1) He didnt kill Karin for no reason, after he stabbed her together with Danzo (already gave you the reasons for this), it would be dumb to leave her alive for various reasons such as the fact that she knows a lot about him (if she somehow teamed up with his enemies it would be disadvantageous), she could make team taka fall apart if she tells the team that sasuke stabbed her etc.
And why would Karin be leaving the team if she was hoping that Sasuke would save her till the bitter end, just like with Killer Bee? That whole scenario would have been avoided by simply using Amaterasu on Danzo and putting it out later. Also putting in the fact that Karin is still with Sasuke and the Leaf didn't get any useful information from her.
And what would happen if those children were brought up knowing that their entire clan was wiped out and they have to live with being the descendant of a clan that turned its back on their own village? We'd have a whole bunch of little Sasukes running around trying to destroy the Leaf, and thats exactly what they need.
Even if Danzo was disliked, its still a criminal offense to waltz right into a top secret meeting and attempt to kill a KAGE. If you don't like the current President for his actions, that doesn't justify personally killing him, would it?
Also, Danzo didnt make Itachi do anything. The Uchiha clan was going to be wiped off the map at one point or another, whether its by Itachi or the other clans themselves.
I'm sorry, were the Samurai supposed to step aside and give him a pat on the back because he's in a bad mood? He's trespassing on high value property, working with Akatsuki, and already an international criminal. The samurai were doing their job.
Im sorry, who threw the first attack again from behind?
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Destroying one of two things that Itachi gave his life to protect from inside Akatsuki because he didn't feel the same way.
Nagato was hated just like every other villain until he gave his life for the village. Same with Itachi. Neither Sasuke nor Nagato had good reasons to destroy Konoha, but Sasuke hasn't shown any act of redemption except appear in a war because he changed his mind, again.
Joining Akatsuki = International Criminal. It's that straightforward
Onoki was hated.
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The Sand was as much a victim of Orochimaru as the Leaf was. Why do you think the 4th Kazekage is dead and Orochimaru took direct control of the invasion?
Either way, Sakura is more hated by the base than Sasuke
1) Its true that its a criminal offense 'waltz' right into that top secret meeting. But for Sasuke's reasons it should be understandable for the NB members. If the president secretly kills my whole family I would definetly not wait for the next election to vote for someone else. I'd take my revenge (if I'd be able to of course, i know its not realistic), even if its the president instead of someone like you or me, he killed my family so I'm gon do something.
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In this manga page Danzo gave Itachi two options, which did sound threatening. With the way he spoke to Itachi you can see he was manipulating him. Itachi was also very young so it was easy to influence him. Danzo did make
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<- Itachi's wiki page also interpreted it as Danzo forcing Itachi to kill the clan.
2) Good point. But you know Zetsu sold him out which created that situation. I know you still got the trespassing card for that but it's completely understandable for Sasuke to approach Danzo at the kage summit because his chances are higher than at the leave village.
3) You're right, he was gonna be first, but you cant be suggesting that he shouldve waited for her move right? Her very reason to approach sasuke was to kill him in the first place. He knew she was gonna be trouble at some time if she'd join him cus her 'Im joining you fck the village just because I love you' was cheap she couldve said that from the moment he left the village and it was just clearly unsincere.
4) Of course he didnt feel the same way. The whole reason he was chasing Itachi was because of his whole family, now that Itachi did all this for Sasuke and Konoha appeared to be the one killing his family he should just let it go? He still didnt avenge his family (im not even speaking about itachi now)
5) Konoha didnt show any apology for killing Sasuke's family either (I know the massacre had to be done, Im just trying to say Sasuke's deeds are understandable)
6) You misunderstood this part, I was talking about Onoki not being hated by NB members, but to come back at your comment; 1st page only showed that gaara didnt like ohnoki's old fashioned thinking, nothing to do with ohnoki using the akatsuki. 2nd page only showed that Raikage didnt trust the other kages because of their use of akatsuki. No hate, and not specificly aimed at ohnoki. 3rd page; raikage only said he didnt want to hear shit about the akatsuki to ohnoki. All the hate that you could possibly get out of these pages is not comparable with the hate towards sasuke but thats understandable for the NV characters because they dont know everything about sasuke. It's not understandable for NB members like you who know everything about him and still hate him.
