Prime Hiruzen vs Hashirama

[MickNerks]

Why do people keep making these threads.

Hiruzen in his prime was already stated to be the stronger of the 2. Kishimoto wouldnt have implied it if it wasn't accurate or if Hiruzen wasnt powerful in his prime. Also, notice how it was stated that in his prime he was stronger than hashirama, not in his current state. For those who think hiruzen in his prime is fanfic and doesnt exist, once again your wrong. Hiruzen in his prime was shown multiple times in the manga, he was just never shown in battle in his prime [

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In terms of Prime Hiruzen vs Hashirama, If you go by the widely known information given to us by Danzo, Orochimaru, Kabuto, Iruka, and Hiruzen himself, it is widely known by the entire village than Hiruzen was known as the Proffesor because he was unparrallel in the utilization in jutus. He was the best of the best, which was confirmed recently when it was shown that hiruzen was the only ninja in the entire manga without doujutsu to be able to

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. He, in his prime was able to master and use all jutsu in the village (excluding Doujutsu releated abilities), which was demonstrated when he mastered complicated moves such as the Shadow clone technique and Death Demon Seal (after only seeing it once). When applying this widely known knowledge about Hiruzen to his younger self, that means he was able to utilize techniques such as sage mode, Shunshin, 8 gates, and many other techniques.

With this being said, its fairly easy to see how hiruzen in his youth could have defeated and been more powerful then hashirama. Hiruzen with sage mode already seems to surpass hashirama with his large arsenal of techniques of different elements, and by adding shadow clones to the mix who all would also have shadow clones of enma, it difficult to even imagine how hiruzen could lose. Hiruzen already has displayed the mokuton is nothing in the presence of enma [

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So with that, im just going to say that Hiruzen in his youth could most likely beat Hashirama with Mid difficulty, with the information given to use about his skills in his prime.

 

[Demonic.]

Hiruzen wins scenario 1 mid difficulty and scenario 2 high difficulty.

Hah. A non-believer. You think just because he wasn't strong as Old Hiruzen he wasn't strong as Prime Hiruzen... pfft. They called him the god of shinobi for a reason.

Why do people keep making these threads.

Hiruzen in his prime was already stated to be the stronger of the 2. Kishimoto wouldnt have implied it if it wasn't accurate or if Hiruzen wasnt powerful in his prime. Also, notice how it was stated that in his prime he was stronger than hashirama, not in his current state. For those who think hiruzen in his prime is fanfic and doesnt exist, once again your wrong. Hiruzen in his prime was shown multiple times in the manga, he was just never shown in battle in his prime [

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--

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--

You must be registered for see links

].

In terms of Prime Hiruzen vs Hashirama, If you go by the widely known information given to us by Danzo, Orochimaru, Kabuto, Iruka, and Hiruzen himself, it is widely known by the entire village than Hiruzen was known as the Proffesor because he was unparrallel in the utilization in jutus. He was the best of the best, which was confirmed recently when it was shown that hiruzen was the only ninja in the entire manga without doujutsu to be able to

You must be registered for see links

. He, in his prime was able to master and use all jutsu in the village (excluding Doujutsu releated abilities), which was demonstrated when he mastered complicated moves such as the Shadow clone technique and Death Demon Seal (after only seeing it once). When applying this widely known knowledge about Hiruzen to his younger self, that means he was able to utilize techniques such as sage mode, Shunshin, 8 gates, and many other techniques.

With this being said, its fairly easy to see how hiruzen in his youth could have defeated and been more powerful then hashirama. Hiruzen with sage mode already seems to surpass hashirama with his large arsenal of techniques of different elements, and by adding shadow clones to the mix who all would also have shadow clones of enma, it difficult to even imagine how hiruzen could lose. Hiruzen already has displayed the mokuton is nothing in the presence of enma [

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--

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].

So with that, im just going to say that Hiruzen in his youth could most likely beat Hashirama with Mid difficulty, with the information given to use about his skills in his prime.

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"The third was said to be the strongest" ...Not was the strongest.

---The people of his time called him the strongest is all this implies.

