[Discussion] 50 Shades of Grey

10th

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We all know the book women all over the world get moist over and the movie coming out on valentines day which is ironic because they're trying to say that's what love is or they wouldn't set it to premiere on valentines day, definition of love is gonna change forever after this. Anyway, this thread is about understand why women like it so much, to start a back and forth conversation hopefully. I know there are several things contributing to this, also isn't this contributing to the "rape culture" that feminists love to talk about. Also it's ironic a self-proclaimed feminist Beyonce made the remix song to promote the movie.
 

Aoihime

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Never read it and have never been interested in reading it
 

Saeha

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Feminists......dumbest persons with social justice warriors
 

sasukesworld

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I will watch it. U_U
Beyonce is just dumb, she's overrated as hell.

I bet crazy feminists/feminazis are going to rage. This will be hilarious.
 

paratise

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The phrase "still a better love story than Twilight" will be replaced after that movie.

I looked over that book. Opened a random page and saw bunch of balls getting smashed into a woman's vagina. Well...k'den.

If someone is intrigued in fiction with sexual contents they can find something better. I am not into that so i did not read much on stuff like that but "11 minutes" from Paulo Choelo was pretty good.
 

Forest

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We all know the book women all over the world get moist over and the movie coming out on valentines day which is ironic because they're trying to say that's what love is or they wouldn't set it to premiere on valentines day, definition of love is gonna change forever after this. Anyway, this thread is about understand why women like it so much, to start a back and forth conversation hopefully. I know there are several things contributing to this, also isn't this contributing to the "rape culture" that feminists love to talk about. Also it's ironic a self-proclaimed feminist Beyonce made the remix song to promote the movie.

Valentines day has little to do with the definition of love. Dunno why u are going about saying that for. Also Beyonce is just an entertainer, I don't think her opinion should speak for all feminists and their respective ideologies.
 

βeeCee

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Never read the book and I have no intentions on reading it. It seems like it's just soft core porn in book form. Sorry I can't shed any light on why the book became so popular.
 

Multiply

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I read it. It was a good series. U_U
 

Defence

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Some women are hypocrites. Love a novel about sexual objectification and enslavement of women yet complain about trivial things as being sexist
 

Jazzy Stardust

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Women are just complicated, if you let every little thing they say or do get to you you'll be annoyed your whole life. Unless your homo, which I don't mind. But women almost never make sense to a man, that is life.
 
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Zee Seh

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Cuz women like to do it the hard way with Rich Men U_U
 

Disquiet

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(Inb4 comment about being poster child for BDSM)


Doesn't this book have BDSM elements? I've never read it myself, but I've seen several members of the BDSM forums I'm apart of mention it (vaguely mentioning some of the contents). A lot of them said it was stupid. Anyways I don't plan on watching it, I'm not really interested in romance movies/books, and just because it dabbles in BDSM doesn't mean it piques my interest.

By the way, those women that like this book most likely aren't the same kind of feminists you're referring to.



BDSM is also not so black and white as to label it sexist or "woman-hating". Switches (a person that loves to dominate and be dominated) completely blows the argument out the water. If the apppearance is enough evidence to label it misogynist or misandrist, what then do we say about switches? You're going to have a hard time accusing a guy of being mysogynist, when the actions you're basing that judgement, is reversed and done on him as well by the opposite ***. From "hating women" to being their doormat.

So then, how are the actions enough to determine misogyny?

Generally speaking, gay doms will dominate male subs - because that's their attraction. Lesbian doms will dominate female subs - because that's their attraction. Bisexuals doms will dominate both male and female - because that's their attraction.

As for the emotion behind it?

Emotions are a complicated thing. Why is it that humans watch horror movies with expectations of being afraid (which is an anxiety)? Many are disappointed when the movie isn't as scary as they hoped. Many parents bring their children along to the horror movies.

We attend halloween events as well. Someone in a costume scares our kid - it's something to laugh about.

What is it about humans that after experiencing such a heart-stopping event, compels them to say, "I want to experience that again!"

And this is considered normal.


(Though the claim that women in scenarios such as that book are distressed, is a argument of its own.)

By the way, there are other ways to scare people than a very blunt jump-out-the-closet wearing a scary costume. We'll lie to them about something we know would make them panic, and then watch for several minutes, enjoying ourselves, before telling them. Just look at all the prank videos.

Again, we do this to our children, and again, this is generally percieved as normal (I think there are some cases where parents have been criticized if they went "overboard").



Are we masochists or are we sadists?

If I was an alien that looked at the cover of the book of humanity, made a superficial judgement and buried it, and ranted about how sick humans are based off that, the pages would turn in their grave.

Maybe we only like to experience such distress when we we percieve that the environment is controlled and safe. The fantasy certaintly gets real, when someone in a halloween mask chases you for pretend, to when someone in a mask chases you with every intention to kill you.


Also, I question "rape culture". There are jokes, sure. There are fantasies depicted in literature, sure. But I don't believe that has made rape into an accepted culture. I think the typical person that would make such a joke, read such a book, demonizes rape at heart. I think these jokes and fantasies very rarely ever crosses into reality, and thus have little to no effects on reality; rendering it unable to culturalize rape.

Rape victims aren't getting justice within the law system? Okay, but I don't think an insensitive joke or fantasy book influenced that system. I also don't think just because the system is broken, it makes rape into something good.

A case where some guy was inspired by something he seen in the media and and decided to commit an act of rape? Then there's a thief culture and a murder culture. Rape deserves more attention? Then you're trivalizing murder culture. But we know better than that, we know despite all the insensitve jokes about murder, all the fantasy depicted in the media, and the influences in behavior it has caused, it doesn't have a let's-turn-a-blind-eye culture.

