Hiruzen Being Unsurpassed

[MickNerks]

Jiraiya surpassed his hype when he went against Pain...

The only ninjutsu that JIRAIYA used in that fight was Summoning Jutsu, barrier ninjutsu, and Fire Ninjutsu. The toads used the oil, and genjutsu.

Kakashi can copy everything from water earth lightning.

Hiruzen has copied jutsu from Water, Earth, Wind, Fire, and Lightning

Only Orochimaru and Kakashi rival him in their Ninjutsu arsenals.

I think Orochimaru rivals him more than Kakashi, but I do believe that kakashi is in the top 3 shinobi with Ninjutsu mastery

 

[MickNerks]

Lol this right here plus rep dude

Jiraiya only has fire and earth release. He is no where close to surpassing hiruzen.

- Hashirama
- Tobirama

are both superior.

Hashirama relys mostly on KKG. In the OT I stated that I was refering to Original Ninjutsu, and not KKG. And even still with KKG, Hiruzen still has more variety with his ninjutsu than Hashirama does. Hashirama just has scale.

Tobirama Specializes in Suiton, but Hiruzen has shown suiton on similar levels as tobirama, and hiruzen still have a wider array of different ninjutus.

Tobirama only has shown suiton and space-time.

 

[Naruto X Hunter]

Edo Tensei is awesome dust bruh.

You mean awesome Dust and Ashes.

 

[Demonic.]

Jiraiya only has fire and earth release. He is no where close to surpassing hiruzen.



Hashirama relys mostly on KKG. In the OT I stated that I was refering to Original Ninjutsu, and not KKG. And even still with KKG, Hiruzen still has more variety with his ninjutsu than Hashirama does. Hashirama just has scale.

Tobirama Specializes in Suiton, but Hiruzen has shown suiton on similar levels as tobirama, and hiruzen still have a wider array of different ninjutus.

Tobirama only has shown suiton and space-time.

Hey man respect the wood. Kekke genkai is superior to ninjutsu anyway.

 

[Koha]

Kakashi's shown more ninjutsu feats than that bag of dust bro.

Who has more panel time? .... Plus Hiruzen's a Kage. He's a last resort fighter, so no shxt Kakashi would naturally have more
feats being in the field more.

 

[MickNerks]

Hey man respect the wood. Kekke genkai is superior to ninjutsu anyway.

I respect Mokuton and other KKG user's. But those are bloodlimit techniques, and I am only talking about the original learned ninjutsu users.

 

[Universal Enlightenment]

When it comes to Natural talent without borrowed,experimental,KG for sure Hiruzen the best not strongest ,to master all 5 elements ,Ninjutsu,Genjutsu, & Taijutsu he's skilled but when it comes to raw power he's good but not the best maybe even far from it.

 

[Mattek2008]

Totally. Hiruzen was the best in Ninjutsu, just the fact that he can use all Nature Transformations without a KKG is evidence enough that he is badass .

Kakashi and Orochimaru are also up there in skill.

You can't compare him to Tobirama and Hashirama since they both only use one element each ( I know Mokuton is techincally 2, but since we've never seen Hashi performe Earth or Water release, i'm not counting him.).

 

[SIR UZMAKIMADARA]

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Look at this scan ^

Naruto already surpassed that fodder hokage U_U

 

[MickNerks]

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Look at this scan ^

Naruto already surpassed that fodder hokage U_U

We are talking about in terms of original ninjutsu. This is not a vs thread.

Hiruzen has more ninjutsu and more element (suprisingly) than naruto

 

[Mattek2008]

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Look at this scan ^

Naruto already surpassed that fodder hokage U_U

That comprehension skill. Just because he is more powerful doesn't mean he is superior in every single way.

 

[WalksInShadows]

None can compare to Hiruzen, he stands on the top of teh shinobi world

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if that meant anything, he would've been 100% capable of neg diffing literally anyone in the world. I could name at least 2 ppl that were more than capable of doing that to him when he was alive.

 

[MickNerks]

if that meant anything, he would've been 100% capable of neg diffing literally anyone in the world. I could name at least 2 ppl that were more than capable of doing that to him when he was alive.

He was said to be the strongest shinobi of his era, so he might have been unparralleled in battle in his youth. We havent seen him in battle so its hard to say.

But he was unsurpassed in terms of ninjutsu

 

[super yang]

yes, he is unparalleled...its basic math

 

[WalksInShadows]

He was said to be the strongest shinobi of his era, so he might have been unparralleled in battle in his youth. We havent seen him in battle so its hard to say.

