Tobirama vs Killer Bee

[KidGamer65]

That is by implying that Bee couldn't touch him b4 Tobirama pull a kunai marks is toss it.Even if he can toss the kunai Bee'll follow it or throw one of his swords as he can see the direction of Kunai then what'll Tobirama do? Pick the kunai and toss it again?Then Bee can keep follow him and attack him untill Tobirama runs out of chakra.That clone also implying that Tobiama starts a battle by making a clone and make it mark the battle field when he has 0 intel on his opponent.Bee used his tail and saved Raikage even b4 Minato can hurt Raikage where as Raikage failed to counter it despite of being fastest after Minato.

Except B has no speed feat that lets me believe he's going to blitz someone who can react to Juubito's Shunshin. If he can't blitz him (which he can't) then he isn't going to stop him from throwing a Kunai.

Lol what? If he throws his sword at Tobirama's Kunai to deflect it, there is still a place for Tobirama to teleport to so he can evade all of B's attacks. So B doing that doesn't hinder Tobirama in any way, shape or form.

lol? Dafuq am I reading here? First you tell me that he's going to blitz Tobirama to prevent him from throwing a Kunai (Lol) then you tell me that he'll just follow him around (even though Tobirama has clones to place markings and he can put markings on Kunai and his sword and toss them whenever he pleases) Following him isn't going to do anything at all, cause he can't keep up with instantaneous movement. Tobirama easily runs circles around him.

Placing markings is a typical fighting style for anyone using Hiraishin. Intel isn't needed. If you are going to grasp at straws here then don't bother replying. Cause that's just a petty argument.

And? B saving Ay has nothing to do with the fact Tobirama will never get hit by B if he stays in his lesser forms.

Nothing suggets that Bee knew about Minato's marking on him to predict that Minato'll come after him.Bee reacted to Minato even when he is about attack Ay.It is not irrelevant as we are comparing the feats of Bee against a FTG user like Tobirama.

Bold is irrelevant. None of this is relevant at all so I'm not going to bother at all. Being able to react to Tobirama's attacks means he'll be able to hit Tobirama himself? What kind of backwards logic are you using here? This argument only works if I said that Tobirama would attack B, but I never said that. You said that he'd magically land a hit on Tobirama despite the latter having superior speed, reflexes and Teleportation.

I don't understand that bold part.Bee isn't trying to use TBB in human form to say that he need to master Rasengan to use TBB.He is using mini Bijju mode and no need to mention he has more experience with TBB than Naruto.I see no reason as to why he can't use it exept he never used it argument.If he couldn't use it on his own whatever,

Then don't bring Naruto into this, cause how he uses Mini Bijuu Dama is completely different from the V2 Jins. Feats are everything. Nothing in the manga begins to imply he can use Bijuu Dama in V2. Only berserk V2 Jins have shown that ability. In fact, only berserk Kurama has shown this ability so why you are trying to give it to the Hachibi is beyond me.

Bee can let Hachibi to take over then Hachibi uses it for him.

Uh, no. Go get me some feats and then we can talk. Until evidence disagrees with me, the only Bijuu who has ever shown to use Bijuu Dama in V2 is Kurama.

Madara said that by including FTG and Tobirama also has 0 Shinshin feats on other hand we atleast know that V2 increases Bee's speed.

Hmm, got some evidence for this claim? Cause I see none. On the other hand, we have Hashirama who was able to keep up with Madara all his life, and Tobirama is already shown to be faster than Hashirama or at least equal in speed as he arrived at the battlefield a split second before Hashirama did. Evidence clearly shows that Tobirama is near Madara's speed when it comes to Shunshin, not just including Hiraishin.

I mean he was following their movements.

Again, he never followed Naruto's Shunshin speed and V1 Ay's Shunshin isn't so impressive that it lets him blitz Tobirama off that bat. That's a load of nonsense right there.

 

[A v i]

Show me the scan where Madara explicitly says he was talking about FTG. Blind Madara

You must be registered for see links

Naruto to the point of Naruto barely raising his hands. Tobirama is faster than Madara

You must be registered for see links

by Madara. My scan is also confirmed because Tobirama was surprised that Minato's teleporting was

You must be registered for see links

. Shino

You must be registered for see links

against Obito. Now using common sense, you can deduce Tobirama had the fastest shunshin of his generation.

