[Discussion] bleach power level is overrated

Forbidden Tale · Jul 16, 2014

RustledJimmies said:
For your own sake, I seriously hope you're trolling.

For your own sake, re read some parts (Aizen vs Yama and Yhwach/Royd vs Yama).

Indora · Jul 16, 2014

RustledJimmies said:
I'm not saying you did, but following that logic, he could put even Goku under KS and it would be GG, nobody is saying that Aizen > Goku, but if KS supposedly GG's everyone, then why not Goku if we're going to follow such logic ?

For your own sake, I seriously hope you're trolling.

@BOLD who said that it solos everyone? It is just about Naruto characters :|

RustledJimmies · Jul 16, 2014

Indora said:
@BOLD who said that it solos everyone? It is just about Naruto characters :|

Re-read the thread please, everyone is saying that KS is unavoidable and BS like that, if it's that powerful, then why wouldn't it solo Goku ? That's what P3ĮÑ was trying to say (I guess).

Forbidden Tale said:
For your own sake, re read some parts (Aizen vs Yama and Yhwach/Royd vs Yama).

I read all of them multiple times, his Bankai has never shown country busting feats, let alone planet busting.

Indora · Jul 16, 2014

RustledJimmies said:
Re-read the thread please, everyone is saying that KS is unavoidable and BS like that, if it's that powerful, then why wouldn't it solo Goku ? That's what P3ĮÑ was trying to say (I guess).

I read all of them multiple times, his Bankai has never shown country busting feats, let alone planet busting.

If they are people who said I must have overlooked that. If that is the case I agree with you that Aizen is overhyped, but still I do not think a Naruto character can defeat Aizen. Only shisui (maybe?)

P3ĮÑ · Jul 16, 2014

Indora said:
@BOLD who said that it solos everyone? It is just about Naruto characters :|

it was my example originally to point out a fallacy. the no limits fallacy which is constantly being abused here with KS. the fact he got beaten nonetheless and weakened by a mugestu slash isn't being mentioned.

This is when someone states that because something has not demonstrated any limits (or only certain limits) then it has none (or only the ones demonstrated).

Example: "Itachi said that no one without a Mangekyou Sharingan can defeat him. Therefore he can beat all of DC, Marvel, DBZ, and Tenchi Muyo."

The person in this argument holds Itachi's statement to be absolute truth, ignoring the possibility that Itachi has no knowledge of certain enemies, or never expected to encounter them. The same can be said of Kishimoto: He never intended for his characters to be pitted in battle against characters from other works of fiction, so therefore statements like this do not hold true to other works of fiction necessarily. Furthermore, there is the possibility that in - universe, Itachi was lying, bluffing, misinformed, or deluded.

A rather common example here, but the reasoning would apply much further. the same logic is also applicable to aizen in this case with his KS, since 'no one' has broken out of it. well yammamoto did anyway. so once caught, you're dead, even tho the opposing char might be way more durable.

TL;DR hyperboles and fallacies are frowned upon in legitimate debates, whereas in nb they're rigidly abused with many verses.

Forbidden Tale · Jul 16, 2014

RustledJimmies said:
I read all of them multiple times, his Bankai has never shown country busting feats, let alone planet busting.

Never showed feats, since Kubo never allowed Yama to go all out.

Yamamoto statament in battle against Yhwach: "I must finish this battle soon, otherwise we all will die" and Unohana said: "Commander finish this quickly before you destroy whole SS by your own strength. Kyoraku and Ukitake if mind serves me right, also said something similar.

Aizen statament in FKT about his shikai: "Ennetsu Jigoku can destroy multiply size area of this thiny town (Karakura - 100.000+ population, which is alone greater than Hidden villages). Multiply size area: area of 200.000+ population, again far greater than hidden villages. Juubi's TBB is also far greater than hidden villages, so that's why I said around same level.

Υαmí · Jul 16, 2014

If I recall, Hagoromo created the moon(which is the size of the united states) on his death bed...his mother, Kaguya, is more powerful than when he was at his strongest. I can't recall a time when any bleach charecter had shown something on a equal or greater power than that :I

Indora · Jul 16, 2014

P3ĮÑ said:
it was my example originally to point out a fallacy. the no limits fallacy which is constantly being abused here with KS. the fact he got beaten nonetheless and weakened by a mugestu slash isn't being mentioned.

