[Discussion] Why does everyone think Marineford WB>Admiral?

[Tobi98]

Nah. Luffy, Newgate, Garp and Shanks were on their own level at that war.

Luffy? What da ****? He was fodder compared to characters in the war

IMO:

Admiral = Yonkou =< Old Whiteeard << Prime Whitebeard

 

[Dr Strangelove]

Luffy? What da ****? He was fodder compared to characters in the war

IMO:

Admiral = Yonkou =< Old Whiteeard << Prime Whitebeard

Pfft, he punched Garp.

And an Admiral does not equal a Yonko, otherwise there would be no Yonko left. The WG would just wipe them out.

 

[Olorin]

I do actually think that if Akainu and WB went all out no distractions it would be about a 50:50 win chance

I do think that Admiral tier is extremely close to Yonko tier (keep in mind that the yonko and admirals all have differerent power levels)

why do you think akainu had to lie to squardo so he can betray whitebeard? he needed a way for whitebeard to be injured before he made a move.

and he was also getting heart attacks at marineford and STILL was a threat.

He lied to squardo because they were in war and he was trying to get every advantage he could

think a 60 year old whitbeard could take on all 3 Admirals and win Tbh U_U.

Yea ... No

After his match against Akainu it was clear WB was gonna die, he was very weak after the fight, after Akainu v WB WB went and died while Akainu pished back ALL the porates including the commanders and Marco and they fled from him

 

[Tobi98]

Pfft, he punched Garp.

And an Admiral does not equal a Yonko, otherwise there would be no Yonko left. The WG would just wipe them out.

Pfft Garp let him

Yeah and they would leave the headquarter without anyone to protect it from other pirates

 

[Dr Strangelove]

Pfft Garp let him

Yeah and they would leave the headquarter without anyone to protect it from other pirates

Pfft no he didn't.

No they wouldn't? Fleet Admiral, VAs. Any of the Yonko could mid diff an Admiral.

 

[Konohas gelber Blitz]

Plot No Attack U_U

 

[Olorin]

Pfft no he didn't.

No they wouldn't? Fleet Admiral, VAs. Any of the Yonko could mid diff an Admiral.

it's not as simple as you put it

Marines: Akainu, Fujitora, Kizaru, Ryokugyu than there's also Mihawk, Kuma, 7th Sichibukai, ... than there's the VA's, not to mention Kong, CP-0 and the Gorosei, you could also include Magellan, ...

Pirates: Shanks, Blackbeard, Kaido, BM, Ben Backman, the first mates of the other 3, ...

I honestly think that the WG as a whole has more power than the 4 Yonko, they balance eachother out, they both have enough power so one doesn't actively seek to destroy the other

 

[Dr Strangelove]

it's not as simple as you put it

Marines: Akainu, Fujitora, Kizaru, Ryokugyu than there's also Mihawk, Kuma, 7th Sichibukai, ... than there's the VA's, not to mention Kong, CP-0 and the Gorosei, you could also include Magellan, ...

Pirates: Shanks, Blackbeard, Kaido, BM, Ben Backman, the first mates of the other 3, ...

I honestly think that the WG as a whole has more power than the 4 Yonko, they balance eachother out, they both have enough power so one doesn't actively seek to destroy the other

The way I put it was pretty simple, a Yonko could mid diff an Admiral. Where did I mention 4 Yonko going against every single force the WG has? I happen to disagree with you, I think the 4 Yonko together could take down the WG, it would be an extremely close battle though.

 

[Hori]

it's not as simple as you put it

Marines: Akainu, Fujitora, Kizaru, Ryokugyu than there's also Mihawk, Kuma, 7th Sichibukai, ... than there's the VA's, not to mention Kong, CP-0 and the Gorosei, you could also include Magellan, ...

Pirates: Shanks, Blackbeard, Kaido, BM, Ben Backman, the first mates of the other 3, ...

