Hiruzen and "manga facts"

[Young Vongola]

I don't really care that much about character's power levels and placements in tier lists or whatever, but I have a question regarding Hiruzen. Why is it that people deny that he knows all jutsu developed in Konoha, and that he was the strongest kage in his era? If I'm not mistaken, it was stated in the manga and/or databooks. Aren't these sources practically law to members of this forum? If so, how come people deny what's been stated? Simply because he hasn't used them?

Everytime I see Itachi mentioned, I see Yata mirror brought up, and people claim it's invincible. We've only seen it block explosive kunai, not any jutsu, if my memory serves correctly. So why is it that Yata mirror is considered invincible by fans because it was stated in the databooks, but not the fact that Hiruzen was a God of Shinobi and can use all Konoha jutsu?

I just need this to be cleared up, because it doesn't make too much sense to me how some things from the book are taken as facts while others aren't.

 

[Mattek2008]

Because he hasn't shown many abilities that he has been said to have, and there are lots of contradictions regarding him being the strongest hokage, such as the people thinking that Hashiramas power was a fairy tale or a myth.

 

[Hypemaster]

Haters gonna hate on the professor

 

[Princessu Kaaantchan]

It's an entirely subjective concept my friend. People see Hiruzen's Summon's feat of pushing full Kurama around and can't accept the fact that, via power scaling, it would flatten anything short of legged Susano'o.

They learn the truth and repress it; then they're introduced to the concept of the "Hype". It's a mystical substance born of a concept new to them all, and one they can't quite cope against.

Why is that? It's simple:

They're afraid.

And they don't like the fact that their favs ain't gettin' any.

 

[startup97]

They are all just mad that an old man can solo the majority of their favourite characters.

 

[AllseeingSharingan]

I don't think he was stronger than 3rd raikage

 

[-Punk-]

Feats > Hype . we can't judge the character just because it was said that he knows all the jutsus . We haven't seen enough of him to even believe his old annoying hype , people have to deal with it until he shut us up.

 

[BenjerminGaye]

I don't really care that much about character's power levels and placements in tier lists or whatever, but I have a question regarding Hiruzen. Why is it that people deny that he knows all jutsu developed in Konoha, and that he was the strongest kage in his era? If I'm not mistaken, it was stated in the manga and/or databooks. Aren't these sources practically law to members of this forum? If so, how come people deny what's been stated? Simply because he hasn't used them?

Everytime I see Itachi mentioned, I see Yata mirror brought up, and people claim it's invincible. We've only seen it block explosive kunai, not any jutsu, if my memory serves correctly. So why is it that Yata mirror is considered invincible by fans because it was stated in the databooks, but not the fact that Hiruzen was a God of Shinobi and can use all Konoha jutsu?

I just need this to be cleared up, because it doesn't make too much sense to me how some things from the book are taken as facts while others aren't.

Because certain clans within konoha (aburame, inuzuka, hyuuga, uchiha)require certain prerequisites(bugs, dogs,byakugan,sharingan) to use their techs. Them being in konoha automatically makes it konoha techs. Konoha techs he can't use. Thus debunking the hype.

 

[Punk Hazard]

Because there's no way Hiruzen knew techniques of the Akimichi, Nara, Yamanaka, Aburame, Uchiha, Hyuga, or Inuzuka, so his hype is questionable at best.

 

[Princessu Kaaantchan]

Feats > Hype . we can't judge the character just because it was said that he knows all the jutsus . We haven't seen enough of him to even believe his old annoying hype , people have to deal with it until he shut us up.

I remember when you postulated that Mei was the best Suiton user in the series.

 

[-Punk-]

I remember when you postulated that Mei was the best Suiton user in the series.

So what ? ......she at least has shown enough feats for me to consider her the best , something the old professor hasn't .

 

[SnakeSkinBlade]

He has mastered the known jutsu that high level ninja can master within the leaf village, excluding kekkei genkai techniques of course.

 

[Holy Cross]

Because they think that a statement made by the writer, and conveyed through people who know about Hiruzen, isn't enough 'proof'

It's almost as if they're in denial.

EDIT: I bet if he actually DID receive feats, people'd say something like, 'I wasn't paying attention, so it didn't happen'.

 

[Joon]

Knowledge is Power. That what makes him great.

 

[startup97]

I bet that when he eventually gets his feats. The haters so much in denial will start to make threads and claim how easily his techniques can be countered.

 

[The Necromancer]

Because they think that a statement made by the writer, and conveyed through people who know about Hiruzen, isn't enough 'proof'

It's almost as if they're in denial.

EDIT: I bet if he actually DID receive feats, people'd say something like, 'I wasn't paying attention, so it didn't happen'.

How about the fact that Hiruzen was frightened when Hashi even spiked his chakra, and claimed that Juubito was "stronger than even you" when referencing Hashirama, despite the fact that Iruka believed him to be stronger than Hashi.

A little contradictory, don't you think?

 

[BenjerminGaye]

It's an entirely subjective concept my friend. People see Hiruzen's Summon's feat of pushing full Kurama around and can't accept the fact that, via power scaling, it would flatten anything short of legged Susano'o.

They learn the truth and repress it; then they're introduced to the concept of the "Hype". It's a mystical substance born of a concept new to them all, and one they can't quite cope against.

Why is that? It's simple:

They're afraid.

And they don't like the fact that their favs ain't gettin' any.

That only happened in the anime

 

[startup97]

How about the fact that Hiruzen was frightened when Hashi even spiked his chakra, and claimed that Juubito was "stronger than even you" when referencing Hashirama, despite the fact that Iruka believed him to be stronger than Hashi.

A little contradictory, don't you think?

What about an actual feat if you will...

Spoiler

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No matter how much you can argue about this fight. Old Hiruzen still soloed Edo Hashirama + Edo Tobirama with clones.

 

[Princessu Kaaantchan]

That only happened in the anime

I have a scan...

 

[The Necromancer]

What about an actual feat if you will...

Spoiler

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No matter how much you can argue about this fight. Old Hiruzen still soloed Edo Hashirama + Edo Tobirama with clones.

-Sigh- They were not full power.