[Discussion] Why Zoro is not Weaker than Luffy

[ekichi onizuka]

i think zoro>luffy

zoro is luffy's weakness.

 

[ekichi onizuka]

ussop could damge luffy

i don't think ussop can touch zoro

Thread i soloed everyone here

 

[ekichi onizuka]

Oda has stated that luffy and zoro's strenght are equals

 

[LitzSabr]

ever seen what Luffy went through in Impel Down, and the first thing after that he went into the war and got pretty ****ed up, than he got his ass kicked by the admirals and than his mind broke ... sorry but that to me is far worse than what Kuma did to Zoro

my point? the thriller bark scene (while epic) proves nothing

It proves everything. Try to understand. It proves Zoro would've dealt with the pain better than Luffy because b/w the two, he has a greater endurance.

Oda has stated that luffy and zoro's strenght are equals

Yeah, that's another thing too. Totally Forgot to add it in OP. :yeah: (Now Added!)

 

[Love Cook]

Oda has stated that luffy and zoro's strenght are equals

Show it

Don't triple post

 

[LitzSabr]

Show it

Don't triple post

I added it in the OP.

 

[VongolaX]

Last time I said that Zoro is close to Luffy in raw power, that fireplay kid said I was a fanboy who knew nothing lol.

Just look at the agreements/mutual understanding in this thread, is everyone here a Zoro fanboy? Lol

 

[WhistleBlower]

I can understand what you're saying but Zoro would not have been able to keep up with Rob Lucci. I guaranteed you this 110%

 

[cptenn94]

zoro is capable of doing things, that luffy is not even close to being capable of doing things. But luffy is still stronger(especially now he has haki). Before zoro could have been considered equal to luffy, but with luffys haki, he can resist zoros swords much better(as before he had to dodge). Zoro has not shown haki as strong as luffy yet.

In fights vs their enemies, zoro tends to win with much less effort than luffy does. Luffy in many fights, is defeated to the point where he cannot do much more fighting. Zoro is usually badly wounded, but still has enough energy left.(this is changeing as they are getting stronger.)


Luffy>zoro>(>)sanji. Zoro is quite close to luffy in fighting power. Zoro can probably do more damage than luffy can. But luffy is still stronger than zoro.(i have the second > between sanji, because it isnt truly clear, exactly how far apart the 2 are.)

Im speaking from a neutral perspective. I like the crew as a whole, not one particular person(except maybe ussop, as his lieing and cowardice can get a bit annoying)

But just to list a small example of why your double standard doesnt work(ie luffy couldnt defeat joza in alabasta arc)

Zoro wouldnt have stood a chance against crocodile.


Compareing "who would beat who, if they were swapped" is useless. Pre haki, zoro wouldnt be able to beat many who luffy fought, and luffy might not have been able to beat many who zoro fought. Regardless of who was stronger. Oda always matches the fights up in a way, that is specific to the person.

For example. If a fight between black beard and straw hats occurs, oda isnt gonna have luffy fight the sniper, and usopp fight black beard, and zoro face a non swordsman. Oda has swordsman fight swordsman, captain fight boss/captain, etc.

Luffy is still stronger.

 

[Mephew D Kensei]

in a vs fight anything goes really either one cld take this IMO but Luffy has been shown to have a tad bit more heart(as in the never say die spirit), not saying Zoro doesn't have it but just that Luffy's is ⅛ more than Zoro's. So Luffy is stronger but Zoro is not weaker if u can understand this.

 

[LitzSabr]

zoro is capable of doing things, that luffy is not even close to being capable of doing things. But luffy is still stronger(especially now he has haki). Before zoro could have been considered equal to luffy, but with luffys haki, he can resist zoros swords much better(as before he had to dodge). Zoro has not shown haki as strong as luffy yet.

In fights vs their enemies, zoro tends to win with much less effort than luffy does. Luffy in many fights, is defeated to the point where he cannot do much more fighting. Zoro is usually badly wounded, but still has enough energy left.(this is changeing as they are getting stronger.)


Luffy>zoro>(>)sanji. Zoro is quite close to luffy in fighting power. Zoro can probably do more damage than luffy can. But luffy is still stronger than zoro.(i have the second > between sanji, because it isnt truly clear, exactly how far apart the 2 are.)

Im speaking from a neutral perspective. I like the crew as a whole, not one particular person(except maybe ussop, as his lieing and cowardice can get a bit annoying)

But just to list a small example of why your double standard doesnt work(ie luffy couldnt defeat joza in alabasta arc)

Zoro wouldnt have stood a chance against crocodile.


