I told you we are about to witness a disaster

[LED ZEPPELIN]

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The TREASURY and the FED do not deny it WILL DEFAULT.


3/14 is the number and we are all about to face hyperinflation, unemployment, police state and poverty.


Didn't I say this twice before?

 

[Unbiased]

You're stupid.

The house already stated they're raising the debt limit. Therefore the US is not defaulting. At least for another year.

 

[LED ZEPPELIN]

You're stupid.

The house already stated they're raising the debt limit. Therefore the US is not defaulting. At least for another year.

link? source?

 

[YowYan]

This disaster you speak of has been in motion for years already. Lets say since the birth of the fed. Remember the 14 trillion dollar dissapearance. Sounds terrible, right? But it didn't get as much attention as it should. Same with the NDAA. And the same will happen with whatever you're currently talking about. People are too distracted.

 

[LED ZEPPELIN]

This disaster you speak of has been in motion for years already. Lets say since the birth of the fed. Remember the 14 trillion dollar dissapearance. Sounds terrible, right? But it didn't get as much attention as it should. Same with the NDAA. And the same will happen with whatever you're currently talking about. People are too distracted.

i see your point but disagree because a currency default (which is different than assuming debt) affects people instantly, right after it happens. it's not a thing like a long term process such as the patriot act. people will be shocked right after it happens because there it will affect everyone in terms of employment, cash, hyperinflation, all their money in their bank accounts and wallets will lose value because 94% of all the money in circulation in the world is debt generated.

Unless people are really really distracted at the point of having attention-deficit disturb symptons they'd notice this at the first glance.

"shit whats happening with my credit card? wait, i cant pay with cash neither? WTF?"



you may say this would be like in 1972 when nixon killed the gold standard but now its not about exchanging money into gold or silver. its about the ability to print it, to make it have a value.

 

[EnDash]

the US treasury hit it's debt ceiling like 10 times already. remember when republicans and democrates were fighting over obamacare? the republicans were threatning not to raise the debt ceiling and that would be problematic. but in the end everyone settled and the ceiling was raised. they are going to do the same now. and if things really get worrying then they just gonna delete some of the US debts like the european union did in greece. countries in the world are going to lose a lot by having US go insolvent.

beside, you said nothing about the US treasury debt in your threads. you were talking about economy relations with big countries like china and market stocks crashing. this is your third "proof" of catastrophe and it will like the past two not come to pass.

 

[Aim64C]

the US treasury hit it's debt ceiling like 10 times already. remember when republicans and democrates were fighting over obamacare? the republicans were threatning not to raise the debt ceiling and that would be problematic. but in the end everyone settled and the ceiling was raised. they are going to do the same now. and if things really get worrying then they just gonna delete some of the US debts like the european union did in greece. countries in the world are going to lose a lot by having US go insolvent.

beside, you said nothing about the US treasury debt in your threads. you were talking about economy relations with big countries like china and market stocks crashing. this is your third "proof" of catastrophe and it will like the past two not come to pass.

The problem is that Led is correct.

[video=youtube;p-IIyP10PUw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-IIyP10PUw[/video]

Ultimately - our current economic system is impossible. The reason we must continually increase the debt ceiling is because we must continue borrowing money to pay the interest on bonds issued to the Federal Reserve.

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The system is ultimately impossible. It -will- collapse.

The question is when. Opec demanding Federal Reserve bank notes for oil gives the dollar a bit more value than a traditional Fiat currency - but that only goes so far in the long run.

Nothing illustrates the volatility more so than our absolutely insane stock market losses and gains in the past week. These are the very same swings in the stock market that the Federal Reserve was created to temper (that was the argument made - that centralized control over the currency supply would help to prevent a chaotic stock market).

The end result of our currency system is hyper-inflation. It is inescapable at this point, to be blunt. Even if we were to get all of the right politicians into the offices with all the right geniuses to come up with a strategy ... the fact is that the dollar will collapse. The only viable strategy is opening up a 'hard' currency backed by precious metals or some impossible-to-print standard and hoping the economy shifts over to it fast enough to prevent the collapse of the dollar from wiping out the pillars of our economy.

But that very action would trigger a collapse of the dollar.

As will any other action meant to stabilize our debt situation.

Does the blatant insanity not stand out to you? "We must raise the debt ceiling or default?"

That's like saying: "I have to take out a new credit card or I'll default on my car loan."

