you need the sharingan in order to see your oponent.
it was ok for sasuke not to use the sharingan for those because he was behind sakura and striking an almost dead woman on the floor.
the one against naruto was just him knowing naruto would strike at sasukes chidori with a rasengan.
if sasuke attacked kakashi with it sasuke would have to activate the sharingan or he would die.
Thanks for explaining all that I was about to write all of these. Dude I have been following your posts recently and all of them are logical. A thousand of years of pain isn't it "Sennin Goreshi" the ultimate taijutsu tech Kakashi taught Naruto when they were in the survival training. It rocksxd
I have one thing to say y isnt sasuke out cold right now. He should be out of chakra right now but he is still able to use chidori and other jutsus. How is dat?
Someone beat me to it! Naruto is going to use a cloneb to hit Sauske with a reduced wind release rasenshuriken. Naruto is going to do to Sauske what he did to Kakuzu except he's not trying to kill him. At the time I couldn't understand why there was such a need to explain what Naruto's new Jitsu did to Kakuzu. Now we know. Cutting chakra vessels... Then again I could be wrong and maybe Naruto has some new "FART" Jitsu that will stop sauske. Good thing we only have to wait a couple of days to find out.
I really hope naruto doesn't sever his chakra system like he did with Kazuzu. As much as I don't really like the way Sasuke's character has turned out it would be even worse if he was unable to continue to be a shinobi. I would think that would be a perfect answer for naruto but it is way too early for Sasuke to be injured to the point where he can't do anything as a ninja.
I would predict though in the very last fight between them (If there is a last fight because talk-no-jutsu didn't work) that would be something that would make sense. But at the same time that would be naruto forcing his ideals on Sasuke rather than Sasuke choosing to stop what he is doing. Which it would be really important for Sasuke to make the choice to stop what he is doing it would show that there is some sanity left.
no thats not what he meant, futon rasengan is different from futon rasen shuriken. fuuton rasengan is an ordinary rasengan made from wind chakra. whereas the FRS is the real deal. A rasengan + wind chakra.
you need the sharingan in order to see your oponent.
it was ok for sasuke not to use the sharingan for those because he was behind sakura and striking an almost dead woman on the floor.
the one against naruto was just him knowing naruto would strike at sasukes chidori with a rasengan.
if sasuke attacked kakashi with it sasuke would have to activate the sharingan or he would die.
You argue that Sasuke knew that Naruto would clash with his Rasengan but how can that be confirmed? Is this simply because you say it? Naruto could have done something else for all Sasuke knew. Besides, Sasuke was not that close to Naruto and had the handicap of near blindness yet he was able to use Chidori effectively without Sharingan. Naruto could have zigzagged or have done many other movements? instead of charging straight like what you're trying to stake as a fact. As for Kakashi/Sasuke you're arguing that without Sharingan Sasuke would die against him as a factual statement yet again. Are you Kishi? Sasuke has other things going for him without having Sharingan active. Are you forgetting his Chidori variations and Katon jutsu?
Listen to get a better understanding of this jutsu we need to break it down from the beginning and why high speeds were needed for it, then why the Sharingan came to "complete" it.
First off, Chidori is a piercing move I suppose designed for just that. It was created by a young Kakashi and it incorporated lighting affinity re-composition with spatial re-composition to an extent. When Kakashi was fighting that Iwa Jounin, it was his initial attempt of this jutsu. So he wasn't experienced with the jutsu and didn't know that his level of speed could be readable. After hearing advice from Minato the young Kakashi most likely figured out that he was not physically strong thus made it that much more complex for Chidori to be a lethal jutsu by him just thrusting his arm into the opponent.
So his answer at that time was to increase momentum by accelerating himself and thus increased piercing capabilities. Adding the Sharingan gave him an edge and a more effective way to land this jutsu without giving the opponent the opportunity to dodge. Sasuke?s beginner Chidori was performed by dragging the hand on the floor, ducking down to increase speed, which is why it was flawed. If Kakashi and Sasuke are moving at top speed and thrusting Chidori then yes, Minato's assessment is correct. In other words, if someone were to try and connect Chidori with their opponent from far away they would need excellent reflexes to dodge a counterattack or to counter their dodge.
The better eyesight alone would complete Chidori because now he'd be able to actually see the opponent and being able to "read" attacks means he can "see" them or see them "clearly". However, if they're standing stationary to inflict the jutsu at point blank range or arm's length, then there's really no need for Sharingan which brings up a major point. During the Raikage fight, speed was put into play but during the other times it wasn't really a focus. In Shippuuden, Kakashi/Sasuke were mainly using it as a weapon as they were close to the opponent and practically shoved it into them (hence Chidori is rarely used with speed anymore). I think the main thing that is suppose to be taken away from Minato's statement is that the way Kakashi used it; Sharingan was needed and the way Sasuke firstly used it were dependent on it.
