Actual thread discussing Orochimaru's abilities

Ghost in the Shell

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Nice thread! He got trolled in the War Arc, even Karin had better feats in the War Arc compared to him.
I know man, smh... Kishi failed big time with him during the War Arc. Him switching from the role of a villain to anti hero to follow "Sasuke's different path" was extremely lame. I was also hoping that we'd see him use the Hydra again to get a better idea of its capabilities.
 

Icelerate

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I know man, smh... Kishi failed big time with him during the War Arc. Him switching from the role of a villain to anti hero to follow "Sasuke's different path" was extremely lame. I was also hoping that we'd see him use the Hydra again to get a better idea of its capabilities.
Hydra Vs Spiral Zetsu's Chibi ShinsuSenju would have been fun to see. EliteKakashi suggested it to be a good idea but Kishi decided to make Oro a spectator instead of an active participant.
 
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Ghost in the Shell

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Hiddensound's alt confirmed

Nice thread +rep
Oro was one of the most awesome char until he got revived
Lol nah, though Orochimaru is one of the characters I like debating with and exploiting the most + he was one of Kishi's best characters prior to the mess that was the War Arc. Jiraiya is my favorite character.

Hydra Vs Spiral Zetsu's Chibi ShinsuSenju would have been fun to see. EliteKakashi suggested it to be a good idea but Kishi decided to make Oro a spectator instead of an active participant.
Yeah, that would have been awesome. The thing with EK though is that he assumes that the Hydra isn't very powerful due to its lack of feats, which isn't true. The heads' striking speed is fast as we witness it against V4 Susano'o and the whole thing is larger than bijuu sized since it's larger than Manda, who is bijuu sized. Maybe it can burrow underground and swim like other snakes can, since it's still just a snake with 8 heads and I think mythical hydras were depicted to be able to do so.
 

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Yeah, that would have been awesome. The thing with EK though is that he assumes that the Hydra isn't very powerful due to its lack of feats, which isn't true. The heads' striking speed is fast as we witness it against V4 Susano'o and the whole thing is larger than bijuu sized since it's larger than Manda, who is bijuu sized. Maybe it can burrow underground and swim like other snakes can, since it's still just a snake with 8 heads and I think mythical hydras were depicted to be able to do so.
It's a pretty giant creature that can't travel fast unlike nimble shinobi. It also lacks durability feats but it is more durable than Manda considering the databook said so. Can Temari cut Hydra down?
 

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It's a pretty giant creature that can't travel fast unlike nimble shinobi. It also lacks durability feats but it is more durable than Manda considering the databook said so. Can Temari cut Hydra down?
Going off your analysis, War Arc Temari's Kiri Kiri Mae can slice through the snakes. The creature is connected to some central point which restricts their movement but the technique is meant to overpower the opposition with so many "branches" that are long enough to cover a wide range, and can attack/cover from many different directions + Orochimaru can come out from any of the heads and attack with Kusanagi. Maybe he can incorporate the white snake poison as well some how.
 

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Going off your analysis, War Arc Temari's Kiri Kiri Mae can slice through the snakes. The creature is connected to some central point which restricts their movement but the technique is meant to overpower the opposition with so many "branches" that are long enough to cover a wide range, and can attack/cover from many different directions + Orochimaru can come out from any of the heads and attack with Kusanagi. Maybe he can incorporate the white snake poison as well some how.
True but I'm sure that Hydra would kill Temari with one of its eight heads before they get cut down.
 
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EliteKakashi

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Yeah, that would have been awesome. The thing with EK though is that he assumes that the Hydra isn't very powerful due to its lack of feats, which isn't true. The heads' striking speed is fast as we witness it against V4 Susano'o and the whole thing is larger than bijuu sized since it's larger than Manda, who is bijuu sized. Maybe it can burrow underground and swim like other snakes can, since it's still just a snake with 8 heads and I think mythical hydras were depicted to be able to do so.
I didn't assume it wasn't powerful.

I said it didn't show anything.

I don't doubt the kages we were never shown in battle were strong, that doesn't mean they actually did anything to debate with, though.

There's nothing to reference it's striking speed off of, either. You note it hits susanoo, but Itachi wasn't even trying to dodge anything. Susanoo would protect him and so would yata. We weren't shown how fast it can move. We weren't shown any techniques from it other than stuff Orochimaru can do without it.

We can assume it's the strongest technique ever if you want to, but that's not gonna mean anything. As of right now, it's an immobile 8 headed snake/dragon that can bash it's head in to things/bite things and Orochimaru can use kusanagi from.

People say "look past the feats", but there's nothing else to look at. There's not even any hype for what it can do. It has the hype of being Orochimaru's best technique(which is also bullshit cause Edo Tensei >>>>>>> ), but that tells us nothing. Same as we know the 2nd Kazekage used puppets, but we have no idea what his puppets did. For all we know he'd destroy Sasori and Chiyo. Or he's a weakling compared to them.

I didn't write the manga, I can't do anything for it.

Good thread overall, though.
 
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You forgot to mention Oro's five pronged seal .
Disliked your post by accident. I actually thought that seal wasn't really oriented for combat. That's actually pretty useful now that I read the jutsu's description, I might edit the OP and add some things in that I missed including that.

He still lost to Sasuke without MS.
Yeah, an Orochimaru who was on his deathbed and extremely handicapped. Both Sasuke and Suigetsu said that he couldn't have won against a healthy Orochimaru. Don't people know what context is?
 
