Why EMS Madara is not on the same level as Hashirama.

[VongolaX]

The way I see it, they're dead even.

Hashirama in the end didn't/couldn't kill EMS Madara

 

[The 1 who knows]

True... i have been sayin this but you brought it out better

 

[ll BL4CKM00N ll]

They're on the same level in every aspect this shouldn't even be debated.

 

[KidGamer65]

They aren't on the same level if Kurama isn't factored in simply because he lost to Hashirama even when he had Kurama, and because his strongest technique is matched by Mokujin, which isn't Hashirama's strongest technique since he has another technique much much much much much more powerful.

 

[TrollingSage]

No its not. That was Hashirama in his SM. I am talking about base Hashirama.

-It doesn't have fire-power to slightly scratch PS
-Madara had later destroyed it



I don't care to bit about character portrayal as its not important when comparing both abilities. And by portrayal, Uchiha were the only match the Senju:

Spoiler

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That's what i said.

Wrong. Hashirama himself in base mode can match the power of bijuu, hence why all of them were under his control:

Spoiler

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So in base mode, his jutsu can match the scales of Kyuubi. All he needs is the power to increase them to folds. That's where Sage mode comes to.

Incorrect. Kyuubi is simply Madara's power same as Hashirama to SM. Hashi in base cannot beat Madara's PS.

As the latest chapter has proved, Hashirama doesnt need SM to pin down Madara. He doesnt need to break PS to defeat him. The wooden dragon that absorbs chakra is enough. If you remember at VOTE when Hashirama saw Susano and kyubi, He said "susano isn't a problem". It was the kyubi+ susano combo that forced him into sm.

 

[TheCCV]

Didn't read because of that lebron pic at the end.
Those things are seriously getting annoying.

 

[Booker]

Didn't read because of that lebron pic at the end.
Those things are seriously getting annoying.

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[YellowFang]

Madara[EMS] used his full potential (i.e. including Kurama) against Hashirama who also went all-out on him, seizing a narrow victory in the end...

Now that Madara has reborn, he has all those abilities with him that he had while an Edo ex. ET reneration and infinite chakra IMO...
Madara sure have an upperhand but Hashi is not far behind, he ain't going down even now...

We'll just have to wait and see...

Note: Never compare Sasuke to Madara until he actually gets a hold of even a portion of power Madara has...

 

[xxSAGExx]

The way I see it, they're dead even.

Hashirama in the end didn't/couldn't kill EMS Madara

It wasn't that Hashirama couldn't, he plain out said he was certain Madara died that day and he doesn't know how he survived so Madara having a way to "survive" doesn't mean Hashirama couldn't have killed him

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. Hashirama has Bijuus 2-8 yet didn't need to use them while Madara used Kurama, they're on the same level but Hashirama is stronger.

Madara[EMS] used his full potential (i.e. including Kurama) against Hashirama who also went all-out on him, seizing a narrow victory in the end...

Now that Madara has reborn, he has all those abilities with him that he had while an Edo ex. ET reneration and infinite chakra IMO...
Madara sure have an upperhand but Hashi is not far behind, he ain't going down even now...

We'll just have to wait and see...

Note: Never compare Sasuke to Madara until he actually gets a hold of even a portion of power Madara has...

Wrong, Hashirama wasn't trying to kill Madara until the end of the fight, he plain out said he didn't want to kill Madara and didn't use the Bijuus 2-8 which he had.

ohkkay i guess she was read this

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Wrong, We plain out saw Hashirama put Kurama to sleep then beat Madara. She sealed Kurama sometime after the fight.

ohhkay so sasukue beat naruto doesnt mean he is stronger , madaara progress from loosing with the rinngan what did hashirama gain?

Was Naruto ever trying to Kill Sasuke while Sasuke was trying to kill Naruto? Hashirama gained Kurama while he already had Bijuus 2-8 that he didn't even need to use.

maadara obtain the rinngan after the fight , saying there arent same lvl is bull, he obtain a new lvl and hashirama never progressed after the fight

Hashirama gained Kurama so false.

and read what i said mcgenius u cant not compare them cuz after the fight he achieved a new lvl , u cant say they arent on the same lvl if hashirama barley won

Hashirama wasn't trying to kill Madara, he was trying to talk him down thru out the whole fight. When he got serious is when Madara died. Hashirama didn't even use his full power, the Bijuus.

no they arent the same lvl they both nearly died righttt like i said its bull madara never used
izanami

I already said why Hashirama wasn't fighting full force while Madara did. Really? The Izanami that isn't suitable for a real battle and wouldn't work on Hashirama because he doesn't try to change his destiny or what is suppose to happen which is what Izanagi does and why Izanami was created to counter.

Madara+Kurama<Hashirama
Hashirama+Bijuus 2-8>>>>>Madara+Kurama

After the battle Hashirama had all Bijuus which puts prime Hashirama>Current Madara

 

[Ahmed1993]

No its not. That was Hashirama in his SM. I am talking about base Hashirama.

-It doesn't have fire-power to slightly scratch PS
-Madara had later destroyed it



I don't care to bit about character portrayal as its not important when comparing both abilities. And by portrayal, Uchiha were the only match the Senju:

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

That's what i said.

