Establishing why Gaara beats Itachi

[Smd]

walts and that other guy soloed this thread.


Im surprised members of there status wasted time on this thread.


Once again it heavily favs gaara. cuz he doesnt have a clue about itachi's arensal

just suanno and amatersu

 

[Fodder#4]

Well.... Gaara certainly has a chance to obtain victory. But, Itachi seems to win more often then not.

 

[Prince Charles]

Meh I guess ill give my Input as well. Nothing to serious though, not trying to get turnt up.

Regarding Gaara taking flight to sky Immediately as you say he would due note Itachi has shown Noteworthy jump height & speed in regards to the duration in which he jumps to reach his destination[

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][

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], So going by that we shouldnt rule out the factor of Itachi reaching gaara of course at a reasonable height and use genjutsu. Now let's say gaara takes to the skies and Itachi is left on the ground? What does gaara do? Gaara's style is piling his opponent with sand and sneak attacks show cased on kimimaro and Deidara which both of them were able to counter and react to Gaara's sand sneak attacks.

Kimimaro

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Deidara

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Both capable of reacting to gaara's sand, Of course im not downplaying gaara by any means but by having the sharigan this will only make the process easier on Itachi in regards to evading his sand attacks.

Regarding Itachi reaching gaara to trap him into a genjutsu, how can Itachi pull this off? Well this is a very overlooked aspect of Itachi's arsenal which is the utilization of crows. As shown

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which would proceed to fly up to where gaara is located on his command and then proceed to form into Itachi himself as shown in the manga Itachi is capable of using his crow clones with clones to lessen the usage of chakra. The crow clones are capable of using genjutsu, dusk crow genjutsu to be exact as shown against naruto and sasuke during their confrontation, that being said the crows can easily or should be capable of forming into Itachi and then proceed to use genjutsu on gaara.

Another interesting detail I brought up before was that the crows have been shown to regroup into a larger form

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. Logically this can be a exploit for Itachi in regards to hopping on to the crow after it reaches a large size and ride upon it as it flies to reach gaara. The crow should be capable of carrying itachi.

 

[MinatoTheYellowFlash]

Wow, you are really ****ing stupid.

I second this.

How stupid are you dude... did you see amaterasu spread after gaara put his sand down? Hell fluck no. Depending on where the location is spreading amaterasu ever but inside the susanoo would be useful, but gay and not ninja like or Itachi like.

 

[Joker]

Can't Itachi just copy his magnet style like Kakashi copied rasengan :|?
I'm now like fluck logic and naruto logic.

Can't copy KKG, if he could he could have the Rinnegan.

 

[Disquiet]

Doesn't Gaara have to touch the ground to turn rocks and minerals into sand? I think I remember seeing that in the manga. Also, Itachi dispersed crows here [

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]. That's a potential counter for that third eye.

PS. I'm too lazy to go all out.


EDIT: Posting this from that other thread.

If this was Itachi, it's bye bye to Gaara's gourd (amaterasu) [

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]. And Itachi's speed fodderizes part 1 Sasuke's. He could also utilize finger genjutsu at that point.

Of course, Gaara may have means of escaping this. But that's why I said it's debatable.


EDIT: Also note how Sasuke is first in front of him, appears behind him, then punches him from the side. The sand simply couldn't keep up with Sasuke's foot speed. I don't even think he was applying shunsin no jutsu....

And amaterasu continues to burn. So yeah, Itachi's speed is definitely a factor in this battle. It would be silly to think otherwise. Especially since that's basically what Lee used to almost beat him. Speed is one of his weaknesses.

 

[Crossroads]

walts and that other guy soloed this thread.


Im surprised members of there status wasted time on this thread.


Once again it heavily favs gaara. cuz he doesnt have a clue about itachi's arensal

just suanno and amatersu

Because they'd actually like to have a nice civilized debate. Something I'm sure you're unfamiliar with.

Unless you'd like to counter the thread, please leave.

 

[Smd]

Because they'd actually like to have a nice civilized debate. Something I'm sure you're unfamiliar with.