I honestly think that the WG as a whole has more power than the 4 Yonko, they balance eachother out, they both have enough power so one doesn't actively seek to destroy the other

I don't think so, the Yonkos have more power than the Marines just that Marines have more men than Pirates... but if you include all the pirates in the new world you will see that there are more strong pirates than strong Marines.... Just look a dressrosa so many strong pirates there. This is why the Navy is constantly arresting pirates to Impel down and also remember about those pirates who escaped from Impel down... the navy lacks too much strong marines... that is why they moved their HQ to the New World... seems like the 1st half is much more safer than it was before now.

 

[Hexuze]

Really?

You do realize that WB was extremely sick and he even fought with Akainu (the strongest admiral at that time) who was near death. He assumed that he killed him once he fell down that crack. Akainu was saved by plot; he would of died if he hadn't held on to that ledge. WB can solo the pre-TS admirals from mid. diff (Kizaru) to high diff. (Kuzan/Aokiji). WB couldn't use his haki to his fullest either since he was sick (according to Shon93's theory). WB was severely handicapped during this war which is no surprise because Oda obviously did this on purpose cause he would of been too OP.

Whitebeard has to fight Kizaru with full power or he will get destroyed.

Well no sh*t. What you think the admirals are weak? Anyone would have to fight an admiral with "full power" even Roger. I doubt he can easily just destroy an admiral without trying even at his prime. Also, WB was mainly focused on Ace's execution at that time.

Although WB manages to TEMPORARILY stop Akainu (he was later seen fighting against the entire WB pirates and coming out on top), at what cost? At the cost of a significant portion of his face. A wound that would be life threatening. This was after he ambushed Akainu too. A careless and sloppy fighting style like that only made matters worse for WB.

Again, Akainu was saved by plot. Don't quote me on this but I remember in a interview that Oda stated that he intended on Akainu dying during the war but he obviously let him live for plot purposes. You're also acting as if WB wasn't suppose to get scars/wounds from fighting an admiral lol. Ofc he's going to get wounded when fighting one of the strongest arsenal that the marines have (admirals).

Rayleigh too easily fought on par with Kizaru. Yet everyone keeps saying WB is above admirals and some go as far as too say he could stalemate 2 admirals. Seriously.

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^Rayleigh never "easily" fought on par with Kizaru either. He struggled as well due to "old age"; if was fighting easily with Kizaru then he could of been able to help the SH's. I agree WB is a bit over-hyped here but he can solo any of the admirals with high-diff.

Conclusion: Despite his OP DF, WB is about the same as Rayleigh and the admirals. Prime WB and Prime Rayleigh are above, though. Although they still can't handle 2 admirals, I would say.

I doubt someone can handle two admirals at the same time. That's a bit over-kill considering what they can do. It's like saying Luffy can handle both Zoro and Sanji at the same time.

 

[shon93]

This guy can't be serious look at the shit Oda had to do beforehand to make WB fightable for Akainu. I don't think that can be skimmed over. WB only dropped to the floor because he was stab in the chest beforehand

Akainu was a fly to WB

 

[Fireplay]

Tell that to all the blood Akainu was coughing.

 

[shon93]

Tell that to all the blood Akainu was coughing.

The quote in yoru sig is funny

 

[Magi]

Completely disagree.. I believe that even in his old age, he would destroy any admiral one on one

 

[SSS12]

But he did win, he won against Akainu

Akainu survived and owned the rest of WB Pirates 10 mins later. WB was left dying with 1/3 of his face blown away before his death was hastened by BB.

Newgate was stronger than all those 3 Admirals at that time, simply because for them to be able to fight him they placed a lewd plan in motion. If you remember correctly:

1. Newgate's health was badlly deteriorated even before the fight.
2. He got stabbed by Squado on the chest and yet Sakazuki, Kuzan and Borsalino were not able to defeat him. They simply injured him.
3. After all that he took down a giant, stopped a ship with one hand that Squado was riding.
4. Managed to defeat Teach well that is until he recieved help from his comrades...

