Best Genjutsu User?

[Draphsin]

Itachi is the best at using genjutsu.

Shisui has the strongest genjutsu.

 

[shelke]

Shisui is mostly featless.

 

[Owarij]

Ao didn't say that in the official translation. He said "one of the few"

Official english?
I think not

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[KingHashirama]

You have strength vs Quantity.

Kurenai and others are masters of genjutsu, because they have various kinds of genjutsu, unlike the MS users..

So what would define the best genjutsu user? The one with mastery over many? or the one with biological strength?

 

[UltimateDeadpool]

Are you comparing a 13 year old who didn't even get his strongest mangekyou ability yet to Shishui, who at that time was already widely known throughout the world as being a genjutsu master?


Exactly? That scan proves at the very least that there are things that Itachi is better at than Shishui. There are things Shishui can't do in genjtsuu, That Itachi can.



Ao simply said that his eye can see through illusions, reinforced by the fact that he saw through the one that was on the mizukage. He never stated it was on the same level, or similar, he made sure to make that distinction clear by stating the color of danzo's chakra was that of Shishui's.



It is the most important factor here. Because the only reason people give Obito praise was because they assumed he some how bypassed the perf jink's ability to cancel genjutsu

Kage level shinobi? Are you joking? Ao and Shikaku both thought that Itachi was manipulating several shinobi, some considered "kage" level shinobi throughout the battle field. They stated only he was capable of nearly such a thing. Meaning if Obito can control one. Itachi can control many at the same time. Try again?



lmfao? you are joking?


And with this folks, you can tell this fellow is just an Itachi hater

Oh, are we comparing MS techniques here?

Itachi can maintain a greater range, that doesn't make him the best. Question: who's a better runner, the one that can run the farthest or the one that can run the fastest?

Ao said that Koto Amatsukami was like the genjutsu that controlled Yagura.

You mean aside from Yagura being a Kage, and Obito maintaining the genjutsu for years?

First off, none of those nameless fodder were considered "Kage-level." Secondly, they said that not even Itachi could do that; they only mentioned him because of the range he could maintain a genjutsu over.

Show me Itachi controlling Kurama then.

I hate the overzealous Itachi fans.

We don't even know Itachi's abilities as a kid, it's pointless to state things like "He was obviously very proficient thanks to Shisui". I'm sure that his best friend taught him a few things. But prior to knowing Shisui at the age of 8, he completely mastered the 3-tomoe sharingan and he got his MS after Shisui died. He probably saw Shisui cast some genjutsu and learned from that, but to go as far as to say that Itachi is only talented due to Shisui's influence is far off track.

Maintaining a genjutsu beyond the range of sensors is quite impressive, especially if you are the only shinobi who has existed w/ the ability to do so.

Yes. Ao was hyping up Obito when everyone thought he was Madara Uchiha. In all honesty, it's good for Obito, but it still doesn't count for much considering that at that moment in the manga, everyone was overhyping Obito because they thought he was someone else.

No, it does matter. If he wasn't on friendly terms with Yagura, then Isobu wouldn't care enough to break him out of Obito's genjutsu.

Anyone with MS can control the Kyuubi, that includes Itachi.

We don't even really know Shisui's either. We have statements, even from Itachi, that Shisui was the best of the Uchiha. Yet, because of popularity, some people are saying that Itachi is better.

Yes it is, but they never said he was the only one that "existed." Also, as T Bogard pointed out, the official translation said that Itachi was one of the few.

It doesn't matter if "Madara" turned out to be Konohamaru, his genjutsu prowess was reminiscent to Koto Amatsukami regardless.

A Kage-level ninja should be capable of handling genjutsus, or else Shii and Kurenai would be the Kages right now.

The potential, yes, however Obito controlled Kurama with his regular Sharingan.

Doesnt matter.

Apparently it does or you wouldn't had mentioned it.