I also came to the conclusion of assuming that Sasuke/Kakashi?s many other Chidori variations don?t need Sharingan as these other jutsu are all long-range where the Sharingan would work well in close combat whether it be jutsu/Taijutsu. Sharingan just completed Chidori to be an all-round jutsu but it is not always necessarily [/U]needed[/U]. Obviously they will have Sharingan active in all of their fights as it is gives the user a beneficial advantage for whatever they do.
Hold on, you are trying to compare your post with a thousand years of death?s post as they were different in points. The post I quoted from you stated this "he has to use chidori along side with Sharingan" in other words, you were saying that Sasuke is unable to use Chidori if Sharingan is not active. Now, a thousand years of death?s post targeted why the Sharingan should be combined with Chidori which I will say that it made a minor point but was poorly done and so with everything stated above should tear down any confusion or misunderstandings about Sharingan and Chidori.
I have one thing to say y isnt sasuke out cold right now. He should be out of chakra right now but he is still able to use chidori and other jutsus. How is dat?
That is a simple concept that people have a hard time fathoming. The chakra that Sasuke sucked out of Karin has obviously held out this long and his willpower. In other words, it was enough for all the times he has used Chidori and his willpower enables him to excel further. This is seen many times throughout the manga. For example take a look below,
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Just imagine Sasuke who does not even have the handicap of a fatal illness, near death situation etc.
I have one thing to say y isnt sasuke out cold right now. He should be out of chakra right now but he is still able to use chidori and other jutsus. How is dat?
Sasuke isn't out of chakra, he just can't use ms because he overused it and he is almost blinded. He is with low chakra but he still got something. The stupidest thing sasuke could do is with is rage being killed by using all of his chakra left.
Hold on, you are trying to compare your post with a thousand years of death?s post as they were different in points. The post I quoted from you stated this "he has to use chidori along side with Sharingan" in other words, you were saying that Sasuke is unable to use Chidori if Sharingan is not active. Now, a thousand years of death?s post targeted why the Sharingan should be combined with Chidori which I will say that it made a minor point but was poorly done and so with everything stated above should tear down any confusion or misunderstandings about Sharingan and Chidori.
It was implied on my thread that chidori was useless without sharingan, i didn't want to say that he couldn't use chidori without sharingan. Sorry if i used the wrong words but that's what i was trying to say. I obviously remember the yellow flash chapter, it was one of my favourites, and i remember kakashi using chidori without sharingan, i could never forget that. But i apologize again for not using propal words.
the fuuton: rasengan was made before the fuuton rasenshuriken, the fuuton rasengan was tested against kakashi's rasengan, and was devoured by it. tbh i dont know why he would use his normal rasengan anymore with the fuuton being alot more powerful without the negative effects of the fuuton rasenshriken he used against kakazu. xd
Guys, I believe you are mistaken about the poisoned kunai. Kakashi said that Sakura should get out as her best offensive skill was making a poisoned kunai and that wouldn't harm Sasuke. He did not say that the kunai she had tried to stab Sasuke with was already poisoned.
In my opinion the next chapter will be a not-so-epic battle, after which Suigetsu and Jugo might arrive and help Sasuke retreat.
My prediction is this is the final scene where everyone gets screwed over except Madara and Sasuke. Currently, Kakashi, Sakura, hardly anyone can take on Madara with that special jutsu of his, plus his own extreme power. Sasuke needs saving, Madara needs him, so ofcourse Madara will appear to take Sasuke to safety. But wait! Madara gets a present! Naruto is suddenly weekend and slowly dieing from the poison that was on the Kunai. Kakashi and Sakura can't do jack against Madara. Madara will just stroll in, grab Naruto and Sasuke, and flee. He then cures Naruto, seeing the fact that he's lived for decades, he must know how to or someone who can cure Naruto. Maybe he won't even bother, just go straight to extracting the kyuubi. GAWD, WHAT HAVE YOU DONE SAKURA?!?! lol epic fail but such a twist to the series! O.O
Guys, I believe you are mistaken about the poisoned kunai. Kakashi said that Sakura should get out as her best offensive skill was making a poisoned kunai and that wouldn't harm Sasuke. He did not say that the kunai she had tried to stab Sasuke with was already poisoned.