Unless you'd like to counter the thread, please leave.

counter the thread? what thread?

Waltz killed your thread along with everyone else.

Besides i like how you ignore all comments on how gaara has no knowledge of Itachi's arsenal.

If you call this debateing than you need help

 

[DeathandHealing]

Dumb question.. If Gaara controls sand. And they are fighting is a desert... And everyone is covered in this said sand...


Couldn't Gaara just slowly work the sand into his opponents body and clog their hearts and kill them? There is bound to be sad getting in peoples mouths, ears and so on. He could easily use the sand in someones ear to destroy a brain connection.

 

[NotAnyones FanBoy]

I was actually going to do more or less this exact same thread with the same counters and all. So I agree with all that was said. Even though Itachi is a stronger shinobi in general, Gaara has the Arsenal to win him 100% low-mid diff because he counters his MS abilities soooo much.

 

[xxSasukEkUnxX]

I shall tell you of, as I of told doctor proof in past debates about this. The deidara fight does not factor, he was in the desert, and a shukaku jin. The only way he would defeat of, Itachi, is if the fight was in the desert, and he was the shukaku jinchuuriki. The third eye is connected to the optical nerve. Sand Dome can conceit with a simple Yasaka Magatama, losing concentration.

 

[Shura]

This is solely subjective to Gaara being cognizant of Itachi's arsenal....Otherwise Genjutsu ends this. Now the Sharingan is able able to discern the mechanics of all Ninjutsu, Taijutsu and Genjutsu without restriction and goes on to enable the user to accurately predict all movements of the opponent in sight. Gaara is already at an initial advantage due to Tsukuyomi; a Genjutsu cultivated from the Mangekyou which can be activated via eye contact and as the Kazekage's initial notion in this battle [your route] is not to defend eye contact but rather execute the timely process of 'flight' then a 'third eye' leaves him vulnerable to Itachi's special version of the Genjutsu: Moon eater. It is a Genjutsu sparked solely on eye contact.​

I believe that the Sunagakure has knowledge on the Akatsuki members such as Itachi and Kisame. It is likely that Gaara has knowledge on Itachi's Genjutsu especially since he is the Kazekage and Jiraiya himself gave Sunagakure intel about Itachi. [

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] With that being said, Gaara will, like Crossroads said, envelope himself in a Sand Dome and leave a Third Eye out in order to make sure that he doesn't make direct eye contact and get caught in a Genjutsu. Tsukuyomi would be useless here due to the fact that Gaara is a long ranged fighter and Tsukuyomi is short ranged. Just take a look at this quote from DrProof;

I can't stand Itachi fanboys who state Tsukuyomi > All, in which I will be explaining it's "Weakness" in sense. I in no way hate Itachi, put I know the extent to his visual prowess. Hopefully you all enjoy my complex theory.

---

Alright so The Uchiha's eyes possess Tenketsu (chakra points) in which emit chakra when ever trying to perform visual techniques eg; Amaterasu, Tsukuyomi in which the immense chakra pressure causes their eyes to bleed:

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Now most visual genjutsu (we hardly have ever seen any, if none at all if it isn't an Uchiha) cannot go afar due to the inability of the human eye to make out direct contact with an opponent within Mid-Long range. Hence why Tsukuyomi is classified as a short-ranged technique:

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However it seems comments such as these are still being made:




Even with proof that Tsukuyomi is obviously inferior to ranges greater than 0-5 meters (Short Range), so if the enemy is 10-15 meters (Mid Range), and/or 20-25 meters (Long Range). So if Itachi/Sasuke is able to capture opponents mid-long range within Tsukuyomi why haven't they done it? Reason because they cannot:

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Ex #1:

Spoiler

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Ex #2:

Spoiler

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Ex #3:

Spoiler

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---

Some individuals may already know this, but this is still going around by Itachi fanboy/fangirls, and it's quite illogical, so I simply wanted to clear this up once again.​

With Gaara being up in the air, locked in the Sand Dome with the Third Eye out, Genjutsu will not work.

