Blind Madara vs Hashirama

[Indestructible]

Alive Rinne Madara > SM Hashi > Sm Blind Madara > Edo Hashirama > Edo Madara> Base Hashirama>EMS Madara

 

[KingHashirama]

Absorbing buddha does seem a bit of a stretch to me. Hashirama still has more experience with sage mode so that helps. But Madara did lots of things previously which was not done before (like susanoo without eyes).

Do you know why the black rods didn't work on Sakura? I tried to find many answers but none of them were satisfactory

@Bold, done by Itachi.

 

[VongolaX]

@Bold, done by Itachi.

He also absorbed chakra without the rinnegan.

 

[KingHashirama]

He also absorbed chakra without the rinnegan.

#Mokuton dna

Or preta path can be used after losing eyes.

 

[VongolaX]

#Mokuton dna

Or preta path can be used after losing eyes.

Well mokuton has the ability to suppress chakra.

Mokuton can only be used absorbing via wood dragon.

 

[ad0]

Alive Rinne Madara > SM Hashi > Sm Blind Madara > Edo Hashirama > Edo Madara> Base Hashirama>EMS Madara

Rubbish you are not being honest or just not aware of the facts (dumb ass)

Alive Rinne Madara > Sm Blind Madara > Edo Madara > SM Hashi > Edo Hashirama > EMS Madara > Base Hashirama

Edo Madara is far stronger than Edo Hashirama he was just toying with Hashirama this is a fact people refuse to accept especially Sasuke fans and Obito fans

 

[Indestructible]

Rubbish you are not being honest or just not aware of the facts (dumb ass)

Alive Rinne Madara > Sm Blind Madara > Edo Madara > SM Hashi > Edo Hashirama > EMS Madara > Base Hashirama

Edo Madara is far stronger than Edo Hashirama he was just toying with Hashirama this is a fact people refuse to accept especially Sasuke fans and Obito fans

Anyone who read the manga objectively knows Edo Hashirama beat Edo Madara and nowhere was it stated Madara was toying with hashirama.

 

[Bronze]

Lol this is alive Hashirama though

Do you think the rods will still be useful?

Spoiler

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The word virtually means nearly, which in mathematical terms, is +95%. Therefore, Edo Hashirama and Alive Hashirama are no different in power, as proven when his SM Mokujin could stand temporarily against PS before getting destroyed later on.

If the rods worked on Edo Hashirama, they work on Alive Hashirama. Assuming, of course, he doesn't get stabbed in a vital organ and dies.

 

[Draphsin]

^ Do you want me to repeat everything I said before already? If you have something new, bring it to the table. I am tired of posting the same thing over and over and reading the same post over and over.

You don't need to repeat anything to address what I said.

The guy was gloating.

Gloating doesn't change the fact that sasuke allowed naruto to create clones in front of him. Now unless you're going to contradict the manga then madara's IC personality gloats much more than sasuke would, therefore he'd do the exact same thing that sasuke did.

But anyways even if madara wasn't the gloating type, the sasuke example is only one out of the hundreds that show someone creating clones [or just cast any old jutsu for that mater] in front of someone else without being blitzed.

- BM Naruto can blitz, why didn't he

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in the middle of madara's mokuryuu?

-

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in front of

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in part 1

- Hiruzen

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without being blitzed

- Killerbee

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without him/naruto getting blitzed by obito [his jutsu may be fast but so is obito so there's no excuse]

- Kisame created

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of

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without being blitzed by gai

- Then we have kisame

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to block an

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before they could even land

If you need more just let me know, but saying that sasuke let naruto use his clones because he was "gloating" is a bad excuse, plenty of faster opponents have let their enemy create clones in front of their face, were they all gloating too?

Once he teleported, none of the avatars were able to react. He smashed one down into the mountains because of his superior striking speed.

Completely irrelevant, this is about sasuke not blitzing naruto before he could create his clones. & Anyways he blitzed one as the other three were

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to attack him, naruto is aware of his jutsu so he knew it was coming. Fact of the matter is that sasuke let naruto use his jutsu, just as plenty of faster characters have done the same.

This has a lot to do with SM. Naruto couldn't gather SM and do what you said either. The one Sasuke magically forgot about gorged on NE and then he could initiate it.

This has been my entire point since the beginning... First of all remember

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&

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scan? That's right madara likes to fight with the real hashirama, he thinks that weak clones are worthless. Madara wants to kill hashi himself so he won't use clones to combat clones. Even if he miraculously did want to use clones, if hashi just stepped up & fought madara himself then madara wouldn't want to use them anymore, as they would ultimately take away from his full power.