But he was unsurpassed in terms of ninjutsu

it was spoken by a guy who had 0 understanding of the outside world or its history. And worse yet, it was unsubstantiated hype because it was spoken simply to cater to Hiruzen's ego while he was in front of the academy kids. Going by feats and hype that were actually substantiated, Onoki and Sandaime Raikage were more than capable of burying Hiruzen.

Even in his younger days, Hiruzen was stated to have been possibly able to kill Orochimaru, and the latter wasn't nearly as powerful as he was by the time Hiruzen died. That doesn't strike me as someone who was actually at the top. I would be more inclined to believe it if he was able to at least match or come near EMS Madara's level. But since never a thing was never established in the story, that DB info about him being at the top of the world means nothing as far as i'm concerned. It's also been said that Madara was the strongest fighter of his day, and that wasn't true at all.

 

[MickNerks]

it was spoken by a guy who had 0 understanding of the outside world or its history. And worse yet, it was unsubstantiated hype because it was spoken simply to cater to Hiruzen's ego while he was in front of the academy kids. Going by feats and hype that were actually substantiated, Onoki and Sandaime Raikage were more than capable of burying Hiruzen.

Even in his younger days, Hiruzen was stated to have been possibly able to kill Orochimaru, and the latter wasn't nearly as powerful as he was by the time Hiruzen died. That doesn't strike me as someone who was actually at the top. I would be more inclined to believe it if he was able to at least match or come near EMS Madara's level. But since never a thing was never established in the story, that DB info about him being at the top of the world means nothing as far as i'm concerned. It's also been said that Madara was the strongest fighter of his day, and that wasn't true at all.

Actually those werent Iruka's words, Iruka stated that those were other peoples words: "It is said"

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Kabuto was the one who stated hiruzen was the strongest of all 5 kages during his reign, making him the strongest of his generation. Unless of course you are willing to call Kabuto fodder as well.

 

[WalksInShadows]

Actually those werent Iruka's words, Iruka stated that those were other peoples words: "It is said"

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Kabuto was the one who stated hiruzen was the strongest of all 5 kages during his reign, making him the strongest of his generation. Unless of course you are willing to call Kabuto fodder as well.

only for Kabuto to turn around and summon a Kage who was w/o a doubt more durable and stronger than Hiruzen in the war that was from his generation. Like i said before, unsubstantiated hype. More to the point, Onoki was shown to be able to nuke an island as well as being able reduce ppl to nothing, and i don't recall Hiruzen ever showing a feat that comes anywhere near that. The dude had trouble mustering up the strength for a few shadow clones against Orochimaru lol

 

[MickNerks]

only for Kabuto to turn around and summon a Kage who was w/o a doubt more durable and stronger than Hiruzen in the war that was from his generation. Like i said before, unsubstantiated hype. More to the point, Onoki was shown to be able to nuke an island as well as being able reduce ppl to nothing, and i don't recall Hiruzen ever showing a feat that comes anywhere near that. The dude had trouble mustering up the strength for a few shadow clones against Orochimaru lol

It seems you are not reading the manga properly, it was never stated that hiruzen ever had a difficult time summoning shadow clones against orochimaru. That is common misconcetion in this base.


Who did kabuto summon that was stronger than Hiruzen??

The same Onoki who couldnt do anything against Garururu which left hiruzen to deal with it himself (while protecting onoki)

 

[WalksInShadows]

It seems you are not reading the manga properly, it was never stated that hiruzen ever had a difficult time summoning shadow clones against orochimaru. That is common misconcetion in this base.

where did i stay it was stated? You seem to have trouble reading the context of a sentence w/o taking it as someone saying it literally happened.

Who did kabuto summon that was stronger than Hiruzen??

Sandaime Raikage. That's who. And he would be from Hiruzen's gen. He's literally the only human up to that point who was stated for an absolute fact that was capable of fighting a bijuu. Hiruzen has nothing whatsoever that puts him in that league.

The same Onoki who couldnt do anything against Garururu which left hiruzen to deal with it himself (while protecting onoki)

you're discounting the facts that Onoki used up a lot of his chakra against Edo Madara and it was impossible for Hiruzen to ever run out of chakra. Seems like you're having trouble reading the manga properly yourself.

 

[Vega]

Hiruzen is most probably the best Ninjutsu user.

I'd say Orochimaru is close as well with Kakashi, however Hiruzen can use all 5 elements as well as a plethora of techniques which give him a massive edge over them. Orochimaru pursued the Rinnegan for the reason to use all kinds of Ninjutsu, so I believe Hiruzen tops him with that.