As for the sand, they were a victim from the moment they found out that their kazekage was dead, before that moment they actually agreed with orochimaru to destroy the leaf just because it was powerful which is a selfish reason. They just dont get portrayed as evil in the manga thats why people on here dont hate them.
Also, sakura gets a lot of troll threads, for good reasons. Sasuke gets hate threads (hes emo hes gay etc etc, while people on her would kill themselves if their family got killed, but lets ignore that) and gets bashed in every other thread that involves him (for example; naruto gets rinnegan theories, whenever someone replies that sasuke is getting it people bash him). And theres a WHOLE LOT MORE threads that involve sasuke than sakura as shes a minor part of the manga compared to him
What do my Username have to do with this thread? I bet you probably feel so badass for insulting someone you've never met just because they have a username that you don't like:|
I'm sorry, It's just that you're saying Obito is more hated than Sasuke while at the same time, your username is dedicated to sasuke in a negative way (and obito has few haters compared to sasuke/sakura/madara). It's not because I don't like the username and I don't feel bad ass now. I said it out of irritation, it was nothing personal though..my bad.
1) He didnt kill Karin for no reason, after he stabbed her together with Danzo (already gave you the reasons for this), it would be dumb to leave her alive for various reasons such as the fact that she knows a lot about him (if she somehow teamed up with his enemies it would be disadvantageous), she could make team taka fall apart if she tells the team that sasuke stabbed her etc.
2) You're totally ignoring my argument about innocent uchihas that got slaughtered along with the uchihas that were involved with the coup.
3) I didnt say he had no other choice, I said he had 2 options and that his option to kill her along with danzo weighed more (cus he may not get the chance again), read the details in my previous comment. Furthermore, you found sakura's intention? I found it foolish, to think she could kill sasuke (or that she should do it without getting the order to do it or without consulting the others), so did kakashi.
4) Sounds like you'd only forgive sasuke if the NV does
1) I know that, but this action is still ungrateful to her... doesn't matter his movil to try kill her was, he had many more to try to save her... In the manga scan i showed to you Tobi told him to decide what to do with her, he had the choice....
2) You are totally ignoring the fact that entire Konoha can't be blamed for that... Just Danzou and Itachi... Eye for an eye, and tongue for a tongue is the way villains think...
3) Why didn't he pick the right choice? Right choice: To try to save her after all she did for him...
Sakura could have done it if she had wanted to, manga fact:
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His eye/mind was hurting him, and she thought she can take advantage of it...
But she didn't, she backed down, right after, Sasuke strangled her...
When Sasuse became an international enemy, everyone was allowed to kill him, it's not like she had to ask for permission (to who exactly?), same for Kakashi. Actually, it's Konoha responsibility to take care of their own thrash....
You say it's foolish, i dont see why... I am countering all your arguments with manga facts, and you just keep repeating the same thing...
4) Actually no, It seems Naruto already forgave him, and I haven't yet... (but this is just my personal opinion, no fact)
1) I know that, but this action is still ungrateful to her... doesn't matter his movil to try kill her was, he had many more to try to save her... In the manga scan i showed to you Tobi told him to decide what to do with her, he had the choice....
2) You are totally ignoring the fact that entire Konoha can't be blamed for that... Just Danzou and Itachi... Eye for an eye, and tongue for a tongue is the way villains think...
3) Why didn't he pick the right choice? Right choice: To try to save her after all she did for him...
Sakura could have done it if she had wanted to, manga fact:
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His eye/mind was hurting him, and she thought she can take advantage of it...
But she didn't, she backed down, right after, Sasuke strangled her...
When Sasuse became an international enemy, everyone was allowed to kill him, it's not like she had to ask for permission (to who exactly?), same for Kakashi. Actually, it's Konoha responsibility to take care of their own thrash....