FTG is considered as speed in NV otherwise there is no way in hell for Minato to be faster than Ay let alone fasters of all time.Now tell me where exactly FTG is not considered as speed in NV and how exactly Madara excluded FTG while saying that? OR u expecting him to say something like Yo Tobirama ur faster than me even without FTG? Since when does being fastest means having fastest shunshin again? Minato is the fastest of his time yet he has slower shunshin that Raikage.:yeah:

 

[Penguin]

FTG is considered as speed in NV otherwise there is no way in hell for Minato to be faster than Ay let alone fasters of all time.Now tell me where exactly FTG is not considered as speed in NV and how exactly Madara excluded FTG while saying that? OR u expecting him to say something like Yo Tobirama ur faster than me even without FTG? Since when does being fastest means having fastest shunshin again? Minato is the fastest of his time yet he has slower shunshin that Raikage.:yeah:

I didn't bring up the Raikage or Minato. I am showing you that Tobirama is speed wise faster than Madara as proven by Madara, keeping up with Hashirama, Shino's definition of teleporting, and Tobirama's amazement that Minato is faster than him.

 

[A v i]

Except B has no speed feat that lets me believe he's going to blitz someone who can react to Juubito's Shunshin. If he can't blitz him (which he can't) then he isn't going to stop him from throwing a Kunai.

Lol what? If he throws his sword at Tobirama's Kunai to deflect it, there is still a place for Tobirama to teleport to so he can evade all of B's attacks. So B doing that doesn't hinder Tobirama in any way, shape or form.

lol? Dafuq am I reading here? First you tell me that he's going to blitz Tobirama to prevent him from throwing a Kunai (Lol) then you tell me that he'll just follow him around (even though Tobirama has clones to place markings and he can put markings on Kunai and his sword and toss them whenever he pleases) Following him isn't going to do anything at all, cause he can't keep up with instantaneous movement. Tobirama easily runs circles around him.

I don't where u pulled that whole Bee can blitz Tobirama argument from. I said Bee attacks Tobirama and Tobirama can't avoid Bee's attacks forever(without pre markings that is) which means that I actually admited Tobirama can dodge his attacks but not each and everyone of them.once again without pre markings that is.

About that Kunai arguement: I said that Bee throws swords at Tobirama not kunai so I don't get where that sword hitting kunai came from.I said Tobirama'll teleport again if he Bee throws a sword or he tries to attack him which means that I admitted that Tobirama can dodge Bee's attacks with ur kunai method.I don't get what actually made say somthing like Dafq? in that point as I have never said that Bee touches Tobirama.Tobirama dodges Bee's attacks with FTG then what? If he keep dodge him then It'll do nothing good to Tobirama either & that is what I said in my post nothing else.

Placing markings is a typical fighting style for anyone using Hiraishin. Intel isn't needed. If you are going to grasp at straws here then don't bother replying. Cause that's just a petty argument.
And? B saving Ay has nothing to do with the fact Tobirama will never get hit by B if he stays in his lesser forms.

Since u said feats are everything do u have any feats of Tobirama doing something like this at the beginning of the battle?

Bold is irrelevant. None of this is relevant at all so I'm not going to bother at all. Being able to react to Tobirama's attacks means he'll be able to hit Tobirama himself? What kind of backwards logic are you using here? This argument only works if I said that Tobirama would attack B, but I never said that. You said that he'd magically land a hit on Tobirama despite the latter having superior speed, reflexes and Teleportation.

I said that because incase if Tobirama tries to attack Bee with attacks like FTG slash.
Sorry for not explaining it my bad.

Then don't bring Naruto into this, cause how he uses Mini Bijuu Dama is completely different from the V2 Jins. Feats are everything. Nothing in the manga begins to imply he can use Bijuu Dama in V2. Only berserk V2 Jins have shown that ability. In fact, only berserk Kurama has shown this ability so why you are trying to give it to the Hachibi is beyond me.

Uh, no. Go get me some feats and then we can talk. Until evidence disagrees with me, the only Bijuu who has ever shown to use Bijuu Dama in V2 is Kurama.

Still no evidence or logical explanation as to why he can not use it. TBB is something any bijju can use it is not limited to Kyuubi if Kyuubi can pull it then why other bijjus can't do it is beyond me.If u are going to repeat bring me scans argument then don't even bother to post a reply as it won't get us anywhere.
Everything we can do about this is agree to disagree with eachother.

Hmm, got some evidence for this claim? Cause I see none.

Since when does FTG is not speed to discard it while talking about speed?

On the other hand, we have Hashirama who was able to keep up with Madara all his life, and Tobirama is already shown to be faster than Hashirama or at least equal in speed as he arrived at the battlefield a split second before Hashirama did. Evidence clearly shows that Tobirama is near Madara's speed when it comes to Shunshin, not just including Hiraishin.