In my opinion the next chapter will be a not-so-epic battle, after which Suigetsu and Jugo might arrive and help Sasuke retreat.
i'm sorry but i think that suigetsu and juugo are dead or maybe captures, if not they had appeared before and if they're alive they will be angry with sasuke for not caring about them so they woldn't save him.
My prediction is this is the final scene where everyone gets screwed over except Madara and Sasuke. Currently, Kakashi, Sakura, hardly anyone can take on Madara with that special jutsu of his, plus his own extreme power. Sasuke needs saving, Madara needs him, so ofcourse Madara will appear to take Sasuke to safety. But wait! Madara gets a present! Naruto is suddenly weekend and slowly dieing from the poison that was on the Kunai. Kakashi and Sakura can't do jack against Madara. Madara will just stroll in, grab Naruto and Sasuke, and flee. He then cures Naruto, seeing the fact that he's lived for decades, he must know how to or someone who can cure Naruto. Maybe he won't even bother, just go straight to extracting the kyuubi. GAWD, WHAT HAVE YOU DONE SAKURA?!?! lol epic fail but such a twist to the series! O.O
I don't know if you're beeing sarcastic but naruto has incredible healing power because of kyuuby, he won't die from poison, the kyuuby would eliminate the poison.
Guys about the poison Kunai Kakashi told that Orochimaru would have not been affected so Kakashi and co. still thinks that Sasuke got Oro's powers. But when Sasuke fought Itachi he was free from the curse seal and Oro came out then he was killed. So Sasuke doesn't have Oro's healing powers or the immune system like Oro I may be wrong but I do think that Sasuke doesn't have the powers of the snake or shall I say Orochimaru so if Sasuke got scratch a by that sort of poison Kunai it should at least have some effect.
You argue that Sasuke knew that Naruto would clash with his Rasengan but how can that be confirmed? Is this simply because you say it? Naruto could have done something else for all Sasuke knew. Besides, Sasuke was not that close to Naruto and had the handicap of near blindness yet he was able to use Chidori effectively without Sharingan. Naruto could have zigzagged or have done many other movements? instead of charging straight like what you're trying to stake as a fact. As for Kakashi/Sasuke you're arguing that without Sharingan Sasuke would die against him as a factual statement yet again. Are you Kishi? Sasuke has other things going for him without having Sharingan active. Are you forgetting his Chidori variations and Katon jutsu?
Listen to get a better understanding of this jutsu we need to break it down from the beginning and why high speeds were needed for it, then why the Sharingan came to "complete" it.
First off, Chidori is a piercing move I suppose designed for just that. It was created by a young Kakashi and it incorporated lighting affinity re-composition with spatial re-composition to an extent. When Kakashi was fighting that Iwa Jounin, it was his initial attempt of this jutsu. So he wasn't experienced with the jutsu and didn't know that his level of speed could be readable. After hearing advice from Minato the young Kakashi most likely figured out that he was not physically strong thus made it that much more complex for Chidori to be a lethal jutsu by him just thrusting his arm into the opponent.
So his answer at that time was to increase momentum by accelerating himself and thus increased piercing capabilities. Adding the Sharingan gave him an edge and a more effective way to land this jutsu without giving the opponent the opportunity to dodge. Sasuke?s beginner Chidori was performed by dragging the hand on the floor, ducking down to increase speed, which is why it was flawed. If Kakashi and Sasuke are moving at top speed and thrusting Chidori then yes, Minato's assessment is correct. In other words, if someone were to try and connect Chidori with their opponent from far away they would need excellent reflexes to dodge a counterattack or to counter their dodge.
The better eyesight alone would complete Chidori because now he'd be able to actually see the opponent and being able to "read" attacks means he can "see" them or see them "clearly". However, if they're standing stationary to inflict the jutsu at point blank range or arm's length, then there's really no need for Sharingan which brings up a major point. During the Raikage fight, speed was put into play but during the other times it wasn't really a focus. In Shippuuden, Kakashi/Sasuke were mainly using it as a weapon as they were close to the opponent and practically shoved it into them (hence Chidori is rarely used with speed anymore). I think the main thing that is suppose to be taken away from Minato's statement is that the way Kakashi used it; Sharingan was needed and the way Sasuke firstly used it were dependent on it.
I also came to the conclusion of assuming that Sasuke/Kakashi?s many other Chidori variations don?t need Sharingan as these other jutsu are all long-range where the Sharingan would work well in close combat whether it be jutsu/Taijutsu. Sharingan just completed Chidori to be an all-round jutsu but it is not always necessarily [/U]needed[/U]. Obviously they will have Sharingan active in all of their fights as it is gives the user a beneficial advantage for whatever they do.
