Actual Kurama or BM avatar

[The Necromancer]

How does it "shit" in durability?

Not durability perse, but a cloak is just chakra, damage can be undone easily, a body can be hurt and destroyed.

 

[KingHashirama]

explain.

In defensive form Hachibi made contact with the 10-tails TBB, without getting destroyed instantly. Something that i suppose would be superior to what Kurama has shown..

no hashirama pounded through ps and the moment it ripped open he used wood golem to grab it. Kurama itself isn't the recipient of the full force of hashirama's ss.

Never said the full-recipient of the full force. The recipient of the full force was a mix of Kurama and the PS itself. But i said, after the PS woreoff, Kurama took punches. Unless Hashirama got some magical sight where he stopped punching the moment ps started wearing off XD.

You can see Kurama's head scratched up little bit.

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that's baseless. Mitigation of losses dosen't equal impossible to tank.
the tails are just as durable as the main body. So ....

No the tails provide a multi-layered defense. And Kurama's tail clashed with Sasuke's PS equally, you are claiming if the blade had gone to the neck of the avatar, Naruto still would've tanked it the same? lol

Anyways I'm not in the mood to get into it with you. Im sure someone else will debate this.

all good =D. But people are comparing Kurama in defensive form to Kurama normally.

Not durability perse, but a cloak is just chakra, damage can be undone easily, a body can be hurt and destroyed.

But it can regenerate, look at Hachibi. The dude easily grows back his tenticles. Kurama's stuff works the same way. Chakra can be depleted and destroyed also, look what happened when Naruto got punched by Obito.

I'm telling you whilst the BM can be upgraded/enhanced with senjutsu, the original body can't. Obviously BM Avatar is stronger. Also the BM Avatar can get wrecked 1000x over and it wouldn't effect actual body as its pure chakra.

This isn't about upgrades mate. this is about as they are. And wasn't Kurama gathering Senjutsu chakra for Naruto? lol.

Pure chakra is stronger?

 

[To Whatever]

The real 100% Kurama would neg diff his Chakra variant.

But BSM Kurama avatar beats 100% Kurama. high-diff.

 

[BenjerminGaye]

In defensive form Hachibi made contact with the 10-tails TBB, without getting destroyed instantly. Something that i suppose would be superior to what Kurama has shown..

He got warped by kakashi, which saved him from the brunt of it.

Never said the full-recipient of the full force. The recipient of the full force was a mix of Kurama and the PS itself. But i said, after the PS woreoff, Kurama took punches. Unless Hashirama got some magical sight where he stopped punching the moment ps started wearing off XD.

Either he stopped pounding or couldn't pound anyone. PS can't put up an offense without kurama and kuramas tbb's can't do jack without the blade. So if hashirama pounded it to the point we're it couldn't fight back it would still have hands remaining.

You can see Kurama's head scratched up little bit.

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true.

No the tails provide a multi-layered defense.

layered defenses is irrelevant b4 juubi lazer. It's burns through like Jinton.

And Kurama's tail clashed with Sasuke's PS equally, you are claiming if the blade had gone to the neck of the avatar, Naruto still would've tanked it the same? lol

Well he should there is nothing leading me to believe the tailed of any bijuu is more durable than the body. Especially when it's in a chakra state.

all good =D. But people are comparing Kurama in defensive form to Kurama normally.

so r u saying 100% kurama would tank it the same way or what?

 

[KingHashirama]

The real 100% Kurama would neg diff his Chakra variant.

But BSM Kurama avatar beats 100% Kurama. high-diff.

eh, I would debate that BSM simply = Full kurama. Seeing that BSM is protrayed to be equal or so to PS.

He got warped by kakashi, which saved him from the brunt of it.

Yes after the laser had started tho. or should i say during the laser.

Either he stopped pounding or couldn't pound anyone. PS can't put up an offense without kurama and kuramas tbb's can't do jack without the blade. So if hashirama pounded it to the point we're it couldn't fight back it would still have hands remaining.

true.

The buddha's entire body wasn't shown, only the top right part of the hands were. So maybe it had hands remaining or no, we'll never know.

layered defenses is irrelevant b4 juubi lazer. It's burns through like Jinton. Well he should there is nothing leading me to believe the tailed of any bijuu is more durable than the body. Especially when it's in a chakra state.

No it didn't, Juubi laser is totally different from jinton, if it was Jinton, Naruto's avatar would've be done for on spot. And the layered defense does matter, Seeing as Hachibi also went into that same form when try to take the Juubi's tbb on. Its a defensive position man. They wouldn't have bothered going into that same position if it would've tanked it the same way with their actual bodies.

so r u saying 100% kurama would tank it the same way or what?

Yea if 100% Kurama was in Defensive form against the laser, it'd tank it also.

 

[HashiraMadara SenjUchiha]

Why are you debating this????

BM shits on Kurama for 1 simple reason PLOT!!!!

 

[Conspirator.]