Official english?
I think not

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Regardless, "The only one I know of" does NOT mean it's a talent exclusive to Itachi.

 

[A v i]

Shisui is mostly featless.

Even by hype people only consider him as someone with stong genjutsu in which case he is no different from Danzo with Shisuis eye.

 

[Gaara Of The Death]

All these dumb **** saying Shusui. This thread is best genjustu user, not ho has the strongest genjustu. Itachi takes this hands down.​

 

[KingHashirama]

All these dumb **** saying Shusui. This thread is best genjustu user, not ho has the strongest genjustu. Itachi takes this hands down.​

Itachi only has 2..... Tsukuyomi, and normal sharingan genjutsu..

 

[Gaara Of The Death]

Itachi only has 2..... Tsukuyomi, and normal sharingan genjutsu..

Tsukuyomi, sharingan genjustu, finger genjsutu,Izanami etc. ​

 

[shelke]

Even by hype people only consider him as someone with stong genjutsu in which case he is no different from Danzo with Shisuis eye.

Danzo's use of KA was so funny that Itachi has done better with his Ephemeral. It was broken through simple conversation intrusion. Shisui is featless. We don't know whether any Uchiha would have been able to resist it or not. We only saw its usage through Itachi.

 

[UltimateDeadpool]

Danzo's use of KA was so funny that Itachi has done better with his Ephemeral. It was broken through simple conversation intrusion. Shisui is featless. We don't know whether any Uchiha would have been able to resist it or not. We only saw its usage through Itachi.

Koto Amatsukami is a form of inception, Mifune was made aware that it wasn't his conscious decision.
Although, that also lends to how B.S. it was that Koto Amatsukami somehow broke Kabuto's hold on Itachi.

How was Ephemeral better?

 

[Owarij]

Oh, are we comparing MS techniques here?

Itachi can maintain a greater range, that doesn't make him the best. Question: who's a better runner, the one that can run the farthest or the one that can run the fastest?

Are you being serious or are you that ignorant?
It means he's better at certain aspects of genjutsu. With this argument there is no "best" genjutsu user. Just ninjas who have strong points. And shishui's strong point as far as we know is his one strong genjutsu.

Are you answering your own questions ? One of them is better at long distances the other is better at speed

It doesn't matter if "Madara" turned out to be Konohamaru, his genjutsu prowess was reminiscent to Koto Amatsukami regardless.

A Kage-level ninja should be capable of handling genjutsus

Any genjutsu that controls someone seeming without them realizing is reminiscent to KA

Itachi controlled Deidara to almost kill himself and he didn't realize until Itachi made him away of it. Was itachi utilizing KA? Try again

Right, your self described definiton of Kage level ninja

Regardless, "The only one I know of" does NOT mean it's a talent exclusive to Itachi.

Who said it was a talent exclusive to Itachi? Reading comprehension skills? That scan was posted as proof that there are things Itachi can do with genjutsu that Shishui can't . Considering under the list of ninjas Ao knows, Shishui is one of them

 

[shelke]

Koto Amatsukami is a form of inception, Mifune was made aware that it wasn't his conscious decision.
Although, that also lends to how B.S. it was that Koto Amatsukami somehow broke Kabuto's hold on Itachi.

How was Ephemeral better?

Awareness or not, the Genjutsu would do its work. Chee was aware that Sasuke was using Genjutsu, Orochimaru was aware, Bee was aware etc. That didn't stop the Genjutsu from taking affect. If a simple breaking in on the conversation is all that it took for Danzo's petty KA to halt, then yes, Itachi's Ephemeral is better, as it took two people to insert their Chakra within Naruto to disturb its flow and then break it, when Naruto himself was aware that he was under the affect of Genjutsu.

That was the use of KA at the hands of the, as the manga puts it, the 'True Master of Sharingan'. The manga has made a clear distinction that both the blood and the body are required for Sharingan to work at optimum efficiency. Danzo lacks both. At least Kakashi at least has the body.

