[Discussion] What a "Bad Shoot" looks like, and how it happens.

[Aim64C]

[video=youtube;b1EdDhmvvVA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b1EdDhmvvVA[/video]

This is a bad shoot.

In order for the cop to use deadly force, the threat must possess the capability, opportunity and intent to use deadly force against the officer or a bystander. Some states allow for other scenarios, but none that reasonably apply to this one.

Capability - Does the threat possess the capacity to inflict lethal force? Lethal force -can- be administered by raw strength or unarmed strikes.

Opportunity - Is the lethal force able to be applied?

Intent - Is there reason to believe the threat means to use lethal force?

What you all do need to consider, as well, is the officer's position. Why did the officer suddenly 'flip' when the man quickly returned to his vehicle?

Were the officer's commands consistent with clearing away any concerns he had with the man's intent?

I will return following my day's work (on lunch) and see what you all have in regards to these questions. I'm curious to see how civilians respond to the video and the brief idea of the "Lethal Force Triangle."

 

[Itachi of the Uchiha clan]

what the fk? why did the **** shoot?

 

[Pirate King]

what the actually ****

 

[Aim64C]

what the fk? why did the **** shoot?

what the actually ****

*sigh*

Work with what I get, I suppose.

The officer did not connect the question "Do you have your license?" with the man suddenly turning around and diving back into his truck.

Keep in mind that, if this were in my Entry Control Point - I would have drawn down on the man for this same action, as well. People dive into vehicles and come back out with everything from baseball bats to shotguns.

So the officer was within his right to 'flip shit.'

The problem is in what the officer then began to command.

The officer was concerned that the man was going for a firearm and would return from his vehicle with it.

Issuing the command: "Get out of the car" does absolutely nothing to distinguish between someone who intends harm to the officer from someone who is obeying the order. Whether the man had a firearm or not - he would be getting out of the car. Worse, the sudden change in tone from the officer will prompt an alarmed and rapid response from the person - meaning his actions are sudden.

Thus, what should the correct order have been?

"Stop!"

That's the order that should have been given. This should be followed with: "Do you have a weapon? Place your hands on your head, please. Turn around slowly, and exit the vehicle, now."

The order "stop" is the basic order that immediately establishes the intent of the person being dealt with. Mistakes and miscommunications happen. "Stop" should be the default response to any behavior that puts the officer on edge. A person who stops is remaining compliant and does not warrant the situation to be escalated any further. A person who does not stop has a clear intention to disregard law enforcement and is a red flag that things will get ugly.

After you first place a stop on the situation, then you must begin clearing the concerns and get back to handling the business of the day without holding people at the barrel of a gun.

The problem, here, is that the officer lacked the training to respond to a high-stress situation.

The officer wanted the man out of the car and away from any possible weapons that were in there. In a time of stress, he simply was ordering the man away from what he feared rather than gaining control of an unexpected situation.

Honestly, I doubt the officer recalls actually pulling the trigger. He was, what we call, 'In the black.' During high stress situations, the conscious mind actually shuts down and yields to more primitive instincts. Memories, in the rare event they are present, are often incomplete and focused on the frame of mind or a specific object. By the time people 'snap back' to consciousness, they have usually done things that are not within the use of force guidelines.

The problem is that society likes to hold individual officers accountable for departmental training failures. While it is true that the end responsibility is with the officer - it is the job of the department to ensure its officers are equipped to handle the tasks of the job.

 

[Prometheus Beta]

Aim64C, ever seen/read the rhetoric most of protester type people peddle? If you have, you should realize that a good proportion of them are likely incapable of even understanding these sort of debates.

The ones who are capable of understanding these things do not seem to be interested in it. Back in 2011, a similar event happened in England (the 2011 riots) and the "youth" at the centre of that was a far more shady guy than the "gentle giant" - a gang leader, drug dealer and criminal who had been previously convicted for attempted murder (all of which his family/friends initially denied).

Nevertheless that didn't stop the riots all over the country or the "we demand justice" type folk even after much of the details of the incident came to light.

I personally wasted a good deal of time reading the details of the incident and those very abstract legal debates. But then you read and watch the "we demand justice" folk (you know, the Al-Sharpton type) and you realize what these sort of events are really all about.

 

[Jazzy Stardust]

I mean sure anything is possible, and sure he could've been reaching for a weapon. But those are all what if scenarios, while a bullet leaves no questions. He could've shot and killed that dude for nothing.

He literally just told him to get his license. While the guy should've said, "hey I'm reaching for my license, don't shoot" the cop reacted before even seeing any actual threat.

These trigger happy cops are annoying. Also it's not like cops are being killed by black dudes everyday, they have no reason to act like this. Cop killing is a rare thing.

 

[Multiply]

"Can I see your license"
-Goes to get license-
"Get out the car!"
-shoots-

Bruh...

This is every black man's worst nightmare. He didn't even give dude a chance to get out the car. He should have told him to slowly put his hands on his head. At that point if the man turned around, he definitely should have been shot. The officer just lost his cool. Seems like he missed vital areas though.

 

[V h o]

As bad as this is, it happens far too often.

 

[Funky Tiger]

a bad shoot is any scene from twilight, thought this was common knowledge.