Establishing why Naruto using up biju chakra is a myth

[Sennin of Logic]

There seems to be a pretty popular myth going around that the reason why Naruto doesn't have RSM in the Last is because he "used up" the chakra of the other bijus, making him loose RSM, especially among the Sasuke fanboys.(surprise, surprise) I'm making this thread to show that such a thing is not only improbable, but also goes against the established concepts of the manga.


Argument A: This was never shown.

Naruto and Sasuke released IT together.

Spoiler

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It's an established fact that you need the biju's chakra to undo IT.

Spoiler

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Sasuke released the bijus after they undid IT, meaning Naruto had to have biju chakra even after "running out."

Spoiler

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Since Naruto was not stated or shown to "loose the biju," there's really no basis for this in the first place.


Argument B: It's impossible use up a biju.


Bijus are like rechargeable batteries. Running out of biju chakra does not make them disappear.

Spoiler

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As you can see, Naruto used all of yin-Kurama's chakra, and it only "puts him to sleep." Since he used the bijus for releasing IT, it's obvious that he didn't go away. Therefore, you can only deactivate a biju, not use them up. In which case, they can make more chakra. Naruto was compared to being the jinchuriki to all bijus, so the other bijus are not an exception, and Naruto obviously would have recharged the chakra of the other bijus. (assuming it even works that way, and they're not simply a key for RSM)


Argument C: There'd be nothing stopping Naruto from regaining it.

This is ridiculously basic. The bijus were all in one place. There's no way Naruto decided to disregard Hagoromo's plan.

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The Last and the ending of Naruto showed Kurama in his natural red color, so it's fairly obvious Naruto followed said plan. He put both Kuramas inside of him. There's absolutely no reason to believe that, even pretending bijus can be used up, Naruto didn't have the rest of the bijus follow suit and get a piece of their chakra again.



Overall, this theory is simply a myth used by Sasuke fanboys in the usual attempts to nerf Naruto to make Sasuke out to be the equal, or superior one. Certainly not the first time. (BSM madness when it was introduced and people tried to make it out like fusing the 2 modes did nothing but make him capable of hurting Juubito)

 

[Itachi of the Uchiha clan]

good thread

 

[BlacLord™]

I suppose you forgot that all the Bijuus were present anyway?

Naruto can't use RSM, stop being a Naruto faptard and trying to deny it. Even Sasuke noted that Naruto had little Bijuu chakra left near the end of their fight; he used the last of it with the Twin Rasenshuriken.

If Naruto still had the Bijuu's chakra, he wouldn't have faced someone with Madara's level of power with just KCSM. What you seem to forget is that Sasuke isn't in his strongest form any more either.

 

[BLAZE]

Wut kind of BS is this

They didn't show RSM becoz movie is retcon.SP didn't knew wut RSM is
as they were making it since Dec 2014

 

[Sennin of Logic]

I suppose you forgot that all the Bijuus were present anyway?

Naruto can't use RSM, stop being a Naruto faptard and trying to deny it. Even Sasuke noted that Naruto had little Bijuu chakra left near the end of their fight; he used the last of it with the Twin Rasenshuriken.

If Naruto still had the Bijuu's chakra, he wouldn't have faced someone with Madara's level of power with just KCSM. What you seem to forget is that Sasuke isn't in his strongest form any more either.

Lol! You haven't read the thread at all haven't you? I've thoroughly debunked this theory 3-fold. I take it you haven't noticed that Toneri has chakra-absorbing abilities? I take it that you haven't seen spoilers said that he absorbed/got rid of RSM in the film? To say Naruto used it up that fight is basically throwing established manga facts in the garbage can in favor of your opinion. And no, Sasuke obviously maintained his power. You don't exactly destroy meteors with chidori through "mastery."