First of all Chidori can be done without Sharingan Kakshi did it when he was young. Well you may be right we saw Kakashi using Chidori when he was young and it was his first attempt in real battle and after the 4th said that it was an incomplete tech he may have realized that he have to practice it more to cover its weakness. But luckily for him he got the Sharingan so basically I can say that even Kakashi can use the Chidori effectively without the Sharingan because he have been using it for such a long time same goes for Sasuke. But the others may be right as well. But you said that it was wrong assuming that Naruto will use Rasengan when Sasuke uses Chidori. Well you are wrong. See Sasuke was surprised when Naruto first used Rasengan and at the valley of the end it was Rasengan vs Chidori and Sasuke knows Naruto too well. Sasuke knows rather than using any other techs Naruto will rather go head to head and use Rasengan.
Thanks for explaining all that I was about to write all of these. Dude I have been following your posts recently and all of them are logical. A thousand of years of pain isn't it "Sennin Goreshi" the ultimate taijutsu tech Kakashi taught Naruto when they were in the survival training. It rocksxd
yh it is a thousand years of pain but i prefer the term a thousand years of death. what a jutsu. maybe that is how naruto will beat madara. be a nice twist....not for madara though
the fuuton: rasengan was made before the fuuton rasenshuriken, the fuuton rasengan was tested against kakashi's rasengan, and was devoured by it. tbh i dont know why he would use his normal rasengan anymore with the fuuton being alot more powerful without the negative effects of the fuuton rasenshriken he used against kakazu. xd
fuuton rasengan uses 3 clones to make and he is not as used to it as rasenagan. also maybe he was going to use it against sasuke. i mean he did make 3 clones and changed his plan to use one of them to hold back kakashi.
You argue that Sasuke knew that Naruto would clash with his Rasengan but how can that be confirmed? Is this simply because you say it? Naruto could have done something else for all Sasuke knew. Besides, Sasuke was not that close to Naruto and had the handicap of near blindness yet he was able to use Chidori effectively without Sharingan. Naruto could have zigzagged or have done many other movements’ instead of charging straight like what you're trying to stake as a fact. As for Kakashi/Sasuke you're arguing that without Sharingan Sasuke would die against him as a factual statement yet again. Are you Kishi? Sasuke has other things going for him without having Sharingan active. Are you forgetting his Chidori variations and Katon jutsu?
Listen to get a better understanding of this jutsu we need to break it down from the beginning and why high speeds were needed for it, then why the Sharingan came to "complete" it.
First off, Chidori is a piercing move I suppose designed for just that. It was created by a young Kakashi and it incorporated lighting affinity re-composition with spatial re-composition to an extent. When Kakashi was fighting that Iwa Jounin, it was his initial attempt of this jutsu. So he wasn't experienced with the jutsu and didn't know that his level of speed could be readable. After hearing advice from Minato the young Kakashi most likely figured out that he was not physically strong thus made it that much more complex for Chidori to be a lethal jutsu by him just thrusting his arm into the opponent.
So his answer at that time was to increase momentum by accelerating himself and thus increased piercing capabilities. Adding the Sharingan gave him an edge and a more effective way to land this jutsu without giving the opponent the opportunity to dodge. Sasuke’s beginner Chidori was performed by dragging the hand on the floor, ducking down to increase speed, which is why it was flawed. If Kakashi and Sasuke are moving at top speed and thrusting Chidori then yes, Minato's assessment is correct. In other words, if someone were to try and connect Chidori with their opponent from far away they would need excellent reflexes to dodge a counterattack or to counter their dodge.
The better eyesight alone would complete Chidori because now he'd be able to actually see the opponent and being able to "read" attacks means he can "see" them or see them "clearly". However, if they're standing stationary to inflict the jutsu at point blank range or arm's length, then there's really no need for Sharingan which brings up a major point. During the Raikage fight, speed was put into play but during the other times it wasn't really a focus. In Shippuuden, Kakashi/Sasuke were mainly using it as a weapon as they were close to the opponent and practically shoved it into them (hence Chidori is rarely used with speed anymore). I think the main thing that is suppose to be taken away from Minato's statement is that the way Kakashi used it; Sharingan was needed and the way Sasuke firstly used it were dependent on it.
I also came to the conclusion of assuming that Sasuke/Kakashi’s many other Chidori variations don’t need Sharingan as these other jutsu are all long-range where the Sharingan would work well in close combat whether it be jutsu/Taijutsu. Sharingan just completed Chidori to be an all-round jutsu but it is not always necessarily [/U]needed[/U]. Obviously they will have Sharingan active in all of their fights as it is gives the user a beneficial advantage for whatever they do.