While some of that is politicians pandering to pandemonium (current revenues allow us to continue payments to the federal reserve - we just can't have two years of unemployment, social security, money dumped into hell-holes of the earth, and wars all over creation) - the fact is that a 'balanced budget' would ultimately trigger a deflationary collapse of our currency supply (which would be a good thing... except for the fact that it would expose the fractional reserve lending insanity that we currently live under... IE - that only 4% of your money is actually in the bank... at least your purchasing power with that 4% will have gone up...)

I don't think it will be this year.

I think it will be next year with the announcement of bailouts for insurance companies and when numbers start rolling in on Medicare and Medicaid spending under Obamacare.

That's my bet. 2014 is probably going to be a chaotic year - but the stock markets are still reacting much in the way that they always have. They rallied around white-washed labor reports (that, when you look deeper, expose that our economy actually got worse... but... who is paying attention, anyway?) - but I doubt that will be a lasting rally/gain. It wreaks of the hyper-reaction of investors who want to edge a .2% gain on their holdings by investing with an upward trend. Many of the gains we saw today will probably dissipate over the next couple days.

But I doubt we'll see an outright collapse. Not yet.

But when it does collapse it's going to be a doozy. Take notes so you can share them around the fire pit with your grand children while telling them tales of machines that could fly and boxes that could talk.

 

[EnDash]

The problem is that Led is correct.

[video=youtube;p-IIyP10PUw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-IIyP10PUw[/video]

Ultimately - our current economic system is impossible. The reason we must continually increase the debt ceiling is because we must continue borrowing money to pay the interest on bonds issued to the Federal Reserve.

You must be registered for see links

The system is ultimately impossible. It -will- collapse.

The question is when. Opec demanding Federal Reserve bank notes for oil gives the dollar a bit more value than a traditional Fiat currency - but that only goes so far in the long run.

Nothing illustrates the volatility more so than our absolutely insane stock market losses and gains in the past week. These are the very same swings in the stock market that the Federal Reserve was created to temper (that was the argument made - that centralized control over the currency supply would help to prevent a chaotic stock market).

The end result of our currency system is hyper-inflation. It is inescapable at this point, to be blunt. Even if we were to get all of the right politicians into the offices with all the right geniuses to come up with a strategy ... the fact is that the dollar will collapse. The only viable strategy is opening up a 'hard' currency backed by precious metals or some impossible-to-print standard and hoping the economy shifts over to it fast enough to prevent the collapse of the dollar from wiping out the pillars of our economy.

But that very action would trigger a collapse of the dollar.

As will any other action meant to stabilize our debt situation.

Does the blatant insanity not stand out to you? "We must raise the debt ceiling or default?"

That's like saying: "I have to take out a new credit card or I'll default on my car loan."

While some of that is politicians pandering to pandemonium (current revenues allow us to continue payments to the federal reserve - we just can't have two years of unemployment, social security, money dumped into hell-holes of the earth, and wars all over creation) - the fact is that a 'balanced budget' would ultimately trigger a deflationary collapse of our currency supply (which would be a good thing... except for the fact that it would expose the fractional reserve lending insanity that we currently live under... IE - that only 4% of your money is actually in the bank... at least your purchasing power with that 4% will have gone up...)

I don't think it will be this year.

I think it will be next year with the announcement of bailouts for insurance companies and when numbers start rolling in on Medicare and Medicaid spending under Obamacare.

That's my bet. 2014 is probably going to be a chaotic year - but the stock markets are still reacting much in the way that they always have. They rallied around white-washed labor reports (that, when you look deeper, expose that our economy actually got worse... but... who is paying attention, anyway?) - but I doubt that will be a lasting rally/gain. It wreaks of the hyper-reaction of investors who want to edge a .2% gain on their holdings by investing with an upward trend. Many of the gains we saw today will probably dissipate over the next couple days.

But I doubt we'll see an outright collapse. Not yet.

But when it does collapse it's going to be a doozy. Take notes so you can share them around the fire pit with your grand children while telling them tales of machines that could fly and boxes that could talk.

yes, the system as you said is impossible. and as you said it will eventually collapse. but i think there is still time and there are still stuff we can do to mitigate it. the world has gone through worse and is still advancing forward, who of us can still feel the great depression or the two world wars today? somehow i think this is going to be less then those.

i think that when the US will reach it's limit, someone is going to pull a solution that will make it so the US will be able to continue operate but with sacrifices. i'm not saying that nothing is going to happen, only that we are not going to have a worldwide catastrophe out of this. by all accounts the US market should have collapsed months ago.

