How come Madara...

[TheRedAndGreenBeast]

Ninja are supposed to cheat lol they're not exactly sportsmen!

 

[HashiramaDescendant]

Well....one could say that how Hashirama defeated Madara was cowardly and cheap. Sneaking up behind him, stabbing him in the back of all places. One could say he was a coward afraid to confront Madara to his face to defeat him. Nao....the way I see it is....there are no rules in a life or death battle. So Hashirama is fine in my book, but so is Madara....it all depends on how you view it. One could say Madara was the victor because he saw beyond for power and Hashirama couldn't. Not only that it could be said Madara played Hashirama as the fool.

It's all in how you perceive things....if you see Hashirama as superior... as I always say it's fine. If you don't mind some advice....pay no attention when ppl say negative things about Hashirama. If you see him as great in your mind that's all that matters. Just view it and move on. It's only a fictional character at the end of the day. Just saying..... I usually only take attention to the Madara negativity when the post is witty. Which is a rarity for those that bash Madara imo. Though I choose to not get emotional. Life goes on my friend. >_O

In a way you're right, but the difference in what Hashi did and Madara did was that Hashi's way of defeating Madara was in the actual battle- he fooled Madara with the wood bunshin and later impaled him through the back (it's a common shinobi tactic to fool the opponent and then strike)... This was IN BATTLE. What Madara did was OUTSIDE of the battle and took years to prepare. Hashirama won the battle at the VOTE fair and square and Madara won the overall battle by stealing Hashi's DNA and forming experiments... This wasn't in battle and this was long after the battle that Madara did these things. Madara had time to recover and prepare for future encounters with Hashi, that's why I think his way of surpassing Hashi was cheap. If he would've defeated Hashi and then stole his DNA, I would have more respect for his character, but he took the coward's route.

 

[RikudouMadara]

What? Him sneaking up on him is a old ninja technique. Why would he confront him when there was an opening for hashi to kill madara. Hashi doesnt have to cheat to win.

Jeez Louise really? :T_T: I'm just.....my door has been blown off the hinges. >_O

"Hashi doesn't have to cheat to win." He cheated before..... XD

Anywho....Itachi I wasn't saying that he was cheating.... read my post in its entirety. I was giving examples of ways one could see their battle. Well...no need to read nao. ^_^ Also Madara didn't cheat.....he chose to obtain power the best way possible. All is fair in love and war my young friend. >_O You see it that way, but we all have different eyes. XD

 

[HashiramaDescendant]

Here lies the critical failure in your thread. Madara didn't gain Hashirama's abilities to become stronger than him [x] it was never his motive. They were always roughly on par to begin with as portrayed through cannon [Hashirama being the only shinobi capable of fighting on edge with Madara, Madara beating Hashirama out of Sennin Modo without the Kyubi's help at VoTE]. However if your concern is as stated by users above, then you may dabble... ​

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What are you even talking about? Madara had the Kyuubi with him the entire time during the fight... That's why Hashi used Sage Mode in the first place? Madara was never comparable to Hashi until he decided to use his cells and experiment on him after the VOTE.

 

[RikudouMadara]

In a way you're right, but the difference in what Hashi did and Madara did was that Hashi's way of defeating Madara was in the actual battle- he fooled Madara with the wood bunshin and later impaled him through the back (it's a common shinobi tactic to fool the opponent and then strike)... This was IN BATTLE. What Madara did was OUTSIDE of the battle and took years to prepare. Hashirama won the battle at the VOTE fair and square and Madara won the overall battle by stealing Hashi's DNA and forming experiments... This wasn't in battle and this was long after the battle that Madara did these things. Madara had time to recover and prepare for future encounters with Hashi, that's why I think his way of surpassing Hashi was cheap. If he would've defeated Hashi and then stole his DNA, I would have more respect for his character, but he took the coward's route.

To each their own of course.... ^_^. I see it as there are no rules. (it's a common shinobi tactic to fool the opponent and then strike)... Madara can be seen as fooling Hashirama and the world and waited to strike. You say in battle, but I feel life in its entirety is a battle... I feel a battle between enemies is not ever over. Hashirama was tricked by Madara.... Nonetheless I can agree Hashirama won the battle, but Madara won the war. Madara has not ever in the Manga been shown to be a coward...not once. Just saying.....but you of course have the right to believe whatever you choose. ^_^

True rivalries are never-ending.

 

[itachi4real]

Jeez Louise really? :T_T: I'm just.....my door has been blown off the hinges. >_O

"Hashi doesn't have to cheat to win." He cheated before..... XD

Anywho....Itachi I wasn't saying that he was cheating.... read my post in its entirety. I was giving examples of ways one could see to their battle. Well...no need to read nao. ^_^ Also Madara didn't cheat.....he chose to obtain power the best way possible. All is fair in love and war my young friend. >_O You see it that way, but we all have different eyes. XD

Oh lol didnt wanna read. Too long. But since u shorten i get what ur saying.