You say it's foolish, i dont see why... I am countering all your arguments with manga facts, and you just keep repeating the same thing...
4) Actually no, It seems Naruto already forgave him, and I haven't yet... (but this is just my personal opinion, no fact)
Lol, its the other way around, you're the one that keeps repeating things, I already told you that the entire village isnt responsible for the massacre and that sasuke doesnt want to destroy the entire village cus he thinks every single person is responsible. Also told you that hiruzen is just as responsible as danzo, and itachi was innocent cus he was being manipulated, i gave you manga pages for this. You dont understand how its foolish for Sakura (who has zero feats and is unexperienced in murder) to kill an MS uchiha who's used to killing all by herself? (not to mention that shes got feelings for him), its obvious that shes gonna get herself killed. Im not gonna react on all your other points cus except for your 4th point (and the stuff about sakura being foolish), you have literally said nothing new
Lol, its the other way around, you're the one that keeps repeating things, I already told you that the entire village isnt responsible for the massacre and that sasuke doesnt want to destroy the entire village cus he thinks every single person is responsible. Also told you that hiruzen is just as responsible as danzo, and itachi was innocent cus he was being manipulated, i gave you manga pages for this. You dont understand how its foolish for Sakura (who has zero feats and is unexperienced in murder) to kill an MS uchiha who's used to killing all by herself? (not to mention that shes got feelings for him), its obvious that shes gonna get herself killed. Im not gonna react on all your other points cus except for your 4th point (and the stuff about sakura being foolish), you have literally said nothing new
Look i am not here to try to understand Sasuke's feelings, that was never in discuss, i am not interested in what are his reasons, i am just judging his actions... Action are what makes people villains.
1) Karin killing attempt: This is why he killed Karin, as cold and selfish as the manga says:
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But it doesn't matter, I repeat I am not discussing Sasuke reasons but his actions.
He try to kill a person who saves him from 2 fatal injuries (Bee's swords and Danzou's wind-sword), and realized Danzou jutsu before him, giving him an advantage in the fight. This kind of action can be considered ungrateful and selfish, i don't care what he wanted to accomplish from that kill. I can't believe this is an understandable behavior for you.
2) Uchiha Genocide: Hiruzen was the one who didn't support Danzou's plan, he wanted to resolved their problem in another way than fighting, manga fact:
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Danzou and the Uchiha's Shinobi are the ones to blame...
I know i said Itachi was to blame too in previous posts... He did the killing after all, but considering the fact that he was just protecting his beloved village, he sounds like a hero...
However , It's a possibility Hiruzen could have come up with an agreement with the Uchiha, we don't know that actually, Itachi killed them all before that happening...
3) Sakura: Doesn't matter what Sakura could have thought, again, i'd rather not analyse hers or noone's feelings, just manga facts. She was there to kill Sasuke, yes she was, but, in the very only time she tried to accomplish her goal, she backed down by herself....
Scans:
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Sakura hadn't made her move yet while Sasuke was ready to strike a chidori in her back, that is really the most bravest way to kill a girl, don't you think? From the back, when she is distracted, well done Sasuke-kun!!
If she actually had tried to do it, it would have ended up like this:
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This time, Sakura could have killed Sasuke... She took advantage of his weakness, but stopped herself in the last second...
I want to tell that every argument i give, i defend it with manga scans, and you are all talk, twisting things around and fanfictioning...
You can have your own opinion, i don't care, i would just like to point out that manga tell a different story from yours...
Its not sasuke who is "most hated" although his "yo yo" personality is annying as shit...... His fans r the most hated cuz they litterally would latch onto his nuts if he was a real person......makes u anna find out where they live and knock some ****ing sense into them.
Very well put together thread. You put forward some good points. I personally have nothing against Sasuke. Considering the emotional rollercoaster he has constantly been through all his life it is not surprising he's a bit messed up. I would not call him evil, and i would not call him good. I would however call him cold.