 

[Korowa]

The best genjutsu user is Itachi. Haters only deny it.

 

[UltimateDeadpool]

I hate how people think Shisui is the best genjutsu user because he has the BEST genjutsu. Having the best Genjutsu doesn't make you the best user, That would make Danzo the best genjutsu user too.

OT: Itachi.

And yet, without Tsukiyomi, Itachi hasn't really done anything that Sasuke, Kurenai, Shii, Kabuto, etc. can't do.

Are you being serious or are you that ignorant?
It means he's better at certain aspects of genjutsu. With this argument there is no "best" genjutsu user. Just ninjas who have strong points. And shishui's strong point as far as we know is his one strong genjutsu.

Are you answering your own questions ? One of them is better at long distances the other is better at speed




Any genjutsu that controls someone seeming without them realizing is reminiscent to KA

Itachi controlled Deidara to almost kill himself and he didn't realize until Itachi made him away of it. Was itachi utilizing KA? Try again

Right, your self described definiton of Kage level ninja



Who said it was a talent exclusive to Itachi? Reading comprehension skills? That scan was posted as proof that there are things Itachi can do with genjutsu that Shishui can't . Considering under the list of ninjas Ao knows, Shishui is one of them

Again, you are not being clear.
1. Shisui's strong point is Koto Amatsukami, but what is Itachi's? Tsukiyomi, another MS jutsu.
2. If there is no "best" genjutsu user, then why are we discussing which of them is "better"?

Oh? Is that so? Then how is it that no other manipulation genjutsu has been compared to it?

Itachi didn't control Deidara, he tricked him, to which may I add made no sense. I understand the premise, that Itachi made him think he was shooting one thing when he was actually shooting another, but where it lacks sense is in that Deidara was actually pointing the gun at his own head when he thought he was pointing it forward. It should also be noted that Deidara was still a pre-teen.

The generally accepted description of a Kage-level ninja. One whom stands out amongst their peers for individual ability and respect, one whom not only holds the reigns of their village but is used as an example of their village's might. Genjutsu is also by no means an ability gifted to only a select few, there are many genjutsu users... yet you don't find it odd that only one of them ever made it to the position of Kage? How do these legendary ninjas become legendary if they are incapable of dealing with genjutsu? One run in with Kurenai during a war and surely someone as powerful as Gaara would die, yes? Or no?

You can save the insults as it seems to be the argument being made by various individuals, that Itachi is the only of capable of such a feat. In fact, let's look at an older post by you in this discussion:

"Stated that Itachi is the only person they know of that is capable of such genjutsu feats, -- This means Itachi is better and more versatile in genjutsu than shishui ever was in the past . Shishui seems to only have one powerful genjutsu that he gained alot of fame from using."

Here, you are completely disregarding anyone else's ability to maintain control of a genjutsu over great ranges because they lack knowledge of the skills of others like Shisui, Obito, etc. In fact, you relate it to not a feat of skill but power, as say the only thing Shisui has that can compare to it is Koto Amatsukami, a jutsu that he may have only used one or two times in his entire life considering how long it takes to recharge and are saying that is solely how he gained his fame, something that no one ever confirmed. A lot of presumptions. The fact too is that Itachi only has one powerful genjutsu, Tsukiyomi, another MS jutsu which pales in comparison to Koto Amatsukami. So how do their base skills stack up?

Awareness or not, the Genjutsu would do its work. Chee was aware that Sasuke was using Genjutsu, Orochimaru was aware, Bee was aware etc. That didn't stop the Genjutsu from taking affect. If a simple breaking in on the conversation is all that it took for Danzo's petty KA to halt, then yes, Itachi's Ephemeral is better, as it took two people to insert their Chakra within Naruto to disturb its flow and then break it, when Naruto himself was aware that he was under the affect of Genjutsu.