Ya Hiruzen is as fast as Madara because he managed to reach battle field at the same time?While I agree with the point of Tobirama being faster than Madara and Hashirama thanks to FTG, I see no evidence to say that Tobirama's shunshin is better than Madara here.

Again, he never followed Naruto's Shunshin speed and V1 Ay's Shunshin isn't so impressive that it lets him blitz Tobirama off that bat. That's a load of nonsense right there.

Once again I have never said that Bee can blitz Tobirama,Iam only using this to say that Tobirama isn't far beyond Bee to make it impossible for him to touch Tobirama(wihtout FTG that is).

I didn't bring up the Raikage or Minato. I am showing you that Tobirama is speed wise faster than Madara as proven by Madara, keeping up with Hashirama, Shino's definition of teleporting, and Tobirama's amazement that Minato is faster than him.

Iam not denying the fact that Tobirama is faster than Madara.He is obviously fastest of his time thanks to his FTG and we are talking about his shunshin and we have no evidence to say that Tobiramas shunshin is faster than Madara and Hashirama.I have proved that FTG is considered as speed and being fastest does not automatically means that having fastest shunshin by using Minato and Raikage as an evidence and I see none from ur argument as to why Tobirama's shunshin is better than Madara and Hashirama.

Once again being fastest doesnot automatically means that he has fastest shunshin,Iam not clueless enough to demand u for scans whenever I have no real argument to counter ur point so I can agree with him being more or less on par with Hashirama.

 

[Gold Lightning]

Well FTG is kind of useless against Bee and his 7 swords style, all those somersaults and spinning means he completely dominates in CQC. And he can bring forth his octopus tentacles at any time which gives him extra reach with his swords. Bee is the best swordsman in the manga no doubt. Tobiramas speed is more than enough to play keep away once he realises it's suicide to try and attack Bee head on. All water jutsu are absorbed by Samehada, and even if Tobirama could use Edo Tensei and his continuos exploding tag jutsu if Bee reacts on time then I can also see Samehada absorbing the chakra from the slips before they go off (not that ET is a factor anyway).

I don't think Bee needs to go full 8 tails, at most 4-6 tails if he's finding it difficult keeping up with Tobirama, he can increase his speed going into his V2 state. Honestly I think Base Killer Bee using 7 swords style (with lightning infused swords) is enough.

Bee has already seem FTG in action and how it works plus he knows he cannot let Tobirama touch him, which is why 7 swords style protects him offensively and defensively. And since Tobirama doesn't have prepped kunai, it will be easier to follow his movements.

 

[KidGamer65]

I don't where u pulled that whole Bee can blitz Tobirama argument from. I said Bee attacks Tobirama and Tobirama can't avoid Bee's attacks forever(without pre markings that is) which means that I actually admited Tobirama can dodge his attacks but not each and everyone of them.once again without pre markings that is.

You told me that B will attack Tobirama BEFORE he has the chance to throw a Kunai, meaning he'd need to blitz him to do that.

That is by implying that Bee couldn't touch him b4 Tobirama pull a kunai marks is toss it.

About that Kunai arguement: I said that Bee throws swords at Tobirama not kunai so I don't get where that sword hitting kunai came from.I said Tobirama'll teleport again if he Bee throws a sword or he tries to attack him which means that I admitted that Tobirama can dodge Bee's attacks with ur kunai method.I don't get what actually made say somthing like Dafq? in that point as I have never said that Bee touches Tobirama.Tobirama dodges Bee's attacks with FTG then what? If he keep dodge him then It'll do nothing good to Tobirama either & that is what I said in my post nothing else.

Lol, and please tell me what the point of throwing a Kunai at Tobirama would be when he can just teleport away? Oh wait, there would be no point at all. If you are telling me he'll throw it to where Tobirama teleports (AS in where the Kunai landed) then please tell me why Tobirama would have to teleport? All he does is let the Sword hit the ground and then he teleports away. Or he teleports and parries with his own sword.

Since u said feats are everything do u have any feats of Tobirama doing something like this at the beginning of the battle?

That's not how feats work pal. Tobirama has already shown the feats to do what I said he can do so there is no reason for him to do it when it goes with his fighting style.

Still no evidence or logical explanation as to why he can not use it. TBB is something any bijju can use it is not limited to Kyuubi if Kyuubi can pull it then why other bijjus can't do it is beyond me.If u are going to repeat bring me scans argument then don't even bother to post a reply as it won't get us anywhere.

Then I'm not going to bother replying again. If you can't debate with real evidence or feats then I'm not going to bother wasting my time here. Its as simple as that.

-No evidence shows that any Perfect Jin can use a Bijuu Dama while in V2.

-No evidence shows that any Bijuu can use Bijuu Dama while in their V2 state bar Kurama.