​

Now even if the third eye is employed; it makes little difference. If we examine the rudiments: Genjutsu affects chakra flow to the brain, meaning, though the Third eye is not an biological attachment, it evidently functions identically as one and must relay the information seen to the brain via the aforementioned chakra connection. Light clusters that travel from the object to the eye pass through the lens, where it is severed and falls reversely on the retina at the back of the eye. Here, via this chakra connection the light is converted into electrical signals that are transmitted to the center of vision in the back part of the brain thus enabling Gaara to see through the eye. Itachi simply manipulates this connection and Gaara is ceased. Amaterasu is another counter but it has already been highlighted:

This may be true, but correct me if I am wrong. Sharingan Genjutsu requires direct eye contact. [

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] Furthermore, take a look at this quote;

Genjutsu: Sharingan is simply the generic use of genjutsu as employed by Sharingan wielders. By establishing direct eye contact with the intended opponents, the user can lock them within a genjutsu of their choosing in order to achieve various effects.

This is from the Naruto wiki, I'll admit, but it states that Sharingan Genjutsu requires direct eye contact and this has been proven every time Itachi or an another Uchiha used a Genjutsu on an opponent. I may be wrong though. I used to debate for Itachi, but I gave up on that a while ago so I didn't really learn anything about his abilites from that point so correct me if I am wrong.

​

Now as Gaara cannot constantly battle Itachi without making Eye contact [give or take the few moments he would be able to do so] and that he is unable to anticipate the pinnacle Genjutsu Tsukuyomi; he would eventually be caught and if he manages to survive would have maintained a critical decline in his battling ability and mental stability. Itachi employs the Genjutsu a second time finishing him off. Given that Itachi's Tsukuyomi and his Dusk Crow Genjutsu solely requires eye contact; it means that they may be used inter changeably yet jointly with something such as a Kunai strike to the neck or Totsuka to finish. As regards Amatearsu and the employment of Ketai Henka over the technique; as your scan has elaborated; the armor of sand covers Gaara through his own will, highlighting that it is not an automatic response to stimuli by the sand itself but rather Gaara's anticipation of the incoming attack which may be intercepted by Amaterasu if his immediate defenses are occupied countering other jutsu. Itachi's physical prowess, highly notable reflexes and complex use of bunhsin, and the fact that his speed was a '5' as opposed to Kimmimaro's '4.5' is sufficient to say that he would able to avoid the high speed sand while on foot and the Sharingan has already

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Gaara's sand.

​

While Itachi is fast enough to dodge the attacks created by Gaara, I doubt that he would be able to dodge something like the Sand Tsunami. [

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] Again, I may be wrong and Itachi may have counters to it so correct me if I am wrong. As for Genjutsu, look above. I already talked about it.

​

Nothing but a timely process with various openings for Itachi. Karasu Bunshin would allow Itachi to close the gap between the two and also allow him to attak from both within the air and on land as well as enforce Genjutsu. The mere fact that Itachi is knowledgeable of his arsenal, Gaara wouldn't have time to grind sand and it is highly questionable if he can take to the skies given: Tsukuyomi [as mentioned above]. Found it rediculous that Gaara would ascend to the heights at which he fought Deidara when there is absolutely no reason to do unless he intends to lose sight of Itachi among the nearby forestry; an action remaining the the same bracket. In as much as Gaara's ability to manipulate earthen elements it ultimately amounts to nothing if he cannot breach Itachi's Genjutsu and intellect. Though his Stamina and chakra pools may be somewhat inferior it is in it's absence where a prodigious aptitude and being readily knowledgeable of what Gaara has to offer highlights itself. The fact is, Gaara cannot kill Itachi; a substantive defense such as the V1-Susanoo's ribcage is sufficient to prohibit any type of Sand burial and even if faced with with jutsu such as

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, Susanoo's ability to perform CQC and basic physical actions allows Itachi to effortlessly escape. On the contrary Itachi has various ways to finish Gaara Such as Izanami. The Genjutsu works by using your opponents senses [

