[Theory] The real reason Uchiha clan was killed

[twistedlink]

Anyone else think the coup was quite a weak story?

I mean I'm sure the clan could muster up quite some damage, but tobi said it could rock the foundations of Konoha.

The clan was destroyed by two Ninjas, albeit super S rank skill...but still.

Personally the coup would have failed, and Konoha wouldve lost Ninja, but it would still be fairly powerful, Konoha is huge and has some very talented Ninja.

We now know that Tobi's plan is to use a giant Tsukyomi to place the entire world under genjutsu to FORCE peace.

Anyone see one massive gaping hole in his plan?

The fact that the sharingan can inhibit the effects of Tsukyomi, and the mangekyou certainly can.

The moons eye plan will fail horribly if many Ninjas out there have Sharingan.


Pain was ordered to kill Kakashi, Pain even said "letting you live will make problems in the long run "

Tobi is getting Sasuke to kill the people "behind the attack 16 years ago"

Danzou of which holds sharingan abilities.

All of Uchiha (sharingan) clan were killed.

Personally Tobi is simply killing off every single Uchiha so his moon eye plan isnt inhibited, or cancelled.

I think he's been lying to everyone, even maybe Itachi, or maybe Itachi was in on the deal, but in exchange-Immortality (hence why he's appeared).

Sasuke was meant to be killed, Tobi wanted Itachi to kill Sasuke...So Sasuke defniitely WASNT part of tobis original plan...

So maybe Itachi and tobi had to make another intermediatory plan to get Sasuke on there side.

 

[Degrees]

So many unanswered questions.

 

[Hosenka]

not really, the uchiha was weak, i mean itachi knocked out 3 of the elder uchiha's investigating shisui's death. so uchiha's like those could never break a mangekyo technique

 

[twistedlink]

Hosenka that's my point, tobi stated the Uchihas coup would have devastated Konoha and maybe brought about the 4th great Ninja war, but the clan was totally annihilated by 2 people, whereas Konoha has hundreds of Ninjas.

There is little reason the coup the uchihas planned would have worked remotely successfully, which leads me to believe no such coup was going to take place, and the clan was murdered to destroy all sharingans, and sasuke was a target too, and as tobi said Itachi just couldnt do it.

Personally Itachi and Tobi did it for other reasons than any old coup

 

[Degrees]

Do you remeber Kimimaro clan they over estimated thier own skills & were prepared to kill themselves in a blaze glory to over throw the mist village, maybe the Uchihas are the same.

 

[Uchiha Riyo]

Well Itachi ambushed them so they probably weren't ready for the attack and even if they were what could they have done against Itachi AND Madara.

 

[chopsy16]

That would be too much of a twisted and complicated plot. Once a huge plot like the Uchiha massacre has been revealed and it makes good sense as to why Itachi did it, I don't think Kishi will change the whole thing again and completely change the meaning of Madara's and Itachi' intentions.

 

[twistedlink]

That would be too much of a twisted and complicated plot. Once a huge plot like the Uchiha massacre has been revealed and it makes good sense as to why Itachi did it, I don't think Kishi will change the whole thing again and completely change the meaning of Madara's and Itachi' intentions.

Kishi will eventually have to change that sequence of events though because even if you cant agree with my theory, I think we all realise tobi is manipulating everyone through lies.

Maybe some or most of what tobi said is true, but there are extraneous variables to consider that will most likely be changed.

Its not a difficult concept to consider either, the above theory, it would be easily explained and make sense.

 

[UchihaSama1991]

It might be some truth in this theory. If you think about the fact that after all there are quite a few people with MS around and that screws up Madaras plan. And the Uchiha and konoha war think about the fact that it would`ve been the other way around if the Uchiha clan were to ambush Konoha. But Itachi and Madara were able to kill them all of because of the Silent Killing Tech. Eliminate all the powerful Uchiha and you can kill whoever is left latter. And no Uchiha had MS at the time except Itachi and Madara. So it might be true what twistedlink is saying. Think about it :

- Madara releases Kyubbi on Konoha => Uchiha get blamed
- Itachi is ordered to eliminate all Uchiha => Madara helps
- Moon eye plan in effect without Uchiha left no oposition.

So it is kinda obvious that things go acording to Madaras will.

