Establishing why: Tayuya&Kido > Sakura or Tsunade

[TheTailedSage]

The medics fate

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The medics don't stand a fighting chance against the sound 4 regardless of rank and people need to recognise that rank means squat in fights if the opposer has the skill to take them out.

Tayuya starting off

Starting with Tayuya people dont like to admit that Tayuya WILL start off with sound genjutsu weather the fans want to admit it or not. Why? because that's the only tool she has and she has no other weapon or jutsu to actually fight. Therefore Tayuya is going to start with genjutsu. Regardless of anyone's knowledge Sakura and Tsunade get caught in the genjutsu.

tayuyas genjutsu affect the limbs that are used to create the sign in order to escape the genjutsu and its stated you need to stop your chakra flow in order to break it.

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However you need to do an hand sign to break out of it no matter how good your chakra control is.

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It is designed to restrict movement and nothing more

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Sakura nor Tsunade will be able to do this so they would have to resort in causing pain to themselves. No, biting your tongue will not work that lame excuse has been used too many times. If this is all that had to be done to break out then Shikamaru wouldn't have taken extreme measure to break his finger. While where on that shikamaru topic, he used shadows to break his fingers (his jutsu) since he was unable to move:

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So if They are trapped in that genjutsu, to manga knowledge, they wont be able to move. Shikamaru beat her because of his unique Naara jutsu. This is why i say rank means nothing in battle if they opposer is a bad match up.

Plus having sage chakra (curse mark) only makes this genjtsu 3x stronger since its a lv2 sound gen.
For argument sake lets say they can break out, it will take them a while and by this time kidomaru follows up.

Kidomaru's input

To ensure they are still and can move one bit (not even to summon katsuya) He uses spider web unrolling to then bind Sakura and Tsunade as re-enforcement to that genjutsu. Now only a fanboy/girl will say that they escape the web which needs special techniques to free yourself (gentle fist or amatarasu) AND Lv2 tayuya sound gen which initially is almost impossible to break out of considering their fighting style and jutsu.

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Neji explaining

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Once they are cocooned they can literally do nothing. Their strength is useless due to the tight restriction they are on and there are still sound 4 left not to mention all they have done is restrain them so far.

Once they are like this Kidomaru sets up his arrow which is guaranteed to leave a huge hole through the victim.

Tsunades fate

Let me say right now that Tsunade WILL die from this shot to the brain because even though she can regenerate the brain cells dont regen. Once they die they die thus she also dies. Sakura dies from an arrow to the heart or the head it doesn't matter.

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If this hits them both its game over.

To make matters worst i haven't even mentioned all their other jutsu, ill gladly counter anything you guys have​

 

[Wabbit]

What if Tsunade and Sakura bites lip like Kurenei to break out of genjutsu will it work?

 

[Europa]

I don't see how biting your tongue or your gums wouldn't work. It only takes pain to dispel it. And the victims can speak in the genjutsu.

 

[TheTailedSage]

What if Tsunade and Sakura bites lip like Kurenei to break out of genjutsu will it work?

No because this is level 2 senjtsu infused sound gen, Shikamaru himself went through extreme measures just to gain control

I don't see how biting your tongue or your gums wouldn't work. It only takes pain to dispel it. And the victims can speak in the genjutsu.

If it were that simple then why did shikamaru break his finger instead of biting his tongue

 

[UchihaNagashi]

I believe Tsunade can survive against Tayuya's Genjutsu. The only reason why Shikamaru didn't bite his tongue, was because he would've had to bite it off completely and die from the lack of blood. However, Tsunade with her healing abilities, can regenerate that part rather easily.

Not to mention, using Byakugō to disrupt the flow of Chakura can be useful. Jiraiya stated that disrupting the Chakura flow by an outer source breaks you out of it. Byakugō as this way, can be considered as an outer distraction, thus being a second party. This can be good for Sakura.

Tsunade can tank rather all attacks, except head targeted, from Kidōmaru when using Arō with strings attached, pull him to the ground and let Sakura finish him.

Not to mention, if they summon Katsuyu, Kidōmaru's web armor will be torn off by the acid, not to mention taking Tayuya out of the game rather easily.

Sakura & Tsunade take this, I disagree with this theory.​

 

[HiddenSound]

I don't see how biting your tongue or your gums wouldn't work. It only takes pain to dispel it. And the victims can speak in the genjutsu.

You're really underestimating Mugen Onsa... Shikamaru had to break a bone to snap out of it.

 

[Headmaster]

2 of the sound 4 can't beat them

 

[fayeon]

Biting lips until its bleed break through genjutsu .

Saying it won't work because shkimaru didn't use it ,is a lame excuse .