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] and begins when the user sees fit to do so by saying "Izanami". All else that is required is for the Itachi to replicate the same Bodily sensation:

Spoiler

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The jutsu was created to control the Uchiha abusers of izanagi and the mere fact that it was used on Kabuto highlights the fact that it can be used outside of it's intended purpose. Even having prior knowledge of the jutsu doesn't save Gaara from it has he possesses no counter. Secondly,

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a spirit weapon which seals anything [both living and non living] it pierces can be used to seal not only Gaara's immediate Defense once in contact but any amounts of Sand thrown at him. Yata no Kagami also repels any waves of sand directed toward Itachi; Gaara cannot anticipate itachi's bunshin given the pace in which he is able to create them and even being able to do so while using shuriken. The Kazekage stands very little chance besting the true potential of the Mangekyo Sharingan. Itachi takes this low-Mid diff. ​

I really need to read up on Itachi again, but isn't Izanami effective only against shinobi that won't accept who they are such as Kabuto?

 

[Crossroads]

counter the thread? what thread?

Waltz killed your thread along with everyone else.

Besides i like how you ignore all comments on how gaara has no knowledge of Itachi's arsenal.

If you call this debateing than you need help

The only people who did a decent job of countering my thread are Waltz and Nous as I've stated earlier, and I'm working on my counter now.

Unless you can stop D-Riding other NB members and think for yourself, then please leave.

 

[Raekwon26]

IMO, when you have to give a character knowledge of the opponents abilities, just so they can compete, it's pretty clear who wins the fight.

That's just my opinion though.

 

[Nous]

Not to appear obtrusive.. but can you [AkatsukiChurch] counter mine as well? I feel a little bored/left out.. u_u

​

 

[Grammar Nazi]

I remember debating this against a Sasori fan years ago- he was reluctant to admit that Itachi is a couple of tiers above Gaara. In all honesty, the way this battle would play out-

1. Gaara proceeds to attack Itachi, covers Itachi with sand
2. Gaara realises he's covering himself instead(much like Deidara)

Even if Gaara is given full knowledge on Itachi, he would still start seeing crows and ultimately lose to genjutsu.

One scary fact about Itachi- He never fought a single battle in the manga in which he had killing intentions. When he did have killing intents, he killed off an entire clan supposedly full of skilled ninja's. There's no way Gaara is taking out a blood lusted Itachi.

Tier is more important than type advantage in Naruto manga. The 5 kages had about 100 ways to potentially destroy Madara and yet they lost miserably.

 

[hixa kuogame]

Um while I agree with the thread title, this is just a poor thread and its not full proof .

"How this fight would play out" is never OK because that's actually not how the fight would go at all
There hasnt been one fight where gaara immediately takes to the skies.
The simulation you casted was completely based on how you would want the fight to play out to support your initial argument, it seems.

 

[Snape Uchiha]

As I'm sure many if you have realized by now, there really is no definite answer. It really depends on the circumstances and each fan is assuming that the circumstances will play out in his favorite characters favor.

 

[Shura]

Not to appear obtrusive.. but can you [AkatsukiChurch] counter mine as well? I feel a little bored/left out.. u_u

​

I would, but I have doubts.. I am waiting for Waltz reply to see if Itachi really is > Gaara. Your point is good as well, but read the first point I brought up when I was countering Waltz. Gaara most likely has knowledge on Itachi's Genjutsu so he won't look into his eyes if he isn't a fool and I don't believe that Gaara is a fool.

 

[Arian]

Basically this.... itachi wouldnt even break a sweat...

This is solely subjective to Gaara being cognizant of Itachi's arsenal and an advantageous terrain....Otherwise Genjutsu ends this. Now the Sharingan is able able to discern the mechanics of all Ninjutsu, Taijutsu and Genjutsu without restriction and goes on to enable the user to accurately predict all movements of the opponent in sight. Gaara is already at an initial advantage due to Tsukuyomi; a Genjutsu cultivated from the Mangekyou which can be activated via eye contact and as the Kazekage's initial notion in this battle [your route] is not to defend eye contact but rather execute the timely process of 'flight' then a 'third eye' leaves him vulnerable to Itachi's special version of the Genjutsu: Moon eater. It is a Genjutsu sparked solely on eye contact.