 

[BAS3D]

The bijuu's Sasuke released weren't apart of Naruto in the first place, they came from Kaguya/Madara

Naruto can't use up Yin Kyuubi's chakra and that's only because his the jinchuuriki of Kurama while he only has bits of chakra from the other tailed beast

Plus bijuu chakra has nothing to do with Rikudo Mode

 

[BLAZE]

Lol! You haven't read the thread at all haven't you? I've thoroughly debunked this theory 3-fold. I take it you haven't noticed that Toneri has chakra-absorbing abilities? I take it that you haven't seen spoilers said that he absorbed/got rid of RSM in the film? To say Naruto used it up that fight is basically throwing established manga facts in the garbage can in favor of your opinion. And no, Sasuke obviously maintained his power. You don't exactly destroy meteors with chidori through "mastery."

dat was fake spoiler

 

[Gerkak]

Indeed naruto never lost RM

 

[Sennin of Logic]

The bijuu's Sasuke released weren't apart of Naruto in the first place, they came from Kaguya/Madara

Naruto can't use up Yin Kyuubi's chakra and that's only because his the jinchuuriki of Kurama while he only has bits of chakra from the other tailed beast

Plus bijuu chakra has nothing to do with Rikudo Mode

This doesn't make much sense. Yin and Yang Kurama themselves are fragments of the original Kurama. There's no difference between receiving a fraction, and receiving the whole bijus other than chakra amount. It's still being a jinchuriki. Actually, biju chakra almost certainly has to do with RSM. Otherwise, there wouldn't have been a fuss about Naruto receiving Shukaku and the 8 tails.

 

[Glad Of War]

I couldn't agree more on this.
Good thread.

 

[BAS3D]

This doesn't make much sense. Yin and Yang Kurama themselves are fragments of the original Kurama. There's no difference between receiving a fraction, and receiving the whole bijus other than chakra amount. It's still being a jinchuriki. Actually, biju chakra almost certainly has to do with RSM. Otherwise, there wouldn't have been a fuss about Naruto receiving Shukaku and the 8 tails.

Are you saying Naruto could go bijuu mode with other tailed beast too? Naruto is a Jin for Kurama only

Minato split Kurama into two Yin and Yang using the death ripper seal, that's nothing like gaining small bits of chakra

bijuu chakra has nothing to with Rikudo Mode, Naruto gained that ability by mixing his kyuubi mode with Rikudo chakra

 

[shadowcb]

Naruto does have permanent tail beast chakra. That include all the tail beast (1-9). Sage told us Naruto possess all their chakra and the tail beast can all communicate to each other through Naruto because of their chakra he possess -

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If their chakra wasn't permanent then Sage wouldn't have them use that method as a means of communication because once Naruto runs out of their chakra they wouldn't be able to communicate to each other that way.

Jayce is right. The tail beast has nothing to do with Naruto's Six path sage mode.

Here is the databook entry of Six path sage mode:

"Six Paths Sage Mode (六道仙人モード, Rikudō Sennin Mōdo)

Heading: A gift from the ancestor of Shinobi that grants a supernatural mental state allowing for the complete, universal comprehension of all things.

← The caster has an unconscious/automatic mastery of the Sage of Six Path's "ability to levitate" (浮遊する能力, fuyū suru nōryoku).

From what I can make out of the main body of text, it says that this is a technique that allows the user to quickly grasp the nature of Chakra with the skill of a well-studied, highly sensitive master. It also seems to have a bunch of philosophical stuff about the Sage of Six Paths which is hard to make out because I can only read about half of it.

→ Kicking a Truthseeker Orb! Surpassing Kurama Mode, his vast Chakra lets him perform this risky stunt!

← His reaction speed meets or exceeds that of Madara in his Ten Tails Jinchūriki Form. It's the height of sensory ability!"

and here's Madara's sage mode verison

"Six Paths Ten Tails Coffin Seal (六道十尾柩印, Rikudō Jūbi Kyūin)

↓ The top caption says that when it seemed that Madara was making Obito use Rinne Rebirth, Obito was actually weaving the sings for the Six Paths Ten Tails Coffin Seal.

Kekkei Genkai/Ninjutsu used by Obito and Madara. Taking the ten bodies of the tailed beasts into oneself, becoming a Jinchūriki and gaining their power. It goes on to say that it's difficult to control the tailed beasts and that this can cause the user to have a psychological collapse, and needs to either have a suitably strong force of will, either inherently or by finding one, in order to gain control. If they do that, they'll obtain the terrifying/astounding power of a "god that shapes the land."

→ The caster condenses and absorbs the ten tailed beasts into himself, awakening ("blossoming") their original power (本来の力, primal power, essential power).

↑ To acquire the power of the ten tailed beasts is the same as possessing the power of the Sage of Six Paths, so it is accompanied by the same Truthseeker Orbs."

It may not be a perfect translation, but it doesn't mention needing the tail beast chakra or Sage chakra. It says Naruto obtained this mode because of his mental state. Yet, Madara sage mode states the user needs the 10 tail sealed inside ones self to obtain that mode.