Sakazuki was suppose to die in the war but due to Oda's change of plans he was alive. Kizaru is afraid of Ben Beckman which I think Newgate can easily defeat, face it Edward was stronger than all Admirals even Sengoku and Garp are stronger than those Admirals but they still admitted inferiority to him... he wasn't called the strongest for nothing. The admials failed to defeat a legend that had lost its fangs... lol

1. As I said, characters like Luffy, Zoro, Law have their best feats when severely injured and motivated. WB had the greatest motivation of all.
2. The admirals never finished their fight with WB. Akainu gravely injured WB while he himself revovered 10 mins later to bust up WB's crew by himself.
3. Even Luffy took down a giant alone, let's not debate what an admiral could do. Both Kizaru and Akainu stopped WB's Bisento with their foot like a boss.
4. That cocky fool would lose to any admiral too.
Akainu survived and kicked the butt of entire WB Pirates by himself. Kizaru was being sarcastic. Or did you forget he still attacked Law's submarine? Come on man. Where did Sengoku and Garp admit WB was stronger? Please show me. The objective was to STOP WB from rescuing Ace, not to kill him. They succeeded. WB failed miserably.

Whitebeard >>>>>every Admiral in a one on one fight....his second in command Marco was able to kick around admirals like its soccer....well except for Akainu U_U of course......Plus Whitebeard wrecked Akainu....he could barely put up a fist to whitebeard the only reason he was able to damage whitbeard is because of his lethal magma.....I think a 60 year old whitbeard could take on all 3 Admirals and win Tbh U_U.

WB>>>>Admiral? One of the supposed-to-be-much-weaker admiral blew away WB face to seal his fate. The reason WB is so strong is because of his quakes too. WB defeat every admiral alone? Not even 2 60 year old WB could do that. Marco was owned by Akainu too.

Is this a joke? Even in his weakened and illness ridden old age wb was able to pummel akainu into oblivion and could certainly have killed him. Look at the amount of damage he took and still kept going. WB is a monster, only matched by Roger and Garp in his prime.

Could have and did are two different things. Facts are - Akainu blew away WB Face and recovered from his beating 10 mins later to bust up rest of WB's crew. He is a monster, but let's not mix up facts with illusions man. I'm talking about Marineford WB not Prime WB.

why do you think akainu had to lie to squardo so he can betray whitebeard? he needed a way for whitebeard to be injured before he made a move.

and he was also getting heart attacks at marineford and STILL was a threat.

To unsettle and confuse the Pirates. So that his allies turn against WB. Half the people fighting for the marines never broke a sweat. If they did, God save the WB alliance.

There is a huge difference between kizaru's hit and run tactics when Whitebeard is destroying some other victim.

If WB fought him one on one, he would pummel him.

Akoji tried to freeze him, that good easily overwhelmed and Akoji ended up getting a stabbed in the chest.

Whitebeard who was sick and already stabbed, end up destroying akainu and sending him underground.


So Whitebeard>>>Admirals

All yonkous>>>admirals at this point

That's Kizaru's fighting style, sorry it's not suicidal like WB's. WB couldn't scratch Aokiji either, remember. WB thought he had defeated Akainu after he blew away half his face. That mistake turned out pretty costly for the rest of his crew.

WB=Admiral

No other Yonkos seen in combat yet.

Really?

You do realize that WB was extremely sick and he even fought with Akainu (the strongest admiral at that time) who was near death. He assumed that he killed him once he fell down that crack. Akainu was saved by plot; he would of died if he hadn't held on to that ledge. WB can solo the pre-TS admirals from mid. diff (Kizaru) to high diff. (Kuzan/Aokiji). WB couldn't use his haki to his fullest either since he was sick (according to Shon93's theory). WB was severely handicapped during this war which is no surprise because Oda obviously did this on purpose cause he would of been too OP.

Saved by plot? WB survived Akainu's punch in the gut by plot. He survived Squardo's stab by plot. WB survived his face being blown away by plot. Do not just say things you don't like by saying "it happened because of plot."