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"Many doubt Hashirama's power was as strong as legends say"

---- The People that hyped Hiruzen as the strongest didn't even believe in Hashirama's power and regarded it as a fairytale

 

[NSUNSR]

By feats Hashirama >>>>>>> Hiruzen
By hype Hashirama >>> Hiruzen

 

[MickNerks]

"The third was said to be the strongest" ...Not was the strongest.

---The people of his time called him the strongest is all this implies.

"Many doubt Hashirama's power was as strong as legends say"

---- The People that hyped Hiruzen as the strongest didn't even believe in Hashirama's power and regarded it as a fairytale

Please understand that they same people alive during Hashirama's time were around during Hiruzen's time. Hashirama was Hiruzen sensei, and died while he was young. But people the same age or 5 year older were still alove, just becasue hashirama died doesnt mean everyone else alive during his time died as well.

Hashirama and tobirama were both around when hiruzen was younger (between 5-16):

Spoiler

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Tobirama was also Hiruzen's sensei and was alive during Hashirama's time. Tobirama once again died in battle, but the people around his age were still alive and were around to see hashirama and tobirama in battle. Hiruzen entered his prime shortly after tobirama's death, maybe 5 to 10 years afterwards which would still leave people alive who knew of Hiruzen's power. So the people who were around to see hiruzen become hokage were the same people who saw Hashirama and Tobirama as hokage.

Ill give you an figurative example:

Pre-Hashirama Death

Hashirama Age:25-27
Tobirama Age: 22-24
Hiruzen Age: 7-9
Peers of Hashirama & Tobirama: 21-29


Post-Hashirama Death

Hashirama (at time of death): 29 - 31
Tobirama Age: 26 - 28
Hiruzen Age: 11 - 13
Peers of Hashirama & Tobirama: 23 - 31


Tobirama's Death + Hiruzen Made Hokage

Tobirama Age: 30 - 31
Hiruzen Age: 15 - 17
Peers of Hashirama & Tobirama: 25 - 33


Hiruzen in his Prime + Hokage

Hiruzen Age: 27 - 29
Peers of Hashirama & Tobirama: 35 - 43


With this little example you can clearly see that the people of Hashirama's Time were still around during Hiruzen's reign in his prime.

By feats Hashirama >>>>>>> Hiruzen
By hype Hashirama >>> Hiruzen

By default hiruzen's hype >>> Hashirama's

Since Hiruzen's hype directly stated that he is stronger than Hashirama.

 

[VongolaX]

1- As for Tobirama and Minato, we can debate here

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and you can see my opinion in them in details.

I'll look into it when I have time.

2- nor did the other Senju, Tobirama was the first one to be defeated, was he not? Lol

No, he wasn't

Hiruzen was, because if Tobirama went down we wouldn't of seen Gojo or the ftg combo with sagemode naruto.

He would appear after the summoning of the god tree along with Hiruzen who went down first.

 

[UltimateDeadpool]

I believe that Prime Hiruzen can beat Base Hashirama, as it was probably Sage Hashirama's power that was considered a fairy tale.

 

[MickNerks]

I believe that Prime Hiruzen can beat Base Hashirama, as it was probably Sage Hashirama's power that was considered a fairy tale.

At least people considered sage Hashirama's power was a fairy tale. People don't even accept Hiruzen for having a sage mode because it's to inconceivable to imagine.lol

 

[super yang]

At least people considered sage Hashirama's power was a fairy tale. People don't even accept Hiruzen for having a sage mode because it's to inconceivable to imagine.lol

they cant conceive it because it is still background noise, outside of the main plot movers - kkg users.

also, they fail to grasp an entire, important part of his hype: he is the heir to the legacy of one -Sarutobi_Sasuke-

!!...Hiruzen defines~ ''hype'' and ''fairytale'' in narutoverse, despite hashirama being the more relevant(& more feat'ed).

So you're not the only one who fully appreciates the legend of prime_Hiruzen

 

[Demonic.]

