What makes some people so sure their beliefs are true and real?

King Kendrick

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Some of them assume they are better than other people because of their beliefs and call people stupid just because that person belief is different. Now I'm not saying there aren't silly people in these beliefs but to call everyone in certain beliefs stupid is pretty immature and low. Some people assumed that I was doing that on this post but I wasn't and someone was telling me I was stupid because I didn't fear stuff like hell.

I mean it is kinda dumb , In Christianity, hell is the place where unrepentant sinners go after this life. The Bible describes hell as eternal (Jude 7, 12-13) and punitive (e.g. Matt. 23:32, 2 Pet. 2:4). Hell is further described as a place of fire (e.g. Matt. 25:41), although there isn't consensus among Christians as to whether that imagery is intended to be literal or figurative. According to Jesus Christ, hell was originally intended for the Satan and demons (cf. Matt. 25:41). So i mean maybe now you believe so but if you went to a dark place with creepy ass demons and fire forever you would most likely be scared .
 

Madarauchiwa

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Some of them assume they are better than other people because of their beliefs and call people stupid just because that person belief is different. Now I'm not saying there aren't silly people in these beliefs but to call everyone in certain beliefs stupid is pretty immature and low. Some people assumed that I was doing that on this post but I wasn't and someone was telling me I was stupid because I didn't fear stuff like hell.

the people who cant back up their claims and dive straight into insults when you try to explain your own views are the ones not worth talking to because they truly are stupid or ignorant whatever you wanna call them. you asked a good question and i didn't think you were attacking any belief in your post
 

Madarauchiwa

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I mean it is kinda dumb , In Christianity, hell is the place where unrepentant sinners go after this life. The Bible describes hell as eternal (Jude 7, 12-13) and punitive (e.g. Matt. 23:32, 2 Pet. 2:4). Hell is further described as a place of fire (e.g. Matt. 25:41), although there isn't consensus among Christians as to whether that imagery is intended to be literal or figurative. According to Jesus Christ, hell was originally intended for the Satan and demons (cf. Matt. 25:41). So i mean maybe now you believe so but if you went to a dark place with creepy ass demons and fire forever you would most likely be scared .

hey man quick question as i noticed you had no other post in this thread so I'm not quite sure if your siding with christianity. but are you calling him dumb for not believing in hell?

EDIT: how funny right after posting this i notice your post at the bottom of page 2
 

Babadook

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Beliefs are not necessarily related to religions, though...People used to believe the Sun goes round the Earth. Why? Because it was plain obvious. The Sun does rise every morning, and sets every evening. How can any sane person deny that the Sun is moving? Then it turns out they were wrong. Why were they so sure that they are right? Out of fear? Out of bigotry? No, they just simply trusted their eyes and the scholars who reasoned for it. But it turned out to be a mere belief. A false one.

But it is highly subjective what you accept as evidence. The Earth is billions of yrs old, it is confirmed by carbon dating, geography, etc. How can anyone deny it? Well, certain creationists simply doubt the reliability of such methods. It is not a sufficient evidence for them. But they are convinced that the Bible is reliable. That is more than enough for them.

So, what you may refuse in an instant, as it holds no evidence for you, may be enough for someone else. If a random stranger tells you that the universe has always existed: you may say 'are you crazy? There was the Big Bang'. Then the person turns out to be a renowned scientists who has just proposed a mathematical model which says there was no BB and the universe has always been.

Let's say another random stranger tells you that your house is burning. Would you believe him/her? Maybe yes, maybe not, but you'd still be concerned. What if it's actually true? Now someone may say this is just a fear motivator...

But let's take another example. I say I'm European. Do you believe me? Why? Why not? At the end of the day, it's a choice. You either choose to believe in smtg or not. If you say you can't know, then you chose to believe you can't know.

But ridiculing others is stupid. The Quran says:

"And do not insult those they invoke other than Allah , lest they insult Allah in enmity without knowledge. Thus We have made pleasing to every community their deeds. Then to their Lord is their return, and He will inform them about what they used to do." /6:108/

But everyone believes in something. Remember that belief is a choice. A choice based on a level of certainty.

Official definitions may differ a bit:



: a feeling of being sure that someone or something exists or that something is true

: a feeling that something is good, right, or valuable

But in the end, even if someone says that there is nothing but this life and there is no purpose in this life: that's still a choice, and to make such a statement also requires a level of certainty to say that there is nothing more but what you see. But then, the person still holds life valuable, otherwise he/she could just suicide. (See Camus). Look at the above definition: 'a feeling that smtg is valuable'. So, we all believe in smtg. And we follow what we believe. Or else, there is not much point in believing. You choose to follow a path coz you think/feel it's good for you. If you say that you can't just be sure about anything: then you don't feel that something is not ok with your current lifestyle? And if you're fine with it, then you believe that you do what's best for you. A few decades later it may turn out that you are not satisfied with your achievements: but you can't be sure in advance.

