War arc Kakashi vs Itachi

[Forbidden Technique]

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It wasn't until this point (a real indication that genjutsu has been initiated) that Sasuke started getting wrecked and mentally abused. Sasuke's 3T can't see through Tsukiyomi's illusions, and before that point in the panel above Sasuke was contesting Itachi, which shouldn't be happening within Tsukiyomi (as seen when it was actually casted). Again, Sasuke could of simply desummoned that giant shuriken to reuse. It's not like we ever got a clear shot of it's location anyways.

If Itachi was ever going to land Tsukiyomi prior to the point above, then it would of been

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, and not in the middle of a shootout when their eyes are in motion and focused on matching each others shurikens.

Lastly, the databook essentially say's genjutsu aside, Itachi was skilled with ninjutsu as well (Karasu Bunshin) pointing to the same picture. Thus, it couldn't of been genjutsu.

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[BenjerminGaye]

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It wasn't until this point (a real indication that genjutsu has been initiated) that Sasuke started getting wrecked and mentally abused. Sasuke's 3T can't see through Tsukiyomi's illusions, and before that point in the panel above Sasuke was contesting Itachi, which shouldn't be happening within Tsukiyomi (as seen when it was actually casted). Again, Sasuke could of simply desummoned that giant shuriken to reuse. It's not like we ever got a clear shot of it's location anyways.

If Itachi was ever going to land Tsukiyomi prior to the point above, then it would of been

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, and not in the middle of a shootout when their eyes are in motion and focused on matching each others shurikens.

Lastly, the databook essentially say's genjutsu aside, Itachi was skilled with ninjutsu as well (Karasu Bunshin) pointing to the same picture. Thus, it couldn't of been genjutsu.

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Again. Read the analysis. If it wasn't genjutsu the fuma shuriken would be on the floor.
Itachi has caught ppl in genjutsu/tsukuyomi using less than that so there's no reason for him to get that close for the technique.

Sasuke was contesting with itachi all throughout it. Yet was failing to see him make clones, failing in taijutsu, etc. That happened twice thus far in this very fight. The first time being the 3t genjutsu at the beginning.
Tool summoning isn't blood contract so there's no desummon/resummon. You store them in a scroll to use later, and sasuke never got the chance to store it back it the scroll.

DB lies as per usual.

 

[EZQ]

It remains a subject of speculation where Itachi knows about Kamui. Regardless, Itachi can notice the chakra build-up in his eye and utilise a Kage Bunshin feint which will go unnoticed to even the Sharingan.

This is ridiculouss. Sense the chakra build up? Kakashi activated kamui faster than two susano arrows, that gives itachi almost no time to do anything. And a clone feint takes too much time since Kamui worked even faster than sumoning jutsu on the gedo mazo's arm. (And the clones both get warped anyways)

OT:

Kamui is faster than Amaterasu

Susano gets warped (all of it, the gedo mazo's arm is bigger than susano)

Tsukuyomi wouldn't work since Kakashi has knowledge on it and has MS.

Itachi can't win this match.

 

[Imperious]

Kakashi can deal with Itachi's elemental jutsu. Kakashi has Suiton to deal with Itachi's Katons and with their being a water source around Kakashi can do his larger scale Suiton. Although Itachi can just copy Kakashi Suiton and use it to cancel Kakashi's Suiton if Kakashi uses them for offensive. Kakashi also as Dotons such as Moguragakure and Doryūheki to try and help block/dodge Itachi's Suiton if they weren't fighting on the water.

Kakashi already knows about Tsukuyomi and had a little bout without looking into Itachi's eyes so Kakashi likely won't fall for any genjutsu that Itachi throws at him and with a Sharingan Kakashi could likely break out of any bar Tsukuyomi which he likely won't fall for. Although with Itachi's speed and cunningness he can set up for a good attack or can land a blow on Kakashi depending on how fast Kakashi can get out of the genjutsu as well as the distance the two have between each other. Kakashi has already avoided one of Itachi's clone feints(by using a clone feint himself) as well as react quickly against an exploding clone from Itachi. Kakashi on the otherhand has successfully feinted Itachi(although he was only a 30 percent clone). With Kakashi's increase in speed overtime and him only getting tactically better and already dealing with Itachi's moves, Kakashi can handle base Itachi while in base for the most part and this isn't even mentioning the rest of base Kakashi's arsenal which could help him take out Itachi.