IC, madara would forget about a stray clone as well, or hashi can conceal one with mayfly + jukkai kotan later down the road. You're not understanding that madara, especially while blind, simply cannot keep up with hashirama's clones who could fuse with the earth/hashi's mokuton & travel to the other side of the world to gather senjutsu. A simple forest conceals all the clone's chakra, making a getaway easy.

Madara is not winning without eyes.

Now image had Sasuke blitzed that Kurama sitting between the smashed mountains. There goes that SM.

Wrong because naruto had multiple clones, if sasuke went for the one in the mountains then the others would chase him & naruto would leave one of the ones in the air behind. & Considering how fast naruto can gather senjutsu it's not impossible to even say he gathered a good amount of it already, so if he just did the same thing a few more times then it might take longer but the result would be the same.

I am not sure what kind of point you were even trying to make, because I know how Bushins work.

Obviously not if you think that madara is going to blitz hashi before he creates some, especially considering that they're the same speed & that clones have been created in front of faster characters before.

 

[shelke]

^ You clearly wasted your time with these scans, when I never said he would blitz Hashirama's bushin making:

Now image had Sasuke blitzed that Kurama sitting between the smashed mountains. There goes that SM. I am not sure what kind of point you were even trying to make, because I know how Bushins work.

I said, quite repeatedly, that Hashirama cannot do everything in a second or two. I also said again and again, that if he uses Bushins, so does Madara. The second the stops to knead SM, he's blitzed.

Why did you bother yourself with countless scans? I told you; I know how bushins work.

 

[Draphsin]

^ You clearly wasted your time with these scans, when I never said he would blitz Hashirama's bushin making

You said hashi would get blitzed whilst making clones, do I really have to bring the quote out?

So he makes clones and kneads chakra before Madara blitzes him?

You have to mold chakra to use any jutsu so this is you blatantly implying that hashi won't get the chance to create clones before being blitzed.

I said, quite repeatedly, that Hashirama cannot do everything in a second or two.

I never said he could either. I said that madara can't stop hashi from doing anything because they're the same sped, so he can't be blitzed.

The only thing that madara can do is disrupt hashi's senjutsu gathering, but I already said multiple times that creating clones & large scale mokuton along with mayfly will ensure a clone has the chance to escape & gather enough. As I can see however you clearly ignored all that.

I also said again and again, that if he uses Bushins, so does Madara.

& Here's some proof that you didn't even read my response, I already explained how an IC "canon" madara wouldn't waste his time playing around with clones. He didn't bother to create clones when they were fighting as edos, madara wants to fight hashirama at his full power as I've explained.

I Also explained how a blind madara even with clones won't be able to find them if hashi creates a forest, since it would be filled with his chakra. Of course you would ignore that too though.

The second the stops to knead SM, he's blitzed.

Again already explained how hashi & his clones won't be stupid enough to gather senjutsu in front of madara, he will make madara lose track of one or push him back with large scale mokuton. I swear am I talking to a brick wall or something?

& Tell me, how does a character that's the same speed as his enemy blitz said enemy? Go ahead I'll wait for an explanation but unlesss hashi is looking at the stars then he isn't going to miss madara charging towards him, so he'll stop.

Why did you bother yourself with countless scans? I told you; I know how bushins work.

I did it because you obviously don't, you said yourself that hashi gets blitzed while making them which is ridiculous. Those scans are to show you that no matter what you say, the only thing that madara even has a chance at stopping hashi from doing is gathering senjutsu. & I explained multiple ways how he could do it without interruption [ways you chose to ignore].

 

[shelke]

You said hashi would get blitzed whilst making clones, do I really have to bring the quote out?

You have to mold chakra to use any jutsu so this is you blatantly implying that hashi won't get the chance to create clones before being blitzed.

I never said he could either. I said that madara can't stop hashi from doing anything because they're the same sped, so he can't be blitzed.

The only thing that madara can do is disrupt hashi's senjutsu gathering, but I already said multiple times that creating clones & large scale mokuton along with mayfly will ensure a clone has the chance to escape & gather enough. As I can see however you clearly ignored all that.

& Here's some proof that you didn't even read my response, I already explained how an IC "canon" madara wouldn't waste his time playing around with clones. He didn't bother to create clones when they were fighting as edos, madara wants to fight hashirama at his full power as I've explained.

I Also explained how a blind madara even with clones won't be able to find them if hashi creates a forest, since it would be filled with his chakra. Of course you would ignore that too though.



Again already explained how hashi & his clones won't be stupid enough to gather senjutsu in front of madara, he will make madara lose track of one or push him back with large scale mokuton. I swear am I talking to a brick wall or something?

& Tell me, how does a character that's the same speed as his enemy blitz said enemy? Go ahead I'll wait for an explanation but unlesss hashi is looking at the stars then he isn't going to miss madara charging towards him, so he'll stop.