 

[twistedlink]

It might be some truth in this theory. If you think about the fact that after all there are quite a few people with MS around and that screws up Madaras plan. And the Uchiha and konoha war think about the fact that it would`ve been the other way around if the Uchiha clan were to ambush Konoha. But Itachi and Madara were able to kill them all of because of the Silent Killing Tech. Eliminate all the powerful Uchiha and you can kill whoever is left latter. And no Uchiha had MS at the time except Itachi and Madara. So it might be true what twistedlink is saying. Think about it :

- Madara releases Kyubbi on Konoha => Uchiha get blamed
- Itachi is ordered to eliminate all Uchiha => Madara helps
- Moon eye plan in effect without Uchiha left no oposition.

So it is kinda obvious that things go acording to Madaras will.

Thankyou

Might be totally wrong, but the theory does at least make logical sense lol

 

[Vergil..]

well madara will use the jubi's power for the moons eye plan so it's raw power wouldn't be canceled out by the uchiha clan unless they had all a magenkyou and i still doubt they would be able to see thought it with MS .

second Pein didnt now about the moons eye plan, he wanted to make a massive weapon to make people value peace more after they felt true pain.

and the uchiha where ambushed by itachi and madara during the night by one they trusted until some days ago and there already deceased clan member and leader, they couldnt see that coming and both with MS that's a really big handicap


yeah madara lied about the kyuubi part since the fourth saw him
well your theory does make some since but still i doupt the uchiha being able to surpass the Jubi power and get out of the tsukuyomi, like when naruto tried to get out of itachi's illusion but was unable due to being inexperienced

 

[Shibuki]

The uchiha are nto weak by no means. Maybe when compared to Itachi and Madara but not when compared to other people.

Maybe the uchiha would have lost at the cival war but they would have made a huge damage to the enire village and this would have affected teh entire fire country.

It would have crippled the village and it would caused the 4th ninja war as the village hidden in the leaves would have become vunerable to invasion. This would allow any of the main hidden villages to easily invade the fire country and take control of it.

The imbalance of power of the villages due to one of the villages suddenely getting more land and therefore more power would have causes comflivts/wars between all the countrys and it would result in the 4th ninja world war.

 

[Vergil..]

The uchiha are nto weak by no means. Maybe when compared to Itachi and Madara but not when compared to other people.

Maybe the uchiha would have lost at the cival war but they would have made a huge damage to the enire village and this would have affected teh entire fire country.

It would have crippled the village and it would caused the 4th ninja war as the village hidden in the leaves would have become vunerable to invasion. This would allow any of the main hidden villages to easily invade the fire country and take control of it.

The imbalance of power of the villages due to one of the villages suddenely getting more land and therefore more power would have causes comflivts/wars between all the countrys and it would result in the 4th ninja world war.

yeah exactly

 

[Ecchidaime]

Im confused how amyn theories are there ??!!!

BTW...IM CONFUSED??!!

 

[twistedlink]

Okay here is the summary towards my theory.

1.Itachi stated to Kakashi near the beginning of the series that the sharingan can inhibit mangekyou tsukyomi by a small amount, and that full mangekyou can even cancel it out.

2.Tobis plan is to simply make a giant tsukyomi on the moon, to make people peaceful, basically zombies under control of madara.

3.For the moons eye plan to be successful, the ability to cancel it out must be eliminated, and the only ones who could eliminate it are sharingan users.

Hence why Tobi is going after everyone who happens to hold the sharingan, even kakashi, Pain himself said he must kill kakashi or he will be a problem in the LONG RUN (meaning future, meaning during the moon eye plan)

As to "It is powered by the juubi so it would be impossible to counter"

I dont think genjutsu works by the amount of chakra you use, you simply use chakra to manipulate brain patterns as Itachi and Jiraiya explain, the juubi simply allowed the mangekyou to be placed over the thousands/millions of people in the narutoverse.

Think about the chakra needed for 1 vs 1 tsukyomi.

The juubi simply allows a mass tsukyomi, so each person has 1/narutoverses population of chakra putting tsukyomi on them, which chances are is the same amount as 1 vs 1.

How would they have made a huge amount of damage to the entire village??

You have the entire Byakagun clan, the aburame clan, Kakashi, Gai and loads of other awesome Jounin, you have ANBU, root, and the 3rd hokage.