Now comes the part where it becomes a toss up. MS vs MS. Kakashi can deal with one of Itachi's MS jutsu aka Tsukuyomi but Ama on the other hand which as far as we know he doesn't have any knowledge about besides what it looks like, upon which would be possible for Kakashi to get hit on the first time around. Sure Kakashi can counter it by going underground or putting up a Doryūheki or using smoke bombs to block Itachi's sight to avoid being hit or something but without knowledge of Ama''s process, I doubt Kakashi would randomly do such. On the flip side Itachi(as far as we know) has no knowledge that Kakashi has Kamui. Itachi hasn't shown the speed to be able to not get hit by it which likely could hit Itachi and be a damaging blow be it taking out a body part like he did against Deidara or be it using Kamui to warp up Itachi entirely like he did Naruto. So it comes down to who hits who first with their MS jutsu.

Next comes the Susanoo, assuming Itachi brings it out before he dies that is. Kakashi has no Ninjutsu that can get past the Yata Mirror nor any jutsu strong enough to break through it or Susanoo itself. Likewise Susanoo isn't something Itachi can keep up for long periods of time due to the drain he feels. Itachi was able to quickly cut off alot of Orochi's snake heads and his sword has good reach so Itachi can slice up Kakashi or seal him if Kakashi is pierced. Itachi has Yasaka no Magatama for some range attacking but Kakashi could likely dodge it. And while Itachi can do all of this with his Susanoo, he may not be able to successfully do so in a fight depending on his chakra levels.

I feel that this is a 50/50 shot here. Kakashi and Itachi take each other out in one hit before Susanoo is brought out. Itachi would seem to have the advantage when full Susanoo comes into play but Kakashi might be able to outlast Itachi. Either way its a 50/50 shot here. Kakashi has gotten very stronger and on the same level as Itachi in the general area in my opinion. Although depending on how Kakashi uses Kamui he could take out Itachi quite early in the fight as well as depending on how Itachi uses Ama he could take out Kakashi quite early in the fight.

 

[Eng nawashi]

If Itachi had really casted the genjutsu when he appeared in front of Sasuke, sasuke shouldnt have been still out of the spread shrukien area after the genjutsu was broken

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while He was above the spread shrukien area when they physically clashed

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which proves that everything happened after the shrukien clash was actually in the genjutsu . It is impossible for someone to actually make hand signs without sharingan can even notice. That is why Sasuke got suspicious. Itachi can create clones without even hand signs but only in genjutsu and it was shown again when a clone of itachi appeared behind Sasuke in tuski to restrain him

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. Sasuke did something similar in the beginning when he stabbed Itachi from behind in genjutsu while the real Sasuke appeared, in genjutsu, to be a snake clone

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. Your logic doesnt make sense either because itachi that appears in the DB scan wasn't even the clone. So i amnot sure how that translates to DB hyping his use of bunshins .also if itachi had really casted the genjutsu when he appeared in front of Sasuke, they should have been still in the same position

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after the genjutsu was broken but that wasnt the case.

 

[BenjerminGaye]

revived this old thired. But I made a post recently saying the same thing youre saying^ and i also said it wayy back when in this very thread.

 

[Eng nawashi]

revived this old thired. But I made a post recently saying the same thing youre saying^ and i also said it wayy back when in this very thread.

But you didnt use Sasuke's position relative to the shrukiens spread on the ground before and after the genjutsu.this should actually end any argument here. Also the fact that if itachi had really casted genjutsu when he appeared infront of sasuke, they should have been still in the same position after the genjutsu was broken. You rather used the fuma shrukien argument which someone may go around by saying it was desummoned or stuff like this But you did well.