Now the belief in God is called faith. If you don't believe in God or the afterlife, basically you are the judge of your own life. On your death bed, you'll evaluate yourself, and you'll die with some regrets, sure, as well as with some good memories. You'll decide if your life was worthy or not.

I think there is a common misconception about this afterlife thing. I can only speak for myself, but to me it's not just a question of hell or heaven...It is a question of responsibility. Did I live a life for which I can take the responsibility even in front of an almighty Creator? Therefore, it is also an irrelevant question to me, if I can be sure. If I was wrong about something- I'll be informed about it.

" In the end you will be brought back to the All-Knower of the unseen and the seen, then He will inform you of what you used to do." /9:94/

"Had Allah willed, He would have made you one nation , but He intended to test you in what He has given you; so race to all that is good. To Allah is your return all together, and He will inform you concerning that over which you used to differ." /5:48/

(((Now, inbefore some mockers appear and say that I'm just weak to evaluate myself: no, that's not what I said, I evaluate myself all the time, I just don't think humans should bestow an eternal judgment upon themselves and others: which is pretty much what happens if you don't believe in God. Now some may ask, why would there be an eternal judge? That's still an irrelevant question to me. The question is am I willing to take responsibility for my deeds knowing that it may get me to eternal hell, or not? Am I living a life worthy of eternal bliss? Now someone may keep asking: ' so what, you can't be sure if you are worthy or not, when you die'. And I never said I can be sure about that. I don't know if I'm going to hell or heaven. But I'm sure that I will get what I've eraned.

"Then every soul will be compensated for what it earned, and they will not be treated unjustly." /2:281/

Now if someone says: "It is not fair to be judged as you can't choose from all the hundreds of gods."

Then my answer is as I've already said. Live the life for which you could take responsibility even in front of an Almighty Judge. You can't? That's your problem. Then live the life you think is best for you, and don't worry about afterlife. But then, everyone is concerned about how people will remember them. Even those who say 'I don't give a fck about what others think', will be more concerned if they'll have kids who will have to take care of the graves of the deceased. "I want to be incinerated."- Ok, just make sure your offsprings respect you enough to incinerate you and not bury you in a mass grave. "I won't have kids. I don't want anyone to remember me." Then have a nice time dying alone, and make sure not to regret it. But no human can guarantee for himself/herself that he/she won't have any regrets at the end of their lives.

Now if someone asks: 'How can you be sure that you won't have regrets, then?' That is again a pointless question. I may have regrets of course, but I'll definitely won't regret having faith in God. That faith will die with me- other than this faith, you can take nothing else in the grave with yourself. "Oh but I take good memories with me". Yeah but you know that you won't have memories, or feelings once your brain stops. "But if your brain stops, your won't feel faith either". True, but this faith is the only thing that can avail me in the grave. Some nice memories can't.

A belief/faith is kind of a hope. You hope that the path you chose will turn out good for you. For a non-believer, the best hope is to have a good job, kids, family etc, money, fame, and to die in the bed, with family around. And this person of course also has some kind f hope that there is no hell. Now I also hope to have a comfortable life and to achieve certain goals: but I'm fine with whatever happens, as long as I keep my faith. That is because I have a hope that goes beyond this life. Some may say: "Oh so you're just afraid your life would end." Again: no, I know my life will end. I'm only afraid that I'd feel ashamed if I had to stand before God. If He'd ask: 'why didn't you believe? Why didn't you want to take responsibility ?' It will be an enlightening and terrifying moment at the same time, for many people. The answer will be: silence. Of course noone is perfect and who knows, -at least I don't- , who'll get what reward or punishment- but I for one hope that I live a life that pleases not only myself and others, but God as well. I can also only hope that my path is the best- not only here but also for an afterlife.