Well no sh*t. What you think the admirals are weak? Anyone would have to fight an admiral with "full power" even Roger. I doubt he can easily just destroy an admiral without trying even at his prime. Also, WB was mainly focused on Ace's execution at that time.



Again, Akainu was saved by plot. Don't quote me on this but I remember in a interview that Oda stated that he intended on Akainu dying during the war but he obviously let him live for plot purposes. You're also acting as if WB wasn't suppose to get scars/wounds from fighting an admiral lol. Ofc he's going to get wounded when fighting one of the strongest arsenal that the marines have (admirals).

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^Rayleigh never "easily" fought on par with Kizaru either. He struggled as well due to "old age"; if was fighting easily with Kizaru then he could of been able to help the SH's. I agree WB is a bit over-hyped here but he can solo any of the admirals with high-diff.



I doubt someone can handle two admirals at the same time. That's a bit over-kill considering what they can do. It's like saying Luffy can handle both Zoro and Sanji at the same time.

Except Oda didn't kill Akainu. That means you have to look at the story differently instead of imagining and hoping Akainu to be dead.
By 'easily' I mean someone who has been reitired for decades and hasn't wielded a sowrd by his own admission going head to head with an admiral is impressive. If he was like WB, still active, I wonder if he could have helped SH.

This guy can't be serious look at the shit Oda had to do beforehand to make WB fightable for Akainu. I don't think that can be skimmed over. WB only dropped to the floor because he was stab in the chest beforehand

Akainu was a fly to WB

Flys don't blow away half your face after being ambushed and destroy the rest of your crew 10 mins later after you thought you had defeated the fly. The fool WB.

Tell that to all the blood Akainu was coughing.

I told that to the half of WB's face blown off.

Funny how everyone simply says I think WB>Admiral with no proof but simply because WB is more likeable. Unbelievable. He has quite a few followers unable to even consider, let alone accept, the alternative.

 

[Hexuze]

Except Oda didn't kill Akainu. That means you have to look at the story differently instead of imagining and hoping Akainu to be dead.
By 'easily' I mean someone who has been reitired for decades and hasn't wielded a sowrd by his own admission going head to head with an admiral is impressive. If he was like WB, still active, I wonder if he could have helped SH.

Like I said before, he lived for plot purposes. Akainu (the strongest admiral out of the three) would of died if he hadn't been protected by plot. I'm not hoping that Akainu died, he's an amazing antagonist to the story. Lol That doesn't mean easily either. He was fighting with the weakest admiral.

idk what you're trying to prove. Look man, WB can defeat each admiral on a 1v1 fight. It's kinda clear already since he "defeated" Akainu and if he can defeat Akainu then he can defeat Kuzan or Kizaru. It's not rocket science dude.

I agree with you though. WB can't take on two admirals, no one can but in a 1v1 fight he will win.

 

[SSS12]

Like I said before, he lived for plot purposes. Akainu (the strongest admiral out of the three) would of died if he hadn't been protected by plot. I'm not hoping that Akainu died, he's an amazing antagonist to the story. Lol That doesn't mean easily either. He was fighting with the weakest admiral.

idk what you're trying to prove. Look man, WB can defeat each admiral on a 1v1 fight. It's kinda clear already since he "defeated" Akainu and if he can defeat Akainu then he can defeat Kuzan or Kizaru. It's not rocket science dude.

I agree with you though. WB can't take on two admirals, no one can but in a 1v1 fight he will win.

I'm trying to disillusion people about WB's strength. Old WB that is. I'm not sure about Akainu being the strongest admiral. I think they're all about the same. Akainu won against Aokiji maybe because his DF gave him an advantage and, well, someone had to win. I think Kizaru is the worst match up for WB because of his speed and attack and flee battle style. I wonder if Akainu could really defeat Kizaru.
Again I'll say it, WB ambushed Akainu, who still managed to burn off WB's face and seal his fate. And the thing is, Akainu, who was supposedly defeated, managed to overwhelm the entire WB crew by himself!
I still think if old WB took on an admiral it would be a tie or the or someone (could be anyone) would win ex-extreme diff, like the FA fight.