 

[Waltz]

What are you even talking about? Madara had the Kyuubi with him the entire time during the fight... That's why Hashi used Sage Mode in the first place? Madara was never comparable to Hashi until he decided to use his cells and experiment on him after the VOTE.

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[ObitoGokuKakashi]

YES YES YES ! I will always agree on Threads that shows Hashi > Madara.

'Cause it is, how it is. : )

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[HashiramaDescendant]

To each their own of course.... ^_^. I see it as there are no rules. (it's a common shinobi tactic to fool the opponent and then strike)... Madara can be seen as fooling Hashirama and the world and waited to strike. You say in battle, but I feel life in its entirety is a battle... I feel a battle between enemies is not ever over. Hashirama was tricked by Madara.... Nonetheless I can agree Hashirama won the battle, but Madara won the war. Madara has not ever in the Manga been shown to be a coward...not once. Just saying.....but you of course have the right to believe whatever you choose. ^_^

True rivalries are never-ending.

You're being a bit too metaphoric, but I agree I guess. xD
Anyways, it's been nice debating with someone who's respectful and uses logic. Kudos to you, good sir.

 

[itachi4real]

YES YES YES ! I will always agree on Threads that shows Hashi > Madara.

'Cause it is, how it is. : )

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Exactly...its crazy how madara accept that hashi was always stronger since they were kids but people on the forum say otherwise.

Ot: man thats a nice pic. I swear madara and hashis back story is better than any other characters story period. Besides itachi and sasuke ofc.

 

[Lightbringer]

Power is power, regardless of the means one acquires it.

Hashirama was reluctant enough to be born with power; I don't see you making a fuss about that though.

So in the end, Madara outsmarted Hashirama and became god.

 

[HashiramaDescendant]

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@Manga scan #1- There is no proof that Hashi used Sage Mode the entire time whilst fighting Madara off the Kyuubi. And as you know, Hashi didn't have the intent to kill Madara until the very end when he stabbed him in the back.
@Manga scan #2- Yes, he could fight on equal grounds with Madara, but not vice versa.

 

[RikudouMadara]

You're being a bit too metaphoric, but I agree I guess. xD
Anyways, it's been nice debating with someone who's respectful and uses logic. Kudos to you, good sir.

My apologies...I have an uncanny proclivity to see most things from the perch which gives a broader view of things. _@: <-- Me being inane...completely silly. Pay no attention lol.

What I meant to say is thanks, but if you don't mind lets see it as a conversation to reach an understanding of how we each think and feel. ^_^ Rather that a debate or argument.

 

[kagekamiha]

Dude.... hes a villain.. its kinda what they do, you know.

 

[HashiramaDescendant]

My apologies...I have an uncanny proclivity to see most things from the perch which gives a broader view of things. _@: <-- Me being inane...completely silly. Pay no attention lol.

What I meant to say is thanks, but if you don't mind lets see it as a conversation to reach an understanding of how we each think and feel. ^_^ Rather that a debate or argument.

Sure, bro.

 

[Limbo]

I sense butthurt.

 

[HashiramaDescendant]

I sense butthurt.

I get that a lot when people can't refute what's being presented.

 

[Waltz]

@Manga scan #1- There is no proof that Hashi used Sage Mode the entire time whilst fighting Madara off the Kyuubi. And as you know, Hashi didn't have the intent to kill Madara until the very end when he stabbed him in the back.
@Manga scan #2- Yes, he could fight on equal grounds with Madara, but not vice versa.

@1) Ad Ignorantiam and it's mostlikely the case as he was leaving mokuton constructs to engage in combat with Madara, still maintaining Sennin Modo. Not an argument HashiramaDescendant; it was a battle to the death, meaning that both had killing intent.

@2) Not entirely but for the much greater portion as highlighted in their confrontation at VoTE, I will agree. As I said prior, there were always roughly on par. ​

 

[HashiramaDescendant]

@1) Ad Ignorantiam and it's mostlikely the case as he was leaving mokuton constructs to engage in combat with Madara, still maintaining Sennin Modo. Not an argument HashiramaDescendant; it was a battle to the death, meaning that both had killing intent.

@2) Not entirely but for the much greater portion as highlighted in their confrontation at VoTE, I will agree. As I said prior, there were always roughly on par. ​

1.) "Most likely" isn't enough proof. Like I said, Hashirama didn't have the intent the kill Madara as he stated at the very beginning of the fight, so whether he used Sage Mode the entire time or not is irrelevant here. It wasn't until the end of the battle that he changed his resolve and had the intent to kill Madara with the wood bunshin mirage.

2.) Yes, with Hashirama being in the lead. It wasn't until Madara used Hashi's cells that they were REALLY comparable and even then it could be argued that Hashirama could still defeat him from what Madara himself said.