✖✖ Sasuke's Power ✖✖

[Shinato]

I was unaware that i would need to spoon feed my points to you. You also made my argument for me since you accurately described Sasukes role throughout the manga. Hes simply been a side character that has been great at advancing some of the plot points. Naruto spent over half of the manga looking for Sasuke. It's pretty clear that Sasuke was just there to advance the plot if not Naruto wouldn't have anyone to motivate him to leave the village and advance the plot.

Sasuke could have been easily written out by Kishimoto and the manga would still be the same. Naruto would still have became a god and would have saved the world like hes doing now. You seem to have missed that the story is about Naruto and not about his sidekick Sasuke.

Not spoon feeding, just that you are either using bad grammar or you are delusional. I also didn't make the discussion about there being no possible way for it to be more than one main character in a manga. (That was you, not me.) Sasuke and Naruto has both had their own paths in the story, their own plots, largely unconnected by each other in Part II. Naruto's reason for wanting to be come strong was in order to become Hokage and make everyone acknowledge him. His reason for wanting to remove hatred was because of Jiraya's wishes. Neither has anything to do with Sasuke, as he didn't advance Naruto's story as he is not directly a part of anyone else's. Sasuke's reason for gaining power was Itachi, his reason for leaving Konoha was Orochimaru and his reason for helping the Akatsuki was Obito. His reason wanting to protect Konoha was Itachi and the Hokage's. Neither is affected by Naruto. The story of Naruto is a story told from two views, one is the view of Naruto and the other is the view of Sasuke. The story originally started with a shared view of both of them. Later that separated into two views and have no been placed together again. If Naruto hadn't existed then Sasuke would still have gone after Itachi, he would still have wanted to protect the village. If Sasuke hadn't existed then Naruto would have died against Haku. (That is 100% certain.)

 

[jiraiya nindo]

I wouldn't relegate sasuke as a useless side character but I would call him a supporting character. His story isn't the primary storyline(hence why he can't be the main character) but he does have a rather complex and developed backstory that is in relation to the main character(naruto). So, he's very important to the manga obv but I wouldn't classify him as a main character.

 

[ThePooka]

I wouldn't relegate sasuke as a useless side character but I would call him a supporting character. His story isn't the primary storyline(hence why he can't be the main character) but he does have a rather complex and developed backstory that is in relation to the main character(naruto). So, he's very important to the manga obv but I wouldn't classify him as a main character.

Thank you for seeing the light and not being a fanboy like the OP. The OP is just imagining the manga like he would like it to be and is ignoring what Kishimoto wrote. It's impossible to have a logical discussion with a fanboy so I've given up trying to bring the OP out of his cave.

 

[Draxus]

Stopped reading after switch organs with a rock.
Sasuke lacks feats, Naruto has the upper hand for now.

LOL me too.

Seriously the OP starts by dissing people for jump to conclusions then proceeds to make the most ridiculous jump in logic I've read about Sasuke's ability to date.

 

[Shinato]

I wouldn't relegate sasuke as a useless side character but I would call him a supporting character. His story isn't the primary storyline(hence why he can't be the main character) but he does have a rather complex and developed backstory that is in relation to the main character(naruto). So, he's very important to the manga obv but I wouldn't classify him as a main character.

Thank you for seeing the light and not being a fanboy like the OP. The OP is just imagining the manga like he would like it to be and is ignoring what Kishimoto wrote. It's impossible to have a logical discussion with a fanboy so I've given up trying to bring the OP out of his cave.

I never once stated Sasuke as a main character, but a side character/support character is something he is not. By Pooka's logic, Obito, Madara and every other member of the Akatsuki is nothing but supporting characters for Naruto's storyline. Which they are not, they are all ranked as "villains" of the story, same as Sasuke was at some point (Five Kage Summit) and he has his own story completely separated from Naruto's. That being said, the main character if the manga Naruto is still Naruto. (As I did state above, if someone would bother to read it before they start to troll so badly.) But, placing him as a supporting character is still faulty. A supporting character isn't as important to the current plot as the main character, unless you mean that the plot would be ruined if Sakura suddenly died.