BM Avatar shits on Kurama. The avatar took the Juubi's laser with the loss of just 6 tails, which is a better durability feat than anything Kurama has shown us. Then there's Naruto matching the combined power of 5 bijuu on his own, and the fact that it was explicitly stated in the manga that Perfect Jins are >>> Bijuu themselves.

 

[Demonic.]

]But it can regenerate, look at Hachibi. The dude easily grows back his tenticles. Kurama's stuff works the same way. Chakra can be depleted and destroyed also, look what happened when Naruto got punched by Obito.

Because Octopus can naturally regrow tentacles. Why didn't it regrow the horn Raikage cut off?

 

[KingHashirama]

Because Octopus can naturally regrow tentacles. Why didn't it regrow the horn Raikage cut off?

who knows. Bad example on my part now that you mention it. However, regeneration is one of Kurama's abilities.

BM Avatar shits on Kurama. The avatar took the Juubi's laser with the loss of just 6 tails, which is a better durability feat than anything Kurama has shown us. Then there's Naruto matching the combined power of 5 bijuu on his own, and the fact that it was explicitly stated in the manga that Perfect Jins are >>> Bijuu themselves.

Sure, just show me the manga scan where it was stated, because i must have missed it.

And Naruto matching the combined power of the 5 bijuu has jack shit to do with Naruto. Kurama already has the power to match theirs.. lol. Naruto doesn't add any power to Kurama, that he already didn't have.

- Regeneration = Kurama's power

- Cloak = Kurama's power

- Sensing evil/good = Kurama's power

- TBB high scales and flash tbb and so on = Kurama's power

There is nothing Naruto added to Kurama, for you to claim he somehow magically got stronger.

 

[Angelic.]

naruto gets those jin powers and with his cloak he shed amaterasu. only juubi can do that (i think )

 

[KingHashirama]

naruto gets those jin powers and with his cloak he shed amaterasu. only juubi can do that (i think )

no pretty much any jinchuriki who can access the chakra from their beasts is capable of doing that.

 

[Bronze]

There is no such thing as avatar. It's Bijuu Mode meaning it's a form manifested from Kurama's Chakra that takes on the form of Kurama, and will have the abilities of Kurama. This makes them equal.

 

[Angelic.]

no pretty much any jinchuriki who can access the chakra from their beasts is capable of doing that.

i meant the bijuu would burn

 

[SkyGodHorus]

So who in your opinion is more durable, powerful?

Many claim Bijuu mode is superior to the beast itself (though i have no clue how this make any sense).

But yea.

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Bijuu mode would be stronger probably since it includes Naruto's chakra as well as senjutsu. However, this doesn't include Yin and Yang Kurama together. We never got to see what Naruto could do with full Kurama.

 

[TrollingSage]

It has already been stated that a perfect jin is stronger than a bijuu because the host is able to focus the bijuu's power more, and no they weren't talking about the juubi.

 

[KidGamer65]

Let's see.

Spoiler

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vs.

Spoiler

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Comparison is flawed. Kurama took a direct hit in there, and but didn't take one against the Juubi, he blocked with his tails, and even then he lost 6 of his tails. Hachibi and Killer B in Bijuu Mode haven't shown to be any stronger or more durable, nor has he shown superior firepower. Kurama? Same. The Bijuu dama he made in Naruto's mind is larger than any Bijuu Dama BM Naruto has made on panel. No feat proves that Kurama isn't as durable as his Avatar version. Same goes for Obito's Jinchuuriki. They didn't show to be any stronger at any point of the manga, whether they were being used by Perfect Jins, or whether they were fighting by themselves.

Kurama Avatar IS Kurama, but formed from chakra, hence why Kurama was extracted when the chains caught and pulled the Avatar away from Naruto. Bijuu Mode is only better overall because:

2 is better than 1.

-The Chakra Avatar is far more versatile.

-The Chakra Avatar is made of chakra, so it doesn't feel pain like the real thing does.

-Jinchuurkis add intelligence to the factor, something Bijuu lose over time according to the Manga, but I won't be surprised if Kishi retconned that.

-Naruto can still use his techniques while in BM unlike other Jinchuuriki.

-BM Naruto is faster than Kurama, and he controls the Avatar, so Kurama will react far faster than it's regular self.

-Naruto can add Senjutsu to the mix.

 

[Amaterasu]

I think I already learnt you a lesson yesterday KH

 

[KingHashirama]

There is no such thing as avatar. It's Bijuu Mode meaning it's a form manifested from Kurama's Chakra that takes on the form of Kurama, and will have the abilities of Kurama. This makes them equal.

Only 50 percent of kurama. Cant make it equal to 100 percent.

Im talking solely about the bm in war arc without senjutsu compared to actual kurama.

 

[KingHashirama]

I think I already learnt you a lesson yesterday KH

What lesson did you teach me? You talked about durability you got proven wrong.

And I already agree the jinchuriko combo makes kurama more verstile. But this has nothing to do with the thread.

 

[BLAZE]

I have my Q
Which is stronger Full Kurama or a jin of Half Kurama with BM