Please understand that they same people alive during Hashirama's time were around during Hiruzen's time. Hashirama was Hiruzen sensei, and died while he was young. But people the same age or 5 year older were still alove, just becasue hashirama died doesnt mean everyone else alive during his time died as well.

Hashirama and tobirama were both around when hiruzen was younger (between 5-16):

Spoiler

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Tobirama was also Hiruzen's sensei and was alive during Hashirama's time. Tobirama once again died in battle, but the people around his age were still alive and were around to see hashirama and tobirama in battle. Hiruzen entered his prime shortly after tobirama's death, maybe 5 to 10 years afterwards which would still leave people alive who knew of Hiruzen's power. So the people who were around to see hiruzen become hokage were the same people who saw Hashirama and Tobirama as hokage.

Ill give you an figurative example:

Pre-Hashirama Death

Hashirama Age:25-27
Tobirama Age: 22-24
Hiruzen Age: 7-9
Peers of Hashirama & Tobirama: 21-29


Post-Hashirama Death

Hashirama (at time of death): 29 - 31
Tobirama Age: 26 - 28
Hiruzen Age: 11 - 13
Peers of Hashirama & Tobirama: 23 - 31


Tobirama's Death + Hiruzen Made Hokage

Tobirama Age: 30 - 31
Hiruzen Age: 15 - 17
Peers of Hashirama & Tobirama: 25 - 33


Hiruzen in his Prime + Hokage

Hiruzen Age: 27 - 29
Peers of Hashirama & Tobirama: 35 - 43


With this little example you can clearly see that the people of Hashirama's Time were still around during Hiruzen's reign in his prime.




By default hiruzen's hype >>> Hashirama's

Since Hiruzen's hype directly stated that he is stronger than Hashirama.

Lol, the only people that were alive in the leaf during Part 1 to see the First Hokage in action were: Hiruzen, Danzo, and the two elders. They would be very young as well, so I highly doubt they ever even saw Hashirama in a serious fight (Like against Madara serious).

The Sannin are amongst the oldest Shinobi aside from the 3 I just mentioned and they would have no idea how powerful Hashirama was, and that was the generation that regarded Hiruzen as the strongest.

So saying Prime Hiruzen > Hashirama simply because a generation that never saw Hashirama in action Says Prime Hiruzen was the strongest is flawed logic

 

[MickNerks]

Lol, the only people that were alive in the leaf during Part 1 to see the First Hokage in action were: Hiruzen, Danzo, and the two elders. They would be very young as well, so I highly doubt they ever even saw Hashirama in a serious fight (Like against Madara serious). The Sannin are amongst the oldest Shinobi aside from the 3 I just mentioned and they would have no idea how powerful Hashirama was, and that was the generation that regarded Hiruzen as the strongest.

Your completely negating the other senju, uchiha, and other shinobi from other clans who joined the leaf and who was around and also in battles with Hashirama and the senju. The people in the background who don't get screen time. There are more than just 15 shinoda in the hidden leaf.

What do you think happen the the entire senju clan?? They migrated into Konoha as well. They were in the village during both Hashirama's time in Hiruzen's time.

 

[Demonic.]

Your completely negating the other senju, uchiha, and other shinobi from other clans who joined the leaf and who was around and also in battles with Hashirama and the senju. The people in the background who don't get screen time. There are more than just 15 shinoda in the hidden leaf.

What do you think happen the the entire senju clan?? They migrated into Konoha as well. They were in the village during both Hashirama's time in Hiruzen's time.

There weren't any shown and Shinobi don't exactly have long life spans. Sounds like you're grasping at straws.

Madara would have Intel on Hiruzen through Zetsu, just like he had on Minato and he still said this:

Spoiler

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This guy says noone can defeat Madara but the deceased 1st hokage. Why wouldn't he say Hiruzen ?

Spoiler

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Hiruzen himself implies he's inferior:

Spoiler

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Your only proof is hype from a generation that never even saw the first hokage in action

 

[maniaoqan]

Hiruzen takes Hashirama mid to high diff.
Hiruzen against both Senju brothers is probably a tie.

 

[Selan]

Hashirama shits on Hiruzen.