Wrong. Hashirama himself in base mode can match the power of bijuu, hence why all of them were under his control:

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

So in base mode, his jutsu can match the scales of Kyuubi. All he needs is the power to increase them to folds. That's where Sage mode comes to.

Incorrect. Kyuubi is simply Madara's power same as Hashirama to SM. Hashi in base cannot beat Madara's PS.

But Here it is said Uchiha < Senju ( at least Madara and Hashirama's generation

Spoiler

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Base or SM , it doesn't matter both are his own powers , he trained hard to achieve them.

Madara is the one using borrowed power ( His brother's eye and the Kyuubi )

SM is Hashirama's own power , unlike the Kyuubi who is a living entity.

If that is so then take away Hashirama's wooden dragon summoning ._.
And Correction: ITachi never said Summonings are not ones own power, he was saying that Kabuto's spamming of OTHER peoples skills and attacks is not his own power

OT: I still think they are both on equal levels, since

The wood Dragon is a Mokuton Jutsu (created by Hashirama's power ) not a Summoning.

Itachi said : stop thinking that others's power are your own.

EMS Madara < Hashirama , EMS Madara + Kyuubi =< Hashirama.

I thought this was common knowledge.. I mean.. cmon Hashi smashed Madara multiple times.. Madara even got the come back from life with everything possible to make him better (Rinnegan, unlimited chakra, Rinnegan, dat DNA, ect) and he still got beat in a matter of a few panels..

I had to clear it out , also read what i said about the living Rinnegan Madara and Edo Madara in the PS.

The way I see it, they're dead even.

Hashirama in the end didn't/couldn't kill EMS Madara

Nope , they are not.
Hashirama couldn't kill EMS Madara + Kyuubi.

True... i have been sayin this but you brought it out better

Thank you.

They're on the same level in every aspect this shouldn't even be debated.

Do you even read the manga ?

They aren't on the same level if Kurama isn't factored in simply because he lost to Hashirama even when he had Kurama, and because his strongest technique is matched by Mokujin, which isn't Hashirama's strongest technique since he has another technique much much much much much more powerful.

I don't agree on the Mokujin > PS part , imo PS can destroy it.
And Hashirama needs to go SM to use Mokujin.

As the latest chapter has proved, Hashirama doesnt need SM to pin down Madara. He doesnt need to break PS to defeat him. The wooden dragon that absorbs chakra is enough. If you remember at VOTE when Hashirama saw Susano and kyubi, He said "susano isn't a problem". It was the kyubi+ susano combo that forced him into sm.

He didn't say Susanoo was a problem , read the manga.
Also read my thread ( especially the Note in the top of the thread ) before talking nonsense.

Didn't read because of that lebron pic at the end.
Those things are seriously getting annoying.

U mad bro ?

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That's my boy

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Madara[EMS] used his full potential (i.e. including Kurama) against Hashirama who also went all-out on him, seizing a narrow victory in the end...

Now that Madara has reborn, he has all those abilities with him that he had while an Edo ex. ET reneration and infinite chakra IMO...
Madara sure have an upperhand but Hashi is not far behind, he ain't going down even now...

We'll just have to wait and see...

Note: Never compare Sasuke to Madara until he actually gets a hold of even a portion of power Madara has...

Kyuubi is not part of Madara's power.

I didn't compare Sasuke to current alive Madara , i said he's gonna surpass EMS Madara and reach his full potential.

 

[TrollingSage]

He didn't say Susanoo was a problem , read the manga.
Also read my thread ( especially the Note in the top of the thread ) before talking nonsense.

Perhaps you should take your own advice and learn to read properly.
This is what I said

As the latest chapter has proved, Hashirama doesnt need SM to pin down Madara. He doesnt need to break PS to defeat him. The wooden dragon that absorbs chakra is enough. If you remember at VOTE when Hashirama saw Susano and kyubi, He said "susano isn't a problem". It was the kyubi+ susano combo that forced him into sm.

 

[KidGamer65]

I don't agree on the Mokujin > PS part , imo PS can destroy it.
And Hashirama needs to go SM to use Mokujin.

Mokujin=<PS, not Mokujin>PS. Also, no. Its a base technique.

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[Champ]

Madara is stronger

 

[Ahmed1993]

Perhaps you should take your own advice and learn to read properly.
This is what I said

Here is what he said :

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He made The Bijuu wear Susanoo like an armor.

Mokujin=<PS, not Mokujin>PS. Also, no. Its a base technique.

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My bad then , because i thought you were talking about the Myojinmon.

 

[iRefleX]

Correction : Kyuubi + EMS Madara =< Hashirama.



I just needed to clarify things ( to myself included ) and please watch your language ( no offence ) so that no flame war erupt.
Thank you.

That fight was pure plot...Madara + kyuubi are stronger than Hashirama. Madara said he could see through the wood clone ye he never saw through the clone that he killed? Pure plot lol...

 

[KidGamer65]

That fight was pure plot...Madara + kyuubi are stronger than Hashirama. Madara said he could see through the wood clone ye he never saw through the clone that he killed? Pure plot lol...

Sharingan has to active genius. Hashirama broke PS and suppressed Kurama, and then defeated Madara. He is clearly stronger.