That was the use of KA at the hands of the, as the manga puts it, the 'True Master of Sharingan'. The manga has made a clear distinction that both the blood and the body are required for Sharingan to work at optimum efficiency. Danzo lacks both. At least Kakashi at least has the body.

Do you remember what Danzo slid to Mifune? To pick him. KA didn't just make Mifune go "I choose you, Danzo." No, it made him believe it was his decision, and he was making conscious reasonings as to why none of the others should be leader. When the ruse was discovered, no longer was Mifune tasked with choosing a leader and they all wanted to rip off Danzo's head.
Naruto was a novice at combating genjutsu and had poor chakra control at the time, hardly a good example.

Where has the manga stated that? Also, I take it the crow did have the blood and body required to use Koto Amatsukami at full efficiency? After all, Danzo did have Senju cells (body) and Shisui's arm (blood).

The best genjutsu user is Itachi. Haters only deny it.

Proof?

 

[Trollasaur]

This ^^
Obito has no genjutsu feats as of now

LOL

Obito anyone saying otherwise is a fanboy. He has the best Genjutsu feats.

 

[shelke]

Do you remember what Danzo slid to Mifune? To pick him. KA didn't just make Mifune go "I choose you, Danzo." No, it made him believe it was his decision, and he was making conscious reasonings as to why none of the others should be leader. When the ruse was discovered, no longer was Mifune tasked with choosing a leader and they all wanted to rip off Danzo's head.
Naruto was a novice at combating genjutsu and had poor chakra control at the time, hardly a good example.

Where has the manga stated that? Also, I take it the crow did have the blood and body required to use Koto Amatsukami at full efficiency? After all, Danzo did have Senju cells (body) and Shisui's arm (blood).

What difference does it make? The Genjutsu was supposed to cast an illusion of Trust on him, so that he would end up choosing Danzo. Whether he became aware of it or not doesn't matter. KA is simply a more powerful form of Sharingan Genjutsu. Awareness or not, it should have worked regardless, as it's meant to completely control the target. Like Obito cast a Genjutsu of 'Trust' on Konan, when she was taking her last breaths and in immense pain. Because of Genjutsu, she was able to tell Obito of the location of Rinnegan.

He didn't have Shisui's arm:

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- He appears to have both of his arms intact. Taking someone's arm wouldn't match taking his Dna.

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I can get the scans for Obito calling Sasuke's Sharingan superior to Obito's use of Sharingans as well. But I think those can be easily seen as the fight can be located without any inconvenience.

 

[SageOfTheTenPaths]

Ok, so the the best Genjutus user is probably Itachi, but not having Jiraiya on the list makes this a SHIT list. His Genjutsu tok out half of Pain. He deserves a place on the list!

 

[IThinkALot]

Well it is between Shisui and Itachi but i would sai Shisui because it was said he was the greatest genjutsu user of the Uchiha(just my opinion tho)

 

[UltimateDeadpool]

What difference does it make? The Genjutsu was supposed to cast an illusion of Trust on him, so that he would end up choosing Danzo. Whether he became aware of it or not doesn't matter. KA is simply a more powerful form of Sharingan Genjutsu. Awareness or not, it should have worked regardless, as it's meant to completely control the target. Like Obito cast a Genjutsu of 'Trust' on Konan, when she was taking her last breaths and in immense pain. Because of Genjutsu, she was able to tell Obito of the location of Rinnegan.

He didn't have Shisui's arm:

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- He appears to have both of his arms intact. Taking someone's arm wouldn't match taking his Dna.

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I can get the scans for Obito calling Sasuke's Sharingan superior to Obito's use of Sharingans as well. But I think those can be easily seen as the fight can be located without any inconvenience.

KA is inception. Although I agree that it shouldn't had been broken so easily, just like it shouldn't had worked so well on Itachi.

Ao said Danzo had Shisui's arm, he recognized the chakra.

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What we're made aware of is that Sharingans drain more chakra from people that aren't Uchiha.

I may like to see that.