Still more questions: 'Oh so you just don't want your life to end, coz humans don't want their beloved things taken away so they invented afterlife.' That is not what I said, either. I'm aware I'll lose everything here- and it's fine with me. I didn't say I believe in God coz I want to get back this life. The belief in God doesn't necessarily mean anyway that there is an afterlife. These are two separate beliefs though connected. But let's say, you die, then you are judged: and then you go back to your eternal sleep. Now someone may ask: 'So you just want a confirmation, a pat on your shoulder by Big Daddy?' Well, why wouldn't I want? But that's not the main reason here. I believe in God and the afterlife for a bunch of interrelated reasons. The question was how can one be sure that his/her belief is correct? Well, if you are not sure: why are you following it? Now one may ask: 'But how can you know you won't change, either?' I may change. I never said I wouldn't. But I follow my path exactly because I believe in God and I think He knows things better than any human. I believe He led me to faith: and who knows, I may stray. But even then, I'd have to take responsibility. If someone doesn't want to take responsibility, (be it phrased "I don't think I have to take responsibility before a god as I don't believe in any"), well, that belief is not worth much, imo. It sounds like: 'I don't believe in responsibility.' But even for that, you'll h a v e to take some kind of responsibility. Deeds have consequences. Being in denial of it is useless.

If someone says after all this: 'I don't believe in afterlife, or god, but I think I'm a good person and I'd take responsibility in front of God'- Well, fine. All there is left is to see who's right u.u)))

End of QA section xD I hope I made sense. But I know that for a non-believer, it might not. But I guess we can all agree that while we can't be sure how life will turn out, if we'll change, how we'll die: we have to take responsibility before ourselves, at least. But as I said, I'm taking this concept further.

I can't be sure about many things, but that's not important. That is not the question to me. Now saomeone may still argue: "But you don't need God, you can die with a clear conscience even without the belief in afterlife." Uhm, maybe? Dunno, I never died. Neither the people who make that statement. I for one don't think I could die with a clear conscience if I didn't believe in God. And again, I take the responsibility before God.

Now this someone may desperately cling to the last possible refutal: "I don't believe in god but even if he existed, I wouldn't care, he can send me to hell, he's just a bully." Fine, you'll get what you asked for, so noone will suffer any injustice, everyone can be happy, right?

Also, a non-believer won't understand a believer, coz a non-believer is still looking for evidence, while a believer already has the evidence he/she asked for. Who knows? Someone might have asked god to win the lottery and he/she did win, so she/he became a believer. Someone may have been praying in all his/her life and never got what he/she asked for, but is still beliving because he/she trusts God, and has other proofs. For a believer, most things increase his/her faith, even things that a non-believer would perceive in an opposite way.

A non-believer may ask for evidence, but to a believer, everything is an evidence. (Well, almost everything). A believer has faith that everything happens out of God's will and He knows best. A non-believer will argue why would God care about what happens here, or why would He allow kids to die...

So, you either think that humans know better than an Almighty Creator would know, and humans have better moral values than the One who created them- or you believe that there are things we can't know/ perceive.

Just my 2 cents.
 
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Aim64C

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I mean it is kinda dumb , In Christianity, hell is the place where unrepentant sinners go after this life. The Bible describes hell as eternal (Jude 7, 12-13) and punitive (e.g. Matt. 23:32, 2 Pet. 2:4). Hell is further described as a place of fire (e.g. Matt. 25:41), although there isn't consensus among Christians as to whether that imagery is intended to be literal or figurative. According to Jesus Christ, hell was originally intended for the Satan and demons (cf. Matt. 25:41). So i mean maybe now you believe so but if you went to a dark place with creepy ass demons and fire forever you would most likely be scared .

Jewish concepts of hell are somewhat different than Christian concepts of hell. In many cases, the Jews simply refer to a state of spiritual suffering.

Though there are other concepts that aren't exactly translated to every Christian belief. The Jews, for example, believe that everyone is dead. When you die - you are 'dead' - or in a sort of state spiritual hibernation/stasis. The 'after life' does not begin until the Messiah comes.

This is what is meant during John 8 -

The statement at the end: "Before Moses was" is a commonly misapplied translation. It's "Before Moses is" or "before Moses will, I am the one." This is directly following a discussion of death and the afterlife.

This concept, while translated early on within Christian theology into a belief in an active afterlife - has not been actually preserved within a theological concept. Therefor, people often misunderstand and say that Jesus was claiming to be "I Am" (God) - by using the phrase "ego emi" - which is a common phrase within greek to respond to an address. Many will point to the fact that the pharisee picked up stones to throw at Jesus - but he also just sat there and called them followers of the devil (which they interpreted to mean that he believed they were the spawn of fornication) and other such things. Claiming himself to be the one who would make it possible for Moses to return to life (which is claiming himself to be the messiah) was just the last straw in a string of insults.

Anyway - the point is that the Jews had a considerably different view of the afterlife than Christians - so reading Christian theological concepts into the Bible is going to generate interpretations that were not likely intended at the time, simply because even the New Testament was written within the context of Jewish reform, prior to the complete development of what would become the platform for mainstream Christian theology.