If asked if a murderer should go free or get prison time, most people making that insensitive joke would say prison time. If asked if a rapist should go free or get prison time, most people who read such books would say prison time.

Many who profess that rape culture is something real, usually use the insensitive jokes and broken law system to legitimize its existence.

That isn't convincing at all. I'm supposed to ignore all the demonization of rape. I can't imagine many people not feeling ashamed if they had to wear visible marks indicating they're a rapist.

Hell, even if that insensitive joke was serious and expressive of the jokester true attitude toward rape, I believe there's a greater chance he/she would back out if confronted, than standing their ground and welcoming rape. Even with the anonymity of the internet.


Even if sexual objectification was condoned, that STILL doesn't mean turning a blind eye to rape cases. Why am I supposed to abandon my common sense, and think porn watchers mock/make light of rape cases because they enjoy watching two people have *** on a screen or get off on adult magazines? Proponents of rape culture seem to make hasty assumptions "that thing" is intimately related to "that thing".


With that in mind, if it then exist as a concept only to parrot the obversation, "Hey look, people are being insensitive." then I honestly, don't get it.
 
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Zee Seh

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(Inb4 comment about being poster child for BDSM)


Doesn't this book have BDSM elements? I've never read it myself, but I've seen several members of the BDSM forums I'm apart of mention it (vaguely mentioning some of the contents). A lot of them said it was stupid. Anyways I don't plan on watching it, I'm not really interested in romance movies/books, and just because it dabbles in BDSM doesn't mean it piques my interest.

By the way, those women that like this book most likely aren't the same kind of feminists you're referring to.



BDSM is also not so black and white as to label it sexist or "woman-hating". Switches (a person that loves to dominate and be dominated) completely blows the argument out the water. If the apppearance is enough evidence to label it misogynist or misandrist, what then do we say about switches? You're going to have a hard time accusing a guy of being mysogynist, when the actions you're basing that judgement, is reversed and done on him as well by the opposite ***. From "hating women" to being their doormat.

So then, how are the actions enough to determine misogyny?

Generally speaking, gay doms will dominate male subs - because that's their attraction. Lesbian doms will dominate female subs - because that's their attraction. Bisexuals doms will dominate both male and female - because that's their attraction.

As for the emotion behind it?

Emotions are a complicated thing. Why is it that humans watch horror movies with expectations of being afraid (which is an anxiety)? Many are disappointed when the movie isn't as scary as they hoped. Many parents bring their children along to the horror movies.

We attend halloween events as well. Someone in a costume scares our kid - it's something to laugh about.

What is it about humans that after experiencing such a heart-stopping event, compels them to say, "I want to experience that again!"

And this is considered normal.


(Though the claim that women in scenarios such as that book are distressed, is a argument of its own.)

By the way, there are other ways to scare people than a very blunt jump-out-the-closet wearing a scary costume. We'll lie to them about something we know would make them panic, and then watch for several minutes, enjoying ourselves, before telling them. Just look at all the prank videos.

Again, we do this to our children, and again, this is generally percieved as normal (I think there are some cases where parents have been criticized if they went "overboard").



Are we masochists or are we sadists?

If I was an alien that looked at the cover of the book of humanity, made a superficial judgement and buried it, and ranted about how sick humans are based off that, the pages would turn in their grave.

Maybe we only like to experience such distress when we we percieve that the environment is controlled and safe. The fantasy certaintly gets real, when someone in a halloween mask chases you for pretend, to when someone in a mask chases you with every intention to kill you.


Also, I question "rape culture". There are jokes, sure. There are fantasies depicted in literature, sure. But I don't believe that has made rape into an accepted culture. I think the typical person that would make such a joke, read such a book, demonizes rape at heart. I think these jokes and fantasies very rarely ever crosses into reality, and thus have little to no effects on reality; rendering it unable to culturalize rape.

Rape victims aren't getting justice within the law system? Okay, but I don't think an insensitive joke or fantasy book influenced that system. I also don't think just because the system is broken, it makes rape into something good.

A case where some guy was inspired by something he seen in the media and and decided to commit an act of rape? Then there's a thief culture and a murder culture. Rape deserves more attention? Then you're trivalizing murder culture. But we know better than that, we know despite all the insensitve jokes about murder, all the fantasy depicted in the media, and the influences in behavior it has caused, it doesn't have a let's-turn-a-blind-eye culture.

If asked if a murderer should go free or get prison time, most people making that insensitive joke would say prison time. If asked if a rapist should go free or get prison time, most people who read such books would say prison time.

Many who profess that rape culture is something real, usually use the insensitive jokes and broken law system to legitimize its existence.

That isn't convincing at all. I'm supposed to ignore all the demonization of rape. I can't imagine many people not feeling ashamed if they had to wear visible marks indicating they're a rapist.

Hell, even if that insensitive joke was serious and expressive of the jokester true attitude toward rape, I believe there's a greater chance he/she would back out if confronted, than standing their ground and welcoming rape. Even with the anonymity of the internet.


Even if sexual objectification was condoned, that STILL doesn't mean turning a blind eye to rape cases. Why am I supposed to abandon my common sense, and think porn watchers mock/make light of rape cases because they enjoy watching two people have *** on a screen or get off on adult magazines? Proponents of rape culture seem to make hasty assumptions "that thing" is intimately related to "that thing".


With that in mind, if it then exist as a concept only to parrot the observation, "Hey look, people are being insensitive." then I honestly, don't get it
.

You still got that BDSM fetish dont ya? Lol
 
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