingan [
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].-Is a long range fighter so the chances of making eye contact from a distance are slimmer.
-Has rock clones on the battlefield to break him out of genjutsu if it does land.
-He wasn't caught in genjutsu once in his fight against Madara and the Susanoo clones and was prepared to break out Ay when he was.
Onoki won't get blindsided by the first izanagi spawn. Danzo can't respawn very far from his point of death as seen against Sasuke. Generally Onoki is not afraid to whip out Jinton from the get go, and knowing Danzo's reputation he will take to the skies and nuke him with jinton at the start. Danzo will respawn somewhere, but he won't respawn in the air next to Onoki due to distance. Besides Onoki has a nice
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when he dodged Muu's attack. After that, he can use
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to widen his field of vision.Vacuum bullets being as big as Susanoo doesn't mean anything since that doesn't mean it's strong enough to destroy the golem, and besides. Even if it eventually is destroyed, Onoki can make another one (he made 2 golems in the Madara fight). I don't see Onoki tiring out in a battle where he won't even be using Jinton.
Look at the bottom panel of this
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. See all those spherical formations cut out of the rock? I count nine of them. We all know that
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are the result of
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which makes a big Jinton sphere. Meaning that off panel, Onoki and Muu matched each other's jintons numerous times. Don't see Onoki getting outlasted in a battle where Jinton (his most taxing technique) will only be used sparingly. Refer to his stamina feats against Madara if that doesn't convince you.Read above bro.
You don't know how izanagi works. Lmao. Danzo is immortal for ten minutes, he doesn't get ten lives. Anyway Jinton is barely needed here.
Apêx1
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Although I agree with many of your points, I don't believe a Baku enhanced Futon is necessary to break the Golem. I disagree with Golem=Sand as the comparison is indirect since it bypassed the sand and ONLY then cracked the rock iirc. So you are overrating the durability if anything, and are relying too much on a jutsu which can be torn apart with Futon's like this one [
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] or this one [
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]. Really no reason for Golem to tank them when it was forcing Susano to actually defend against them.
KCN
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@Beans
Your scan supported my case. Onoki was oblivious to Muu's presence until Gaara shouted "Behind you, Tsuchikage". Onoki's never shown to camp to unreachable distances when performing Jinton agaist grounded opponents; against a stagnant Muu, he used it from about 5 meters max [
I fail to see what Mobile core does. If Onoki blocks his field of vision from Baku's suction using it to raise the ground, he'd have to eventually manoeuvre around it if he wants to use Jinton or to deal with it using Doton (which he needs to be in close range to use, which is suicide considering Baku just sucks him all the way in; it's too powerful). If he uses the core to lower the ground on Baku, again, he'd have to show himself to either A) aim his Jinton or B) hit it with Doton. Considering Baku's suction can be aimed upwards also [
Your scan supported my case. Onoki was oblivious to Muu's presence until Gaara shouted "Behind you, Tsuchikage". Onoki's never shown to camp to unreachable distances when performing Jinton agaist grounded opponents; against a stagnant Muu, he used it from about 5 meters max [
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] despite initially being quite some distance away, which is further supported by his encounter with Sasuke at the summit, whereby he literally flew in his face to execute Jinton [
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]. Onoki only performs Jinton from afar when the enemy has means to guage range like Madara's PS or Deidara's flight. Realistically he should never be too far from Danzo if he uses Jinton the first time, allowing Danzo to spawn behind him. My point regarding vacuum bullets size was due to rock golem being quite a large technique itself, so a sizeable attack is what's needed to bust most of it, and Danzo has just that. A few of those and the golem should get cracked considering only one from bomb from Deidara wrecked it, albeit it was smaller I will say that. Rock clones get taken down simultaneously by this [
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] -- Onoki, or his clones rather who would naturally be weaker, slower and less mobile than he already is won't be able to dodge. I fail to see what Mobile core does. If Onoki blocks his field of vision from Baku's suction using it to raise the ground, he'd have to eventually manoeuvre around it if he wants to use Jinton or to deal with it using Doton (which he needs to be in close range to use, which is suicide considering Baku just sucks him all the way in; it's too powerful). If he uses the core to lower the ground on Baku, again, he'd have to show himself to either A) aim his Jinton or B) hit it with Doton. Considering Baku's suction can be aimed upwards also [
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], Onoki isn't entirely safe. And you must remember Danzo isn't going to be scratching his thread through all this, he'll be relentlessly going after Onoki as well.
Beans2
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The fact that both sand mother and rock golem were both used as a defense hints at them being roughly equal though I agree it's not conclusive evidence since the golem lacks durability feats. If you use logic though solid rock should be more durable than sand and the fact that it's larger makes me think it's more durable than sand mother. Your first scan isn't working. Your second scan shows a fuuton slash getting tanked by V2 Susanoo which doesn't defend itself at all and in fact exposes its ribcage to the attack. Sasuke drops the Susanoo because of MS strain; a few seconds before that Sasuke uses Amaterasu in V2 Susanoo [
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]. What makes you think rock golem is so far below V2 in durability that a fuuton like that would do damage? If you think it is below sand mother in durability that could be true but please explain how durable you think it really is?Onoki was oblivious to Muu's presence because he was invisible. Gaara noticed first because his sensor sand picked up Muu whereas Onoki can't find an invisible opponent. Muu went visible just before attacking...Onoki had full intel on Muu and knew his moveset. Her wouldn't go for a short jinton against someone whose abilities he knew nothing about, he'd test him out at a safe distance first. And don't know where you're getting this five meter stuff from. Both of them where outside the massive
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meaning they fired their jintons at a much further distance. I'm seeing no reason why Onoki would be oneshotted by an izanagi respawn blitz in midair, at a distance, especially since we don't know the degree to which Danzo can control his respawn position.That's not evidence for fuuton doing real damage to the golem. V2 Susanoo tanked it. The size part is irrelevant since the golem is much
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than any of Sasuke's Susanoo, and fuuton stands no chance at pressuring it since it's much bigger and can be made much heavier. We don't know if Deidara's bomb was C1 or C2. It didn't tank, but the golem took the attack leaving the two of them unharmed, and that tiny golem (infused with Akatsuchi's much weaker chakra) is way smaller than Onoki's.Sasuke dodged six wind bullets with his back to them at a close range. At a distance the clones can outright evade, nor will they necessarily be grouped up together.
Baku's suction is nullified by Onoki anchoring himself down with weighted rock technique so it isn't a threat to him. Mobile core is useful in moving Baku below the battlefield removing the suction completely before Onoki fires Jinton at Baku straight through the rock (he can't see him but he has the general idea where that large animal summon is) so Jinton hits. Golem with a rock clone manipulating its weight can fend off Danzo while Onoki uses kills the Baku.