 

[ad0]

Not when Minato can end a freaking war, when Tobirama can't handle 20 fodders even with help of 6 of his students. U_U

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anyway, lets stay on topic. U_U

Obito sticking the gudoudama near Minato Shoulders:

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Tobirama taking the gudoudama away to Obito using FTG with his clone:

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Naruto said: You can copy my dad

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Tobirama is only weaker than Minato because he donot have Kyuubi without Kyuubi tobirama is Stronger although i like Minato

Tobirama biggest feats was he was the creator of Reanimation jutsu
Minato biggest was his Beauty that all

 

[Valhorus]

Lol wut , Hashirama low - mid max .

And Tobirama is stronger than Minato only in your dreams . Tobirama doesn't have ET feats So His ET cannot be counted cuz it is fodder anyway . You are counting Featless ET right ? Okay I'm going to count Minato's long named jutsu which was enough to put Juubi Jinchuriki on leash since we are using featless techniques .

 

[Tenshi Hikari]

Both men have been called the God of Shinobi - but, let's face it, Prime Hiruzen is probably too op for Hashi
Hashirama can go SM

Scenario 1: Hashirama by himself
Scenario 2: Hashirama + Tobirama

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Hashiramaaaa! Period.

 

[Minato namikaze123]

Hashi solos both the scenes...

 

[MickNerks]

There weren't any shown and Shinobi don't exactly have long life spans. Sounds like you're grasping at straws.

So just because you havent seen anyone from Hashirama's era, it means that they are all dead? That is completely insane. By your logic Sasuke Sarutobi, Orochimaru parent's, Hashirama's Mother, and the entire Uzumaki clan didnt exist because they were never shown.

It was stated that before the formation of the Villages shinobi had short lifespan because they were always at war, but once villages were formed shinobi were able to live long lives.

Madara would have Intel on Hiruzen through Zetsu, just like he had on Minato and he still said this:

Spoiler

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Nothing in the manga suggest than Madara knew of Minato or Hiruzen.. Now you are grasping. Madara didnt even know that Tsunade was Hashirama's grandaughter, and she was know as a legendary shinobi of the leaf, so its clear that Madara could care less about what was happening in the hidden leaf village. He was more focused on completing his plan.

This guy says no one can defeat Madara but the deceased 1st hokage. Why wouldn't he say Hiruzen ?

Spoiler

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Obviously the legend in the village was that Hashirama was able to defeat madara and save the village. Hiruzen never even encountered madara, so why include him in that statement. Dan also failed to say the Sage of six paths could defeat madara, so should we believe that he cant, just because Dan didnt mention him??

Hiruzen himself implies he's inferior:

Spoiler

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Your only proof is hype from a generation that never even saw the first hokage in action

This is definitley an older hiruzen, who is far from his prime. And he didnt admit he was inferior, he stated clearly that Hashirama was out of his league, but he didnt make any statement referring to himself. Once again you are reaching.

And in your second scan that is not the correct translation. In the official Viz, Hiruzen states "You havent changed a bit, Lord Hashirama". So hiruzen didnt state that he was scared, only that Hashirama hadnt changed..

Hiruzen has never admitted inferiority to Hashirama.

 

[RicardoA]

Troll thread is troll.

OT: Hashirama wins, low-diff against any version of Hiruzen. By feats, hype, portrayal, everything. And i'm being generous.
Scenario 2 is not even worth addressing.

 

[Demonic.]

Nothing in the manga suggest than Madara knew of Minato or Hiruzen.. Now you are grasping. Madara didnt even know that Tsunade was Hashirama's grandaughter, and she was know as a legendary shinobi of the leaf, so its clear that Madara could care less about what was happening in the hidden leaf village. He was more focused on completing his plan.

Wrong. Madara had Intel on Minato:

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He knew how powerful he was, and was weary of him. This clearly proves Madara kept tabs on the leaf, Madara would also have intel on Prime Hiruzen, yet Madara still called Hashirama the ultimate shinobi.

Spoiler

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And since Madara was the only one to know about Hashirama's power, he would know who was the strongest between Prime Hiruzen and Hashirama