 

[Flaming Amaterasu]

I wouldn't relegate sasuke as a useless side character but I would call him a supporting character. His story isn't the primary storyline(hence why he can't be the main character) but he does have a rather complex and developed backstory that is in relation to the main character(naruto). So, he's very important to the manga obv but I wouldn't classify him as a main character.

This is ignorance in itself. Sasuke is one of the main characters, his development has been since the beginning, with Naruto, thus classifying him as one of the main characters by default.

Not spoon feeding, just that you are either using bad grammar or you are delusional. I also didn't make the discussion about there being no possible way for it to be more than one main character in a manga. (That was you, not me.) Sasuke and Naruto has both had their own paths in the story, their own plots, largely unconnected by each other in Part II. Naruto's reason for wanting to be come strong was in order to become Hokage and make everyone acknowledge him. His reason for wanting to remove hatred was because of Jiraya's wishes. Neither has anything to do with Sasuke, as he didn't advance Naruto's story as he is not directly a part of anyone else's.

Sasuke's reason for gaining power was Itachi, his reason for leaving Konoha was Orochimaru and his reason for helping the Akatsuki was Obito. His reason wanting to protect Konoha was Itachi and the Hokage's. Neither is affected by Naruto. The story of Naruto is a story told from two views, one is the view of Naruto and the other is the view of Sasuke. The story originally started with a shared view of both of them. Later that separated into two views and have no been placed together again. If Naruto hadn't existed then Sasuke would still have gone after Itachi, he would still have wanted to protect the village.

If Sasuke hadn't existed then Naruto would have died against Haku. (That is 100% certain.)

He's one of the more "special" narutards on here, pay little mind to him. Naruto and Sasuke are equal as it currently stands.

 

[Shinato]

LOL me too.

Seriously the OP starts by dissing people for jump to conclusions then proceeds to make the most ridiculous jump in logic I've read about Sasuke's ability to date.

Dissing people? Why is that everyone who says something has such a hard time hearing someone else say that they say it? I merely stated that people are going to a single conclusion which is the most drastic conclusion one can go to, which is human instinct. (To expect the worst.) So, I said that they are doing that without thinking of other possibilities or a slightly weaker version of it. Then I stated my own conclusion of a possibility. I never once insulted or commented negatively to someone else, nor did I say that jumping to the most drastic conclusion is directly wrong. By every information we've gained of Sasuke's abilities so far, logically he should be able to swap places with anything he can at least see. (If not imagine) That includes someone's head, which is an instant kill. That alone was my own guess on his powers, other than that I just noted that his "limitations" may not be as drastic as the majority seems to think.

 

[Flaming Amaterasu]

Dissing people? Why is that everyone who says something has such a hard time hearing someone else say that they say it? I merely stated that people are going to a single conclusion which is the most drastic conclusion one can go to, which is human instinct. (To expect the worst.) So, I said that they are doing that without thinking of other possibilities or a slightly weaker version of it. Then I stated my own conclusion of a possibility. I never once insulted or commented negatively to someone else, nor did I say that jumping to the most drastic conclusion is directly wrong. By every information we've gained of Sasuke's abilities so far, logically he should be able to swap places with anything he can at least see. (If not imagine) That includes someone's head, which is an instant kill. That alone was my own guess on his powers, other than that I just noted that his "limitations" may not be as drastic as the majority seems to think.

The reason Kag was able to dodge his technique was because she was shifting dimensions and Sasuke was already going in for the attack for more analysis on her. The people who keep saying it's so impressive with naruto hitting her with a bijuu claw are hilarious because it was thanks to Sasuke keeping her busy that it was even possible for naruto to land a strike.

 

[Flakez]

logically he should be able to swap places with anything he can at least see. (If not imagine) That includes someone's head, which is an instant kill. That alone was my own guess on his powers

Might as well post this in the fanfic section.

Kishi is not stupid enough to make something like this.

 

[ThePooka]

Might as well post this in the fanfic section.

Kishi is not stupid enough to make something like this.