On a side note: Sasuke did NOT try to kill Karin. Even tho his attitude was extremely cold towards her and he left her (abandoned her) on the floor. The reason I say this is because everyone seems to be forgetting what took place before he sent his Chidori through her and what Danzos words were.
Sasuke told Karin to stay still when Danzo was holding her ransom.
Sasuke sent Chidori spear through her which pierced Danzo.
Danzo stated that Sasuke had hit one of his vital organs.
Sasuke did not hit any of Karins vital organs (remember he had told her to stay still?) plus as an Uzumaki Karin would also have strong life force to survive (Sasuke mentality).
I just think he wanted to continue on his own at this point which is why he left her.
In relation to the thread, Sakura appears to be the most hated character on NB. Again i do not dislike her either, I just think she needs to be more useful.
Very well put together theead. You put forward some good points. I personally have nothing against Sasuke. Considering the emotional rollercoaster he has been through all his life it is not surprising he made some of the decisions he chose to make. He's just a kid with issues.
On a side note: Sasuke did NOT try to kill Karin. Even tho his attitude was extremely cold towards her and he left her (abandoned her) on the floor. The reason I say this is because everyone seems to be forgetting what took place before he sent his Chidori through her and what Danzos words were.
Sasuke told Karin to stay still when Danzo was holding her ransom.
Sasuke sent Chidori spear through her which pierced Danzo.
Danzo stated that Sasuke had hit one of his vital organs.
Sasuke did not hit any of Karins vital organs (remember he had told her to stay still?) plus as an Uzumaki Karin would also have strong life force to survive (Sasuke mentality).
I just think he wanted to continue on his own at this point which is why he left her.
In relation to the thread, Sakura appears to be the most hated character on NB. Again i do not dislike her either, I just think she needa to be more useful.
Look i am not here to try to understand Sasuke's feelings, that was never in discuss, i am not interested in what are his reasons, i am just judging his actions... Action are what makes people villains.
1) Karin killing attempt: This is why he killed Karin, as cold and selfish as the manga says:
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But it doesn't matter, I repeat I am not discussing Sasuke reasons but his actions.
He try to kill a person who saves him from 2 fatal injuries (Bee's swords and Danzou's wind-sword), and realized Danzou jutsu before him, giving him an advantage in the fight. This kind of action can be considered ungrateful and selfish, i don't care what he wanted to accomplish from that kill. I can't believe this is an understandable behavior for you.
2) Uchiha Genocide: Hiruzen was the one who didn't support Danzou's plan, he wanted to resolved their problem in another way than fighting, manga fact:
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Danzou and the Uchiha's Shinobi are the ones to blame...
I know i said Itachi was to blame too in previous posts... He did the killing after all, but considering the fact that he was just protecting his beloved village, he sounds like a hero...
However , It's a possibility Hiruzen could have come up with an agreement with the Uchiha, we don't know that actually, Itachi killed them all before that happening...
3) Sakura: Doesn't matter what Sakura could have thought, again, i'd rather not analyse hers or noone's feelings, just manga facts. She was there to kill Sasuke, yes she was, but, in the very only time she tried to accomplish her goal, she backed down by herself....
Scans:
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Sakura hadn't made her move yet while Sasuke was ready to strike a chidori in her back, that is really the most bravest way to kill a girl, don't you think? From the back, when she is distracted, well done Sasuke-kun!!
If she actually had tried to do it, it would have ended up like this:
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This time, Sakura could have killed Sasuke... She took advantage of his weakness, but stopped herself in the last second...
I want to tell that every argument i give, i defend it with manga scans, and you are all talk, twisting things around and fanfictioning...
You can have your own opinion, i don't care, i would just like to point out that manga tell a different story from yours...