That all said - it's my interpretation that Hell is actually self-imposed. Hell is suffering and isolation borne by people who are capable of remorse.

There is, within Jewish context, what is called "eternal damnation." This is not hell within the context of suffering - this is the enemies of God - those who have aligned themselves against God willingly. They are not being deceived, but have placed their own person as being greater than the universe (or God - I'm giving you a summary of inferences, so there's some room for interpretation, obviously). One could call them servants of the devil, or simply allies in his ideology (once one understands this ideology, it is obvious why they can never be truly allied).

Contrary to popular belief, these 'demons' are not bent on suffering and destruction. They don't relish in bloodletting or act like stereotypical evil - or even outwardly selfish characters.

The evil is in the belief that one always knows better. It is the belief that he/she knows enough to create a perfect world - or, perhaps, is the arrogance to believe that they have the capacity to envision a world that is perfect. It is the implicit assumption that the universe they live within is flawed and that their intellect can pave the way to its perfection.

You just have to do what they say and conform to that same ideology. Because, you see, if the attempt to create a perfect world fails - it's your fault for not being sincere-enough about it.

This is why the ideology of the devil ultimately leads to destruction, and why it has been assigned an unforgivable status.

But, I've deviated considerably from the topic.
 

Karna

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*I am not talking about everyone from these groups and I'm not saying everyone should be like me and I'm not making fun of people beliefs**I met all types of people from christians,atheist, ect. that just assume that they are right about something existing or not existing. For example I might see a christian person saying an atheist is going to hell for not believing in yahweh but the christian swears up and down that other religions are a lie or an atheist may say a Christians are stupid for thinking yahweh is real because the atheist feels that it is fake.At the end of the day we really don't know and some people are just going off assumptions.Like if someone if talking to me about this stuff I ask them how are they so certain that they are correct.I often hear"Because*insert belief* is stupid and that is why I'm correct" or"Because the bible say*insert something from the bible". I even ask some of these people how would they feel if they are wrong.Some still say they are right and others say they aren't sure.I really don't like to categorize myself as anything but if I had to categorize myself I would say I'm pan-agnostic( belief that all thing could or could not be god(s)...). I often get told stupid thinks like:
"You're atheist"
"You're scared and confused"
"You're pantheist"
"You're going to hell"
Like if I was atheist I wouldn't believe in the possibility of deities possible being real or not. I have nothing to be afraid or confused of and pantheist is the belief that everything is god.If hell is real than whatever I'm not afraid<I told someone that and they though I worshiped satan...
Have you met people who automatically think their belief is the right one?



As far as 'what makes them be sure of it' is concerned, it's their ego it originates from people giving in to whatever makes them feel good about themselves-right or wrong(they are cowards), so if believing in god makes them secure or mocking the notion of god makes them feel superior/smarter-hence stroking their ego-making them feel secure, then that's what they do. But even they(atheists/believers) are not absolutely sure about it themselves which is why they need your(people's) approval to confirm/be secure with their belief. And that's when you have people like you described in your OP. Just insecure people, nothing more.

Have I ever encountered one? Countless, these creatures are everywhere, not like society is running low on stupid folks.
 

Callypigia

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You will probably not get a truthful answer from most people. For many people it's fear; fear of death, fear that there is nothing after this life. The need to believe there is some justification for the bad things that happen, and a place that people are rewarded/punished for their actions obscures the facts. It is a security blanket. This may be a lower level of spiritual development, but it's true for many.

It is also a way to alleviate cognitive stress and decision making. If a god has a pre-determined plan for you and the world, why question the world? Why change or analyze your actions and choices? I know some people who use religion as a way to improve upon themselves, and that's good, but most of them believe that it is the "goodness of god" that instills the power to change. When one believes another entity has some spiritual power over them it creates a paradoxical sense of helplessness and empowerment.

The reason people adamantly argue back and forth is because of cognitive dissonance. When one places their entire life into a religious or atheist parameter they have to defend their beliefs or begin to feel the anxiety of cognitive dissonance; questioning how they've lived their life thus far, questioning the beliefs they have held on to blindly. The way cognitive dissonance is relieved is by telling yourself that you are correct without question, or changing your belief structure. The latter is difficult.

There are different development stages of religious and spiritual development (check Fowler's stages of religious development; they coincide with Kohlberg's stages of moral development). All in all people find their own path and own truths. They have trouble letting go of that path because they have invested so much into it. For many (whether atheist or religious) it defines who they are. It's more work to redefine our beliefs and our identity than to continue believing what we've come to find comfort in.
 
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