That sig.

 

[shon93]

Flys don't blow away half your face after being ambushed and destroy the rest of your crew 10 mins later after you thought you had defeated the fly. The fool WB.

Akainu survived for plot purposes bro 1 v 1 he didn't stand a chance vs WB and thats factual. I really think if he could have stood up when WB hit hit he wouldn't have let his self fall in that whole

[video=youtube;NZkL4_4Y5jg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZkL4_4Y5jg[/video]

5:17 Look at Akainu rolling into the little whole like a little girl. What if WB decided to hit him more? I'm not siding with WB in anyway because he is more likeable I'm merely pointing out facts and its a fact that Akainu loss to a weakened WB who was sick and stabbed beforehand

Sure he blew off half of WB face but that didn't stop WB from fighting even long after....it took BB whole crew to bring down WB..so that shows me that Akainu didn't stand a chance

 

[SSS12]

Akainu survived for plot purposes bro 1 v 1 he didn't stand a chance vs WB and thats factual. I really think if he could have stood up when WB hit hit he wouldn't have let his self fall in that whole

5:17 Look at Akainu rolling into the little whole like a little girl. What if WB decided to hit him more? I'm not siding with WB in anyway because he is more likeable I'm merely pointing out facts and its a fact that Akainu loss to a weakened WB whole was sick and stabbed beforehand

Sure he blew off half of WB face but that didn't stop WB from fighting even long after....it took BB whole crew to bring down WB..so that shows me that Akainu didn't stand a chance

More like WB couldn't defeat Akainu if he took him head on. He had to ambush him. And yes, WB did stop Akainu... for 10 mins. WB didn't hit him more because he couldn't. Akainu had done his part too. Why else didn't he finish off someone who had killed his son? And WB's temporary halt of Akainu's rampage didn't last long, he still owned the rest of the WB pirates combined.
Look what happened to this fly trying to stop Akainu, the supposed first mate to WB himself.
[video=youtube;-aMfuASnjdU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-aMfuASnjdU&feature=player_detailpage[/video]

 

[Hexuze]

I'm trying to disillusion people about WB's strength. Old WB that is. I'm not sure about Akainu being the strongest admiral. I think they're all about the same. Akainu won against Aokiji maybe because his DF gave him an advantage and, well, someone had to win.

WB can still defeat any admiral in a 1v1 situation. Heck he would struggle more with Garp than any of the three admirals. No, the admirals aren't the same in strength. Sure some can defeat other opponents a lot more efficiently and effectively if they have the elemental advantage. Yeah it doesn't take away from the fact that Akainu defeated Aokiji, who both are superior to Kizaru. Yes Kuzan is a better fighter but he still lost to Akainu. Kizaru is overrated; he can be countered with observation haki which takes away the biggest asset to his ability: speed.

I think Kizaru is the worst match up for WB because of his speed and attack and flee battle style. I wonder if Akainu could really defeat Kizaru.

Akainu can defeat Kizaru. (high-extreme diff.)

Again I'll say it, WB ambushed Akainu, who still managed to burn off WB's face and seal his fate. And the thing is, Akainu, who was supposedly defeated, managed to overwhelm the entire WB crew by himself!
I still think if old WB took on an admiral it would be a tie or the or someone (could be anyone) would win ex-extreme diff, like the FA fight.

It doesn't take away from the fact that WB>Akainu during that fight. I mean WB could of easily "killed" Akainu during his first encounter but where's the fun in that? Oda usually has major fights near the end of the arc. Well idk about extreme diff. but I think WB will win high-diff. if he fought an admiral. Akainu still couldn't kill WB after he sent a magma fist through his chest cause WB is a tank. You also have to take that into account if you're going to place them in a 1v1 fight. WB is extremely tanky which means Akainu has to place a lot more blows on WB than WB has to place on him.

That sig.

ikr Sanji is badass. Oda needs to give him more moments to shine though; hopefully during the Big Mom encounter we'll see something.