Compareing "who would beat who, if they were swapped" is useless. Pre haki, zoro wouldnt be able to beat many who luffy fought, and luffy might not have been able to beat many who zoro fought. Regardless of who was stronger. Oda always matches the fights up in a way, that is specific to the person.

For example. If a fight between black beard and straw hats occurs, oda isnt gonna have luffy fight the sniper, and usopp fight black beard, and zoro face a non swordsman. Oda has swordsman fight swordsman, captain fight boss/captain, etc.

Luffy is still stronger.

First let's talk about the Haki thing.

SBS Vol 71. Chap 703.

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Luffy (Haoshoku Haki), Zoro (Busoshoku Haki), Sanji (Kenbunshoku Haki)​

Their specialty haki color is in the parentheses.

Zoro's specializes in CoA a/c to Oda. He is better than Luffy in that depart. Luffy has a better CoC(which Zoro doesn't have as of now).

I didn't based my whole argument and tried to proved the equivalence of the two solely by swapping opponents. The Daz and Enel examples I used is for the purpose that in a fight b/w Luffy and Zoro, the wins against daz and Enel are insignificant.
However in swapping Lucci and Kaku , there are no complications. Both are Rokushiki users except from the fact that Lucci is not a swordsman but has a higher physical power than Kaku. It would only increase the level of difficulty for Zoro.
And yeah, Jozu beats Alabasta Luffy and also Zoro. Also, Alabasta Zoro can defeat Alabasta Crocodile(wet swords), possibly even faster then Luffy, for all we know Zoro finishes his fights faster than luffy even with the same opponents. Zoro was equal to Luffy back then too.

in a vs fight anything goes really either one cld take this IMO but Luffy has been shown to have a tad bit more heart(as in the never say die spirit), not saying Zoro doesn't have it but just that Luffy's is ⅛ more than Zoro's. So Luffy is stronger but Zoro is not weaker if u can understand this.

Zoro showed extreme spirit and neglected certain death back in Thriller bark. Sure he had the body backing up, but extreme will power is also necessary for that.

 

[Rokudaime Hokage Naruto]

Luffy too fast.

/thread

 

[Aertes]

2. Whiskey Peak
Luffy vs. Zoro: They clashed 2 times head on and both times it was inconclusive implying both are equal. Nothing more, nothing less.

And then Nami came along and one shoted both of them. How can this "fight" be an argument ffs.

You mostly presented facts that show Zoro's stamina to be better than Luffy's. Well, I think this was obvious.
In overall strength considering speed, psychical power, haki etc Luffy is above Zoro. There's not a big difference but at this point we can clearly see that Luffy's haki is superior to Zoro's. And that's the main reason Luffy would win in a fight against Zoro.

 

[sepfiroth]

pre enies loby
zoro = luffy

pre time skip
luffy >= zoro

post time skip
luffy > zoro

 

[Love Cook]

I added it in the OP.

haha you clown.

Databooks aren't written by Oda but by assistants just to produce some extra merchandise. The biggest garbage and rumors come from those books. Like unconfirmed bounties and bon-chan being killed off in ID a few years back.

 

[LitzSabr]

And then Nami came along and one shoted both of them. How can this "fight" be an argument ffs.

You mostly presented facts that show Zoro's stamina to be better than Luffy's. Well, I think this was obvious.
In overall strength considering speed, psychical power, haki etc Luffy is above Zoro. There's not a big difference but at this point we can clearly see that Luffy's haki is superior to Zoro's. And that's the main reason Luffy would win in a fight against Zoro.

You are smart enough to tell which part is serious and what is used just as a comedic relief. Nami beating Luffy and Zoro only meant that she stopped them from fighting, it is just presented in this way to showcase her nature and for the sake of comedy.
Speed wise, Zoro specifically was commented by Usopp on his swordsplay speed, which they couldn't even see, but it was not the same in Luffy's case.
And about the physical power, please make a comparison for your statement.
And as I said, if you have other facts, do point them.
About the Haki, I already said, Luffy's Haki is stronger than Zoro, but only CoC. Not CoA. There is no fact or comparison backing it up in favour of Luffy. But as for Zoro, Oda is on his side.

 

[24 12 11 to troll]

Prove it Rinne, Prove it.

I thought Zoro would not follow a captain who is "weaker" then himself?
Thought the manga clearly stated this , I can be wrong though but I dont think I am.