If shikamaru used the lip or tongue bite And it doesn't work than he try to break his finger instead

Than i believe you ..


But it never been stated that the lip bite doesn't work instead its confirmed that they use it in breaking other genjutsu's


So your whole scenario fails



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Also to free themselves from the chakra webs

They use chakra scalpel (both have it)

 

[Untamed]

Tsunade's regeneration and Katsuyu could help relieve her of the webs . Katsuyu's acid.

Katsuyu protected Sakura from Pein's jutsu that destroyed the Leaf village. She hid in Katsuyu's body and was protected and safe. That wasn't even a huge katsuyu I think.

Also Tsunade's strength could tear the trees and use them as weapons to swing at the two shinobi.

 

[fayeon]

Actually by your logic no one can beat tayuya solo


Since they can't break through genjutsu unless they have shadows like shikamru

 

[KingHashirama]

But why can't i say Tsunade just f*cks up their nerve system, and then Sakura proceeds to solo them with the poison kunai?

 

[TheTailedSage]

But why can't i say Tsunade just f*cks up their nerve system, and then Sakura proceeds to solo them with the poison kunai?

Because they get restricted at the beginning of the fight

Actually by your logic no one can beat tayuya solo


Since they can't break through genjutsu unless they have shadows like shikamru

No but they are just a bad match-up . Lot of people can beat tayuya but they are just unabel to do so.

Tsunade's regeneration and Katsuyu could help relieve her of the webs . Katsuyu's acid.

Katsuyu protected Sakura from Pein's jutsu that destroyed the Leaf village. She hid in Katsuyu's body and was protected and safe. That wasn't even a huge katsuyu I think.

Also Tsunade's strength could tear the trees and use them as weapons to swing at the two shinobi.

Katsuya doesnt get summoned due to webs and gen. if they were to go inside katsuya the water in katsuyas body would only amplify the gens effect.

Biting lips until its bleed break through genjutsu .

Saying it won't work because shkimaru didn't use it ,is a lame excuse .

If shikamaru used the lip or tongue bite And it doesn't work than he try to break his finger instead

Than i believe you ..


But it never been stated that the lip bite doesn't work instead its confirmed that they use it in breaking other genjutsu's


So your whole scenario fails



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Also to free themselves from the chakra webs

They use chakra scalpel (both have it)

How is that a lame excuse, if it was that siple to do so he WOULD have done so. Tell me why he broke his finger then if the counter is so lame. do you think someone of shikamarus intellect would break his finger if he didnt have to?

The whoel scenario doesn't fail. Even if what yoru sayign is plausable which from manga facts it isnt, the shock of being in the genjutsu stuns them for a while. they get webbed. They woudl have o move in order to cut it so you poin tis invalid.

2 of the sound 4 can't beat them

I know

I believe Tsunade can survive against Tayuya's Genjutsu. The only reason why Shikamaru didn't bite his tongue, was because he would've had to bite it off completely and die from the lack of blood. However, Tsunade with her healing abilities, can regenerate that part rather easily.

Not to mention, using Byakugō to disrupt the flow of Chakura can be useful. Jiraiya stated that disrupting the Chakura flow by an outer source breaks you out of it. Byakugō as this way, can be considered as an outer distraction, thus being a second party. This can be good for Sakura.

Tsunade can tank rather all attacks, except head targeted, from Kidōmaru when using Arō with strings attached, pull him to the ground and let Sakura finish him.

Not to mention, if they summon Katsuyu, Kidōmaru's web armor will be torn off by the acid, not to mention taking Tayuya out of the game rather easily.

Sakura & Tsunade take this, I disagree with this theory.​

And someone of Shikamarus intellect would have done it if he had regen jutsu but it still would of taken him a while to actually overcome the shock of the genjutsu, plus i would take a while to bite your own tongue off so like i said by the time they have done all of this they are caught by doki or kidomarus web. You need tiger hand seal to active it which she wont be able to do that's exactly what i'm saying. Their counters to gen need hand seals. I know that which is why the only way to kill her is head shot i did say that mate. They aren't going to summon Katsuya because they get dealt with quicky; the gen and web combo prevents them from summoning.

 

[I Sun I]

Biting lips =pain >> tayuya genjutsu

Shikamaru not using it ,doesn't mean it does not work .

Plot wise if all characters used the same thing to free themselves it would been lame .





Example sasuke and itachi used eye genjutsu on each other to dispel the genjutsu

Even though they could have amatsaru part of themselves to dispel the genjutsu .


But because they didn't use that and used something else doesn't mean it wouldn't work.



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I am 100% sure if they bite their tongues or lips until they bleed and feel pain the genjutsu will go away .