I did it because you obviously don't, you said yourself that hashi gets blitzed while making them which is ridiculous. Those scans are to show you that no matter what you say, the only thing that madara even has a chance at stopping hashi from doing is gathering senjutsu. & I explained multiple ways how he could do it without interruption [ways you chose to ignore].

Is that what my quote said? I have literally placed kneading chakra after the clones statement, and I am talking about KGs? How many times do I have to repeat myself? He isn't making clones and entering SM too quickly. Here is where he is blitzed.

Madara not countering Bushins with his own Moku-Bushins to stop the original from kneading Senjutsu is a far-fetched logic. He absolutely would try to let his own clones handle clones, whilst he can close the gap between himself and the real Hashirama to stop SM. Or he simply does this whilst creating the black rod and proceeding to stab him as his first strike.

The rest I don't agree with, and we have gone through this countless times. Try to grasp the placement of vocabulary items next time. I didn't even remotely imply that he stops him from making Bushins, which is why Kneading Chakra (an obvious allusion to Senjutsu) was placed after Bushins.

 

[Draphsin]

Is that what my quote said?

That's how I interpreted it.

How many times do I have to repeat myself? He isn't making clones and entering SM too quickly. Here is where he is blitzed.

How many times do I have to repeat myself? Madara can't blitz hashi. He makes clones just fine, he creates mokuton just fine, he sends a clone to use mayfly all just fine.

Madara not countering Bushins with his own Moku-Bushins to stop the original from kneading Senjutsu is a far-fetched logic.

& How does madara know what hashi's plan is? The clone that's going to be gathering the senjutsu will have mayflied out of the area already.

He absolutely would try to let his own clones handle clones, whilst he can close the gap between himself and the real Hashirama to stop SM.

But he can't, I already told you he's not doing anything while blind & only relying on his senses. Hashi can easily do what zabuza did to kakashi in pt 1 & since madara has no eyes then restricting his senses literally blinds him.

Or he simply does this whilst creating the black rod and proceeding to stab him as his first strike.

No because he doesn't have superior speed to hashi, mokuton pushes him back.

Try to grasp the placement of vocabulary items next time.

How am I supposed to know you were referring to hashi molding chakra after he creates clones? He has to mold chakra anyways, maybe if you said "then" instead of "and" I wouldn't have misinterpreted it. Regardless though hashi can't get blitzed, not by someone who is virtually the same speed.

which is why Kneading Chakra (an obvious allusion to Senjutsu) was placed after Bushins.

I had no idea you were alluding to senjutsu, if you wanted to refer to it then you should've just said it.

 

[ad0]

Anyone who read the manga objectively knows Edo Hashirama beat Edo Madara and nowhere was it stated Madara was toying with hashirama.

Yes i know you should able to understand what it means

It common sense that Edo Madara was toying with Edo Hashirama we all know Edo Madara likes to dance

dont agree with me then it is like this as per you:

Tsunade>>Edo Madara
how does it sounds Madara looked serious fighting with Tsunade

 

[VongolaX]

Spoiler

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The word virtually means nearly, which in mathematical terms, is +95%. Therefore, Edo Hashirama and Alive Hashirama are no different in power, as proven when his SM Mokujin could stand temporarily against PS before getting destroyed later on.

If the rods worked on Edo Hashirama, they work on Alive Hashirama. Assuming, of course, he doesn't get stabbed in a vital organ and dies.

I'm completely aware of how close they're to full strength.

The issue here is his techniques, some don't know how these black rods will play out for someone alive or used in general.

 

[shelke]

That's how I interpreted it.

How many times do I have to repeat myself? Madara can't blitz hashi. He makes clones just fine, he creates mokuton just fine, he sends a clone to use mayfly all just fine.

& How does madara know what hashi's plan is? The clone that's going to be gathering the senjutsu will have mayflied out of the area already.

But he can't, I already told you he's not doing anything while blind & only relying on his senses. Hashi can easily do what zabuza did to kakashi in pt 1 & since madara has no eyes then restricting his senses literally blinds him.

No because he doesn't have superior speed to hashi, mokuton pushes him back.

How am I supposed to know you were referring to hashi molding chakra after he creates clones? He has to mold chakra anyways, maybe if you said "then" instead of "and" I wouldn't have misinterpreted it. Regardless though hashi can't get blitzed, not by someone who is virtually the same speed.

I had no idea you were alluding to senjutsu, if you wanted to refer to it then you should've just said it.

Well then, there is no agreement as before.

 

[XY iNVeRSe]

Lol this is alive Hashirama though

Do you think the rods will still be useful?

Even more so since non edo hashi doesn't have unlimited chakra.

 

[XY iNVeRSe]

#Mokuton dna

Or preta path can be used after losing eyes.

Or he can just absorb chakra like kisame and kaguya as examples.