 

[Forbidden Technique]

If Itachi had really casted the genjutsu when he appeared in front of Sasuke, sasuke shouldnt have been still out of the spread shrukien area after the genjutsu was broken

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while He was above the spread shrukien area when they physically clashed

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which proves that everything happened after the shrukien clash was actually in the genjutsu . It is impossible for someone to actually make hand signs without sharingan can even notice. That is why Sasuke got suspicious. Itachi can create clones without even hand signs but only in genjutsu and it was shown again when a clone of itachi appeared behind Sasuke in tuski to restrain him

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. Sasuke did something similar in the beginning when he stabbed Itachi from behind in genjutsu while the real Sasuke appeared, in genjutsu, to be a snake clone

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. Your logic doesnt make sense either because itachi that appears in the DB scan wasn't even the clone. So i amnot sure how that translates to DB hyping his use of bunshins .also if itachi had really casted the genjutsu when he appeared in front of Sasuke, they should have been still in the same position

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after the genjutsu was broken but that wasnt the case.

Yuck, did you quote me with this? Post is inaccurate, but you can debate that with someone else.

 

[Eng nawashi]

Yuck, did you quote me with this? Post is inaccurate, but you can debate that with someone else.

Yeah i quoted you with this but i deleted it to avoid long debates. And i think it is completely accurate lmfao.

 

[BenjerminGaye]

But you didnt use Sasuke's position relative to the shrukiens spread on the ground before and after the genjutsu.this should actually end any argument here. Also the fact that if itachi had really casted genjutsu when he appeared infront of sasuke, they should have been still in the same position after the genjutsu was broken. You rather used the fuma shrukien argument which someone may go around by saying it was desummoned or stuff like this But you did well.

in my later comment i did. But i forget with thread it was.

 

[Eng nawashi]

in my later comment i did. But i forget with thread it was.

My bad i thought i were the first to use this argument .

 

[Amenotejikara]

Kakashi wins this. He is slightly better in base stats and Kamui is more haxx than Itachi's MS techniques

his base stats don't even rival sick itachi.

 

[BenjerminGaye]

his base stats don't even rival sick itachi.

get the **** out your mouth sick itachi can't even dodge shuriken.

 

[Amenotejikara]

get the **** out your mouth sick itachi can't even dodge shuriken.

I like how this retard just ignores the shuriken was rigged which only occurred due to itachi's blurred vision.

 

[BenjerminGaye]

I like how this retard just ignores the shuriken was rigged which only occurred due to itachi's blurred vision.

calls me a retard but still making shit up years after the manga ended.

 

[Amenotejikara]

calls me a retard but still making shit up years after the manga ended.

So no counter? I didn't think so.

 

[BenjerminGaye]

Gargle gargle gargle I'm slurping on d!ck

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[Amenotejikara]

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Let's first post the actual translation. Zetsu has no idea whether it's by sharingan or illness. Secondly you'd have to be pretty retarded to think his illness slows itachi down, the logical reason is that his bad vision improperly made itachi unable to fluently move like he should. that's the point of precognition, to enable one to fight more focused, which is enhances furthered with EMS via straight tomoe. Then again I can't really expect much from a guy who thinks itachi could lose to kakuzu.

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[BenjerminGaye]

Let's first post the actual translation. Zetsu has no idea whether it's by sharingan or illness.

he said that in reply to white zetsu's suggestion.

Secondly you'd have to be pretty retarded to think his illness slows itachi down, the logical reason his vision improperly made itachi move to fluently like he should.

We've seen sharingan overuse in multiple cases none of which resulted in slower movement, bar kakashi who is a special case.

that's the point of precognition, to enable one to fight more focused, which is enhances furthered with EMS.

irrelevant to the point.

Then again I can't really expect from a guy who thinks itachi could lose to kakuzu.

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quote me where i said the bold.


at least you swallow.

 

[Amenotejikara]

he said that in reply to white zetsu's suggestion.

rrelevant to the point.

We've seen sharingan overuse in multiple cases none of which resulted in slower movement, bar kakashi who is a special case. irrelevant to the point.
quote me where i said the bold.

if sharingan deteriorates then so do the effectiveness of the users movement. That doesn't mean the user is slower, it means they wouldn't be able to be more precise with their movement and jutsu. that's what zetsu (in the actual translation) said itachi movement was strange. I brought up ems because it shows that the sharingan dictate how well the user moves.

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Only thing the illness contributed was stamina drop