You're not making any sense at all. First of all, this is a thread about sasuke being an understandable character, so we're discussing whether his actions were understandable or not. If you're not discussing this, you're in the wrong thread.. second, you're saying you dont care about his reasons? that makes literally NO SENSE. If i kill you just for fun, then i did something wrong. If i kill you because you're hitler, then i did it for a reason. Now you're saying you dont care about why i killed you, you just care about me killing you. thats just plain stupid. Furthermore, ive provided manga scans for my arguments, if you're gna ignore that, thats up to you. im not gonna keep posting them the same way you do. So dont tell me im twisting things unless you can prove that. This is also gonna be the last time that I reply, unless you actually stop ignoring my arguments, and say new things which i have not replied to yet.
It was this point that Sasuke told Karin to stay still...
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And this point Danzo stated Sasuke had hit a vital organ (his heart) (whereas Sasuke had intentionally not hit any of Karins)...
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Sasuke had just killed the man responsible for his brothers death, and in his eyes, responsible for the annihilation of his clan. Sasuke at this point is still an emotional wreck, heartbroken and full of hatred for Danzo for what he did to Itachi; even using an image of his beloved brother during a Jutsu as his hatred and pain increased in battle...
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At the point of killing Danzo (Sasukes first cold blooded kill other than Itachi) yes he was a bit loopy..
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However
Itachi
changed that...
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As I said before... I do not see Sasuke as evil, and I do not see him as good. I see him as a bit cold... and overall... a bit messed up.
And the same goes for Karin...
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HOWEVER, with all that said and done, I still think Sasuke could very easilly go back to the dark side. I question his true intentions regarding the Juubi etc etc and I do feel he has an ulterior motive. In his own head.. it would be for the greater good, in reality it could be something very different. His motives are still evidently different to those of Naruto and those fighting beside him, even at this stage. Maybe he intends to rid the world of tailed beasts, who knows... but I feel he has a plan that will result in him going up against Naruto for their final battle.
NOTE: I am NOT a Sasuke fanboy, neither am I a Sasuke hater. He has his own story. Personally he roughly comes in joint No.5 in my top five (Joint 5th with Naruto).
It was this point that Sasuke told Karin to stay still...
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And this point Danzo stated Sasuke had hit a vital organ (his heart) (whereas Sasuke had intentionally not hit any of Karins)...
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Sasuke had just killed the man responsible for his brothers death, and in his eyes, responsible for the annihilation of his clan. Sasuke at this point is still an emotional wreck, heartbroken and full of hatred for Danzo for what he did to Itachi; even using an image of his beloved brother during a Jutsu as his hatred and pain increased in battle...
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At the point of killing Danzo (Sasukes first cold blooded kill other than Itachi) yes he was a bit loopy..
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However
Itachi
changed that...
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As I said before... I do not see Sasuke as evil, and I do not see him as good. I see him as a bit cold... and overall... a bit messed up.
And the same goes for Karin...
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HOWEVER, with all that said and done, I still think Sasuke could very easilly go back to the dark side. I question his true intentions regarding the Juubi etc etc and I do feel he has an ulterior motive. In his own head.. it would be for the greater good, in reality it could be something very different. His motives are still evidently different to those of Naruto and those fighting beside him, even at this stage. Maybe he intends to rid the world of tailed beasts, who knows... but I feel he has a plan that will result in him going up against Naruto for their final battle.
I know Sasuke didn't hurt Karin to death when he attacked Danzou.
But he did try to kill her after that, his intentions were not to try to save her, or leave her, he was going to murder her in cold blood... Look at his face, Sasuke was a crazy Psychopath...
...On a side note: Sasuke did NOT try to kill Karin. Even tho his attitude was extremely cold towards her and he left her (abandoned her) on the floor...
My post was a response to this...
It doesn't matter what kind of person is Karin, she healed Sasuke twice, and discovered how Izanagui works before him, giving him an advantage in the battle with Danzou....
Itachi didn't change Sasuke. He was even more angry with Konoha after his talk with Edo-Itachi. Read the manga....
The Hokages, apparently, magically changed his mind.
I have my doubts...
sakura has saved countless lives and is one of the worlds strongest medics. but if you think keeping people alive is useless maybe you should go and tell the doctors that next time you get sick
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for me i didn't really start hating her until i just got fed up with her not doing anything and just beating naruto.
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