However the genjutsu will delay sakura or tsunade at least five seconds

And kido uses his webs on sakura or tsunade


Sakura or tsunade after breaking through genjutsu will use something to cut the webs

And they already have chakra scalpel in their arsenal so bye bye webs

From than sakura or tsunade can solo .




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Another example(even though in this genjutsu the person paralyze but can move a little) : sasuke stabs his hand to get free from genjutsu

He did not break his finger or bite his lips but again it doesn't mean "biting lips "or "breaking finger" won't work .

 

[TheEvilOne]

Releasing the seal counters the genjutsu, their superior stamina, taijutsu, speed, intelligence and strength destroys them. Only the biggest Sakura/Tsuande haters would disagree.

 

[TheTailedSage]

Releasing the seal counters the genjutsu, their superior stamina, taijutsu, speed, intelligence and strength destroys them. Only the biggest Sakura/Tsuande haters would disagree.

Okay evil one, clearly didnt read the post

Biting lips =pain >> tayuya genjutsu

Shikamaru not using it ,doesn't mean it does not work .

Plot wise if all characters used the same thing to free themselves it would been lame .





Example sasuke and itachi used eye genjutsu on each other to dispel the genjutsu

Even though they could have amatsaru part of themselves to dispel the genjutsu .


But because they didn't use that and used something else doesn't mean it wouldn't work.



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I am 100% sure if they bite their tongues or lips until they bleed and feel pain the genjutsu will go away .

However the genjutsu will delay sakura or tsunade at least five seconds

And kido uses his webs on sakura or tsunade


Sakura or tsunade after breaking through genjutsu will use something to cut the webs

And they already have chakra scalpel in their arsenal so bye bye webs

From than sakura or tsunade can solo .




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Another example(even though in this genjutsu the person paralyze but can move a little) : sasuke stabs his hand to get free from genjutsu

He did not break his finger or bite his lips but again it doesn't mean "biting lips "or "breaking finger" won't work .

That counter is getting really old with no evidence to back it up. so then why did he use something that gave him way more pain? think about it :| if it were that simple to bite his lip he would have done so.

No that would be stupid because genjutsuing eachother out of it is much more efficient and they were both already inside the gen so harming each other inside the gen is useless.

how can you be 100% sure when no one has been shown doing this? pain didnt do it so what makes you think that its that simple to break out of.

I already countered the rest on another post.

 

[TheEvilOne]

Okay evil one, clearly didnt read the post


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Why should I read a post which is coming from a Tsunade hater???

Hell, Genma (!!!!! ) and a random jounin forced the sound 4 to use the CS2... Imagine what would a Hokage do againt them, lmao. There is no need to counter or explain how she defeats them.


btw, Tsunade can release the seal without handseals. Only the Sozo Saize requires a handseal.

 

[TheTailedSage]

Why should I read a post which is coming from a Tsunade hater???

Hell, Genma (!!!!! ) and a random jounin forced the sound 4 to use the CS2... Imagine what would a Hokage do againt them, lmao. There is no need to counter or explain how she defeats them.


btw, Tsunade can release the seal without handseals. Only the Sozo Saize requires a handseal.

I have said this many times before, personal preference doesnt cloud my judgment in a fight, because i dislike a character doesnt mean im biased. Your ignorance to not read the thread is why im not really taking your post into consideration. you bring rank into it again... and no she cant sheneeds the tiger hand seal.

 

[I Sun I]

Okay evil one, clearly didnt read the post




That counter is getting really old with no evidence to back it up. so then why did he use something that gave him way more pain? think about it :| if it were that simple to bite his lip he would have done so.

No that would be stupid because genjutsuing eachother out of it is much more efficient and they were both already inside the gen so harming each other inside the gen is useless.

how can you be 100% sure when no one has been shown doing this? pain didnt do it so what makes you think that its that simple to break out of.

I already countered the rest on another post.

Than why sasuke stabs himself instead of breaking a finger ? Why did he use something that gave him way more Pain? :|


And the reason people mention the lip bite is because its been used in the manga as a way to dispel genjutsu

There is nothing proving that lip bite doesn't work on tayuya period .

 

[TheTailedSage]

Than why sasuke stabs himself instead of breaking a finger ? Why did he use something that gave him way more Pain? :|

so getting stabbed isn't extremely painful? try stabbing yourself through the hand and you will have first hand experience of the pain he felt. plus the pain is immediate and direct

 

[mafo]

TSUNADE RAKES THEM BOTH BY HERSELF LOW DIFF
SUMMON SLUG = ACID
GYAKUGO = GENJUTSU SHIELD
SHE WOULD CLEAR THE FOREST PUNCHING THEM TO BITS.

C'mon guys she got split in half by a huge bolder and survive...LOW DIFF