This is when someone states that because something has not demonstrated any limits (or only certain limits) then it has none (or only the ones demonstrated).

Example: "Itachi said that no one without a Mangekyou Sharingan can defeat him. Therefore he can beat all of DC, Marvel, DBZ, and Tenchi Muyo."

The person in this argument holds Itachi's statement to be absolute truth, ignoring the possibility that Itachi has no knowledge of certain enemies, or never expected to encounter them. The same can be said of Kishimoto: He never intended for his characters to be pitted in battle against characters from other works of fiction, so therefore statements like this do not hold true to other works of fiction necessarily. Furthermore, there is the possibility that in - universe, Itachi was lying, bluffing, misinformed, or deluded.

A rather common example here, but the reasoning would apply much further. the same logic is also applicable to aizen in this case with his KS, since 'no one' has broken out of it. well yammamoto did anyway. so once caught, you're dead, even tho the opposing char might be way more durable.

TL;DR hyperboles and fallacies are frowned upon in legitimate debates, whereas in nb they're rigidly abused with many verses.

You make good points, but Aizen never used KS in Ichigo's fight so I do not think this was a good example. However I agree with you that Aizen is over-hyped, but he would likely still defeat any character in a one on one battle since he has enough DC and his KS.

RustledJimmies · Jul 16, 2014

Forbidden Tale said:
Never showed feats, since Kubo never allowed Yama to go all out.

Yamamoto statament in battle against Yhwach: "I must finish this battle soon, otherwise we all will die" and Unohana said: "Commander finish this quickly before you destroy whole SS by your own strength. Kyoraku and Ukitake if mind serves me right, also said something similar.

Aizen statament in FKT about his shikai: "Ennetsu Jigoku can destroy multiply size area of this thiny town (Karakura - 100.000+ population, which is alone greater than Hidden villages). Multiply size area: area of 200.000+ population, again far greater than hidden villages. Juubi's TBB is also far greater than hidden villages, so that's why I said around same level.

Just read P3ĮÑ's posts, those are obvious hyperboles with no feats supporting them, Amaterasu was also stated to burn as hot as the sun.

Umari Senju · Jul 16, 2014

Kirikoe said:
lol its not only aizen though..

Gremmy > NV .-.

This right here. I was just going to mention this Stern Ritter. He literally bombarded Soul Society with a Meteor equivalent if not larger than Madara's meteor Drop on the SA.......

.......And Kenpachi sliced in into peices without breaking a sweat. It took 2 Kage and everything they had to stop Madara's.

Yes Bleach Universes Power scale is on par with the NV

Lana Del Taka · Jul 16, 2014

Chīkara said:
Well Aizen really GG'S.

You must be registered for see images

Suigetsu!!

P3ĮÑ · Jul 16, 2014

Indora said:
You make good points, but Aizen never used KS in Ichigo's fight so I do not think this was a good example.

so is it safe to assume that aizen lost his KS ability while in hogyuko form? or was he too blinded by his power?

but he would likely still defeat any character in a one on one battle since he has enough DC and his KS.

his fraggor isn't as much destructive as the juubi TBB anyway with the feats he did, the size of the crator doesn't match the AOE of the juubi TBB. also, when you say any character, that's just no. we have universal level anime characters. or do you mean from naruto only?

Indora · Jul 16, 2014

P3ĮÑ said:
so is it safe to assume that aizen lost his KS ability while in hogyuko form? or was he too blinded by his power?

his fraggor isn't as much destructive as the juubi TBB anyway with the feats he did, the size of the crator doesn't match the AOE of the juubi TBB. also, when you say any character, that's just no. we have universal level anime characters. or do you mean from naruto only?

Only Naruto. I am well aware that there are Verses that even make DBZ look like fodder. Also I think that Aizen was too blinded by his power. It would not make much sense if a stronger version of him loses his main power.

Umari Senju · Jul 16, 2014

P3ĮÑ said:
so is it safe to assume that aizen lost his KS ability while in hogyuko form? or was he too blinded by his power?

his fraggor isn't as much destructive as the juubi TBB anyway with the feats he did, the size of the crator doesn't match the AOE of the juubi TBB. also, when you say any character, that's just no. we have universal level anime characters. or do you mean from naruto only?