Maybe Sasuke will switch places with Narutos balls like the OP predicted. :'(

 

[Draxus]

Dissing people? Why is that everyone who says something has such a hard time hearing someone else say that they say it? I merely stated that people are going to a single conclusion which is the most drastic conclusion one can go to, which is human instinct. (To expect the worst.) So, I said that they are doing that without thinking of other possibilities or a slightly weaker version of it. Then I stated my own conclusion of a possibility. I never once insulted or commented negatively to someone else, nor did I say that jumping to the most drastic conclusion is directly wrong. By every information we've gained of Sasuke's abilities so far, logically he should be able to swap places with anything he can at least see. (If not imagine) That includes someone's head, which is an instant kill. That alone was my own guess on his powers, other than that I just noted that his "limitations" may not be as drastic as the majority seems to think.

I would consider these disses btw:

Judging his powers based of half information is doomed to come out wrong, which is what people are doing. Now, people say that this ability he has is not strong or OP because of the limitations. Those that say that either lack imagination or logic.

Don't get hung up on the word choice that you miss the entire point. You sir, are a hypocrite. You said people shouldn't be doing something then immediately did the same thing.

Also to settle the other debate going on here. Sasuke is not the main character (protagonist), he is a 2nd character (deuteragonist).

 

[Shinato]

Might as well post this in the fanfic section.

Kishi is not stupid enough to make something like this.

He may not, but from what we know of his powers as of right now, he should be able to do just that. What we know; That it has a time limit and a range limit. That Sasuke can swap two things within his range in an instant as long as he can see it. That includes people, as he has done with both Kaguya and Madara in the past. If his ability will be noted to be unable to select specific parts of a human in a newer chapter, then he will not be able to do it. That is why I am stating, with the current knowledge we have of his powers.

 

[jiraiya nindo]

I never once stated Sasuke as a main character, but a side character/support character is something he is not. By Pooka's logic, Obito, Madara and every other member of the Akatsuki is nothing but supporting characters for Naruto's storyline. Which they are not, they are all ranked as "villains" of the story, same as Sasuke was at some point (Five Kage Summit) and he has his own story completely separated from Naruto's. That being said, the main character if the manga Naruto is still Naruto. (As I did state above, if someone would bother to read it before they start to troll so badly.) But, placing him as a supporting character is still faulty. A supporting character isn't as important to the current plot as the main character, unless you mean that the plot would be ruined if Sakura suddenly died.

Sasuke isn't a villian, he doesn't display the usual villian archtypes. I would classify sasuke as more of an anti-hero since he parallels naruto but is also in contrast to naruto's path. His goals were always good but he achieved his goals through evil means. Sasuke is the antagonist to naruto who is the protagonist of the manga.

To your second point, that's not true. Supporting characters have what they call subplots. These subplots are very important as they connect different plot lines from the main character. I think sasuke's role has largely been comprised of subplots that move the overall story or main plot along.

 

[ThePooka]

Sasuke isn't a villian, he doesn't display the usual villian archtypes. I would classify sasuke as more of an anti-hero since he parallels naruto but is also in contrast to naruto's path. His goals were always good but he achieved his goals through evil means. Sasuke is the antagonist to naruto who is the protagonist of the manga.

To your second point, that's not true. Supporting characters have what they call subplots. These subplots are very important as they connect different plot lines from the main character. I think sasuke's role has largely been comprised of subplots that move the overall story or main plot along.

It's great that the OP is getting a dose of reality today. It's hard to combat fanboy delusions alone, but I'm lucky have some support in the form of "common sense" from the rest of the forum community.

 

[Draxus]

He may not, but from what we know of his powers as of right now, he should be able to do just that. What we know; That it has a time limit and a range limit. That Sasuke can swap two things within his range in an instant as long as he can see it. That includes people, as he has done with both Kaguya and Madara in the past. If his ability will be noted to be unable to select specific parts of a human in a newer chapter, then he will not be able to do it. That is why I am stating, with the current knowledge we have of his powers.

If you can admit that much, then you should stop saying that it's only because of plot that he doesn't use his ability to swap organs or rip off body parts. Since for all we know, he can't! It could be he has to swap whole objects.

Blaming plot for Sasuke's power's limitations is why people are calling you a fanboy

 

[Shinato]

Don't get hung up on the word choice that you miss the entire point. You sir, are a hypocrite. You said people shouldn't be doing something then immediately did the same thing.

Also to settle the other debate going on here. Sasuke is not the main character (protagonist), he is a deuteragonist.