​

Now even if the third eye is employed; it makes little difference. If we examine the rudiments: Genjutsu affects chakra flow to the brain, meaning, though the Third eye is not a biological attachment, it evidently functions identically as one and must relay the information seen to the brain via the aforementioned chakra connection. Light clusters that travel from the object to the eye pass through the lens, where it is severed and falls reversely on the retina at the back of the eye. Here, via this chakra connection the light is converted into electrical signals that are transmitted to the center of vision in the back part of the brain thus enabling Gaara to see through the eye. Itachi simply manipulates this connection and Gaara is ceased. Amaterasu is another counter but it has already been highlighted:

​

Now as Gaara cannot constantly battle Itachi without making Eye contact [give or take the few moments he would be able to do so] and that he is unable to anticipate the pinnacle Genjutsu Tsukuyomi; he would eventually be caught and if he manages to survive would have maintained a critical decline in his battling ability and mental stability. Itachi employs the Genjutsu a second time finishing him off. Given that Itachi's Tsukuyomi and his Dusk Crow Genjutsu solely requires eye contact; it means that they may be used inter changeably yet jointly with something such as a Kunai strike to the neck or Totsuka to finish. As regards Amatearsu and the employment of Ketai Henka over the technique; as your scan has elaborated; the armor of sand covers Gaara through his own will, highlighting that it is not an automatic response to stimuli by the sand itself but rather Gaara's anticipation of the incoming attack which may be intercepted by Amaterasu if his immediate defenses are occupied countering other jutsu. Itachi's physical prowess, highly notable reflexes and complex use of bunhsin, and the fact that his speed was a '5' as opposed to Kimmimaro's '4.5' is sufficient to say that he would able to avoid the high speed sand while on foot and the Sharingan has already

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Gaara's sand. ​

​

Nothing but a timely process with various openings for Itachi. Karasu Bunshin would allow Itachi to close the gap between the two and also allow him to attak from both within the air and on land as well as enforce Genjutsu. The mere fact that Itachi is knowledgeable of his arsenal, Gaara wouldn't have time to grind sand and it is highly questionable if he can take to the skies given: Tsukuyomi [as mentioned above]. Found it rediculous that Gaara would ascend to the heights at which he fought Deidara when there is absolutely no reason to do unless he intends to lose sight of Itachi. In as much as Gaara's ability to manipulate earthen elements it ultimately amounts to nothing if he cannot breach Itachi's Genjutsu and intellect. The fact is, Gaara cannot kill Itachi; a substantive defense such as the V1-Susanoo's ribcage is sufficient to prohibit any type of Sand burial and even if faced with with jutsu such as

You must be registered for see links

, Susanoo's ability to perform CQC and basic physical actions allows Itachi to effortlessly escape. On the contrary Itachi has various ways to finish Gaara Such as Izanami. The Genjutsu works by using your opponents senses [

You must be registered for see links

] and begins when the user sees fit to do so by saying "Izanami". All else that is required is for the Itachi to replicate the same Bodily sensation:

Spoiler

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The jutsu was created to control the Uchiha abusers of izanagi and the mere fact that it was used on Kabuto highlights the fact that it can be used outside of it's intended purpose. Even having prior knowledge of the jutsu doesn't save Gaara from it has he possesses no counter. Secondly,

You must be registered for see links

a spirit weapon which seals anything [both living and non living] it pierces can be used to seal not only Gaara's immediate Defense once in contact but any amounts of Sand thrown at him. Yata no Kagami also repels any waves of sand directed toward Itachi; Gaara cannot anticipate itachi's bunshin given the pace in which he is able to create them and even being able to do so while using shuriken. The Kazekage stands a slim chance at besting the true potential of the Mangekyo Sharingan. Itachi takes this low-Mid diff. ​