Yet we have this guy over here, telling me that he can despite feats disagreeing. Despite the fact you have no evidence towards the contrary. Go get evidence or feats to prove your point and then we can continue this discussion.

Since when does FTG is not speed to discard it while talking about speed?


Ya Hiruzen is as fast as Madara because he managed to reach battle field at the same time?While I agree with the point of Tobirama being faster than Madara and Hashirama thanks to FTG, I see no evidence to say that Tobirama's shunshin is better than Madara here.

Not even gonna bother with this as its irrelevant since Tobirama can evade B with Hiraishin.

 

[PlasticAngelx]

Killer Bee wins.

 

[A v i]

You told me that B will attack Tobirama BEFORE he has the chance to throw a Kunai, meaning he'd need to blitz him to do that.

Plz, I said Bee'll charge at Tobirama that dosen't mean that he can blitz him.I was even saying Tobirama cannot avoid his attacks forever(without marks that is) implying that Tobirama can dodge some of Bee's attacks and u completly ignored those points.Bee can blitz Tobirama b4 he throws a kunai? Plz don't ignore/twist my points for the sake of bashing my logics,I said pulling Kunai,placing a marking and tossing it not just tossing a kunai. Lets not forgot the fact that Tobirama won't carry any prepared kunai.I still considered the point of Tobirama being able to pull this feat yet ur blaming me for something I have never said?

Lol, and please tell me what the point of throwing a Kunai at Tobirama would be when he can just teleport away? Oh wait, there would be no point at all. If you are telling me he'll throw it to where Tobirama teleports (AS in where the Kunai landed) then please tell me why Tobirama would have to teleport? All he does is let the Sword hit the ground and then he teleports away. Or he teleports and parries with his own sword.

Once again plz don't twist my points: I said Bee'll throw sword at Tobirama.I don't get from where ur pulling that Bee throws the sword near kunai argument.Let me explain this:

Bee engages Tobirama>Tobirama throws the Kunai(Implying that Tobirama pulls and marks the kunai)> Bee notices it >Tobirama Disappears and teleports to his kunai > Bee throws kunai to attack Tobirama who just teleported to his kunai.

^^^^^I still considered Tobirama being able to dodge this attack as well yet ur pulling all that Bee can blitz Tobirama argument out of nowhere?

Then I'm not going to bother replying again. If you can't debate with real evidence or feats then I'm not going to bother wasting my time here. Its as simple as that.

I guess it is good for both of us.

-No evidence shows that any Perfect Jin can use a Bijuu Dama while in V2.
-No evidence shows that any Bijuu can use Bijuu Dama while in their V2 state bar Kurama.
Yet we have this guy over here, telling me that he can despite feats disagreeing. Despite the fact you have no evidence towards the contrary. Go get evidence or feats to prove your point and then we can continue this discussion.

U have evidence but I don't? What is ur evidence? He can't use it because he never used it is an evidence now?

No evidence to say that how perfect jins can't use TBB eventhough every Bijju can use TBB.
No evidence why other Bijjus can't use it despite of being Bijju's and having the ability to use TBB just like Kyuubi.

Spoiler

Lets see:
Bee has been a perfect jin for years.
Hachibi is a bijju just like Kyuubi.
Hachibi has the ability to use TBB.
Bee's knowledge on TBB is good enough to train Naruto.
Bee can use TBB.
Kyuubi proved that using TBB without going full BM is possible.
Naruto proved that u don't even need to enter V1 or V2 to pull TBB.

I have this many points to support my point Yet I have no evidence and Bee can't use it just because he was using a smaller version even when we have no logical reason as to say that he can't use it.

It is exactly what I said b4 we aren't going anywhere with this so let us agree to disagree.

 

[shelke]

Bee reacted to FTG twice and matched Aes V2 Speed for Lariat. Him not reacting to Tobirama's FTG, Striking Speed, or Body Flicker is far-fetched. Tobirama cannot blitz or hoodwink Bee through FTG. Not a chance. At Kenjutsu level, Bee by feats is much superior, until proven otherwise by the manga.

Multiplying Explosive Tags seem unnecessary when I don't think they would be able to damage Bee in full BM or perhaps even V2, given its durability. Once TBB hits, the Edos would go into recovery, stopping the source summoning them, and thus the technique. Close Combat at V1 would prove to be extremely deadly for Tobirama. His Suiton is irrelevant, when Bee can run Raiton through his Katanas and use it to numb Tobirama, who has no Raiton feats of his own to cancel out the numbness.

Bee takes this mid-difference most.

 

[GodKage]

Killer bee win mid diff bijuu mode to strong