And you are ignoring what others are saying to assume the role of "correct". I said, that conclusions based on half information is doomed to go wrong. So I went ahead and proved that by coming up with one single different outcome that may just as well be the case. Beyond that point, I never did actual state my own conclusion of his powers. I stated what he said and what we knew about the power, then stated the logical outcome of it. (I stated, that if he says he can swap places with something in an instant, then he should be able to do that with anything, including body parts or a rat.) That is not a theory or conclusion, that is stating exactly what the character said, only with an example. Then I took out a point in regards to his eye contact comment, which is flawed by the Manga itself. I took out that point and made a theory on how that may be wrong as the manga has provided proof that he doesn't require eye contact. (Not a conclusion to his power, but a theory on how one of his "limitations" works.) What I said that people are doing is that they are judging an entire tree by a few of its leaves. They are judging Sasuke's entire power based off a few half information of a single one of his powers. Then taking it to the most drastic levels possible. Neither of which I did. (So again, people have problems when someone states something that someone else said.) I stated what Sasuke said, and I made assumptions that is not drastic on a singular point of his comments. While I said that people shouldn't make the most drastic conclusions to an entire character's power based of a few small bits of info. I did the opposite of what I said that someone shouldn't do. So again, people just have problems when someone states something someone else said.

 

[Draxus]

And you are ignoring what others are saying to assume the role of "correct". I said, that conclusions based on half information is doomed to go wrong. So I went ahead and proved that by coming up with one single different outcome that may just as well be the case. Beyond that point, I never did actual state my own conclusion of his powers. I stated what he said and what we knew about the power, then stated the logical outcome of it. (I stated, that if he says he can swap places with something in an instant, then he should be able to do that with anything, including body parts or a rat.) That is not a theory or conclusion, that is stating exactly what the character said, only with an example. Then I took out a point in regards to his eye contact comment, which is flawed by the Manga itself. I took out that point and made a theory on how that may be wrong as the manga has provided proof that he doesn't require eye contact. (Not a conclusion to his power, but a theory on how one of his "limitations" works.) What I said that people are doing is that they are judging an entire tree by a few of its leaves. They are judging Sasuke's entire power based off a few half information of a single one of his powers. Then taking it to the most drastic levels possible. Neither of which I did. (So again, people have problems when someone states something that someone else said.) I stated what Sasuke said, and I made assumptions that is not drastic on a singular point of his comments. While I said that people shouldn't make the most drastic conclusions to an entire character's power based of a few small bits of info. I did the opposite of what I said that someone shouldn't do. So again, people just have problems when someone states something someone else said.

When did I say other peoples assumptions were correct?

So by your own completely made up rule (you really think its impossible to come to a correct conclusion with only have the info? HA!), your conclusions are also doomed. You are basing you own ideas off the same "leaves". That's what hypocrisy is all about.

In your opinion your assumptions are not drastic, but I, and many others would disagree.

 

[Shinato]

If you can admit that much, then you should stop saying that it's only because of plot that he doesn't use his ability to swap organs or rip off body parts. Since for all we know, he can't! It could be he has to swap whole objects.

Blaming plot for Sasuke's power's limitations is why people are calling you a fanboy

He has proven that he can switch the place of others, with Kagyua and Madara. Even if he cannot replace organs (which was an example.) then he can still teleport Kaguya to wherever he wants, as he did it in the past. (Or he did it with Naruto/Madara, meaning he is able to do it with people too and not just objects.) He could easily have placed his hand against Naruto's and teleported Kaguya inbetween the seals and beaten her. Though plot restricts that, as seen before. We lack information on a single point, so I made a theory around that single point, still I did state the he may just be able to only swap whole objects/people. That means that I stating a possible idea, not stating it as a fact. However, I stated that plot limits that, because it does if he is able. Even without doing that, even with just swapping Kaguya as a whole, he can still instantly beat her with Naruto's help. (The seal) Meaning that plot even restricts his ability which we know he is able to do. (Meaning that logically, it restricts him from other things as well.)

 

[Shinato]

When did I say other peoples assumptions were correct?

So by your own completely made up rule (which is dumb BTW, you really think its impossible to come to a correct conclusion with only have the info), your conclusions are also doomed. You are basing you own ideas off the same "leaves". That's what hypocrisy is all about.

In your opinion your assumptions are not drastic, but I, and many others would disagree.