@ 1st part: Maybe he was blinded by his power. There was no mention that he could no longer us KS ability so I would go with the latter (blinded by power)

@ 2nd Part: So true. If the he meant any character anywhere then we need only to turn to DBZ as the powerscaling there is way higher than any Naruto character.

Forbidden Tale · Jul 16, 2014

RustledJimmies said:
Just read P3ĮÑ's posts, those are obvious hyperboles with no feats supporting them, Amaterasu was also stated to burn as hot as the sun.

No, there were stated by multiple characters (4-6), so character lying, bluffing, misinformed, or deluded can't apply here.
Yes, amaterasu was stated to be hot as sun, and it was stated by Kishimoto himself, so I don't see why would I go against it.

When you mentioned "hot as sun", temperature of ZnT is 15.000.000 degrees, you think that something like that wouldn't be able to destroy world?

Umari Senju · Jul 16, 2014

Forbidden Tale said:
No, there were stated by multiple characters (4-6), so character lying, bluffing, misinformed, or deluded can't apply here.
Yes, amaterasu was stated to be hot as sun, and it was stated by Kishimoto himself, so I don't see why would I go against it.

When you mentioned "hot as sun", temperature of ZnT is 15.000.000 degrees, you think that something like that wouldn't be able to destroy world?

If there is enough of it yes it could destroy the world. But have you seen any Uchiha, Including Madara use an Amateratsu capable of even destroying an entire village in one fell swoop?

Now if he can somehow make a grand scale Amateratsu say spawn from his Perfect Susanoo then Yeah at best he could probably destory a small country....But the world is a big place and tring to destroy the whole thing is going to take something huge which we have yet to see in Madar's or any uchiha's aresnal.

Forbidden Tale · Jul 16, 2014

Umari Senju said:
If there is enough of it yes it could destroy the world. But have you seen any Uchiha, Including Madara use an Amateratsu capable of even destroying an entire village in one fell swoop?

Now if he can somehow make a grand scale Amateratsu say spawn from his Perfect Susanoo then Yeah at best he could probably destory a small country....But the world is a big place and tring to destroy the whole thing is going to take something huge which we have yet to see in Madar's or any uchiha's aresnal.

What? You most probably misunderstand me, I didn't say that Amaterasu can destroy the world, i'm reffering to Yamamato from Bleach.

realobito1 · Jul 16, 2014

First off their are only two people in Naruto that can even do a tailed beast ball. And including them their are five people in naruto that can even compete with bleach. Every captain in the battle in fake karakura town resulted in entire buildings crumbling. Every captain in bleach has this kinda power. Yammamoto can destroy soul society with the mere presence of his bankai. Why are we even talking about this? bleach characters get hit by powerful explosions that destroy the surrounding area. Naruto characters don't have their endurance so it is not even a matter of power so much as Naruto character are essentially human and the characters in bleach are supernartural gods of death!
And Before you start I prefer Naruto to bleach, however the characters are not as strong

Umari Senju · Jul 16, 2014

Forbidden Tale said:
What? You most probably misunderstand me, I didn't say that Amaterasu can destroy the world, i'm reffering to Yamamato from Bleach.

Whoops my bad. well then....yeah....He split a large swath of ground in two with his Bankai and that was a simple slash. Pushed to his limits yeah Yamamoto could probably pierce the earths core with that and start a planetary catastrophe.

And the real kicker is all the members of 0 squad are said to be even more powerful than him!

Autism · Jul 16, 2014

I'm going to NOW respond to you failures because P31N already owned you hard enough -- don't respond, and I am not even trying, you tards have ZERO argument.

Firstly I will be using physic calculations, you cannot deny simple physics and if done such, your argument is hereby invalidated and you have ZERO credibility, less than you already have for not looking into the matter at hand. These calcs were done at NF and widely accepted, by people with Ph.D.s in the matter, no it does not matter if it's "not official", or "not canon", because it makes perfect sense and if you want to debunk the calc? Come at me right here or make a thread there, you'll be ridiculed either way.

Gremmy's meteor: