Sasuke should hate Hiruzen

[Son Ryuto Uzumaki]

It was Hiruzen who could not fulfill his obligations as Hokage. Hiruzen was a shitty mediator considering what happened between the Hyugga brothers sacrifice leaving Neji(who should hate Hiruzen also) without father. Sasuke endures genocide :skorps: just souly because hiruzenZzz couldn't use his investigative skills to find the real culprit behind the death of his wife and their successors let alone Kurama destroying the village and killing many.

Hiruzen should have known that no mere Uchiha could control Kurama let alone while the fourth Hokage was there to bare witness to his wife ultimate demise in the process. And its really sad because people actually cried at Hiruzen's funeral. Due to his ineffectiveness his subordinates had to resort to evil means in order to do his job to protect the village

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So Should Sasuke(and many others) Hate:devil: Hiruzen due to the transgressions he allowed as Hokage!?

 

[foxyladyland]

What if Sasuke knows he is named after Hiruzen Sarutobi the 3rd Hokage's father Sarutobi Sasuke?
He hasn't said anything about it himself , but what if he knows?
He probably liked Hiruzen also he knows Danzo was the one who ordered Itachi to murder the Uchiha .
Sasuke seemed a bit sad when he had to go to HIruzen's funeral. it was depressing.

hopefully we will see more Shisui

 

[Draphsin]

Danzo & obito are to blame.

 

[Raekwon26]

Hate him? Maybe.

He should be ashamed of him.
Just a horrible job done as Hokage. Just horrible. Kishi made him look weak.

 

[Hypemaster]

Sasuke should be thanking him.

 

[VolatileSoul]

The man is dead. Sasuke said he want's to be Hokage because all of the past ones messed up and caused his misery. There is no point in hating Hiruzen. Besides, it's not like Sasuke loves him.

 

[Umari Senju]

Why should he hate Hiruzen? Hiruzen wanted peaceful negations with the Uchiha. Don't forget Sasuke's entire clan was planning a coup. Hiruzen sought a peaceful solution to this but was forced to allow Itachi to do it to keep the entire village from falling apart.

You call them failings but this is what it means to be a leader of a nation. You can't make a decision based off of your own personal views. Doing nothing would have resulted in him being overthrown as Hokage. Ordering a kill the Uchiha clan decree would make him into a tyrant and destroy the village internally.

The Hyuuga affair would have resulted in a war with Kumogakure had Hirzen not made the decision he did. So you'd rather have hundreds die just to save face in front of other leaders rather than the loss of a single person who was willing to do this because it was his duty?

Leadership isn't some black and white scenario where one side is good and the other is bad. As a leader you have to account for the repercussions of your decision. Hiruzen's decisions effect the entire nation not just him. He may not have been the best leader, but he wasn't a poor one.

 

[Young Vongola]

I think he doesn't hate Hiruzen because he knows he tried to keep peace, but at the end of the day had to do what was "safest" for Konoha. The Uchiha WERE actually planning a coup, which is what Danzo, Hiruzen and the elders feared. So just think, if Hiruzen hadn't let the genocide mission go through things would be a lot worse. His only choice was to honor Itachi's last wish which was to keep Sasuke safe/away from Danzo.

 

[Xlad]

Spoiler

Why should he hate Hiruzen? Hiruzen wanted peaceful nagotions with the Uchiha. Don't forget Sasuke's entire clan was planning a coup. Hiruzen sought a peaceful solution to this but was forced to allow Itachi to do it to keep the entire village from falling apart.

You call them failings but this is what it means to be a leader of a nation. You can't make a decision based off of your own personal views a single person. Doing nothing would have resulted in him being overthrown as Hokage. Ordering a kill the Uchiha clan decree would make him into a tyrant and destroy the village internally.

The Hyuuga Adair would have resulted in a war with Kumogakure had Hirzen not made the decision he did. So you'd rather have hundreds die just to save face in front of other leaders rather than the loss of a single person who was willing to do this because it was his duty?

Leadership isn't some black and white senario where one side is good and the other is bad. As a leader you have to account for the reprecussions of your decision. Hiruzen's dicisions effect the entire nation not just him. He may not have been the best leader, but he wasn't a poor one.

Wow. Very good post.

 

[Raekwon26]

People always say the Uchiha Clan was planning a Coup, but ALWAYS leave out WHY and HOW that planned Coup came to be.....

It wasn't some spur of the moment thing.

 

[Shunsin no Shisui]

hopefully we will see more Shisui

Please marry me! ....eheh, just kidding. =D

It was Hiruzen who could not fulfill his obligations as Hokage. Hiruzen was a shitty mediator considering what happened between the Hyugga brothers sacrifice leaving Neji(who should hate Hiruzen also) without father. Sasuke endures genocide :skorps: just souly because hiruzenZzz couldn't use his investigative skills to find the real culprit behind the death of his wife and their successors let alone Kurama destroying the village and killing many.

Hiruzen should have known that no mere Uchiha could control Kurama let alone while the fourth Hokage was there to bare witness to his wife ultimate demise in the process. And its really sad because people actually cried at Hiruzen's funeral. Due to his ineffectiveness his subordinates had to resort to evil means in order to do his job to protect the village

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So Should Sasuke(and many others) Hate:devil: Hiruzen due to the transgressions he allowed as Hokage!?

mgrh mgrh *coughs* I think it's best if we leave Hiruzen be. U_U Afterall, we can say he is more like Itachi in a way. They both failed during their lifetime. hmm Itachi managed to do something praiseworthy when he was edo. :yeah: Hiruzen also seems to be doing a good job at making up for what he's done.

 

[To Whatever]

It was Hiruzen who could not fulfill his obligations as Hokage. Hiruzen was a shitty mediator considering what happened between the Hyugga brothers sacrifice leaving Neji(who should hate Hiruzen also) without father. Sasuke endures genocide :skorps: just souly because hiruzenZzz couldn't use his investigative skills to find the real culprit behind the death of his wife and their successors let alone Kurama destroying the village and killing many.

Hiruzen should have known that no mere Uchiha could control Kurama let alone while the fourth Hokage was there to bare witness to his wife ultimate demise in the process. And its really sad because people actually cried at Hiruzen's funeral. Due to his ineffectiveness his subordinates had to resort to evil means in order to do his job to protect the village

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So Should Sasuke(and many others) Hate:devil: Hiruzen due to the transgressions he allowed as Hokage!?

Regarding the Hyuuga Clan and the death of Neji's father. Hiruzen wasn't being the mediator. He was simply there to hear the Hyuuga leaders decisions regarding the cloud village as it was Hiashi's fault since he killed an important cloud nin. Hizashi willingly accepted the idea of taking his brother's place as he wanted to decide his own fate. Hiruzen didn't say anything because he most likely saw the conviction Hizashi had and since it would avoid war with the Cloud there was nothing needed to say. Hiruzen respected the Hyuuga enough make such an important decision.

Hiruzen was against the massacre of the Uchiha Clan, he was simply outnumbered and had no time to create a more peaceful solution before Danzo and the others acted.

He watched over Sasuke & Naruto after their family were killed.

Hiruzen's failure to kill his student shouldn't be held against him because he had full intent to kill him when he attacked the leaf.
It can be compared to Naruto's unwillingness to kill Sasuke(would die with him).

Hiruzen admitted he wasn't perfect and his ineffectiveness let Danzo work behind the scenes but as a whole that doesn't make him a bad person and Sasuke shouldn't hate him.

You should know how konoha's elders work when they talk to Tsunade. Or when they tried to keep Naruto hidden despite the entire village being destroyed. Hiruzen isn't as tenacious as Tsunade when it comes to things like that.

 

[BlacLord™]

Sasuke knows Hiruzen's intentions were good and he appreciates that he tried to resolve the situation without a massacre.

He should, and does hate Danzo for putting Itachi in such a difficult situation and for the massacre.

 

[-Spoiler-]

People always say the Uchiha Clan was planning a Coup, but ALWAYS leave out WHY and HOW that planned Coup came to be.....

It wasn't some spur of the moment thing.

A uchiha tried to destroy the village?

 

[To Whatever]

People always say the Uchiha Clan was planning a Coup, but ALWAYS leave out WHY and HOW that planned Coup came to be.....

It wasn't some spur of the moment thing.

They felt(were) oppressed and when a certain Uchiha released a giant ass fox on the village it was the breaking point.

They were ostracized and oppressed even more because they were seen as a threat and the village had reason to believe they were behind the attack.

 

[From the Dark Spire]

Why should he hate Hiruzen? Hiruzen wanted peaceful negations with the Uchiha. Don't forget Sasuke's entire clan was planning a coup. Hiruzen sought a peaceful solution to this but was forced to allow Itachi to do it to keep the entire village from falling apart.

You call them failings but this is what it means to be a leader of a nation. You can't make a decision based off of your own personal views. Doing nothing would have resulted in him being overthrown as Hokage. Ordering a kill the Uchiha clan decree would make him into a tyrant and destroy the village internally.

The Hyuuga affair would have resulted in a war with Kumogakure had Hirzen not made the decision he did. So you'd rather have hundreds die just to save face in front of other leaders rather than the loss of a single person who was willing to do this because it was his duty?

Leadership isn't some black and white scenario where one side is good and the other is bad. As a leader you have to account for the repercussions of your decision. Hiruzen's decisions effect the entire nation not just him. He may not have been the best leader, but he wasn't a poor one.

Regarding the Hyuuga Clan and the death of Neji's father. Hiruzen wasn't being the mediator. He was simply there to hear the Hyuuga leaders decisions regarding the cloud village as it was Hiashi's fault since he killed an important cloud nin. Hizashi willingly accepted the idea of taking his brother's place as he wanted to decide his own fate. Hiruzen didn't say anything because he most likely saw the conviction Hizashi had and since it would avoid war with the Cloud there was nothing needed to say. Hiruzen respected the Hyuuga enough make such an important decision.

Hiruzen was against the massacre of the Uchiha Clan, he was simply outnumbered and had no time to create a more peaceful solution before Danzo and the others acted.

He watched over Sasuke & Naruto after their family were killed.

Hiruzen's failure to kill his student shouldn't be held against him because he had full intent to kill him when he attacked the leaf.
It can be compared to Naruto's unwillingness to kill Sasuke(would die with him).

Hiruzen admitted he wasn't perfect and his ineffectiveness let Danzo work behind the scenes but as a whole that doesn't make him a bad person and Sasuke shouldn't hate him.

You should know how konoha's elders work when they talk to Tsunade. Or when they tried to keep Naruto hidden despite the entire village being destroyed. Hiruzen isn't as tenacious as Tsunade when it comes to things like that.

Both of these I couldn't say better myself... Thank you both.

 

[Raekwon26]

They felt(were) oppressed and when a certain Uchiha released a giant ass fox on the village it was the breaking point.

They were ostracized and oppressed even more because they were seen as a threat and the village had reason to believe they were behind the attack.

You're making my point.
And when they looked talk with the leader of the village and make progress, none was made and felt that if they don't act now, it could be the end for all of them.

Hiruzen's job is to lead, he was so passive it's borderline shameful.

A uchiha tried to destroy the village?

Are you serious?
You do know the Uchiha felt oppressed BEFORE that even took place?
You know that right?

 

[To Whatever]

You're making my point.
And when they looked talk with the leader of the village and make progress, none was made and felt that if they don't act now, it could be the end for all of them.

Hiruzen's job is to lead, he was so passive it's borderline shameful.

Hiruzen was restricted by the Elders and Danzo even before the coup was even thought of. It was already established before Hiruzen became Hokage that the Uchiha would be watched. Konoha doesn't have a totalitarianism government. Hiruzen can't say "fk all that noise elders, Danzo. This is what i'm going to do". It's hard to make progress after a giant fox with Sharigan attacked your village.

Hiruzen most likely took it up with the elders but they were positive that the attack wasn't a coincidence and that someone amongst the Uchiha in the village are threatening Konoha.

A coup as a stupid decision that they made and the end result was a stupid decision that Itachi and the elders made.

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You see how stubborn as **** they are?

Tsunade was about to beat the shit out of them. I don't know how Hiruzen even got shit done.

 

[-Spoiler-]

Are you serious?
You do know the Uchiha felt oppressed BEFORE that even took place?
You know that right?

so what the gave them the konoha police force, the problem with the uchiha is that they were power hungry not oppressed, all the other noble clans was isolated in certain areas of the village did they tried a coup? no.

the uchiha was just as much to blame for the massacre as danzo the brought it on themselves there were easier ways of dealing with the situation.
even itachi rather take full blame than damage the clan rep.

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[Umari Senju]

Hiruzen was restricted by the Elders and Danzo even before the coup was even thought of. It was already established before Hiruzen became Hokage that the Uchiha would be watched. Konoha doesn't have a totalitarianism government. Hiruzen can't say "fk all that noise elders, Danzo. This is what i'm going to do". It's hard to make progress after a giant fox with Sharigan attacked your village.

Hiruzen most likely took it up with the elders but they were positive that the attack wasn't a coincidence and that someone amongst the Uchiha in the village are threatening Konoha.

A coup as a stupid decision that they made and the end result was a stupid decision that Itachi and the elders made.

A good leader knows when NOT to act as well as when to. Keep that in mind.

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You see how stubborn as **** they are?

Tsunade was about to beat the shit out of them. I don't know how Hiruzen even got shit done.

so what the gave them the konoha police force, the problem with the uchiha is that they were power hungry not oppressed, all the other noble clans was isolated in certain areas of the village did they tried a coup? no.

the uchiha was just as much to blame for the massacre as danzo the brought it on themselves there were easier ways of dealing with the situation.
even itachi rather take full blame than damage the clan rep.

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And I completely agree with both of you 100%. To the OP; Do you have any younger brothers or sisters? if so have you ever made a decision that looks bad on you or brought shame to you in the eyes of your parents and others because of something they did and you took the blame for it?

It's the same thing here. Hiruzen, Like all the other Kage of every Village think about the well being of their village as a whole. If it makes them look weak then they appear weak. That doesn't make them poor leaders.