 

[Aim64C]

yes, the system as you said is impossible. and as you said it will eventually collapse. but i think there is still time and there are still stuff we can do to mitigate it. the world has gone through worse and is still advancing forward, who of us can still feel the great depression or the two world wars today? somehow i think this is going to be less then those.

It's already worse.

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The author, unfortunately, does not realize the true causes of the problems (unions forcing companies to pay $50 an hour to a riveter wouldn't fix anything) - but does recognize the problems.

When you take those conditions and put them to the tune of the true causes:

[video=youtube;tGk5ioEXlIM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tGk5ioEXlIM[/video]

And the picture becomes very clear.

Obama pushing for an increase in minimum wage? His personal reasons are irrelevant (he thinks it will get him more popularity) - but the lobbying for an increase in minimum wage is specifically aimed at being a stop-gap against the corrosive effects of inflation. But that will only worsen the economic picture, as the purchasing power of even more Americans will be eroded.

To exemplify - I work for a non-profit Dialysis clinic. Most of our patients are veterans receiving care through the VA, Medicare recipients, Medicaid recipients, etc. We treat first and worry about payment later (we take in a number of patients who get booted from other clinics for missing payments).

So, obviously - my employers are evil money-grubbers who want to wallow in money.

Anyhow - I make roughly $15 an hour. Minimum wage is currently about half of that. While my pay is likely to increase following my certifications for the work I do and other stuff - it's not likely to exceed $20 an hour within the next three to five years. Thus, I currently make roughly 200% of minimum wage.

So, what happens if it gets raised to Obama's $11.50 an hour? Well, initially, that will seem great. People making minimum wage will have more 'money' to spend on goods and services that have not yet adjusted to the fact that all people involved in bringing that product to those minimum wage earners also increases. Environments with strong labor unions will force businesses to increase worker pay to similar minimum wage ratios as before (or worse - force the business to close/leave - with no business to absorb the displaced employees). Others will offer slight increases in pay, while many will simply have to increase their pay to their lowest paid employees without being able to compensate their more senior employees.

This necessitates a rise in prices. Not only have labor costs of manufactured goods (this would include a burger) increased - but so have the prices of their constituent parts - shipping prices go up, energy prices go up, materials prices go up, etc. This forces increased interest in foreign businesses and also means higher domestic costs - most notably in the consumables market.

In other words - food. Consumable prices are on the front lines of inflation with their prices being highly dynamic (due to expiration of the product and the fact that the industry does not 'run up' an inventory). Land and rent prices also go up in response to increased interest in home ownership from minimum wage earners.

You see where this is going. In the end - the increase in minimum wage forces an inflation of prices - most notably among the cost of living (which is what the minimum wage is intended to provide for).

Me? Well - I'm no longer making 200% minimum wage, but 130.4% of minimum wage while the cost of living has inflated. So, I lose purchasing power. Even if my pay were to increase by $5 an hour to $20 an hour - I'd still be looking at 173.9% of minimum wage - which means my purchasing power is roughly less than when I started the job.

But it is the fault of my employer, right?

They are just greedy.

This is precisely why it is called: "Trickle Up Poverty."

Even if my employers were to do the logical thing and increase prices - they would have to take the argument up with Medicare, Medicaid and insurance companies. That would reflect in higher premiums, greater budget deficits (or more taxes), and higher billing for our services.

But so few of our employees receive minimum wage - we get paid above it, now. We can't realistically increase costs, and can't realistically do much to have our pay adjusted. We simply have to eat the decrease in our purchasing power.

i think that when the US will reach it's limit, someone is going to pull a solution that will make it so the US will be able to continue operate but with sacrifices. i'm not saying that nothing is going to happen, only that we are not going to have a worldwide catastrophe out of this. by all accounts the US market should have collapsed months ago.

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This has hardly been noticed in the media.

Why do business in American Dollars?

Because they are needed to buy oil from Opec, and because American and American-based companies use those dollars for business.

"But they just printed twice as much money this year as they had in circulation last year!"

Businesses can (and will) take up other currencies. But they are based on the same centralized bank system that the Federal Reserve is (with much smaller currency bases). The result is that those currencies will be printed into oblivion by a central bank to try and keep the currency 'stable' - which will bubble and collapse those currencies in much the same way (just on a much shorter time scale).

There is no deal that politicians can make that will save the dollar. They do not have the power of a god, as much as American culture believes that the government is capable of violating the laws of physics.