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EliteKakashi

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Disliked your post by accident. I actually thought that seal wasn't really oriented for combat. That's actually pretty useful now that I read the jutsu's description, I might edit the OP and add some things in that I missed including that.
It's really not considering he has to completely trap his opponent in order to pull it off. And if he does fully trap his opponent, then he should just kill them. I mean in a fight situation where he has to trap/capture an opponent and not kill them, I guess it's useful, but in most vs section fights? It wouldn't have much use given he could just kill the person if he has them in a position where he can place the seal.
 

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He ****ing ran from Jiraiya. Orochimaru is a ***** that Itachi could have killed if we wanted.
Itachi "ran" from Jiraiya after having: Fought with and using tsukuyomi on Kakashi and using tsukuyomi on Sasuke, and was in a battlefield advantageous to Jiraiya, on top of the fact that Itachi was a spy for Konoha and if he had used that amaterasu on Jiraiya instead of the wall, there's nothing standing in between Akatsuki and Naruto.

Even with having used up the chakra he already had and being in the battlefield advantageous to Jiraiya, Kisame noted that Itachi could have won the fight/didn't need to flee.

Orochimaru's one noted weakness in this manga is sharingan genjutsu. Itachi just so happens to have the sharingan. That does not make Orochimaru a fodder anymore than Kisame losing to Gai without putting up much of a fight makes him a fodder. A bad matchup is a bad matchup, plain and simple.

So please. Stop.
 

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I didn't assume it wasn't powerful.

I said it didn't show anything.

I don't doubt the kages we were never shown in battle were strong, that doesn't mean they actually did anything to debate with, though.

There's nothing to reference it's striking speed off of, either. You note it hits susanoo, but Itachi wasn't even trying to dodge anything. Susanoo would protect him and so would yata. We weren't shown how fast it can move. We weren't shown any techniques from it other than stuff Orochimaru can do without it.

We can assume it's the strongest technique ever if you want to, but that's not gonna mean anything. As of right now, it's an immobile 8 headed snake/dragon that can bash it's head in to things/bite things and Orochimaru can use kusanagi from.

People say "look past the feats", but there's nothing else to look at. There's not even any hype for what it can do. It has the hype of being Orochimaru's best technique(which is also bullshit cause Edo Tensei >>>>>>> ), but that tells us nothing. Same as we know the 2nd Kazekage used puppets, but we have no idea what his puppets did. For all we know he'd destroy Sasori and Chiyo. Or he's a weakling compared to them.

I didn't write the manga, I can't do anything for it.

Good thread overall, though.
Itachi blocking the snakes with Yata doesn't really change my point of them having fast striking speed since the heads reached susano'o in just one or two panels from the Hydra's position relative to Itachi and susano'o. Considering that the Hydra is relatively stationary in the sense that it doesn't have much liberty of movement, it also shows that the snakes are very long and cover a wide range, like I already said to Icelerate. Shinobi that don't have Raikage level speed and above would have a hell of a time trying to dodge all eight heads + Orochimaru with Kusanagi, who can all strike from different directions as well. Think of it like a summon on a higher level than Manda or any of the boss toads of Myōbokuzan.

It's really not considering he has to completely trap his opponent in order to pull it off. And if he does fully trap his opponent, then he should just kill them. I mean in a fight situation where he has to trap/capture an opponent and not kill them, I guess it's useful, but in most vs section fights? It wouldn't have much use given he could just kill the person if he has them in a position where he can place the seal.
Doesn't really have to trap his opponent to use it. He can catch them off guard via clone feints, Mayfly, distractions using snake summons, or Hiding like a Mole, and place the seal on them to disturb their chakra flow and render them unable to use techniques effectively. It's just as useful as the temporary curse mark binding and Zetsu spores. It is just a supplementary technique in the end though, nothing that Orochimaru would use as one of his main or go to abilties, so you have a point in that sense. I feel that it'd really shine against the Raikages since it would significantly inhibit their ability to maintain RnY.
 

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Doesn't really have to trap his opponent to use it. He can catch them off guard via clone feints, Mayfly, distractions using snake summons, or Hiding like a Mole, and place the seal on them to disturb their chakra flow and render them unable to use techniques effectively. It's just as useful as the temporary curse mark binding and Zetsu spores. It is just a supplementary technique in the end though, nothing that Orochimaru would use as one of his main or go to abilties, so you have a point in that sense. I feel that it'd really shine against the Raikages since it would significantly inhibit their ability to maintain RnY.
The issue with placing the seal on them, IMO, is he has to hit the stomach, and in order to do that, he has to remove the clothing covering their stomach, do the handsigns, then place the seal. It doesn't sound like much, but in order to get access to the stomach of the victim, he would have to have some way of stunning them or incapacitating them for a short period of time, and again, with that done, killing them makes much more sense.

It's a really effective technique in theory, but it'd be really hard to pull off. And I'm also not sure it'd work on the Raikages with their raiton cloaks on, considering he seems to need to touch the skin.

Although it would possibly be useful if he's fighting something like 4 Tailed Naruto. I'm not sure if it has the ability to undo the transformation or not, though, but it's something to consider.

I think his curse mark binding is probably a better option if he's going to go the route of restricting the enemies chakra/abilities.

But yeah, like you said, it's not exactly something he's going to rely on regardless.
 
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