 

[Seventh Sama]

Lol at people disagreeing. Did you forget that one needs the bijuu chakra In order to undo MT?

Anyways great thread.

 

[ShidoZ]

Wut kind of BS is this

They didn't show RSM becoz movie is retcon.SP didn't knew wut RSM is
as they were making it since Dec 2014

/Thread
Obv they wanna show it first in anime..

 

[Solo]

What you seem to forget is that Sasuke isn't in his strongest form any more either.

The hell are you talking about? Sasuke is 100x stronger than he was during the 4th Great Ninja War.

Sasuke Taijutsu and Kenjutsu might be weaker, but most of his strongest Jutsu doesn't require his left hand.

 

[Solo]

Wut kind of BS is this

They didn't show RSM becoz movie is retcon.SP didn't knew wut RSM is
as they were making it since Dec 2014

SP work with Kishi on the movie though. The manga's story is already written out in advance. It's not like Kishi sit there week by week thinking of the story.

 

[Ansatsuken]

I'm not yet see the movie, sorry. That is mean not much I can do.

 

[ShidoZ]

SP work with Kishi on the movie though. The manga's story is already written out in advance. It's not like Kishi sit there week by week thinking of the story.

Its like showing Goku's SSJ in movie before they do it in anime..
Of course anime has to do it first

 

[iNotorious]

Great thread OP :')

 

[Xlad]

Naruto does have permanent tail beast chakra. That include all the tail beast (1-9). Sage told us Naruto possess all their chakra and the tail beast can all communicate to each other through Naruto because of their chakra he possess -

You must be registered for see links

If their chakra wasn't permanent then Sage wouldn't have them use that method as a means of communication because once Naruto runs out of their chakra they wouldn't be able to communicate to each other that way.

Jayce is right. The tail beast has nothing to do with Naruto's Six path sage mode.

Here is the databook entry of Six path sage mode:

"Six Paths Sage Mode (六道仙人モード, Rikudō Sennin Mōdo)

Heading: A gift from the ancestor of Shinobi that grants a supernatural mental state allowing for the complete, universal comprehension of all things.

← The caster has an unconscious/automatic mastery of the Sage of Six Path's "ability to levitate" (浮遊する能力, fuyū suru nōryoku).

From what I can make out of the main body of text, it says that this is a technique that allows the user to quickly grasp the nature of Chakra with the skill of a well-studied, highly sensitive master. It also seems to have a bunch of philosophical stuff about the Sage of Six Paths which is hard to make out because I can only read about half of it.

→ Kicking a Truthseeker Orb! Surpassing Kurama Mode, his vast Chakra lets him perform this risky stunt!

← His reaction speed meets or exceeds that of Madara in his Ten Tails Jinchūriki Form. It's the height of sensory ability!"

and here's Madara's sage mode verison

"Six Paths Ten Tails Coffin Seal (六道十尾柩印, Rikudō Jūbi Kyūin)

↓ The top caption says that when it seemed that Madara was making Obito use Rinne Rebirth, Obito was actually weaving the sings for the Six Paths Ten Tails Coffin Seal.

Kekkei Genkai/Ninjutsu used by Obito and Madara. Taking the ten bodies of the tailed beasts into oneself, becoming a Jinchūriki and gaining their power. It goes on to say that it's difficult to control the tailed beasts and that this can cause the user to have a psychological collapse, and needs to either have a suitably strong force of will, either inherently or by finding one, in order to gain control. If they do that, they'll obtain the terrifying/astounding power of a "god that shapes the land."

→ The caster condenses and absorbs the ten tailed beasts into himself, awakening ("blossoming") their original power (本来の力, primal power, essential power).

↑ To acquire the power of the ten tailed beasts is the same as possessing the power of the Sage of Six Paths, so it is accompanied by the same Truthseeker Orbs."

It may not be a perfect translation, but it doesn't mention needing the tail beast chakra or Sage chakra. It says Naruto obtained this mode because of his mental state. Yet, Madara sage mode states the user needs the 10 tail sealed inside ones self to obtain that mode.

I actually have to go with this. The additional Tailed Beasts chakra if anything, provides more as a bonus. It didn't say that an accumulation of Bijuu Chakra was needed for Six Paths Sage Mode in DB4. He would still have the Bijuu Chakra however.

Basically speaking, to have RSM, Naruto needs to have actual Sage Mode enhanced by Rikudou's.