/Thread .

 

[Aertes]

You are smart enough to tell which part is serious and what is used just as a comedic relief. Nami beating Luffy and Zoro only meant that she stopped them from fighting, it is just presented in this way to showcase her nature and for the sake of comedy.
Speed wise, Zoro specifically was commented by Usopp on his swordsplay speed, which they couldn't even see, but it was not the same in Luffy's case.
And about the physical power, please make a comparison for your statement.
And as I said, if you have other facts, do point them.
About the Haki, I already said, Luffy's Haki is stronger than Zoro, but only CoC. Not CoA. There is no fact or comparison backing it up in favour of Luffy. But as for Zoro, Oda is on his side.

And you're smart enough to understand that they were not fighting seriously, even if Luffy stated so. If they were, I doubt Nami or anyone else could stand in the way.
I was talking overall. Combining speed, power etc. Luffy is above Zoro. Speed wise as you say, don't compare Usopp's observing abilities to Luffy's, that's ridiculous. In G2 I believe Luffy to be a lil faster than Zoro. Haki wise, I am sorry but Zoro never demonstrated CoA the same level as Luffy's. If he did I would like to see it. Zoro also at this point doesn't have CoC.
Same tier yes, same level no.

 

[LitzSabr]

/Thread .

Show me a scan(if you can) where Zoro says that.

And you're smart enough to understand that they were not fighting seriously, even if Luffy stated so. If they were, I doubt Nami or anyone else could stand in the way.
I was talking overall. Combining speed, power etc. Luffy is above Zoro. Speed wise as you say, don't compare Usopp's observing abilities to Luffy's, that's ridiculous. In G2 I believe Luffy to be a lil faster than Zoro. Haki wise, I am sorry but Zoro never demonstrated CoA the same level as Luffy's. If he did I would like to see it. Zoro also at this point doesn't have CoC.
Same tier yes, same level no.

They were fighting seriously. These are the things which I can't make you understand. At what times does zoro put on his bandana? when he is damn serious! He did put it on that time. Why did he put it on? because Luffy was serious too. It's just like saying, Akainu and Whitebeard fought, but no, they were not serious. What's not serious is their fight being ended by Nami.

Secondly speed wise, If we won't deduce from what the characters in the manga say, then should I put an Einstein there to give us opinions? But before anybody says, Luffy at that time (with Kraken) used gear 3rd,so obviously he would be a little slow at that time for anyone to comment on his speed.
Gear 2nd Luffy is a little faster than Zoro but Zoro's swordsplay speed can keep up with that, considering how fast it's called. Now if you think that only a Gear 2nd Luffy is enough to defeat zoro, then you are mistaken. To match the striking power to zoro, he needs to go in gear 3rd.

Now why does he need to go G3?
Take the time when they fought Kraken as an example where Luffy used G3 while Zoro easily dealt the same amount of damge(although more lethal) or take another example; Back in Enies lobby a gear 3rd luffy punched through the wall and a small tower near the bridge

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While Kaku sliced through the whole Tower of Justice and his attack flew through it

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And later zoro stopped an attack of the same caliber which sliced through the Judicial Tower(But one more thing, this attack was stronger than the one that cut through the Judicial Tower, Kaku called the previous one a 'demonstration', i.e Zoro obliterated an attack even stronger than the previous one.)

Spoiler

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Now if you look at this picture

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You can clearly see that the Tower of justice is wider(a bit) than what Luffy destroyed. And Zoro completely obliterated an attack which was stronger than an attack that cut through the Tower and went on. Sure Luffy's hand would've destroyed alittle more if something else was present but so would have Kaku's Rankyaku which went on flying.

So without using Gear 3rd, there is no way Luffy can take on the full power of Zoro, but that would reduce his speed too, in exchange of making him comparable to Zoro in striking power.

About the CoA haki, Zoro never had the need to show it(because he never got any opponent of that Caliber) so how can you Compare that to Luffy's and say that he has a weaker Haki. Now why I said that zoro has a superior CoA, it's because Oda himself said that amongst the 3, Zoro specializes in that, so this speaks for itself.

 

[KingHashirama]

He is weaker.... no reason to bring this stuff up. Captain is the strongest in the crew period. No amount of logic or thread making is going to change that manga law.

But is Zoro close to Luffy? yes.

Zoro already stated, he would not follow a weak man. Another hint at luffy being stronger than him. You guys tend to judge on scenarios too much.