I said it was doomed, not that it was doomed to go wrong or right. The definition of the word "Doomed" is that you are decided to reach an un-happy ending and to some what they have theorized are a good ending and to some its a bad ending. (As they are both subjective) Though that is not really the point here. I said that it is impossible to know that you have guessed right until all your information has been given, that is what we have proof/evidence for. You cannot really know if you are right until its proven, even then it may not be correct. (As if someone trick you for example..) Also, learn to read before you reply. I said that people are basing Sasuke's entire powerlevel of this one power and the "limitations" we know of it. I based my theory of the facts we have of it, and the made a theory around a single of his "limitations". Not his entire power. (I only stated what we know about the other two "limitations", I didn't make a theory about them.) A drastic assumptions would be one of two extremes, like left or right, weak or strong. People are making the drastic assumptions that Sasuke is weak based on half information, which I advice against. I made a theory based of a single point using logic and what we know so far. (Using logic to fill in the missing areas.) Not his entire power like what people do, that is why its not drastic.

 

[Draxus]

He has proven that he can switch the place of others, with Kagyua and Madara. Even if he cannot replace organs (which was an example.) then he can still teleport Kaguya to wherever he wants, as he did it in the past. (Or he did it with Naruto/Madara, meaning he is able to do it with people too and not just objects.) He could easily have placed his hand against Naruto's and teleported Kaguya inbetween the seals and beaten her. Though plot restricts that, as seen before. We lack information on a single point, so I made a theory around that single point, still I did state the he may just be able to only swap whole objects/people. That means that I stating a possible idea, not stating it as a fact. However, I stated that plot limits that, because it does if he is able. Even without doing that, even with just swapping Kaguya as a whole, he can still instantly beat her with Naruto's help. (The seal) Meaning that plot even restricts his ability which we know he is able to do. (Meaning that logically, it restricts him from other things as well.)

No he can't teleport Kaguya where every he wants. He would need to have to swap he body with something in between Naruto and himself. So as you say we don't know everything about this ability, so you can't make the claim that Sasuke doesn't use it in the way you think he should is purely because of plot.

You don't know all the restrictions of the ability. Of course if you're saying that the only reason the ability has restrictions is because of plot, then I can't argue against that, but that would be ridiculous argument to make since you can easily state the reason he has the ability at all is because of plot.

I said it was doomed, not that it was doomed to go wrong or right. The definition of the word "Doomed" is that you are decided to reach an un-happy ending and to some what they have theorized are a good ending and to some its a bad ending. (As they are both subjective) Though that is not really the point here. I said that it is impossible to know that you have guessed right until all your information has been given, that is what we have proof/evidence for. You cannot really know if you are right until its proven, even then it may not be correct. (As if someone trick you for example..) Also, learn to read before you reply. I said that people are basing Sasuke's entire powerlevel of this one power and the "limitations" we know of it. I based my theory of the facts we have of it, and the made a theory around a single of his "limitations". Not his entire power. (I only stated what we know about the other two "limitations", I didn't make a theory about them.) A drastic assumptions would be one of two extremes, like left or right, weak or strong. People are making the drastic assumptions that Sasuke is weak based on half information, which I advice against. I made a theory based of a single point using logic and what we know so far. (Using logic to fill in the missing areas.) Not his entire power like what people do, that is why its not drastic.

LOL... dude context matters, okay! You clearly used doomed in a way to infer that their conclusions would turn out to be incorrect. This type of backpedaling and word gymnastics is quite unbecoming.

There is no way you can separate limitations from the power, since its the limitations that define how the power is used. So by adding or changing a limitation you intern change the entire power. But how every you wanna "define" what you are doing, it still isn't any different to the observer between you and anyone else's theory on the limitations of Sasuke's power.

Again, you can't objectively define everything. "Drastic" is in the eye of the beholder. You saying he can swap someones organs w/ a rock is incredibly drastic to me. The other poster's idea of him being able rip someones head is less drastic, as we know this can be done w/ kumi, but I feel these two doujutsu work completely differently. It's fine if you feel it's not drastic, but how most communities work is that the popular opinion is generally excepted. If you think you're idea isn't drastic you should be able find a size-able people on the Base who would agree. I personally don't think you will.