I know Itachi and Tobi are S+ class in skill, but they decimated the clan without much colateral damage (surroundings werent destroyed) meaning not much of a fight was put up.

 

[Shibuki]

Again you are underestimating the Uchiha a lot. The uchiha are known as geniouses. Not to the extreme as Itachi, sasuke and Madara but still there extremely strong.

Ok lets say the vilage has Gai, Kakashi, Asuma, 3rd Hokage andmany more. It woudlnt be enough. Several fo these awesome jonin would be killed. Another thing to consider is if the jonin are killed in the future they wont have enough chunin and jonin to protect the village.

Remember when the sand and the sound attacked the attack was cut short but Kohona was severely damaged by this. It would have been much worse if it had continued and gaara had attacjked the village. The shukaku is extremely powerful we didnt get to see its full power. Even if Kohona won that war another village would have been able to invade with out any problem.

When that happened mere genin had to go on misisons that high level chunin and jonin should have been on. The other villages couldnt know that they lost a lot of power. Can you remember any main charcters that were killed when the sand and sound attacked konoha attacked the village. No you cant and yet you see the village was crippled by it a lot.

 

[John Constantine]

Again you are underestimating the Uchiha a lot. The uchiha are known as geniouses. Not to the extreme as Itachi, sasuke and Madara but still there extremely strong.

Ok lets say the vilage has Gai, Kakashi, Asuma, 3rd Hokage andmany more. It woudlnt be enough. Several fo these awesome jonin would be killed. Another thing to consider is if the jonin are killed in the future they wont have enough chunin and jonin to protect the village.

Remember when the sand and the sound attacked the attack was cut short but Kohona was severely damaged by this. It would have been much worse if it had continued and gaara had attacjked the village. The shukaku is extremely powerful we didnt get to see its full power. Even if Kohona won that war another village would have been able to invade with out any problem.

When that happened mere genin had to go on misisons that high level chunin and jonin should have been on. The other villages couldnt know that they lost a lot of power. Can you remember any main charcters that were killed when the sand and sound attacked konoha attacked the village. No you cant and yet you see the village was crippled by it a lot.

Awesome post... Most defenitely the Coup d'etat would have worked and the Leaf had real reasons to be affraid..
The reason Itachi was able to kill the entire clan with some help of Madara was because this two are insanely strong genious..
And off course the Clan was not expecting a sneak attack from the inside.​

 

[squiremarcus]

nice points, definitely a possibility. I'll give you reps for this

 

[twistedlink]

I think you're overestimating the Uchiha Clan, lets face it none of them were anywhere near the skill of Itachi or Madara.

By having the Uchiha win the coup means the Uchiha clean are over 50% of Konohas entire power.

Add Itachi had he not gone defect and you have yourself an inproportionate amount of power.

The Uchiha clan were known as a brilliant battle clan in konoha, but it was one of many.

In any case, the coup going successfully or not does not disprove my theory.

Madara could have simply made the coup story up to sasuke, in place of what was the real reason above.

 

[twistedlink]

Remember when the sand and the sound attacked the attack was cut short but Kohona was severely damaged by this. It would have been much worse if it had continued and gaara had attacjked the village. The shukaku is extremely powerful we didnt get to see its full power. Even if Kohona won that war another village would have been able to invade with out any problem.

The main dent was 3rd hokage dying.

the 2nd dent would have been gaara attacking the village, but last i checked bijuu are much stronger than ninja.

So saying the shukaku would have destroyed lots doesnt really prove much, other than its stronger than ninja, which we all kind of already know...


Again, for the coup to be successful or damaging to Konoha you need the clan itself to be stronger than Konoha itself minus themselves.

Meaning they have to represent 50%+ of Konohas entire militaristic power, which would be retarded because then there would be no reason for the coup.

The reason they were going ahead with a coup was because they were being ostracised and being pushed down in power and rank, so if anything itd be the other way around.

Theyd kill quite a few Lead Ninja but they would have been dealt with very fast.

Itachi managed to kill the entire clan without amaterasu or susano'o (same as tobi)

so yeah, Itachi and Tobi are super geniuses, but they didn't even use their good techs (we saw no black fire in the clans area when sasuke was running through there, or burnt buildings, or smashed buildings, in fact everything looked intact.

It was a simple feat for Itachi and Madara even without using MS techs.