Hold on, you are trying to compare your post with a thousand years of death’s post as they were different in points. The post I quoted from you stated this "he has to use chidori along side with Sharingan" in other words, you were saying that Sasuke is unable to use Chidori if Sharingan is not active. Now, a thousand years of death’s post targeted why the Sharingan should be combined with Chidori which I will say that it made a minor point but was poorly done and so with everything stated above should tear down any confusion or misunderstandings about Sharingan and Chidori.
That is a simple concept that people have a hard time fathoming. The chakra that Sasuke sucked out of Karin has obviously held out this long and his willpower. In other words, it was enough for all the times he has used Chidori and his willpower enables him to excel further. This is seen many times throughout the manga. For example take a look below,
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Just imagine Sasuke who does not even have the handicap of a fatal illness, near death situation etc.
how did sasuke know for sure naruto was going to charge forwards with a rasengan.
an educated guess. sasuke has worked with naruto in the past and knew that if naruto is met with a powerful jutsu coming straight at him naruto is going to try and force his way through.
also i based the kakashi beating sasuke thing on the sasukes chidori attack.
sasuke is using what chakra he has left for this attack by the looks of it so it wouldnt be able to withstand a full powered lightning blade. not only that but kakashi has his sharingan. so kakashi would be able to counter sasuke chidori while jabing him with a raikiri. if kakashi didnt do that then im sure kakashis raikiri will beat that lower powered chidori.
finally sasukes eyes are not as good as they where so sasuke doesnt need to be in tunnel vision to not be able to see the counter.
now finally about chidori.
you say that the user doesnt need to be moving at that speed where the users eyes would enter the tunnel vision state.
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from what i gather speed is needed in order to make the jutsu effective in combat.
if not then why would kakashi teach sasuke to move that fast and why would minato forbid the jutsu?
why not just teach sasuke to use chidori and why doesnt minato say "dont move that fast"
i base my opinions on logic. and the logical explanation in this case is to look at what has been said and shown and the conclusion is that the jutsu is powerful but in order to be effective you need speed and at the speed needed you need the sharingan to see your oponents counter or you are going to end up dead.
if any of these are wrong then why did kishi make it out like that?
im not saying im kishi, im giving my opinion just like you. someone on this forum saying "you are not kishi" doesnt diserve to be here. these are predictions made though what we have read and what we think will happen.
none of use can be proven wrong until kishi says/writes so.
this thread is for discussing opinions.
im not taking a dig at sasuke or i will exploit many of his flaws and idiotic moments.
i am saying what i have arrived at through my logic.
sasukes other moves with the name chidori in, through my logic , i would say they are not the same kind of jutsu therefor do not have the same flaw as chidori.
why do i say they are not the same? because chidori as a jutsu uses alot of chakra focused in the users hand, then adds lightning and finally uses shape manipulation to turn it into a surge to increase its power.
now if you change its shape to fit a different purpose then its not the same.
it used what sasuke knows to create a different jutsu but kept the same noise (im guessing) which gave the chidori its name. therefor he called those jutsu chidori name status as they have the same obvious feature.
also i do say sasuke is useless without his sharingan.
all he really has is the fire style jutsu that he has which is easily avoided and the lightning jutsu that needs his sharingan and his chidori sword.
yes the chidori moves are good but they use alot of chakra and without his sharingan he wouldnt be able to see his oponents moves and would have to fight differently. he would be a chunin level ninja most likely.
sasuke has needed his sharingan ever since he fought haku. almost every oponent he has ever fought he used his sharingan. which if you ask me is like naruto using the foxs power against almost every oponent from the start.
right now it seems that its like naruto going 4-6 tails on everyone from the start.
i wouldnt say its like sage mode because naruto had to learn that not unlock a dormant power. naruto's is harder to work with and more of a burden. and works in the other way. rather than being able to avoid attacks it is able to withstand them in the cost of his life span.
id like to ramble on but i think you can get what im saying.
I'm so glad that it was not only me but also Kakashi who noticed Naruto's fast move, I believe, if it's not Time Space Jutsu, it may be a kind of Pre-Time Space Jutsu :naruto:
Second, I'm starting to think that Itachi gave Naru some Jutsu not agianst Sasuke, but Madara...he knew that sooner or later Madara would start to manipulate Sasuke...and he knew his weak points better than anyone else.
And I really like the idea :
I suppose Sasuke will "come back", otherway, Naru won't forgive it himself and become a Hokage, and becomeing a Hokage is must for the end or pre-end of the manga
I always thought that was a drawing mistake in the manga, when Naruto and Yamato did that combind attack
